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HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

slidebite posted:

Well, at risk of turning this toooo much into a political thread, the political pundits are pretty sure it's going to happen next week, with the actual vote to occur on Oct 14.

I'm pretty sure the house before the election will look very much the same as the house after the election. This is a waste of money.

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DrakeriderCa
Feb 3, 2005

But I'm a real cowboy!

Pretty Little Rainbow posted:

What do you figure the most important poo poo to read over here is?

Also what are the rules for face to face transfers in Canada?

Calibers that interchange, effective ranges for rounds and other minor bullshit. The most important thing is to know ACTS and PROVE down pat. Memorize that poo poo.

Face to face, as in "not involving a gun store"? Phone in the transfer, wait for it to be approved (Usually approved on the phone), and then sort out shipping or meeting options. In the case of a restricted gun, you may need to organize a short term ATT to get the firearm to the post office, or to pick it up. It's really straightforward.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg


Geez, I really don't want to keep making political poo poo in this thread, but I found this a real interesting read and thought some of those here would also.
Election call actually strategy to destroy the Liberals

quote:

OTTAWA -- Conventional wisdom suggests Stephen Harper must be mad to thrust the country into an election at a time when he has little hope of winning a majority.

The prime minister himself has acknowledged that public opinion polls "aren't particularly wonderful."

"My expectation is that we will have another minority," Harper said Wednesday in Tuktoyaktuk, N.W.T., where he's on a three-day, campaign-like swing through the Arctic.

So why have an election?

"It gives the government a fresh mandate that will give the government another couple of years to proceed," said Harper.

A former chief of staff to Harper suggests there's more to this seemingly self-evident, benign response than meets the eye.

Tom Flanagan, a political scientist at the University of Calgary, believes Harper would be satisfied to return with a strengthened minority -- a result that would throw the Liberals into chaos, thereby advancing the prime minister's longterm strategy of destroying Canada's so-called natural governing party.


"I don't think Harper has to be thinking about a majority at all," Flanagan said in an interview.

"Strategically, this is sort of a prolonged war of attrition."

As Flanagan sees it, the first major battle in this incremental war occurred in 2004, when Harper managed to reduce Paul Martin's Liberals to a minority. In the second clash in 2006, Harper won his own Conservative minority.

The third skirmish, which Harper appears set to launch next week, likely won't kill what Flanagan jokingly refers to as "the evil empire." But, if the Tories can win a few more seats at the Liberals' expense -- an outcome Flanagan considers realistic given Harper's superior campaign skills and the Tories' fatter war chest -- he predicted that would be enough to throw the Grits into a longterm tailspin that could eventually lead to their demise.

"You can fight a war with some objective less than total victory," he said of the coming campaign.

If the Liberals lose even a handful of seats, Flanagan predicted they'll immediately dump Leader Stephane Dion, a forecast echoed privately by plenty of Grits. The party would have to embark on a costly leadership campaign before most contenders from the last contest, including Dion, have paid off their leadership debts.

Moreover, a reduction in popular vote would mean the already cash-strapped Liberal party would get less money in election expenses rebates and in its annual public subsidy. Flanagan said that could make it difficult for the Liberals to pay off any debts from the coming election campaign and harder to secure bank loans for a future campaign.

Hence, he concluded, another Tory minority "would be enough to throw the Liberals into turmoil and give Harper . . . a virtually free hand in Parliament for quite a while and really handicap his main opponent."


Not surprisingly, Dion and other opposition leaders have a different assessment of Harper's strategy.

They contend the prime minister is inventing excuses for an early election strictly because he fears Tory fortunes will plummet over the fall as the government is hit with further bad news about the sluggish economy and various alleged ethical lapses.

They charge that Harper wants to pre-empt parliamentary committee hearings into the so-called Cadman affair and Tory party spending irregularities in the 2006 campaign.

And, they say, he wants to get the vote out of the way before Julie Couillard releases her tell-all book on Oct. 14, which promises more juicy details about her biker gang past and how her former relationship with Maxime Bernier ended in his resignation as foreign affairs minister.

Flanagan doubted such potential landmines -- which he believes could be easily defused -- are directly influencing Harper's decision to pull the plug on his government.

