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Who Killed WCW?
Eric Bischoff
Hulk Hogan
Vince Russo
Jerusalem
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oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

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Rusty Shackelford posted:

Can we talk about something that WCW did that I thought was great? I really thought the WCW All-Nighter specials were awesome from top to bottom.

For those not aware, WCW ran a couple of marathons on TBS of old matches and it was hosted by Tony, Larry, Bobby & Gene hanging out in what appeared to be a hotel room like they were having a sleepover of sorts and they would talk about the matches and the angles before and after they showed them.

I was in high school during the Monday Night Wars and me and my friends (read: my dog) watched a LOT of wrestling and I cannot ever recall these marathons.

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Rusty Shackelford
Feb 7, 2005


oldpainless posted:

I was in high school during the Monday Night Wars and me and my friends (read: my dog) watched a LOT of wrestling and I cannot ever recall these marathons.

That's because they took place before the Monday Night Wars.

oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

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Rusty Shackelford posted:

That's because they took place before the Monday Night Wars.

Oh, OK. They sound pretty cool. I wish I had seen some of them. Although I would rather they just have Bobby and Gene and jettison Tony and Larry.

ultimateforce
Apr 25, 2008

SKINNY JEANS CANT HOLD BACK THIS ARC


Mr. Carlisle posted:

Norman Smiley was one of my favorite wrestlers for reasons really unknown to even me after I first watched a match where I think he was just jobbed out. The combination of the name, the fact that he was smiling for most of his match and then when he started doing ridiculous dances and hamming it up - it just 'worked' somehow and made the guy really likable.

For the Smackdown taping I went to Smiley did the curtain jerker match of the night and 1/2 the arena did a NORMAN! chant for a very short moment and it was pretty loving rad. I had forgotten all about it till just now.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


I loved Norman Smiley even as a jobber on WCW Saturday Night before he got any gimmick. I remember in late 97 when he did a quick promo where he declared even if anyone else wouldn't, he would stand behind Sting against the nWo! I just wish WCW had been willing to get behind him. He was a good worker who was over, but they'd never push him beyond joke Hardcore title reigns where Ralphus was the guy who got more of the spotlight.

Carlton Banks
Jan 5, 2004

"The Tigers' biggest obstacle to a championship will be keeping a straight face. The Tigers in three."

Rusty Shackelford posted:

That's because they took place before the Monday Night Wars.

Yeah, the last one I remember watching was in late 91 or early 92 (might have went on longer though). I just remember waking up one night and I couldn't fall back asleep so I turned on the tv, started flipping channels and OH MAN WCW IS ON AT 2 AM

The WWE experimented with that the weekend of WM12, when they aired every PPV from WM11 through the Feb '96 In Your House for $30 (the standard PPV price at the time), with Dok Hendrix talking for a few minutes between each show explaining the major angles of the PPV that was coming on next. I can't imagine them doing that today since it would cut into DVD sales, but it was pretty cool.

I think I ODed on wrestling that weekend; from Friday through Monday I watched the 12 PPV marathon (only sleeping through Summerslam since I'd already watched it) + WM12 + Raw/Nitro

Today it takes a miracle to make it through a whole Raw or Smackdown

Carlton Banks fucked around with this message at 04:00 on Jan 9, 2010

MelvinTheJerk
Jun 4, 2001

I'm still here.


The best part of WCW when I was in high school was Jericho being the man with a thousand and one holds.

Also, the man with one hold. ARM BAR!

Beef Jerky Robot
Sep 20, 2009

"And the DICK?"


MelvinTheJerk posted:

The best part of WCW when I was in high school was Jericho being the man with a thousand and FOUR holds.

The American Dream
Mar 1, 2007
Don't Forget My Balls

MelvinTheJerk posted:

The best part of WCW when I was in high school was Jericho being the man with a thousand and one holds.

Also, the man with one hold. ARM BAR!

loving read the list during a commercial break to the fans in the arena.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


WCW on a pole matches!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VthqNbuI3s David Flair vs DDP from a random Nitro in 1999...

Oh wait no, it is from Starrcade 99. Great idea Russo, stick DDP in a pole match on your biggest PPV of the year against David Flair.

The infamous Pinata on a pole match: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qrvIAOCk_pQ Maybe I've posted that before, it feels like I should have by now. Guess who is on commentary.

Suben
Jul 1, 2007

In 1985 Dr. Strange makes a rap album.


MassRayPer posted:

I loved Norman Smiley even as a jobber on WCW Saturday Night before he got any gimmick. I remember in late 97 when he did a quick promo where he declared even if anyone else wouldn't, he would stand behind Sting against the nWo! I just wish WCW had been willing to get behind him. He was a good worker who was over, but they'd never push him beyond joke Hardcore title reigns where Ralphus was the guy who got more of the spotlight.

