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Powerful Two-Hander posted:last night my dad tried to argue in complete seriousness that the reason for high house prices and unaffordable rents was that it was too hard for landlords to evict people and that they weren't able to make enough of a return so were selling up now?
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Aug 20, 2023 19:24
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the free market is perfect except any time it could harm me i expect everyone involved to hold themselves to an unstated moral code i am not subject to this moral code, obviously
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Aug 20, 2023 19:29
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Roosevelt posted:now? fair point, it all went wrong in march 2004
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Aug 20, 2023 19:33
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it all went wrong in the 10th millennium bc, you mean
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Aug 20, 2023 19:34
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bob dobbs is dead posted:it all went wrong in the 10th millennium bc, you mean SA wasn't around in those days though
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Aug 20, 2023 19:38
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land being bullshit fuckery undergirded with violence is a lot older than capitalism
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Aug 20, 2023 19:40
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yes, but march 2004 is when powerful two-hander registered on the something awful forums
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Aug 20, 2023 19:41
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its always been capitalism we just didnt start calling it that till recently
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Aug 20, 2023 19:42
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oh yeah i see re jonny: you need violence subordinated to capital to have capitalism, and the violent dudes in ancient empires sure as gently caress werent subordinated to the money dudes
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Aug 20, 2023 19:42
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no im sure caesar was just tearing through europe for the thrill of exploration. nothing to do with england's tin stash
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Aug 20, 2023 19:46
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Jonny 290 posted:no im sure caesar was just tearing through europe for the thrill of exploration. nothing to do with england's tin stash putting a capitalist point of view on caesar is like those medieval paintings where they put caesar in plate harness and lances or shakespeare putting him in doublets. bein rich as crassus didnt save crassus
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Aug 20, 2023 19:49
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Jonny 290 posted:its always been capitalism we just didnt start calling it that till recently no. you should read some theory, op
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Aug 20, 2023 19:49
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Jonny 290 posted:its always been capitalism we just didnt start calling it that till recently that's a thing capitalists invented to try to claim that it's the "natural order" of things or whatever, don't buy into it
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Aug 20, 2023 19:50
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bob dobbs is dead posted:re jonny: you need violence subordinated to capital to have capitalism, and the violent dudes in ancient empires sure as gently caress werent subordinated to the money dudes hey guess what that debt book I keep talking about explains real well
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Aug 20, 2023 19:51
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i tend to disagree
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Aug 20, 2023 19:52
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Shame Boy posted:hey guess what that debt book I keep talking about explains real well graeber kinda sucked at ancient history, read him for the anthropology
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Aug 20, 2023 19:52
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Jonny 290 posted:i tend to disagree what it’s been forever is “class society” but that takes many forms and they’re not all the same
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Aug 20, 2023 19:53
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later rome is actually used as an example of where the interests of money won out vs. the interests of everyone else on a large scale for the very first time in history and the fact that we've modeled all our poo poo after the romans is kinda A Problem
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Aug 20, 2023 19:53
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bob dobbs is dead posted:graeber kinda sucked at ancient history, read him for the anthropology not that debt book, this one
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Aug 20, 2023 19:54
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Shame Boy posted:not that debt book, this one michael hudson is cool. he exaggerates stuff sometimes to drive home the point but i think his points are solid and he’s a good communist boy
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Aug 20, 2023 19:55
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bob dobbs is dead posted:bein rich as crassus didnt save crassus do you think anyone has made a serious attempt on the life of any of the techlords? for all the gadsen flags they wave americans are the most servile people in history.