However, he said Harper would rather call the election himself, on his own timing and terms, than wait for the combined opposition parties to topple the government later this fall over some trumped up scandal.

"He doesn't like being at the mercy of others. He likes to be in control of what he's doing."

As plausible as the various theories on what's motivating Harper may be, Tory insider Bob Plamondon suspects only one thing would push Harper "over the edge" into an election: the prospect of winning a majority.

"I suspect that there's some pretty strong or in-depth party polls that are riding by riding, that are persuading him that his chances are pretty good right now,"
said Plamondon, author of a soon-to-be-released book chronicling the successes and failures of the Conservative party since Confederation.

"There may be some inner confidence that they can move those numbers closer to a majority."
Not sure if I share the authors hypothesis, but Harper is incredbily shrewd and intelligent. I certainly wouldn't put it past him and I'd give him a fat (for me) donation and a prayer at night
I don't pray, but I'll make an exception

Gtab
Dec 9, 2003
I am a horrible person, disregard my posts.

slidebite posted:

Not sure if I share the authors hypothesis, but Harper is incredbily shrewd and intelligent. I certainly wouldn't put it past him and I'd give him a fat (for me) donation and a prayer at night
I don't pray, but I'll make an exception

You and me both.

----------------
This thread brought to you by a tremendous dickhead!

Pretty Little Rainbow
Dec 27, 2005

by T. Finn


Can I apply for my PAL in BC exactly 28 days before my 18th birthday so my background check ends the day I turn 18 and I get that poo poo or what?

DrlHn
May 7, 2007


If the CFC is unusually fast in processing that application by one or two days, wouldn't they just reject it due to your age?

Chunderbucket
Aug 31, 2006

I had a beer with Stephen Miller once and now I like him.

DrlHn posted:

If the CFC is unusually fast in processing that application by one or two days

what the hell kind of CFC have you been working with

DrlHn
May 7, 2007


Chunderbucket posted:

what the hell kind of CFC have you been working with

Point taken.
He probably won't see it for months

beaver_cheese
Feb 13, 2001

Bad day for that beaver.

If I were in your shoes I'd wait the 28 days and apply after you've actually turned 18 just to be on the safe side. I can almost guarantee you wont be seeing anything for months, but you don't want any reason for your application to be denied.

Better safe than sorry.

Pretty Little Rainbow
Dec 27, 2005

by T. Finn


I heard that BCs is fairly awesome and not retarded.

Well If I'm going to wait another month on top of this I'll go blow this gun money on stupid poo poo,

DrlHn
May 7, 2007


like short term bonds

Chunderbucket
Aug 31, 2006

I had a beer with Stephen Miller once and now I like him.

Pretty Little Rainbow posted:

I heard that BCs is fairly awesome and not retarded.

Very well could be, once I moved to Alberta it was only a couple weeks wait after I contacted the CFC.

Months later, I went back to NB to get my poo poo to find out that the CFO had finally gotten around to visiting my house there, two days previous. This was probably 8-9 months after I originally submitted the application, mind you.

Chunderbucket fucked around with this message at 06:27 on Aug 31, 2008

DocCynical
Jan 9, 2003

That is not possible just now


Chunderbucket posted:

Very well could be, once I moved to Alberta it was only a couple weeks wait after I contacted the CFC.

Months later, I went back to NB to get my poo poo to find out that the CFO had finally gotten around to visiting my house there, two days previous. This was probably 8-9 months after I originally submitted the application, mind you.

Visited your house? WTF? Make sure you have a safe bolted down and poo poo?

KnightElite
Apr 10, 2004
Awesome

I'm currently looking to purchase a deer hunting rifle, and I live in Saskatchewan. However, I would like to get something that has a military style pistol grip (I was in the military for a while, and I find it a lot more comfortable to hold than a traditional rifle grip). Doesn't necessarily have to be an assault rifle derivative, though it seems likely that will be all I will find that matches this.

I've done some looking so far, and I've found the AR180B-2, which is too small a caliber for deer, the CZ-858, which might work (is 7.62mmx39mm an ammunition type I can get here, and is it suitable for deer hunting?), and the HK SL8-5, which is also .223 caliber and retarded expensive to boot. Is the CZ-858 my best bet for a rifle that does what I want, since all the larger caliber AR15 derivatives are restricted, or does a deer rifle of this type even exist that can be legally used in Canada?