With Norman Smiley under WWE contract (as a trainer for FCW) I really wish they'd bring him on screen for a segment with Santino. Holy gently caress would those two be amazing together.

Smiley has like the most appropriate name ever. It's impossible to hate him!

MelvinTheJerk
Jun 4, 2001

I'm still here.


The American Dream posted:

loving read the list during a commercial break to the fans in the arena.

That was part of what was so funny. They would come back from break and he would still be going. I don't think I'd ever marked so hard up to that point as I did when Ralphus hit the armbar on Malenko.

Also, Jericho doing the Goldberg entrance with Ralphus but constantly getting lost backstage was equally hilarious.

Volcano Style
May 2, 2006

THERE IS ONLY ONE


I will never forget Screamin' Norman Smiley's reign as Hardcore Champion, it was the most amazing thing. I remember a match where he'd agreed to defend the title against Jimmy Hart, who came to the ring in a full medieval suit of armour and nothing Norman could do would hurt him. And Norman retained when he put Hart through a table and Jimmy couldn't get up again.

Please someone track this down for me.

Orange Carlisle
Jul 14, 2007



Wait - Norman Smiley is still employed with a wrestling company.. and its WWE? Awesome.

Golden Bee
Dec 24, 2009

I came here to chew bubblegum and quote 'They Live', and I'm... at an impasse.


The American Dream posted:

loving read the list during a commercial break to the fans in the arena.

According to his book, he actually just started insulting them so they'd be really really rowdy when they got back.

They really, really misused Jericho.

JOHN CENA
Oct 20, 2006


Golden Bee posted:

According to his book, he actually just started insulting them so they'd be really really rowdy when they got back.

They really, really misused Jericho.

you gotta know there's something wrong with a company for punishing their midcarders for getting bigger reactions than their main eventers.

Free Market Gravy
Sep 17, 2005



dusty udder smoker posted:

you gotta know there's something wrong with a company for punishing their midcarders for getting bigger reactions than their main eventers.

Reading the portion of Jericho's book where he explains a very simple "Jericho makes fun of Goldberg, Jericho gets destroyed by Goldberg" storyline to Bischoff, Hogan and Goldberg and gets met with anger and utter confusion made me the entire time.

It was a perfect example of slamming one's head into a brick wall.

Skinty McEdger
Mar 9, 2008

I have NEVER received the respect I deserve as the leader and founder of The Masterflock, the internet's largest and oldest Christopher Masterpiece fan group in all of history, and I DEMAND that changes. From now on, you will respect Skinty McEdger!



The Hogan spin on the Jericho situation was that he liked him alot and felt he should've been better used by WCW, but it was that terrible backstage politician Kevin Nash that held him down. On the otherhand Nash says that he was pushing for him to have a better role, shown by how still didn't bury him on his way out when he had the book and that they shared an agent.

However the best take on the situation was by Scott Steiner, who said in his shoot that they all wanted him in the NWO, 'which was the best sign that they wanted to kill his heat.' I cannot recommend Steiners shoot video enough.

Paper Jam Dipper
Jul 14, 2007

by XyloJW


I can't recall if it was a rumour at the time or fantasy booking in the late 90s, but I remember talk that Chris Jericho was supposed to be the leader of the nWo when it splintered and Hogan left (Which he did after the Warrior feud, and then left the Black and White nWo to make it a B team. There was talk of him leaving the nWo a lot in 1998). "nWo Express" was the name being passed around.

Again, I don't remember if it was legit or not. I just remember it in some forums in like 1998/1999.

Skinty McEdger
Mar 9, 2008

I have NEVER received the respect I deserve as the leader and founder of The Masterflock, the internet's largest and oldest Christopher Masterpiece fan group in all of history, and I DEMAND that changes. From now on, you will respect Skinty McEdger!



They started the Jericho in the NWO angle by having the giant win him the TV title, and then look out for him in his first few title defences. According to Jericho's book, when Jericho told Bischoff he didn't want to join the group as he didn't want to be one of twenty guys standing around twiddling their thumbs in the background, instead of changing the booking they just kept the angle without ever explaining why the Giant would be looking out for Jericho even in favour of his NWO team mates.

Paper Jam Dipper
Jul 14, 2007

by XyloJW


Skinty McEdger posted:

They started the Jericho in the NWO angle by having the giant win him the TV title, and then look out for him in his first few title defences. According to Jericho's book, when Jericho told Bischoff he didn't want to join the group as he didn't want to be one of twenty guys standing around twiddling their thumbs in the background, instead of changing the booking they just kept the angle without ever explaining why the Giant would be looking out for Jericho even in favour of his NWO team mates.