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Aug 20, 2023 20:05
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crassus died in direct military confrontation in pitched battle dont think bezos would get himself in one of those
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Aug 20, 2023 20:08
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Midjack posted:do you think anyone has made a serious attempt on the life of any of the techlords? for all the gadsen flags they wave americans are the most servile people in history. the google exec who got OD'd, maybe the crypto guy who got shanked in a parking lot probably a few others
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Aug 20, 2023 20:10
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bob dobbs is dead posted:crassus died in direct military confrontation in pitched battle hypothetically one or both of musk and zuck could die in hand to hand combat. they won't, but for a few minutes it seemed possible
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Aug 20, 2023 20:13
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infernal machines posted:the google exec who got OD'd, maybe there have been more than one crypto guy getting dismembered events in just the last like year
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Aug 20, 2023 20:17
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Shame Boy posted:there have been more than one crypto guy getting dismembered events in just the last like year yeah, this guy was better known than most and had some projects outside of crypto. also it was last year sometime. i can't be bothered to look up his name though
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Aug 20, 2023 20:19
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infernal machines posted:but if landlords didn't own properties, where would renters live? on some level you do have to find a solution for people to live somewhere without owning it, right? or am I missing something (I have no particular suggestion to this quandary just noting it exists) unless you’re trying to abolish all land ownership in which case - problem solved 
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Aug 20, 2023 20:54
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echinopsis posted:on some level you do have to find a solution for people to live somewhere without owning it, right? or am I missing something (I have no particular suggestion to this quandary just noting it exists) You're getting warmer
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Aug 20, 2023 20:54
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my landlord is the municipality, which works well enough that i think it could be elevated to general practice
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Aug 20, 2023 20:55
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encourage tech lords to take up hobbies that will kill them if they gently caress up, like sub guy (except preferably solo)
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Aug 20, 2023 20:57
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haveblue posted:encourage tech lords to take up hobbies that will kill them if they gently caress up, like sub guy (except preferably solo) given that sub guy managed to compress two billionaires into something with no billion and no air, nah, keep the multiplayer ventures comin'
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Aug 20, 2023 21:01
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haveblue posted:encourage tech lords to take up hobbies that will kill them if they gently caress up, like sub guy (except preferably solo) rich people killing themselves with a small amount of collateral deaths would be an improvement over the current situation of rich people not killing themselves with a gigantic number of collateral deaths
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Aug 20, 2023 21:06
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Cybernetic Vermin posted:my landlord is the municipality, which works well enough that i think it could be elevated to general practice my municipality is the largest landlord in the country. this would be fine if not for a decade and a half of city governments underfunding the community housing corp, leading to over $1billion in backlogged repairs and over a thousand units being removed from the market because they're literally uninhabitable. in theory, the system should work, and in practice politics have destroyed it that said, i fully support municipal owned housing, funded by tax revenues from, among other things, property taxes. you do actually have to fund it though echinopsis posted:on some level you do have to find a solution for people to live somewhere without owning it, right? or am I missing something (I have no particular suggestion to this quandary just noting it exists) yeah, as noted, municipal owned housing would be an ideal solution, and it works in a lot of places. the place where i live isn't necessarily one of them, but it's not an unworkable idea
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Aug 20, 2023 21:35
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Aug 20, 2023 21:52
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municipal/public owned housing isn't all that perfect either, in singapore for example it creates a lot of problems that i'm too high to talk about right now. class divide and xenophobia come to mind. also they all look the same
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Aug 20, 2023 21:53
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sporean xenophobia is middling in the grand scheme of things but if you look at the region, they are the least xenophobic country within about 2500 miles radius
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Aug 20, 2023 21:55
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bob dobbs is dead posted:sporean xenophobia is this about that family that got wiped out in australia via bad mushrooms
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Aug 20, 2023 22:02
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infernal machines posted:my municipality is the largest landlord in the country. this would be fine if not for a decade and a half of city governments underfunding the community housing corp, leading to over $1billion in backlogged repairs and over a thousand units being removed from the market because they're literally uninhabitable. yep, ultimately i think it works only so-so in a *lot* of places, but the problems tend to be stuff that needs to get fixed *anyway* (i.e. get politics to do baseline sane things), and the starting point is for sure better than the pure-market-forces alternative. and it does work very well where i am at, so can be done.
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Aug 20, 2023 22:07
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hey guys, check this out: crapitalism eh? eh?
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Aug 20, 2023 22:07
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rotor posted:hey guys, check this out: 
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