Thanks for any help you guys can provide.

Pretty Little Rainbow
Dec 27, 2005

by T. Finn


7.62x39 is usually regarded as a pretty good deer round. A CZ-858 would do well I'd imagine and so would an SKS if you felt like putting one of those horrible pistol grip stocks on it.

Rhobot Mk. II
Jan 15, 2008
Mk. II: Bigger, longer, uncut robo-cock.

KnightElite posted:

I'm currently looking to purchase a deer hunting rifle, and I live in Saskatchewan. However, I would like to get something that has a military style pistol grip (I was in the military for a while, and I find it a lot more comfortable to hold than a traditional rifle grip). Doesn't necessarily have to be an assault rifle derivative, though it seems likely that will be all I will find that matches this.

I've done some looking so far, and I've found the AR180B-2, which is too small a caliber for deer, the CZ-858, which might work (is 7.62mmx39mm an ammunition type I can get here, and is it suitable for deer hunting?), and the HK SL8-5, which is also .223 caliber and retarded expensive to boot. Is the CZ-858 my best bet for a rifle that does what I want, since all the larger caliber AR15 derivatives are restricted, or does a deer rifle of this type even exist that can be legally used in Canada?

Thanks for any help you guys can provide.

You could also buy a Norinco M14-S and throw one of those drop dead sexy replacement stocks that has a pistol grip on it. .308 is great for deer.

Also: I have a question for people who've bought guns online. When they mail it to you, do they require YOU to be home to receive the package? I might be out of town when a gun I bought arrives. Can anyone sign for it or will they make you come to the post office?

DocCynical
Jan 9, 2003

That is not possible just now


Rhobot Mk. II posted:

You could also buy a Norinco M14-S and throw one of those drop dead sexy replacement stocks that has a pistol grip on it. .308 is great for deer.

Also: I have a question for people who've bought guns online. When they mail it to you, do they require YOU to be home to receive the package? I might be out of town when a gun I bought arrives. Can anyone sign for it or will they make you come to the post office?

It's just a package, anyone can sign for it. They don't "know" that it is a gun.

I had one brought right to my door on a Sunday around Christmas, which was awesome.

Alternatively, if your mail carrier is a douchebag and sucks and your gun is a pistol, they can cram it into the mailbox.

Rhobot Mk. II
Jan 15, 2008
Mk. II: Bigger, longer, uncut robo-cock.

DocCynical posted:

It's just a package, anyone can sign for it. They don't "know" that it is a gun.

I had one brought right to my door on a Sunday around Christmas, which was awesome.

Alternatively, if your mail carrier is a douchebag and sucks and your gun is a pistol, they can cram it into the mailbox.

Mother of god...I better go measure the mailbox

KnightElite
Apr 10, 2004
Awesome

Rhobot Mk. II posted:

You could also buy a Norinco M14-S and throw one of those drop dead sexy replacement stocks that has a pistol grip on it. .308 is great for deer.

Thanks, this is almost exactly what I was looking for! The other advantage is that the rifle is really cheap ($400) through Marstar, though getting the replacement stock adds another $600 onto the price.

Chunderbucket
Aug 31, 2006

I had a beer with Stephen Miller once and now I like him.

DocCynical posted:

Visited your house? WTF? Make sure you have a safe bolted down and poo poo?

Hell if I know, I never actually met him in person. I guess he had a question about the application which the Alberta CFO resolved with a five minute phone call, as opposed to wasting time making loving house calls.

Flanker
Sep 10, 2002

OPERATORS GONNA OPERATE
After a good night's sleep


KnightElite posted:

Thanks, this is almost exactly what I was looking for! The other advantage is that the rifle is really cheap ($400) through Marstar, though getting the replacement stock adds another $600 onto the price.


Is it too late to tell you to get the CZ-858? Costs a touch more than the M14 but 762x39 is cheaper and will murder deer just fine.

Rhobot Mk. II
Jan 15, 2008
Mk. II: Bigger, longer, uncut robo-cock.