"Did anyone change the script for Giant to stop helping Jericho?"
"Why, did it happen last week?"
"Yeah, Giant mentioned it happened again last week."
"Do you know where it's on today's show?"
"Well, we just changed the opening and main event four times. Do you want to change that?"
"I just want to do coke man."

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


Skinty McEdger posted:

They started the Jericho in the NWO angle by having the giant win him the TV title, and then look out for him in his first few title defences. According to Jericho's book, when Jericho told Bischoff he didn't want to join the group as he didn't want to be one of twenty guys standing around twiddling their thumbs in the background, instead of changing the booking they just kept the angle without ever explaining why the Giant would be looking out for Jericho even in favour of his NWO team mates.

The answer is obviously that even back then, Big Show and Jericho knew they would be the best of friends forever and one day dominate the tag team world.

nyratk1
Jul 24, 2006

by Tiny Fistpump


Jerusalem posted:

The answer is obviously that even back then, Big Show and Jericho knew they would be the best of friends forever and one day dominate the tag team world.

They saw the sparkle in each other's eyes.

oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

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Skinty McEdger posted:

The Hogan spin on the Jericho situation was that he liked him alot and felt he should've been better used by WCW, but it was that terrible backstage politician Kevin Nash that held him down. On the otherhand Nash says that he was pushing for him to have a better role, shown by how still didn't bury him on his way out when he had the book and that they shared an agent.

However the best take on the situation was by Scott Steiner, who said in his shoot that they all wanted him in the NWO, 'which was the best sign that they wanted to kill his heat.' I cannot recommend Steiners shoot video enough.

Where can i get Steiner's video? I bet its one of the greatest things in the world.

Paper Jam Dipper
Jul 14, 2007

by XyloJW


Jerusalem posted:

The answer is obviously that even back then, Big Show and Jericho knew they would be the best of friends forever and one day dominate the tag team world.

Back then, it was the former Champion Giant looking out for midcard sensation Jericho.

Last year, it was tag team Champion and legend Jericho looking out for plodding giant Big Show.

Skinty McEdger
Mar 9, 2008

I have NEVER received the respect I deserve as the leader and founder of The Masterflock, the internet's largest and oldest Christopher Masterpiece fan group in all of history, and I DEMAND that changes. From now on, you will respect Skinty McEdger!



oldpainless posted:

Where can i get Steiner's video? I bet its one of the greatest things in the world.

Scott Steiners shoot is from RF video. Its not at all what you would expect from him. He's a very reasoned intellegent athelete who has dumb himself down so all those stupid marks can understand him. Oddly enough he hardly hates anyone. Except HHH and Shawn, oh and Buff Bagwell.

oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

This post brought to you by RAID: SHADOW LEGENDS.
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Skinty McEdger posted:

Scott Steiners shoot is from RF video. Its not at all what you would expect from him. He's a very reasoned intellegent athelete who has dumb himself down so all those stupid marks can understand him. Oddly enough he hardly hates anyone. Except HHH and Shawn, oh and Buff Bagwell.

I don't know if your being sarcastic about the dumbing down part. But not hating anyone surprises me. I would think he hates like at least half the people in the industry. But why does he hate Bagwell? They were such good friends in the NWO!!

CVagts
Oct 19, 2009


oldpainless posted:

I don't know if your being sarcastic about the dumbing down part. But not hating anyone surprises me. I would think he hates like at least half the people in the industry. But why does he hate Bagwell? They were such good friends in the NWO!!

Wasn't there an incident when Bagwell took the piss out of Scott in an interview, dressing like him and doing an impression of him, and then Scott beat the everloving poo poo out of him at the PPV?

Satire Forum Mom
Oct 4, 2003
MY CUNT DRIPS BROWN REFUSE LIKE A DIRTY HOOKAH. PS. THE BACK OF MY THIGHS ARE RIDICULOUS - COTTAGE CHEESE ANYONE?

oldpainless posted:

I don't know if your being sarcastic about the dumbing down part. But not hating anyone surprises me. I would think he hates like at least half the people in the industry. But why does he hate Bagwell? They were such good friends in the NWO!!

He's not- Scott Steiner sounds like a really smart, logical dude in that shoot. He's full of poo poo sometimes, but I mean, guy's still a wrestler.

