Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
redeyes
Sep 14, 2002
I LOVE THE WHITE STRIPES!

'Much like with bit depth, there is a common misconception that the higher the sample rate, the better the quality of the audio. This isn’t so. Increasing your sampling rate simply allows you to capture higher frequencies. So as long as your sample rate is high enough to capture and reproduce the highest frequency in your audio, then that frequency and everything below it can be captured and reproduced perfectly. Increasing the sample rate cannot improve it in any way.'

redeyes fucked around with this message at 01:31 on Jun 1, 2021

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Zereth
Jul 8, 2003




... Casettes and DVD-A/SACD are the same level of convenience as a loving reel to reel?

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004









redeyes posted:

'Much like with bit depth, there is a common misconception that the higher the sample rate, the better the quality of the audio. This isn’t so. Increasing your sampling rate simply allows you to capture higher frequencies. So as long as your sample rate is high enough to capture and reproduce the highest frequency in your audio, then that frequency and everything below it can be captured and reproduced perfectly. Increasing the sample rate cannot improve it in any way.'

That sounds like someone who has not experienced GHz sampling with natural wood conductors for their power cables (the high tensile strength lignin fibers are able to withstand the massive sampling load).

BurritoJustice
Oct 9, 2012



Zereth posted:

... Casettes and DVD-A/SACD are the same level of convenience as a loving reel to reel?

Also cassettes, the shittest medium of all time, above streaming for quality.

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.

Have there been any good audiophile tantrums yet over the push towards lossless streaming?

EL BROMANCE
Jun 10, 2006

COWABUNGA DUDES!



Zereth posted:

... Casettes and DVD-A/SACD are the same level of convenience as a loving reel to reel?

I could probably get my hands on a reel to reel faster than something that can play DVD-A

BurritoJustice posted:

Also cassettes, the shittest medium of all time, above streaming for quality.

High speed dubbed, crap tapes on crap equipment sure, but it’s perfectly possible to make a cassette sound great too. Certainly heard stuff that came very close to the CD original in terms of quality.

(Not knocking that streaming isn’t better quality, just it’s not the ‘shittest medium’ that a lot of people remember).

qirex
Feb 15, 2001



njsykora posted:

Have there been any good audiophile tantrums yet over the push towards lossless streaming?

It’s not high res enough! Current complaining trends include lack of support for DSD, a niche format only used by SACD until recently which apparently has hideous license fees despite its [because of?] its obscurity so it has extremely limited support outside of foobar2000

BurritoJustice
Oct 9, 2012



EL BROMANCE posted:

I could probably get my hands on a reel to reel faster than something that can play DVD-A
High speed dubbed, crap tapes on crap equipment sure, but it’s perfectly possible to make a cassette sound great too. Certainly heard stuff that came very close to the CD original in terms of quality.

(Not knocking that streaming isn’t better quality, just it’s not the ‘shittest medium’ that a lot of people remember).

Yeah, I know tapes have a higher end that can approach archive quality. They're just more suceptible to wear and cheap gear so the end user experience is often really poor. Were digital audio tapes ever a thing?

Zereth
Jul 8, 2003




EL BROMANCE posted:

I could probably get my hands on a reel to reel faster than something that can play DVD-A

I as assuming this was if you owned the required hardware.

Take the plunge! Okay!
Feb 24, 2007





BurritoJustice posted:

Yeah, I know tapes have a higher end that can approach archive quality. They're just more suceptible to wear and cheap gear so the end user experience is often really poor. Were digital audio tapes ever a thing?

There is a format called Digital Audio Tape. A friend of mine had one of the early consumer products using DAT in his pretty sweet setup, but the CD pretty much killed any possibility of a DAT home market. As far as I know, it still has use in commercial applications.

KozmoNaut
Apr 23, 2008

Happiness is a warm
Turbo Plasma Rifle


DAT was a candidate for a recordable replacement or complement to the CD, but it got hobbled by fears of large-scale copyright infringement. These days it's only really used in situations involving old recordings originally made to DAT and not yet transferred to disk or another archival format. Sony stopped making DAT equipment in 2005, so it is very much a dying format that has no benefit over hard disk recording or portable digital recorders with flash storage.