Flanker posted:

Is it too late to tell you to get the CZ-858? Costs a touch more than the M14 but 762x39 is cheaper and will murder deer just fine.

Flanker, Do you know anywhere out east that has 762x39 in large supply? I'm thinking of adding an CZ-85L to my collection, but I don't know any place that carries it in quantity.

mikerock
Oct 29, 2005




CZ-58L (CZH-2003) > CZ-858

sailorjosh
Apr 23, 2006

Peanut butter, mother fucker.

Anyone know any sites that carry igman 8x57? I usually get igman ammo from districorp but they're out.

mikerock
Oct 29, 2005




I buy mine from Reliable, don't know if they ship ammo.

http://www.reliablegun.com/Reliable/Reliable.html

sailorjosh
Apr 23, 2006

Peanut butter, mother fucker.

mikerock posted:

I buy mine from Reliable, don't know if they ship ammo.

http://www.reliablegun.com/Reliable/Reliable.html

Thanks. Sent them an email. No way do I wanna pay $25 a box for remchester ammo.

Flanker
Sep 10, 2002

OPERATORS GONNA OPERATE
After a good night's sleep


Rhobot Mk. II posted:

Flanker, Do you know anywhere out east that has 762x39 in large supply? I'm thinking of adding an CZ-85L to my collection, but I don't know any place that carries it in quantity.

canadaammo.com

Also a great shop known as the USA

HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

Flanker posted:

Is it too late to tell you to get the CZ-858? Costs a touch more than the M14 but 762x39 is cheaper and will murder deer just fine.

I think finding good hunting ammo in 7.62x39 might be a problem. There's lots of FMJ stuff around but not a ton of soft point. .308 on the other hand is practically the standard hunting cartridge in North America.

KnightElite
Apr 10, 2004
Awesome

HPL posted:

I think finding good hunting ammo in 7.62x39 might be a problem. There's lots of FMJ stuff around but not a ton of soft point. .308 on the other hand is practically the standard hunting cartridge in North America.

This, and I like the look of the Norinco better. It still won't happen for a little while, since I still have to send in the forms to get my PAL (will be mailing them on Monday). Thanks for the suggestion though.

DrakeriderCa
Feb 3, 2005

But I'm a real cowboy!

Flanker posted:

Also a great shop known as the USA

Prison time!

sailorjosh
Apr 23, 2006

Peanut butter, mother fucker.

HPL posted:

I think finding good hunting ammo in 7.62x39 might be a problem. There's lots of FMJ stuff around but not a ton of soft point. .308 on the other hand is practically the standard hunting cartridge in North America.

Yeah, the only soft point around was Igman, and it's pretty much gone and as far as I know can't be imported right now for whatever stupid reason. They also make cheap .303, 8x57, and 7.62x54r soft point. Sucks.

DrakeriderCa
Feb 3, 2005

But I'm a real cowboy!

sailorjosh posted:

Yeah, the only soft point around was Igman, and it's pretty much gone and as far as I know can't be imported right now for whatever stupid reason. They also make cheap .303, 8x57, and 7.62x54r soft point. Sucks.

Milarm has some Bosnian soft point x39. I haven't shot it, but I've sold it to a few guys for hunting ammo.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg


Well, Qubecor's can once again sleep soundly knowing their government is extra-vigilant.

New Gun Law in Effect in Quebec

quote:

Quebec's new gun control legislation, Bill 9, came into force Monday.

The legislation is dubbed Anastasia's law in memory of 18-year-old Anastasia DeSousa, who was killed during the September 2006 Dawson College shooting.

The law bans the possession of firearms in schools and daycare centres, and on public and school transportation.


Fines for contravening the law forbidding firearm possession on those premises range from $500 to $5,000.

Under the new rules, teachers, gun club owners, and public transit and health-care workers are also required to report suspicious behaviour relating to firearms, even if it contradicts doctor-patient or any other confidentiality.

Further, there will be mandatory supervision of target practice where restricted and banned firearms are in use.

'These are small measures'

Wendy Cukier of the Coalition for Gun Control says the new law is a step in the right direction.

"These are small measures, but improvements are always incremental," she said in a phone interview.

Cukier praises the law's provision on reporting suspicious behaviour.