Skinty McEdger
Mar 9, 2008

I have NEVER received the respect I deserve as the leader and founder of The Masterflock, the internet's largest and oldest Christopher Masterpiece fan group in all of history, and I DEMAND that changes. From now on, you will respect Skinty McEdger!



Satire Forum Mom posted:

He's not- Scott Steiner sounds like a really smart, logical dude in that shoot.

Exactly this. He's entirely respectful and well spoken. He even brings up that if even if he hated Russo's booking, what was he going to do about it: he was getting a legit push out of it which was more than he could say for any other booker.

The Buff thing comes from him being forced to pair up with him, and finding him just plain annoying. Rick Steiner really likes him, but Scott prefered to travel with guys like Lance Storm. Bagwell went into business for himself on a show cutting a promo burying Steiner, so he stiffed him in the ring. But he draws a distinction between him and his brother who would just stiff the poo poo out of the lower card for no reason. Scott always had a reason.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


In 2001 when it looked like Bischoff would buy the company with Fusient, WCW was changing up its roster. But to do so, they had to keep the payroll the same. So when they wanted to sign someone, they had to release someone or multiple people to make up the difference.

So when they wanted to bring in Steve Corino and Chris Daniels, people had to be fired. One of the guys who was fired during this period was Crowbar/Devon Storm.

The week he was fired, on the March 7th Thunder, they destroyed a limo to advance a feud between Ernest Miller and Kanyon. One can only wonder if the limo cost more than the contracts of the guys who were being fired at this point.

JOHN CENA
Oct 20, 2006


Satire Forum Mom posted:

He's not- Scott Steiner sounds like a really smart, logical dude in that shoot. He's full of poo poo sometimes, but I mean, guy's still a wrestler.

i cannot even fathom a clearly speaking and articulately speaking scott steiner

Skinty McEdger
Mar 9, 2008

I have NEVER received the respect I deserve as the leader and founder of The Masterflock, the internet's largest and oldest Christopher Masterpiece fan group in all of history, and I DEMAND that changes. From now on, you will respect Skinty McEdger!



dusty udder smoker posted:

i cannot even fathom a clearly speaking and articulately speaking scott steiner

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zQtn_Ek0C_g

He's still in character, but he is just so calm and normal.

Skinty McEdger fucked around with this message at 05:02 on Jan 10, 2010

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


dusty udder smoker posted:

i cannot even fathom a clearly speaking and articulately speaking scott steiner

On some awards show a year or 4 back, Hogan came out to present an award and was cutting a promo Hulkster style when suddenly he cut off and said in a completely normal voice,"Why am I talking like Hulk Hogan?" and finished off the rest of the presentation in a completely standard voice. It was bizarre.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


One of the weirder things on WCW PPV was Hulk Hogan burning an Observer at World War 3.

Hogan claimed that the Observer said The Giant would win the WW3 Match, but instead it was Savage who won. He also claimed that Savage and Hogan worked the boys about a torn tricep. Of course, Savage actually had a torn tricep which was blatantly obvious on screen. On top of this, one of the match finishes involved Savage having to submit to an arm bar which the announcers cited being due to the torn tricep (which Hogan had earlier said was fake, making the finish look like poo poo.) So this proved the dirt sheets were wrong and the internet has all the scoops brother!

Except, the Observer reported that Savage would win WW3 anyway and they just lied about what it said to try and prove the dirt sheets were wrong.

oldpainless
Oct 30, 2009

This post brought to you by RAID: SHADOW LEGENDS.
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-3_c...feature=related

This was one of the related videos to the Steiner one posted earlier. I thought it was quite hilarious.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?


MassRayPer posted:

Except, the Observer reported that Savage would win WW3 anyway and they just lied about what it said to try and prove the dirt sheets were wrong.

Jesus loving Christ

WSAENOTSOCK
Apr 13, 2002


That sounds about right.

Paper Jam Dipper
Jul 14, 2007

by XyloJW


Jerusalem posted:

On some awards show a year or 4 back, Hogan came out to present an award and was cutting a promo Hulkster style when suddenly he cut off and said in a completely normal voice,"Why am I talking like Hulk Hogan?" and finished off the rest of the presentation in a completely standard voice. It was bizarre.

Dusty Rhodes speaking normally fucks me right up.

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Top Bunk Wanker
Jan 31, 2005

Top Trump Anger

Jerusalem posted:

On some awards show a year or 4 back, Hogan came out to present an award and was cutting a promo Hulkster style when suddenly he cut off and said in a completely normal voice,"Why am I talking like Hulk Hogan?" and finished off the rest of the presentation in a completely standard voice. It was bizarre.

I know the first time I heard Steiner doing commentary, I was completely confused when it was just an ordinary guy's voice.

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