Magnetic tape in general is a shrinking niche, the only real holdout is large-scale backup to LTO tape, due to a favorable price per GB compared to hard drives.

KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 08:33 on Jun 1, 2021

Neurophonic
May 2, 2009


taqueso posted:

That sounds like someone who has not experienced GHz sampling with natural wood conductors for their power cables (the high tensile strength lignin fibers are able to withstand the massive sampling load).

https://www.kv2audio.com/technology.html#DynamicVsSampling

quote:

At KV2 we undertook a different approach to digital to overcome the inherent problems in existing systems. We looked at an alternate conversion process developed by Sony™ and Philips™ called Direct Stream Digital or DSD. The Super Audio CD (SACD) is based on this digital format and unlike PCM conversion, DSD technology is based on a 1 Bit Sigma-Delta converter that produces a stream of pulses. The amplitude of the analog waveform is represented by the density of pulses and is called Pulse Density Modulation (PDM). The resulting digital bit stream is encoded at an enormous 2,822,400 samples per second! (2.8224MHz)

This a company making PA products, not even hifi. If you scroll down there’s this beauty:

Collateral Damage
Jun 13, 2009



DAT did find a use as a data storage media through the DDS standard and was in use up until the early 2010s before it could no longer keep up with LTO.

And as KozmoNaut says, magnetic media in general is dying out as its only remaining advantage (cost-per-capacity) is getting slimmer and slimmer for each year.

e: I think it was limits of the physical format that killed DDS, there was simply not enough room in the casette to expand capacity any more. The last two DDS standards went to an 8mm tape instead of a 4mm to expand capacity, but by then LTO was already eating its lunch.

Collateral Damage fucked around with this message at 15:00 on Jun 1, 2021

Flipperwaldt
Nov 11, 2011

Won't somebody think of the starving hamsters in China?



The lossy Digital Compact Cassette existed for a short while too.

KozmoNaut
Apr 23, 2008

Happiness is a warm
Turbo Plasma Rifle


It's now been a full two months since I got laid off, and company policy is to only keep laid-off people around for long enough to finish any outstanding tasks, even if they have a 6-month severance period with full pay. So I've been milling around at home, looking for jobs online, having some interesting online interviews, but also a lot of time to listen to music.

As I was idly listening to some new promo albums that came in, I was fiddling around with my receiver's settings, and I realized that I actually don't like Audyssey at all, it's almost muffled compared to the direct sound. Listening to music is much more pleasing to me with it turned off, which makes sense in hindsight. I bought my speakers because I like the way they sound, so it seems silly to mash a whole ton of EQ and correction on top of that.

I turned off dynamic EQ as well, it's too heavy-handed even at the 15dB setting for "loudly mixed rock/pop music". It still gets switched on automatically when I turn on dynamic volume for watching movies in the evening/night, and that seems like the best use for it.

Not that Audyssey and similar systems are completely useless or anything, they make a lot of sense for subwoofers or correction up to a room's transition freqency, which is why I'm glad my Denon has the "bypass L/R" setting (which Audyssey Labs say you should never use), so my subs still have room correction applied.

Of course, my experience is based on the standard Audyssey MultEQ, and from what I've read XT is even worse in how much correction it applies to higher frequencies. XT32 is supposedly much more focused on low frequencies, plus I think you can limit the frequency range it applies filters to. I don't know how bad/good YPAO, Dirac and so on are in comparison, but I think I'm just sticking with minimal correction from now on.

This has been your "I've been laid off and I'm bored at home due to lockdown" moment.

KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 18:15 on Jun 2, 2021

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

Someone linked a site over in the pseudoscience thread.



Oof. I mean, it looks nice, but it's so entirely uselessly complicated.

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003





A steal at a mere $1934 for a 2 meter power cable!

knox_harrington
Feb 18, 2011

Running no point.

Combat Pretzel posted:

Someone linked a site over in the pseudoscience thread.



Oof. I mean, it looks nice, but it's so entirely uselessly complicated.

It's also a render, right?

qirex
Feb 15, 2001



LessLoss are the ones who make the Blackbody, the spiritual successor to the VPI Magic Brick.