"A lot of the information about risk factors is not in police databases, but in the community," she said. "It's giving police additional tools as well as resources and will have an impact."

While Canada's gun control laws are largely a federal responsibility, Cukier noted that provincial legislation can strengthen the federal laws and limit loopholes.

Quebec's new laws were drafted after Kimveer Gill killed De Sousa during a shooting rampage at Dawson College. Another 20 people were injured.

Quebec now has some of the strictest gun control laws in Canada.

Montreal's École Polytechnique massacre in 1989, where a gunman shot and killed 14 women, led the federal government to toughen gun laws.
And I'm positive a law like this would have made Mr. Crazy Nuts think twice about killing.


Oh, but windbag is working on more:

quote:

Cukier will continue to lobby for stricter gun control.

She noted that Gill possessed a semi-automatic weapon and was a member of a gun club.

"We're still working to ensure that military-style weapons are not available to civilians," she said.

Yeah, thanks you stunned oval office. How about lobbying for a CCW so someone could actually stop a nut job that is bound and determined to cause mayhem with any weapon available?
Yeah, fat chance.

DrakeriderCa
Feb 3, 2005

But I'm a real cowboy!

Wendy Cukier boggles my mind. She's so aggressively stupid, it hurts.

Wendy Cukier posted:

"We're still working to ensure that military-style weapons are not available to civilians," she said.

You'll never take away my military-style rifle!

Only registered members can see post attachments!

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg


DrakeriderCa posted:

You'll never take away my military-style rifle!

Their logic is so hosed up, they can't hide a total ban agenda if they tried.

All Military Style Guns are banned. Our mission is complete!
YAY!
Hey, mah bolt action hunting rifle here is far more powerful than pretty much any military rifle.
BAN THE SNIPER RIFLE!
YAY!

Oh poo poo, I almost have a tear in my eye:
New poll put tories in the lead

This part:

quote:

Harper vs. Dion: leadership

The poll asked potential voters about several leadership qualities, and how they applied to Harper and Dion. Across Canada, most respondents preferred Harper.

The results suggest Dion has had a difficult time convincing Canadians he would be an effective prime minister:

Who would be better when it comes to...

Being prime minister of a majority government:

* Harper: 46 per cent
* Dion: 22 per cent

Being easygoing and likeable:

* Harper: 38 per cent
* Dion: 29 per cent

Standing up to the United States:

* Harper: 42 per cent
* Dion: 29 per cent

Caring about people like me:

* Harper: 30 per cent
* Dion: 28 per cent

I'm actually shocked. In a good way.

FullMetalJacket
Apr 5, 2008


slidebite posted:

Their logic is so hosed up, they can't hide a total ban agenda if they tried.

All Military Style Guns are banned. Our mission is complete!
YAY!
Hey, mah bolt action hunting rifle here is far more powerful than pretty much any military rifle.
BAN THE SNIPER RIFLE!
YAY!

Oh poo poo, I almost have a tear in my eye:
New poll put tories in the lead

This part:


I'm actually shocked. In a good way.

don't trade the devil that you have for the one you don't know, i guess.

slidebite
Nov 6, 2005

Good egg


FullMetalJacket posted:

don't trade the devil that you have for the one you don't know, i guess.
Well, I'll tell you one thing. Assuming Obama gets in and he carries through with his promise of renegotiating NAFTA, I'd feel more comfortable with Harper in the PM chair than Dion.

DrakeriderCa
Feb 3, 2005

But I'm a real cowboy!

slidebite posted:

Well, I'll tell you one thing. Assuming Obama gets in and he carries through with his promise of renegotiating NAFTA, I'd feel more comfortable with Harper in the PM chair than Dion.

Oh Lord yes.

large hands
Jan 24, 2006


Well I just impulse bought the last 10.5" LAR-15 that Questar had in stock

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HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

FullMetalJacket posted:

don't trade the devil that you have for the one you don't know, i guess.

As much as people rag on Harper for being "cold and distant", Dion is an absolute black hole of charisma. I am surprised at the numbers for the "standing up to the US" question since the media usually paints Harper as "Bush's lapdog" or "Walking in lockstep with Bush" or any other similar things. Polls are kind of BS anyway.

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