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gauss
Feb 9, 2001

by Reene


$445 is a pretty good price for a cosmetically worn (heavy holster wear) but mechanically sound P226 right? I haven't joined the SIG parade and would really like to

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Locus
Feb 28, 2004

But you were dead a thousand times. Hopeless encounters successfully won.

ShaiHulud posted:

It may as well be. You think American hicks invented the jackalope? Nope.


Fun with taxidermy.

Not to disagree with you about hicks or that whole crypto-taxidermy hobby, but interestingly, Jackalope legends are likely based in part on a horrific viral infection rabbits can get that causes horn-like tumors on their head and face.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackalope

Easychair Bootson
May 7, 2004

Where's the last guy?
Ultimo hombre.
Last man standing.
Must've been one.


gauss posted:

$445 is a pretty good price for a cosmetically worn (heavy holster wear) but mechanically sound P226 right? I haven't joined the SIG parade and would really like to
That's a good price if you can get it out the door for around that amount. We see them for sale in similar condition for $400-450 online, plus shipping and transfer fee, and that's still considered a pretty solid deal if you're in the market.

spankmeister
Jun 15, 2008








Locus posted:

Not to disagree with you about hicks or that whole crypto-taxidermy hobby, but interestingly, Jackalope legends are likely based in part on a horrific viral infection rabbits can get that causes horn-like tumors on their head and face.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jackalope



Yeah just FYI that's basically a wart.

gauss
Feb 9, 2001

by Reene


GroovinPickle posted:

That's a good price if you can get it out the door for around that amount. We see them for sale in similar condition for $400-450 online, plus shipping and transfer fee, and that's still considered a pretty solid deal if you're in the market.

It's with a local dealer I'm on good standing with. So no shipping or transfer, but sales tax would apply. But thanks, good to know.

NosmoKing
Nov 12, 2004

I have a rifle and a frying pan and I know how to use them

infrared35 posted:

If that's "out the door" definitely. They can be had a little cheaper than that, but by the time you factor in shipping and transfer fees...

I got one a few weeks ago and it feels good knowing that no matter how much I shoot it, I will never have to clean it.

Yep, that's without tax, but it's the cash and carry "father's day special" price. It's not even out of the way, it's directly on my way home.

I think that tomorrow is new murder-machine day...

juggalo baby coffin
Dec 2, 2007

How would the dog wear goggles and even more than that, who makes the goggles?



What the hell does high speed low drag mean? I thought it was some kind of TFR in-joke about tacticlol gun aerodynamics but I've seen it used in other places too and I'm worried the world has gone mad.

Gtab
Dec 9, 2003
I am a horrible person, disregard my posts.

FirstPersonShitter posted:

What the hell does high speed low drag mean? I thought it was some kind of TFR in-joke about tacticlol gun aerodynamics but I've seen it used in other places too and I'm worried the world has gone mad.

It's a descriptor for direct action cool guy groups like SEALs and what not. They're high-speed, low-drag.

We use it ironically here.

iyaayas01
Feb 19, 2010

Perry'd


FirstPersonShitter posted:

What the hell does high speed low drag mean? I thought it was some kind of TFR in-joke about tacticlol gun aerodynamics but I've seen it used in other places too and I'm worried the world has gone mad.

If you have to ask, you don't need to know.

hangedman
Dec 20, 2003

Fish out of water

FirstPersonShitter posted:

What the hell does high speed low drag mean?

Seriously, and as best as I can tell, high-speed refers to the fact that it can be brought into action quickly, and low-drag means that there's nothing that can get caught on anything or no unnecessary motions or operations that you don't need. So "high-speed, low-drag" could refer to a gun or knife itself, but more bizarrely, it could refer to the people who use those things.

Given that most anything or anyone in the firearms industry could be sold as being "HSLD," it's meaningless. Most companies do not set out to eliminate their competitive edge with products that are notoriously slow to wield and cumbersome to operate.

It would be interesting to trace the etymology of the word, though.

Cheap Bourbon
Apr 13, 2010


thermobollocks posted:


My question: What the hell do I do about the rings forming in my .357 cylinder when I shoot .38? I've tried brass-brushing the piss out of it with some Hoppes, but no dice.

.40cal brass brush. Just need it a taaad bigger than the .35 caliber bore brush yer using. Yeah, you'll wreck the poo poo out of it, but they're cheap enough.

Captain Log
Oct 2, 2006

Captain Log posted:

"I AINT DYING! Choo choo motherfucker!"




I willingly have a Hi Point C9 and I would rather have that gun than a loving Sigma.