Fake edit: it’s now active! Still does nothing.

redeyes
Sep 14, 2002
I LOVE THE WHITE STRIPES!

doing that kind of random poo poo with leads will cause impedance changes and other artifacts.. probably still inaudible changes.

strtj
Feb 1, 2010


knox_harrington posted:

It's also a render, right?

I don't think so. If you are ripping people off for the kind of money they are, you can almost certainly afford some really nice wire stripping equipment and a good macro photography rig.

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

knox_harrington posted:

It's also a render, right?
Quite possible. If so, great attention to detail.

On the other hand, I work in cable manufacturing, and the guy who prepares the model for catalog shots over here can do pretty fancy things with the cables.

spookygonk
Apr 3, 2005
Does not give a damn


https://www.audiowood.com/shop/sit-and-spin-coffee-tableturntable

That plinth looks a little big.

Oh there's more delights on this website:


https://www.audiowood.com/shop/el-chunko

spookygonk fucked around with this message at 10:54 on Jun 4, 2021

KozmoNaut
Apr 23, 2008

Happiness is a warm
Turbo Plasma Rifle


At least it's aptly named.

Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



I kinda like it. Also you missed these.

Neurophonic
May 2, 2009



This has to be genius level trolling.
https://www.audiowood.com/shop/little-sound-things





https://aliens.fandom.com/wiki/Houndeye

Olympic Mathlete
Feb 25, 2011





Fantastic Foreskin posted:

I kinda like it. Also you missed these.

$175 dollar driver, $1750 retail price. Nice mark up.

Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



Is it sad that when I saw the website I thought it was cheap for "audiophile" and reasonably ("reasonably") priced for "art"?

Crime on a Dime
Nov 28, 2006



Fantastic Foreskin posted:

Is it sad that when I saw the website I thought it was cheap for "audiophile" and reasonably ("reasonably") priced for "art"?

strtj
Feb 1, 2010



Oh no... they just ripped apart a Pro-Ject turntable? So they're taking an entry level belt drive system and turning it into... this? I mean, I know people get obsessed with mass and anti-resonant bases, but

e: a Rega turntable, no better.

strtj
Feb 1, 2010


Fantastic Foreskin posted:

I kinda like it. Also you missed these.

"delivery anywhere in the Deep South can be arranged" I think I found the answer to what is going on here.

strtj
Feb 1, 2010


I looked it up and the resonant frequencies of concrete are actually pretty gnarly. You've got big spikes at 10kHz and up, so even assuming that you've managed to cancel any possible resonance down in the standard un-braced wood area (~200-1000Hz, depending on cabinet size and material) you've just shifted those resonances higher rather than eliminating them.

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






strtj posted:

I looked it up and the resonant frequencies of concrete are actually pretty gnarly. You've got big spikes at 10kHz and up, so even assuming that you've managed to cancel any possible resonance down in the standard un-braced wood area (~200-1000Hz, depending on cabinet size and material) you've just shifted those resonances higher rather than eliminating them.



This gives me an idea for a listening room on a giant seismologically isolated platform. You know, so the sound of plate tectonics doesn't get in the way of your enjoyment of *reads notes* The Sheffield Track & Drum Record.

strtj
Feb 1, 2010


KillHour posted:

This gives me an idea for a listening room on a giant seismologically isolated platform. You know, so the sound of plate tectonics doesn't get in the way of your enjoyment of *reads notes* The Sheffield Track & Drum Record.

Excuse me, I will not have any of that trash in my listening room. I exclusively demo new systems with The Cardas Sweep Record, or a DSD rip of it made on $50k worth of equipment.

Bargearse
Nov 27, 2006

Don't get your pen, son, you won't be needing that. My order's simple, a shitload of dim sims. And I want a bucket of soya sauce.



Those look a lot like the round concrete Tannoys I posted here a while ago.

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004









This is what happens when someone actually follows through on the "let's make an audiphile store lol" idea

DancingShade
Jul 26, 2007

MAYBE IF MY WEAK NONSENSICAL "BURNS" ARE CONVOLUTED ENOUGH, NOBODY WILL NOTICE THAT IN SPITE OF BEING A CONDESCENDING TAINTSMEAR IN EVERY THREAD I POST IN, I HAVE LITERALLY NEVER HAD ANYTHING EVEN REMOTELY INSIGHTFUL OR FUNNY TO SAy.

