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fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames


Salad Prong

Johnny B. Goode posted:

Ok, now how do I do the same for other programs? Winamp, etc?

Tell Winamp to stop checking file associations everytime it starts.

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Nam Taf
Jun 25, 2005

I am Fat Man, hear me roar!



Johnny B. Goode posted:

Ok, now how do I do the same for other programs? Winamp, etc?

Winamp should not do it. If it does, read back a couple of pages on how to disable it from trying to re-take file associations, as you're changing file associations with another program when it is not running.

Maneki Neko
Oct 27, 2000



Two-Dogs posted:

Is there a way for me to get windows 7 on my pc right now? I'm running xp pro currently, and I didnt see any clear cut links on the microsoft website. I figured this was the place to ask.

Buy a technet or msdn subscription.

NFX
Jun 1, 2008



Fun Shoe

I think that the MSDNAA issue is just a temporary one (related to the corrupted installs that were discussed earlier?). At least it goes back and forth on the IEEE list. First there was nothing, then Windows 7 came up in Spanish, French, German and Japanese, and now it's down again.

LooseChanj
Feb 17, 2006

Logicaaaaaaaaal!


Thermopyle posted:

Out of curiosity, what do you miss about the old ways?

Would you believe I didn't use the start menu for years? Just an address toolbar on the taskbar and something called Truelaunch which let you make folders in a quicklaunch alike. XP sp3 did away with the first, and when I rebuilt my comp TL wouldn't work right. The app launcher gadget just wasn't that same.

Godzilla07
Oct 4, 2008



Has anybody had some weird sleep issues with W7? I'm running the Ultimate RTM. If I put my laptop to sleep for around 4+ hours, it will wake from sleep but the computer is only usable for about a minute before it locks up. It won't lock up slightly after wake if I just leave it on sleep for 2-3 hours though. I'm wondering if this is an issue with my laptop or W7. Aside from this minor nag, I'm loving W7 and it's been great ever since the Beta.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames


Salad Prong

Godzilla07 posted:

Has anybody had some weird sleep issues with W7? I'm running the Ultimate RTM. If I put my laptop to sleep for around 4+ hours, it will wake from sleep but the computer is only usable for about a minute before it locks up. It won't lock up slightly after wake if I just leave it on sleep for 2-3 hours though. I'm wondering if this is an issue with my laptop or W7. Aside from this minor nag, I'm loving W7 and it's been great ever since the Beta.

First: check that your BIOS and system drivers are up to date.

Also, it could be you have some program running that freaks out after 4+ hours in sleep mode and hangs the system: I think some DRM mechanisms do this. Could you post a list of all programs, active or background, that usually are running when you have the sleep problems?

Pilsner
Nov 23, 2002



Nam Taf posted:

You're odd.

The only way to do it would be to re-enable the quicklaunch section of the taskbar. I have no idea why you've got such dogged determination to use an inferior method. The addiction of habit really must be strong.

With the classic start menu, you can have a list of apps in the start menu, and open them by simply hitting Win + the first letter of the shortcut's name, given that it's unique. Some people put their 9 favorite apps in the start menu and prefix the shortcuts with "1", "2", etc., to allow instant startup of the app by hitting the number key.

Sorry if I sound like some "raarrgh gently caress M$" person here, but they truly have no idea how people are using Windows with the keyboard, they only consider people who click with their mouse.

Nam Taf
Jun 25, 2005

I am Fat Man, hear me roar!



Pilsner posted:

Sorry if I sound like some "raarrgh gently caress M$" person here, but they truly have no idea how people are using Windows with the keyboard, they only consider people who click with their mouse.

Win + 1-9 open the first 1-9 pinned items in the new taskbar. Just fyi, since obviously that means MS ignore keyboard users.

There's many more winkey shortcuts in W7 too, over what Vista had.

Pilsner
Nov 23, 2002



Nam Taf posted:

Win + 1-9 open the first 1-9 pinned items in the new taskbar. Just fyi, since obviously that means MS ignore keyboard users.

There's many more winkey shortcuts in W7 too, over what Vista had.

I don't use pinning, so I can't really use that, but thanks.

Nam Taf
Jun 25, 2005

I am Fat Man, hear me roar!



Pilsner posted:

I don't use pinning, so I can't really use that, but thanks.

Right click start menu item. Choose propeties. Click in 'shotcut key' section and bind it to a key. Unfortunately it seems to only bind it to a CTRL+ALT+[key] combo, but that is somewhat close, and you don't need to then even open your start menu.

This seems a bit outdated, it seems.

Lum
Aug 13, 2003



fishmech posted:

Tell Winamp to stop checking file associations everytime it starts.

So what about for other apps. I have an app that commits the henious security vulnerability of wanting to use the serial port and for some reason this triggers a UAC prompt.

I've used the app for years, it basically updates the database on a GPS unit that I have (Origin B2 for any UK car goons who give a poo poo) and it's kosher.

Would like to not have the UAC prompt every time I run it though, which is a couple of times a week.

Cojawfee
May 31, 2006
I think the US is dumb for not using Celsius

I solve that by not using UAC. Until Microsoft finds a way for me to say an application can do something, and can always do it without asking me, I am not using UAC.

What pisses me off is there isn't just a way to only pop up UAC when an application does something on its own. If I am running something, I shouldn't have to click through a bunch of windows just to start it up. I just want pop ups when some program is trying to install or run something else. I think the first setting of UAC would do something like this, but UAC never remembers anything I tell it, so what is the point?

capitalcomma
Sep 9, 2001

A grim bloody fable, with an unhappy bloody end.

-snip-

capitalcomma fucked around with this message at 03:22 on Jun 10, 2014

LooseChanj
Feb 17, 2006

Logicaaaaaaaaal!


Cojawfee posted:

when an application does something on its own.

Determing that is much, much, MUCH harder than it sounds.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames


Salad Prong

Cojawfee posted:

I solve that by not using UAC. Until Microsoft finds a way for me to say an application can do something, and can always do it without asking me, I am not using UAC.

If an application can always have full UAC priveleges, then if that program is compromised you have an always-on admin user to gently caress over the system with.

Linux and OS X both do the UAC-type thing as well because its the kind of security that actually works.

Honestly, you should consider using applications that are 1) Updated since Vista's launch and 2) Written by competent developers.

The Merkinman
Apr 22, 2007

I sell only quality merkins. What is a merkin you ask? Why, it's a wig for your genitals!

So still playing around in themes, the .themepack thing is nice.
I'm running the RC, but can someone running RTM confirm that themepacks CAN NOT change your account picture, even though it's mentioned with everything else under Personalize?


Pilsner posted:

I don't use pinning, so I can't really use that, but thanks.
Why don't you use pinning?
The apps that, when launched, would show up in the taskbar anyway, might as well already have them there and get the added benefit of Win+#

Lum
Aug 13, 2003



fishmech posted:

Honestly, you should consider using applications that are 1) Updated since Vista's launch and 2) Written by competent developers.

It was fine under XP, even in a non-admin account. It's only the bloody serial port.

To update the app, I'd also have to buy the newer version of the device in question, which I'm loathe to do because despite having a colour screen, it's missing an important feature that the old one has and I rely upon.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames


Salad Prong

Lum posted:

It was fine under XP, even in a non-admin account. It's only the bloody serial port.

To update the app, I'd also have to buy the newer version of the device in question, which I'm loathe to do because despite having a colour screen, it's missing an important feature that the old one has and I rely upon.

Lum posted:

There is also the driver that I use to update my Origin B2 (A GPS device that maintains a database of speed cameras) The USB interface doesn't work on Vista or 7, only XP, however I just use the serial cable instead which does work only it triggers a UAC prompt, apparently you need admin to access the serial port now? However if I only had the USB cable I'd have to use USB pass through to XP mode to get it to work.

If this is the same device it seems it would be easier to buy the USB cable and run XP Mode, than to buy a new device. But regardless yes it worked fine in XP, but XP was released in 2001! There were a bunch of serial port using devices that were incompatible with XP because XP freaked over direct serial port access and didn't have something like UAC to allow it.

Lum
Aug 13, 2003



fishmech posted:

If this is the same device it seems it would be easier to buy the USB cable and run XP Mode, than to buy a new device. But regardless yes it worked fine in XP, but XP was released in 2001! There were a bunch of serial port using devices that were incompatible with XP because XP freaked over direct serial port access and didn't have something like UAC to allow it.

I may as well use the serial cable and XP mode, even cheaper, however the startup time of XP mode is more annoying than having to OK a UAC prompt.

I think part of the issue may be because the app is from an "unknown publisher"

Edit: Just found out that the USB version is just a USB->Serial adaptor + driver and the same drat software anyway.

Lum fucked around with this message at 16:20 on Sep 21, 2009

Shrieking Muppet
Jul 16, 2006


Sorry if this belongs in Haus of tech support but I figured someone else might be having similar issues and might have some insight. I built a new machine this past week and I'm running windows 7 32bit RC until the real version comes out. right now have 3 hard drives running on it

C: New Segate, SATA
D: Not as new Segate, SATA
E: Old Segate, IDE

When windows 7 goes into standby and is woken up the D: drive will disappear. It won't come back until I reboot. From what i can tell this might be the OS. Additionally it lists C and D as electable in the USB eject interface on the system tray. From what i can gather its seeing the two drives as USB and ejects the D drive when on standby.

EDIT: Last one was IDE, not that it seems to matter.

Shrieking Muppet fucked around with this message at 20:32 on Sep 21, 2009

scarymonkey
Jul 15, 2003

by angerbeet


^^ What's the model of your system/motherboard?

Shrieking Muppet
Jul 16, 2006


scarymonkey posted:

^^ What's the model of your system/motherboard?

Gigabyte, GA-P55M-UD2

Reading into it some more i suspect the it might be the board enabling AHCI, which has windows deciding to eject the non system drive when it goes into standby.

redeyes
Sep 14, 2002
I LOVE THE WHITE STRIPES!

Ezekiel_980 posted:

Sorry if this belongs in Haus of tech support but I figured someone else might be having similar issues and might have some insight. I built a new machine this past week and I'm running windows 7 32bit RC until the real version comes out. right now have 3 hard drives running on it

C: New Segate, SATA
D: Not as new Segate, SATA
E: Old Segate, SATA

When windows 7 goes into standby and is woken up the D: drive will disappear. It won't come back until I reboot. From what i can tell this might be the OS. Additionally it lists C and D as electable in the USB eject interface on the system tray. From what i can gather its seeing the two drives as USB and ejects the D drive when on standby.

Hey thats screwed up, that happens to my Gigabyte DS3 with Windows 7 final. The HD is a d: drive which is a WD 1.5TB green power drive. Also in ACHI mode. Hmm.

Shrieking Muppet
Jul 16, 2006


redeyes posted:

Hey thats screwed up, that happens to my Gigabyte DS3 with Windows 7 final. The HD is a d: drive which is a WD 1.5TB green power drive. Also in ACHI mode. Hmm.

I tried turning the option off in the BIOS but the machine refused to boot. I will probably be installing Win7 64bit this coming weekend (Grandfather still has the 64bit iso that works) when I go home so I'll try an install with ACHI turned off and see what happens.

redeyes
Sep 14, 2002
I LOVE THE WHITE STRIPES!

Ezekiel_980 posted:

I tried turning the option off in the BIOS but the machine refused to boot. I will probably be installing Win7 64bit this coming weekend (Grandfather still has the 64bit iso that works) when I go home so I'll try an install with ACHI turned off and see what happens.

Well, You can certainly revert to the MS ACHI drivers. I believe that I am using the Intel Matrix Manager 8.9. I will revert tomorrow and post if it worked.

Xenomorph
Jun 13, 2001


Cojawfee posted:

I solve that by not using UAC. Until Microsoft finds a way for me to say an application can do something, and can always do it without asking me, I am not using UAC.

What pisses me off is there isn't just a way to only pop up UAC when an application does something on its own. If I am running something, I shouldn't have to click through a bunch of windows just to start it up. I just want pop ups when some program is trying to install or run something else. I think the first setting of UAC would do something like this, but UAC never remembers anything I tell it, so what is the point?

Woah, make sure you never, ever use Linux or Mac OS X then!

The amount of prompts for changing system settings on those operating systems can be mind-numbing. Those prompts require you to type in your password over and over and over to continue (and not just click "Continue" like in Windows).
I end up blanking my password before doing a lot of system changes in Linux or Mac OS X just to cut down on how annoying the prompts are (which just makes those "Mac vs PC" commercials that must more retarded considering Apple made fun of Vista's UAC prompts when it had a lot more annoying prompts in Mac OS X).

UAC is one of the absolute best thing to happen to Windows is a long loving time. It's right up there with Windows going 32-bit for the consumer in 1995, and Windows going with the NT kernel for consumers in 2001.

You really prefer things without UAC? That means the most destructive malware and most retardedly written applications can happily destroy anything they want in your OS. Windows was actually designed to let this happen before, and only Linux and Mac OS X actually tried to prevent it. Windows has an absolute lovely security record. UAC is a great step to improve security. It puts Windows security back up at a Linux and Mac OS X level.

DuckConference
May 27, 2004



Xenomorph posted:

You really prefer things without UAC? That means the most destructive malware and most retardedly written applications can happily destroy anything they want in your OS. Windows was actually designed to let this happen before, and only Linux and Mac OS X actually tried to prevent it. Windows has an absolute lovely security record. UAC is a great step to improve security. It puts Windows security back up at a Linux and Mac OS X level.

Yeah except the part where they neutered the security aspects of UAC in Windows 7.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames


Salad Prong

SecretFire posted:

Yeah except the part where they neutered the security aspects of UAC in Windows 7.

They didn't neuter it, that's just slashdot stupidity.

Xenomorph
Jun 13, 2001


SecretFire posted:

Yeah except the part where they neutered the security aspects of UAC in Windows 7.

Some system changes are auto-elevated. So yeah, it is possibly to change something by accident under Windows 7. This was to reduce the frequency of prompts for some common action.

Applications will still trigger it the same as far as I know.

So yeah, some retarded app trying to write to Windows or Program Files will still trigger UAC, and retarded functions like Winamp trying to re-set file associations on every launch will still trigger UAC.

Philthy
Jan 28, 2003



Pillbug

Xenomorph posted:

Woah, make sure you never, ever use Linux or Mac OS X then!

I never get prompted very often on my iMac. I turned off UAC in Vista because it was way too excessive. I plan on upgrading to Windows 7, so I guess I'll see if they've toned it down a poo poo ton or not.

fishmech
Jul 16, 2006

by VideoGames


Salad Prong

Philthy posted:

I never get prompted very often on my iMac. I turned off UAC in Vista because it was way too excessive. I plan on upgrading to Windows 7, so I guess I'll see if they've toned it down a poo poo ton or not.

Bro, you need to realize that this is because OS X apps have been part of a proper security system from the start. Where most of your Windows apps probably expect admin access all the time.

Iblys
Sep 23, 2003

gay for iBag....i mean, disconnect and self-destruct one bullet at a time...

n/m

4 Day Weekend
Jan 16, 2009


Xenomorph posted:

You really prefer things without UAC? That means the most destructive malware and most retardedly written applications can happily destroy anything they want in your OS. Windows was actually designed to let this happen before, and only Linux and Mac OS X actually tried to prevent it. Windows has an absolute lovely security record. UAC is a great step to improve security. It puts Windows security back up at a Linux and Mac OS X level.

You make it sound like without UAC you're computer will die, but I've been using XP for ages and I've never had something like that happen.

DuckConference
May 27, 2004



fishmech posted:

They didn't neuter it, that's just slashdot stupidity.

http://www.pretentiousname.com/misc...whitelist2.html

quote:

Win 7 UAC Code-Injection: How it works

In the quest to reduce the number of UAC prompts, for their code only, Microsoft have granted (at least) three groups of components special privileges:
Processes which anything else can run elevated without a UAC prompt.

This is the list of about 70 processes published on Rafael's Within Windows blog. (Update: New list for RC1 build 7100.) If you run a process on this list and it requires elevation then it -- the whole process -- will be given elevation without showing you a UAC prompt.

Discovery of this list is what lead to the earlier RunDll32.exe exploit where you could ask RunDll32.exe to run your code from within a DLL and it would do so with full elevation and no UAC prompt. Microsoft have since removed RunDll32.exe from the list but there are still plenty of other processes on the list, several of which can be exploited if you can copy files to the Windows folder.

Processes which can create certain elevated COM objects without a UAC prompt.

Programs on this second list are able, without being elevated themselves, to create certain elevated COM objects without triggering a UAC prompt. Once such an object has been created the processes can then tell it to perform actions which require administrator rights, such as copying files to System32 or Program Files.

This appears to be a superset of the first list. In fact, it seems to include all executables which come with Windows 7 and have a Microsoft authenticode certificate.

Unbelievably, as of build 7000 (and confirmed in RC1 build 7100), the list includes not only programs like Explorer.exe which use this feature (or potential security hole, if you like) but also programs such as Calc.exe, Notepad.exe and MSPaint.exe. Microsoft appear to have done nothing to minimize the attack surface and have arbitrarily granted almost all of their executables with this special privilege whether they actually use it or not. You can see evidence of this yourself by opening MSPaint, using the File Open dialog as a mini-file manager, and making changes within Program Files (e.g. create a folder or rename something); it'll let you do that without the UAC prompt that non-MS apps should trigger. I doubt that is intentional and it shows how little thought has gone into the UAC whitelist hacks MS have added to make their own apps seem better.
COM objects which can be created with elevation, by the things in list 2, without a UAC prompt.

Full enumeration of this list has not yet been done. The list is known to include IFileOperation and may simply be all Microsoft-signed COM objects that allow elevation at all.

It does not look like third-party COM objects can be elevated without triggering a UAC prompt, even by Microsoft processes, so the process and object must be on lists 2 and 3 respectively to bypass the UAC prompt. Given the number of processes which can be attacked and the fact that there are Microsoft COM objects to do many admin tasks, that isn't much of a consolation.

My proof-of-concept program is a standalone executable that is run as a normal unelevated process. I made from scratch in about a day and a half. Keep in mind that, while I am an experienced Windows developer, I am not a "security researcher" or "hacker" and this isn't the kind of thing I write every day.

The proof-of-concept works by directly copying (or injecting) part of its own code into the memory of another running processes and then telling that target process to run the code. This is done using standard, non-privileged APIs such as WriteProcessMemory and CreateRemoteThread.

quote:

The underlying problem is that the silent elevation feature, enabled by default in Windows 7 beta, does not check where the code requesting elevation comes from. It checks which process it is running within but not the particular code came from. So, for example, if you inject code into Explorer, or get Explorer to load your DLL, then you can create elevated COM objects without the user's knowledge or consent.

There are many ways to get your code into another process that's running at the same security level. That usually isn't a problem because there's usually nothing you can do in that other process that you can't already do in your own. The silent elevation feature changes that.

Getting your code into another process can be done in various ways. You can use buffer-overflow exploits (although ASLR helps greatly to mitigate those) or you can install yourself as a plugin DLL which the targeted program loads, like an Explorer shell extension. My proof-of-concept program uses a well-known technique called code injection. Code injection has the advantage that you don't have to trick the target program into loading your code; you simply push it into the other process and tell it to run it. This isn't a hack, either; everything is done using documented, supported APIs. (Legitimate uses of the APIs include debugging and inter-process communication. The APIs do not require elevation to use.)

DuckConference fucked around with this message at 08:19 on Sep 21, 2009

Stanley Pain
Jun 16, 2001

Bit. Trip. RIP.




Which is why you should run UAC on the highest setting.

The Gasmask
Nov 30, 2006

Breaking fingers like fractals

While messing around with Aero, I had a bunch of windows open and tried to alt-tab, but pressed the wrong key and windows key-tabbed instead. Turns out it's like a 3D alt-tab, where you use the mousewheel to cycle through and click on the window you want up front! I have a feeling that's one of the touted aero features, but I've only been using Windows 7 for a few days, so I'm still awed by all the little things. Microsoft has really hit the nail on the head with this OS, plus offering an RC until March is fantastic. I can see OSX users getting into Windows 7, I use both and they're finally on par.

I originally got the RC for use with a new computer I'm building, but I ran into a bunch of issues with hardware incompatibility so I finally said screw it and decided to install on my old machine while I waited for the parts. Even though my machine is older 7 runs extremely smooth, which is in part caused by the upgrade to a 64-bit OS. Still having some trouble recognizing anything more than 3.5 GB of RAM though (there's 4GB in the system). Games run great, faster than on XP, so I can finally play Prototype at more than 10fps.

On a slightly less cool note, I've noticed that Windows has trouble with applications that need to restart during the install. Instead of picking up where it left off it starts the process over again, meaning that I can't install the programs. Not critical, but it is annoying. I've tried messing around with UAC, searching high and low for a setting, and doing it on a different drive, but to no avail.

Sereri
Sep 30, 2008

awwwrigami



The Gasmask posted:

While messing around with Aero, I had a bunch of windows open and tried to alt-tab, but pressed the wrong key and windows key-tabbed instead. Turns out it's like a 3D alt-tab, where you use the mousewheel to cycle through and click on the window you want up front! I have a feeling that's one of the touted aero features

Not only this but it's been there since Vista

Zam Wesell
Mar 22, 2009

[Zam is suddenly shot in the neck by a toxic dart; Anakin and Obi-Wan see a "rocket-man" take off and fly away, and Zam dies]

I know this is a long shot but one can always hope. Has anyone tried Ableton Live 7/8 with Windows 7 64-bit and gotten it to work? Ableton 7 worked fine on my computer in Vista 64-bit, so it's weird that it doesn't work properly in Win7. I even tried "Run in compatibility mode" thingie. I've also messed around with all kinds of drivers and Aero on/off etc. The problem with Ableton is that it is quite laggy, when it ran perfectly in Vista (pc has 8gb ram, e8400, 9800gtx etc so specs arent the problem).

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KaLogain
Dec 29, 2004

I got her number. How do you like them apples?


Cybernetic Crumb

Ezekiel_980 posted:

Sorry if this belongs in Haus of tech support but I figured someone else might be having similar issues and might have some insight. I built a new machine this past week and I'm running windows 7 32bit RC until the real version comes out. right now have 3 hard drives running on it

C: New Segate, SATA
D: Not as new Segate, SATA
E: Old Segate, SATA

When windows 7 goes into standby and is woken up the D: drive will disappear. It won't come back until I reboot. From what i can tell this might be the OS. Additionally it lists C and D as electable in the USB eject interface on the system tray. From what i can gather its seeing the two drives as USB and ejects the D drive when on standby.

I had this exact same problem. I installed the latest Intel Matrix Storage Manager and it solved it.

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