(It works. Sigma's not so much.)

Sgt. Shaved Balls
Sep 6, 2006

by Lowtax


Captain Log posted:

I willingly have a Hi Point C9 and I would rather have that gun than a loving Sigma.

(It works. Sigma's not so much.)

Think of what you're saying!!!!

Frozen Horse
Aug 6, 2007
Just a humble wandering street philosopher.

hangedman posted:

It would be interesting to trace the etymology of the word, though.

It originally refered to streamlined bomb casings, such as the mk-82 in comparison to the rounded, bulbous casings of WWII bombs. The lower-drag meant less fuel consumption when carried externally on wing pylons of jet aircraft.

Captain Log
Oct 2, 2006

Captain Log posted:

"I AINT DYING! Choo choo motherfucker!"




Sgt. Shaved Balls posted:

Think of what you're saying!!!!

I bought it as a cheap joke when I was getting another gun. It is a reprehensible hunk of bullshit but it works. I would recommend it to anyone with a hosed budget. It goes bang when you pull the trigger.

Everything else about it it awful. Not as bad as a $300 Sigma. With that kind of money you can buy a real gun.

Capn Beeb
Jun 29, 2003

Enter the woods, find a friend!


FirstPersonShitter posted:

What the hell does high speed low drag mean? I thought it was some kind of TFR in-joke about tacticlol gun aerodynamics but I've seen it used in other places too and I'm worried the world has gone mad.

Here let this man teach you

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL4soX9ml2E

Captain Log
Oct 2, 2006

Captain Log posted:

"I AINT DYING! Choo choo motherfucker!"




Capn Beeb posted:

Here let this man teach you

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OL4soX9ml2E

I need to know which one of us this guy is.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PKMhQbeh1Ms&feature=related

Jager
Aug 4, 2003

Eeww!


Any opinions here on the best* .22lr suppressor?
*best for my purposes:
-excellent suppression on both pistols (CZ-75 kadet) and rifles (Spike's 16" upper & 10/22)
-user serviceable
-price not a concern
-great customer support from manufacturer

I’m leaning towards one constructed completely using stainless steel for durability and because it has the most options for cleaning (usually rated for full auto use too) although suppressors using titanium aren’t out of the running either. I’m not concerned about getting the smallest or lightest model if it means sacrificing other factors.

The models I am looking at and would like some input on are:
-AAC Element
-SWR Spectre
-Liberty Kodiak
-Liberty Kodiak TL

I have been reading nfatalk.org, silencer talk, silencer tests (AAC biased?), ARFcom, and silencer research. Can anyone fill me in on the history of manufacturer drama? Almost every single review/recommendation thread has some mention of “that manufacturer”, dB ratings will no longer be posted because company A used it to smear company B, or that so-in-so screwed their customers. All I have been able to pull so far is that AAC has questionable customer service related to the Prodigy, and that AAC “mil-tested” Gemtech’s 5.56 suppressor to failure but never show any proof that their 5.56 suppressor passed the same test other then word of mouth.

Pitch
Jun 16, 2005

しらんけど


Jager posted:

-user serviceable
Is there such a thing? You aren't allowed to keep replacement parts.

I like turtles
Aug 6, 2009



I think he means "can be taken apart and baffles can be cleaned", as you can with most .22lr suppressors.

Capn Beeb
Jun 29, 2003

Enter the woods, find a friend!


Devmd's suppressor was pretty drat quiet on his Kadet kit. I think it was a TacSol of some flavor, but I can't remember for certain. He had a neat wrench to take off the end cap for easy disassembly.

.22 cans get dirty so fast holy poo poo

Jager
Aug 4, 2003

Eeww!


Pitch posted:

Is there such a thing? You aren't allowed to keep replacement parts.

I like turtles is correct. When it comes to .22lr suppressors you really want to be able to take them apart to clean off all the lead buildup on the baffles. With sealed aluminum .22lr suppressors the owner is stuck sending them back to the manufacturer and paying to get them cleaned out. Sealed stainless steal suppressors allow the owner to do "dip" cleaning (50/50 mix of white vinegar and hydrogen peroxide) which is still not ideal since you are creating dangerous lead acetate.

iyaayas01
Feb 19, 2010

Perry'd


Figured this would be the best place for this, since I am (technically) asking a question, and I don't really want to start a new thread because it would be nothing but blue balls, seeing as how I don't have any good pictures.

A couple of months ago I asked questions for the best methods for medium to long term storage of guns in order to prevent corrosion. This was because I was going to be back in the Midwest on leave and was going down to my grandfather's place in Kansas to see what his gun collection consisted of, and to make sure they were going to be well preserved, as I was fairly certain he had at least a few cool old guns and was also fairly certain that he wasn't taking the best care of them.

So, what did I find?

Well, for starters, a pretty run of the mill 10/22, NIB. He won this, and the next gun, from his job and proceeded to store them away without bothering to even remove the tags, much less shoot them.

The next gun was a Winchester Model 1894, in .30-30 of course, manufactured sometime in the 1970s, as far as I could tell. NIB pristine condition.

That gets the "new" stuff out of the way, on to the old.

First up, a Winchester 37 single shot shotgun, chambered in .410. This was in pretty rough condition, the wood was a little beat up and there was some spots of pitting on the metal, as well as a lot of surface rust. Grandpa said he bought it sometime in the 1950s.

Next, Stevens 5100 SxS 12 gauge, in passable condition (better than the 37, still pretty beat up, not much pitting but a fair amount of surface rust). Still quite a bit of the original finish left. Features a case hardened engraved boxlock. This gun was probably made sometime in the '30s or '40s, and is in pretty good shape considering that fact.

Getting back to Winchester, next is a slick Winchester 62A .22 pump action rifle. To be clear, I didn't do this to get an "in" on any of the guns or anything, I did it because I was worried that there were some pieces of history that were being neglected, but goddamn, when my grandfather passes on (not likely anytime soon, the guy spent his whole life eating bacon fat and drinking beer and he's as healthy as a horse at 70, he's going to live to be 90 at least ), that Winchester 62A is on my "really really want list." It's like sex, I'm bringing a couple bricks of .22lr the next time I'm in the Midwest, because me and him are going shooting so I can put that thing through its paces. It's that nice. On top of that, it's in as almost as good condition as the NIB guns in his collection..bit of a surface rust near the muzzle, but that cleaned off pretty nicely. Other than that, the original finish is pretty much good.

Finally, last but certainly not least, a Winchester 97. 12 ga, with the standard 30'' barrel. This gun is quite possibly older than my grandfather, and considering that it's not in bad shape...wood is a little beat up, and the metal has a nice patina to it.

So, that's the collection...what, if any, of those are particularly noteworthy? If anyone wants to give me ballpark figures for what they're worth (tough to do without pictures, I know, but I just said "ballpark"), my grandparents would be appreciative as I told them I'd attempt to give them an estimate of what those are worth.

Ah, and in the other thread I mentioned a Colt Lightning in .38-40...well, since this trip was about guns, my grandfather arranged a little side trip for us. Apparently, I have a second cousin or something that lives in the same general area as my grandparents who is a huge gun collector. When I say "gun collector," I mean guns that were made two centuries ago type of guns. I think the newest gun in his collection was a S&W M1917 that was probably made sometime in the '20s. A lot of the remainder had a production date that started with "18--" something. The collection consisted of a shitload of revolvers and about 10 or so rifles. One was the aforementioned Lightning, the rest of them were various types of Marlin lever action rifles, in a plethora of calibers, and featuring not one but two saddlering carbines...here's the part: he had some original era-ish manufactured ammo for each gun. The revolvers were mainly Colts and S&Ws (obviously) but there were also some Marlin revolvers (mainly cute little derringers, with some sick intricate engraving on them). Some of these had a really weird action that I had never seen before...it was like the opposite of a top break. Instead of breaking open with the barrel pointing down, they pointed up. The condition these guns were in was nuts...of the ~40, I think maybe 5 were in NRA Good, with another 5 in Very Good, with the rest in Very Good Plus or better. I DO have pictures of these, but they're crappy ones on my cell phone...anyone have a good way of getting pictures off of a non-smartphone?

iyaayas01
Feb 19, 2010

Perry'd


Unrelated question...I've decided that I may be in the market for a spotting scope. Any recommendations?

Sir Sidney Poitier
Aug 14, 2006

My favourite actor


I know little about firearms. In film and TV, guards carry pistols. They hear a noise and decide to go and check it out, and on the way they cock the pistols. This seems to happen with shotguns, too.

Is this silly? To my uneducated mind it wouldn't make sense for them to carry a weapon that's not (barring the safety) ready to fire as they wouldn't know when they'd need it, they might get surprised by someone and having to take time to cock it before firing would get them killed.

Pirate Radar
Apr 18, 2008

You're not my Ruthie!
You're not my Debbie!
You're not my Sherry!


Anjow posted:

I know little about firearms. In film and TV, guards carry pistols. They hear a noise and decide to go and check it out, and on the way they cock the pistols. This seems to happen with shotguns, too.

Is this silly? To my uneducated mind it wouldn't make sense for them to carry a weapon that's not (barring the safety) ready to fire as they wouldn't know when they'd need it, they might get surprised by someone and having to take time to cock it before firing would get them killed.

Short answer: The guys who do sound work for TV and movies love to insert the noise of guns cocking, basically whenever a gun comes onto screen. They even do this when the guns in question don't actually have hammers to cock (for example, when a cop draws their Glock handgun, a striker-fired semiautomatic, and the sound of a hammer being cocked is inserted into the scene).

Long explanation: It depends on the gun's action. Some handguns are single-action. This means that the trigger only performs one action--in this case, releasing the hammer and letting it spring forward into the firing pin, impacting the primer and firing the round. Single-action semiautomatic handguns can (and should) be carried "cocked and locked" with a round in the chamber, the hammer back and the safety on. When you draw the weapon, it's a simple movement of your thumb to release the safety and make the gun ready to fire. Other guns are double-action. This means that the trigger both pulls back and releases the hammer. The hammer can be manually cocked, in many cases, but there's less of a reason to do so. Double-action guns are commonly carried with a round in the chamber and the safety (if there is one) off, relying on the heavy trigger pull (since the trigger does two things on a double-action gun, the force required to pull it is greater) to prevent negligent discharges. Police officers, for instance, carry their sidearms with a round in the chamber, so all they need to do in order to fire the weapon is draw and pull the trigger. Revolvers can be either single-action or double-action as well, though since they lack safeties they shouldn't be carried around in a holster with the hammer cocked.

Pirate Radar fucked around with this message at 11:09 on Jun 14, 2010

Illegal Clown
Feb 18, 2004



Chantilly Say posted:

Short answer: The guys who do sound work for TV and movies love to insert the noise of guns cocking, basically whenever a gun comes onto screen. They even do this when the guns in question don't actually have hammers to cock (for example, when a cop draws their Glock handgun, a striker-fired semiautomatic, and the sound of a hammer being cocked is inserted into the scene).

Long explanation: It depends on the gun's action. Some handguns are single-action. This means that the trigger only performs one action--in this case, releasing the hammer and letting it spring forward into the firing pin, impacting the primer and firing the round. Single-action semiautomatic handguns can (and should) be carried "cocked and locked" with a round in the chamber, the hammer back and the safety on. When you draw the weapon, it's a simple movement of your thumb to release the safety and make the gun ready to fire. Other guns are double-action. This means that the trigger both pulls back and releases the hammer. The hammer can be manually cocked, in many cases, but there's less of a reason to do so. Double-action guns are commonly carried with a round in the chamber and the safety (if there is one) off, relying on the heavy trigger pull (since the trigger does two things on a double-action gun, the force required to pull it is greater) to prevent negligent discharges. Police officers, for instance, carry their sidearms with a round in the chamber, so all they need to do in order to fire the weapon is draw and pull the trigger. Revolvers can be either single-action or double-action as well, though since they lack safeties they shouldn't be carried around in a holster with the hammer cocked.

Yep, this is pretty much it. A lot of it is just the sound guys thinking it's right, but in some cases, it is right. For example, if my HD gun is my 92FS, the safety is off and the hammer is down. If a bad guy suddenly appears in my house and I have to shoot, I just pick it up and shoot. It's ready to go. Now if I hear him breaking in and I have a couple seconds before he gets there I will cock it. That way I get a lighter trigger pull and maybe a more accurate shot. I do roll my eyes though when I see a movie and the guy cocks the gun to shoe he's really serious. I guess it makes sense when the gun is a 1911 or other SAO. I always laugh when I see a situation like that because I'm always thinking, "This isn't really that tense, it's not cocked yet so he can't shoot him." And yes, when it's on hammerless stuff, like Glocks, it's just bad editing. When I was younger and heard that sound I just told myself it was the safety. Yeah, that doesnt' help when the gun doesn't have a safety either!

Sir Sidney Poitier
Aug 14, 2006

My favourite actor


Illegal Clown posted:

I guess it makes sense when the gun is a 1911 or other SAO.

Can you elaborate on this please? Why would it make sense with those and what's an SAO? I assumed semi automatic <something>.

Pitch
Jun 16, 2005

しらんけど


Anjow posted:

Can you elaborate on this please? Why would it make sense with those and what's an SAO? I assumed semi automatic <something>.
Single-Action Only. It means the hammer must be cocked for the gun to fire because the trigger only serves to drop it. In other actions pulling the trigger will raise the hammer and then drop it in one motion.

It doesn't make a lot of sense there either, though, because the gun is useless when uncocked and as a result everyone carries it cocked with the safety on.

I like turtles
Aug 6, 2009



Anjow posted:

Can you elaborate on this please? Why would it make sense with those and what's an SAO? I assumed semi automatic <something>.

It contains more information than you're probably interested in, but I've got a limited glossary at the front of the newbie thread.

vains
May 26, 2004


How much does it cost to convert from DA/SA to DAK? I've scoured the internet(read typed DAK conversion into google and gunbroker) and I cant find it anywhere.

Easychair Bootson
May 7, 2004

Where's the last guy?
Ultimo hombre.
Last man standing.
Must've been one.


Looks like $200.

http://lmgtfy.com/?q=dak+conversion+site%3Asigsauer.com

http://sigforum.com/eve/forums?a=tpc&f=150601935&m=1050024102

It looks like unless you can buy the parts used, you may be better off sending it to Sig and having them do the work, but of course then you have to factor in shipping.

Unless the gun has some sentimental value, you'd probably come out better by selling your gun and buying one with a DAK trigger.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Veins McGee posted:

How much does it cost to convert from DA/SA to DAK? I've scoured the internet(read typed DAK conversion into google and gunbroker) and I cant find it anywhere.

It's $200 for the factory to do it. I priced the parts through Top Gun Supply, and to just buy the parts it came to $300. I kept my eyes open on gunbroker and found a set for just over $100 shipped.

rally
Nov 19, 2002

yospos


If one were to obtain the parts cheap, would they probably just drop or does it normally require some fitting?

iioshius
Apr 22, 2005



Do you guys have any experience with the SAO Sig P220? They're on sale for $689, new, from CDNN. Is that a good price? Are these good guns? I'd assume so, since Sigs seem to have a good reputation on TFR, but I've never met anyone who's handled the SAO variant, and there isn't one anywhere near where I live to try and test it out myself.

Black Stormy
Apr 1, 2003



rally posted:

If one were to obtain the parts cheap, would they probably just drop or does it normally require some fitting?

I would imagine they would drop in. The DAK trigger system isn't near as complicated as I thought it would be.

Easychair Bootson
May 7, 2004

Where's the last guy?
Ultimo hombre.
Last man standing.
Must've been one.


rally posted:

If one were to obtain the parts cheap, would they probably just drop or does it normally require some fitting?
They'd drop in, assuming that your frame is DAK-compatible. By the way, when it comes to detail stripping the P series guns, this video is great.

iioshius posted:

Do you guys have any experience with the SAO Sig P220? They're on sale for $689, new, from CDNN. Is that a good price? Are these good guns? I'd assume so, since Sigs seem to have a good reputation on TFR, but I've never met anyone who's handled the SAO variant, and there isn't one anywhere near where I live to try and test it out myself.
I've never shot one, but they have a pretty solid reputation. That's a decent price, and I would say it's a great price if it comes with the Houge Hogue aluminum grips that run about $150 new (I think the CDNN guns do, or at least they did when they popped up a few months ago).

eine dose socken
Mar 9, 2008



ShaiHulud posted:

Hick family members use Scherzl - the heel of a bread loaf or the ends of a meat roast.

That would be correct for Bavaria- we either say Scherzl or Scherzerl.

Also that Jackalope thing is a bavarian legend called the "Wolpertinger", which is a very popular legend/taxidermist joke. I don't know if it predates the American Jackalope myth, but it sure is widespread.

There's a nice specimen in the Munich Hunting and Forestry Museum- the image text states that it's main prey are "soft Prussian skulls"

walrusman
Aug 4, 2006



eine dose socken posted:

That would be correct for Bavaria- we either say Scherzl or Scherzerl.

Also that Jackalope thing is a bavarian legend called the "Wolpertinger", which is a very popular legend/taxidermist joke. I don't know if it predates the American Jackalope myth, but it sure is widespread.

There's a nice specimen in the Munich Hunting and Forestry Museum- the image text states that it's main prey are "soft Prussian skulls"



When I was at that museum they had a ton of them on display, and a few for sale. I almost bought one but shipping something that large and fragile would be expensive.

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eine dose socken
Mar 9, 2008



walrusman posted:

When I was at that museum they had a ton of them on display, and a few for sale. I almost bought one but shipping something that large and fragile would be expensive.

Especially when your nearest taxidermist can probably whip one up for you from scraps he would otherwise throw away or feed to his dog.

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