I want to build and sell an audio cable that's simply a heavily insulated tube filled with conductive liquid metal (highly prone to leaking if pierced). Ideally something dangerous like mercury.

Slap on some really nice cable sleeving, call it "stellar-grade audio" or something, suitable for use in space missions to the moons of neptune. The liquid metal really smoothes the highs and evens out the mids.

Price? Only available for hard gold bullion. Delivered, no certificates accepted.

KozmoNaut
Apr 23, 2008

Happiness is a warm
Turbo Plasma Rifle


Reverse audiophiles can be fun, too.


quote:

You have not heard those, they absolutely do sound more precise than cheap studio monitors. I think they may actually be flat with both bass and treble all the way down, but then they just don't sound like loudspeakers at all.


quote:

I understand your disbelief. I was also in disbelief as I expected the speakers to be a joke and wouldn't believe it if I didn't hear it myself. But they are as much above cheap studio monitors as the monitors are above regular hifi speakers. I guess there is some DSP magic at play, but they realy sound that good. Really the only way we could resolve this issue is that you [...] listen for yourself.

quote:

The problem is that you seem to be assuming I like them for the opposite reason why I do, so I guess you will just need to listen for yourself.

I think they might actually be doing the opposite of what you suggest - they generate overtones that cancel out the overtones produced by the speaker itself.

I have been listening on studio monitors for years, as I prefer the sound over the typical consumer audio sound.

Sure, they won't shatter your room, and they are really only powerful enough for listening from close distance, but the thing is how the bass sounds like real bass, rather than loudspeaker bass, it sort of adds weight to other sounds, rather than being directly heard and the whole sound often almost sounds like if it wasn't coming out of speakers.

quote:

Based on comparing them with studio monitors. They sound more like good headphones or not like speakers at all. They can play string bass. The drums sound unamplified on good enough recordings. There is no doubt that their distortion is extraordinarily low, and it's not the distortion of the amplifier but the speakers. I don't know how you expect me to prove it to you.

quote:

They can play the kick drum without any noticeable accompanying "dunnn" sound, which is enough to tell that their distortion must be extraordinarily low. In fact the people who said they "yes, they make sound" may dislike them for their dryness. Occams razor has nothing to do with that, as your phone screen has better image quality than the best TV screens a few decades ago. And that is my last reply, do it yourself if you care about measurements, you'd probably say I faked them anyway.

Context: This dude was adamant that his speakers have superior clarity and lower distortion than studio monitors costing 100x as much, based on a theory that Chinese manufacturers don't know that low frequency distortion is less audible, so they build their speakers and amps with super low distortion. And that somehow makes them sound better than studio monitors.

These are the speakers in question: https://aliexpress.com/item/4001105186185.html

KozmoNaut fucked around with this message at 08:47 on Jun 5, 2021

smellmycheese
Feb 1, 2016



DancingShade posted:

I want to build and sell an audio cable that's simply a heavily insulated tube filled with conductive liquid metal (highly prone to leaking if pierced). Ideally something dangerous like mercury.

Slap on some really nice cable sleeving, call it "stellar-grade audio" or something, suitable for use in space missions to the moons of neptune. The liquid metal really smoothes the highs and evens out the mids.

Price? Only available for hard gold bullion. Delivered, no certificates accepted.

I was thinking the other day. Has anyone ever tried a speaker cable company that just sells cables of stranded precious metals? Silver for the pleb tier, moving on up to gold and platinum, and then some ultra rare earth metals for the big spenders. I reckon it could be a money spinner

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull


KozmoNaut posted:

Context: This dude was adamant that his speakers have superior clarity and lower distortion than studio monitors costing 100x as much, based on a theory that Chinese manufacturers don't know that low frequency distortion is less audible, so they build their speakers and amps with super low distortion. And that somehow makes them sound better than studio monitors.

These are the speakers in question: https://aliexpress.com/item/4001105186185.html

I wish I could thank you for posting this because it made me giggle but I think my brain broke too, help

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply