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BananaNutkins
Aug 26, 2004

I'll split you open and I don't even like coconuts.


The Emperor's Soul is just standard Sanderson refined to the point that it still works for normies who don't care about omg magic systems. The prose still isn't great, but at least it isn't repetitious, and there's no padding to the story.

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White Chocolate
Jan 23, 2007
Sweat Baby, sweat baby

I just finished The book of radiance and drat. drat good stuff. I started reading war breaker on his website because it was free and seeing two of those characters in a different view... ah.

Torrannor
Apr 27, 2013

---FAGNER---
TEAM-MATE


I'm sad that I will inevitably be disappointed with the choice of title for Stormlight 5. Stones Unhallowed is a cool name, has quite the significance in-universe, and it would give me immense satisfaction if it came out before Kingkiller 3, Doors of Stone. On the other hand, Stones Unhallowed doesn't abbreviate to KoW, which is what's needed to make the book acronyms a ketek (WoK-WoR-O-RoW-?).

Leng
May 13, 2006

One song / Glory
One song before I go / Glory
One song to leave behind


No other road
No other way
No day but today


The last I remember, Team Dragonsteel are still having internal debates about whether it's KoW or KoWt, since technically the first book was The Way of Kings.

Sab669
Sep 24, 2009



I vote KoW because you can pronounce it like cow :colbert:

His Divine Shadow
Aug 7, 2000

I'm not a fascist. I'm a priest. Fascists dress up in black and tell people what to do.


Mordiceius posted:

Finished ďThe Emperorís Soul.Ē It was... fine? I think this thread overhyped it to a degree. Not my most favorite thing heís done, but I enjoyed the journey. Neat format. The magic presented felt far more soft than others. I think I ended up expecting some bigger twist. It was still a very solid story.

CURRENT SANDERSON RANKINGS -

The Final Empire
The Hero of Ages
The Emperorís Soul
The Well of Ascension
Elantris
The Hope of Elantris

So where to next? I recommend Warbreaker, then Mistborn era 2

Mainly recommending Warbreaker since it's free, I'd read it before stormlight though.

Evil Fluffy
Jul 13, 2009

Scholars are some of the most pompous and pedantic people I've ever had the joy of meeting.

Torrannor posted:

Stones Unhallowed is a cool name, has quite the significance in-universe, and it would give me immense satisfaction if it came out before Kingkiller 3, Doors of Stone.

You mean the book that Rothfuss has done so little work on he got publicly called out by his editor due to showing absolutely nothing of the book for 9 years? That book?

Doors of Stone is never coming out. Rothfuss has gone full GRRM.

Mordiceius
Nov 10, 2007

I was terrified at first, but I think I'm okay with it.



His Divine Shadow posted:

So where to next? I recommend Warbreaker, then Mistborn era 2

Mainly recommending Warbreaker since it's free, I'd read it before stormlight though.

Thatís pretty much what Iím doing. At this point, I plan Warbreaker to Mistborn Era 2 to Stormlight, with any and al short stories added in release order.

socialsecurity
Aug 30, 2003
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes

Mordiceius posted:

Thatís pretty much what Iím doing. At this point, I plan Warbreaker to Mistborn Era 2 to Stormlight, with any and al short stories added in release order.

I'd swap warbreaker and mistborn, Warbreaker is rough like Elantris and had more Stromlight crossover also not the same good reader Mistborn has.

Mordiceius
Nov 10, 2007

I was terrified at first, but I think I'm okay with it.



socialsecurity posted:

I'd swap warbreaker and mistborn, Warbreaker is rough like Elantris and had more Stromlight crossover also not the same good reader Mistborn has.

That's actually why I'm doing Warbreaker first. Wanna get all the non-Michael Kramer stuff out of the way.

Tunicate
May 15, 2012





Leng posted:

The last I remember, Team Dragonsteel are still having internal debates about whether it's KoW or KoWt, since technically the first book was The Way of Kings.

and there's the possibility of swapping in an H

Evil Fluffy
Jul 13, 2009

Scholars are some of the most pompous and pedantic people I've ever had the joy of meeting.

Tunicate posted:

and there's the possibility of swapping in an H

The Whay of Kings? Sounds like a fitness book about the Thrill of getting swole.

Leng
May 13, 2006

One song / Glory
One song before I go / Glory
One song to leave behind


No other road
No other way
No day but today


Tunicate posted:

and there's the possibility of swapping in an H

Can't find the WoB but I think they're leaning against it, because they want it to be symmetrical to people who don't know about the diacritic H. Which I'm a bit like, nobody's gonna buy book 5 in this series without having already read the others.

The Breakfast Sampler
Jan 1, 2006




I finished Rhythm of War the other day and I dunno. Just didn't grab me like the other books in the series so far. It felt meandering and I'm having a hard time keeping track of the Fused people, whatever. I've been having some health problems so that's probably part of my issue, but I thought it was hard to follow. Some cool moments as usual but the series is starting to feel bloated. And I say this as a pretty big fan of Sanderson, the Mistborn books aren't technical marvels (though they get better) but they're some of my favorite stories, ever.

Sab669
Sep 24, 2009



I do feel that they're getting way too many names. Parshendi --> Listeners --> Singers --> Fused --> <every different school of Void Radiant>. I've just stopped even trying to take it in.

socialsecurity
Aug 30, 2003
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes

The Breakfast Sampler posted:

I finished Rhythm of War the other day and I dunno. Just didn't grab me like the other books in the series so far. It felt meandering and I'm having a hard time keeping track of the Fused people, whatever. I've been having some health problems so that's probably part of my issue, but I thought it was hard to follow. Some cool moments as usual but the series is starting to feel bloated. And I say this as a pretty big fan of Sanderson, the Mistborn books aren't technical marvels (though they get better) but they're some of my favorite stories, ever.

Rhythem did feel like a low point but I'm hopeful with the next series being planned to take place over that certain timeframe things will move a bit quicker.

ElGroucho
Nov 1, 2005

We already - What about sticking our middle fingers up... That was insane


Fun Shoe

The Breakfast Sampler posted:

I finished Rhythm of War the other day and I dunno. Just didn't grab me like the other books in the series so far. It felt meandering and I'm having a hard time keeping track of the Fused people, whatever. I've been having some health problems so that's probably part of my issue, but I thought it was hard to follow. Some cool moments as usual but the series is starting to feel bloated. And I say this as a pretty big fan of Sanderson, the Mistborn books aren't technical marvels (though they get better) but they're some of my favorite stories, ever.

There's a scene where the Sibling says, "Are you still asking me about light? It's getting tedious," and I couldn't agree more. I think Sanderson likes dissecting the magic systems to excess, and it's honestly the least interesting thing about his books to me.

I felt the same way about Mistborn. 3 pages about how coins and metal work? I don't need to know how the sausage is made. Just show me the cool zoomy stuff.

ConfusedUs
Feb 24, 2004

Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!



I love all the magi-science stuff. I'm a huge sucker for it.

Incidentally, I really liked RoW and Bands of Morning.

scary ghost dog
Aug 5, 2007


the navani stuff in RoW was worth it for the end of the book when she discovers investiture fission

Taffer
Oct 15, 2010




ConfusedUs posted:

I love all the magi-science stuff. I'm a huge sucker for it.

Incidentally, I really liked RoW and Bands of Morning.

Same. My complaint with magi-science in RoW isn't "there's too much" but rather Navani made way too many massive discoveries way too fast and the book did not make it seem like she was unraveling very complex mysteries of the universe, but rather just having them handed to her on a platter. Not only did they feel handed to her, but she also had really broad understanding just.... come to her, intuitively, even though the experiments that the book went into great detail describing didn't explain as part of the phenomenon.

I really dig that whole.... style of doing magic, I just felt like there was too much happening in one part of one book, and that it was too easy. This stuff should have been spread out over the last couple books, and some of it probably should have been pushed forward to book 5.

And Rlain still should have ended up bonding to the sibling :mad:

socialsecurity
Aug 30, 2003
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes

Taffer posted:

Same. My complaint with magi-science in RoW isn't "there's too much" but rather Navani made way too many massive discoveries way too fast and the book did not make it seem like she was unraveling very complex mysteries of the universe, but rather just having them handed to her on a platter. Not only did they feel handed to her, but she also had really broad understanding just.... come to her, intuitively, even though the experiments that the book went into great detail describing didn't explain as part of the phenomenon.

I really dig that whole.... style of doing magic, I just felt like there was too much happening in one part of one book, and that it was too easy. This stuff should have been spread out over the last couple books, and some of it probably should have been pushed forward to book 5.

And Rlain still should have ended up bonding to the sibling :mad:

Yeah for how often before this they show their technological progress as the results of years of testing and large groups of people working on it this really felt like "Person unravels greatest secrets of the universe by sitting in a room for a week and thinking hard about it"

Democratic Pirate
Feb 17, 2010



socialsecurity posted:

Yeah for how often before this they show their technological progress as the results of years of testing and large groups of people working on it this really felt like "Person unravels greatest secrets of the universe by sitting in a room for a week and thinking hard about it"

Agreed, though Sanderson threw enough in there that it could arguably be seen as person with severe imposter syndrome spends life consumed by administrative tasks and delegation, finally has breakthroughs when locked away in a room and told to pursue their talent

DarkHorse
Dec 13, 2006

Vroom Vroom, BEEP BEEP!

Nap Ghost

And unfortunately, obsessively documenting the scientific process probably isn't interesting to most people. I'm sure some authors could do it, but even stripped down to a ludicrous epiphany people were still bored. Imagine them reading the weeks and months and years of failures until you start getting usable data.

Navajo being an administrator that gave her shallow insight into the whole breadth of stormlight research and techniques at least makes her sudden discovery of connections more plausible, at least for Plot.

TheMadMilkman
Dec 10, 2007



DarkHorse posted:

Navajo being an administrator that gave her shallow insight into the whole breadth of stormlight research and techniques at least makes her sudden discovery of connections more plausible, at least for Plot.

And being fed information by someone who can hear the rhythms, and has been studying stormlight and voidlight for many lifetimes.

Torrannor
Apr 27, 2013

---FAGNER---
TEAM-MATE


Just a reminder, there are regular posters in this thread who haven't read RoW (or any Stormlight books) yet.

I'm still very intrigued that there was at least one Bondsmith on Ashyn. How does this work, were there spren on that world, too? It would be kinda weird, since Syl said that spren figured out the Nahel bond from observing the Honorblades. But perhaps it was just Roshar spren that didn't know how to form Radiant bonds before. Maybe Ashyn spren (or at least one of them) learned how to do it another way? And Ashyn spren would be Odium spren, right? The humans brought him with them to Roshar. But then RoW gave the impression that Ishar was the Bondsmith who led the Ashyn survivor to Roshar, and it would be kinda strange for him to then become a Herald of Honor.

This is all very intriguing, and I hope we will have some characters do the obvious thing: Check out the human survivors on Ashyn. I kinda doubt anything like this could happen in SA5, which will presumably mainly cover about 10 days, but there's surely space for such a trip in the back 5 books.

Fezz
Aug 31, 2001
You should feel ashamed.

Magic stuff:
Keep in mind that the names just describe what they can do, not how they do it. Both Hoid and Shallan can Lightweave. Shallan gets hers from Pattern, Hoid gets his from his homeworld magic system. So Ishar is using a different magic system to smith bonds. However his magic doesn't have the safeguards that Roshar's does so while he can do more things, it's more dangerous. Basically Ashyn was destroyed by unrestrained magic where every magic user was a bomb just waiting to go off.

Infinite Karma
Oct 23, 2004
Good as dead







Democratic Pirate posted:

Agreed, though Sanderson threw enough in there that it could arguably be seen as person with severe imposter syndrome spends life consumed by administrative tasks and delegation, finally has breakthroughs when locked away in a room and told to pursue their talent
I thought that was broadcast loud and clear, in a pretty heavy handed way. In everyone's point of view but her own, Navani is always a world famous inventor and artifabrian. Only she ever makes excuses about not 'really' being one. Plus she's revolutionized science and magical technology. Impostor syndrome, 100%

Taffer
Oct 15, 2010




Fezz posted:

Magic stuff:
Keep in mind that the names just describe what they can do, not how they do it. Both Hoid and Shallan can Lightweave. Shallan gets hers from Pattern, Hoid gets his from his homeworld magic system. So Ishar is using a different magic system to smith bonds. However his magic doesn't have the safeguards that Roshar's does so while he can do more things, it's more dangerous. Basically Ashyn was destroyed by unrestrained magic where every magic user was a bomb just waiting to go off.

Wasn't it destroyed using dawnshards?

egg tats
Apr 3, 2010


Infinite Karma posted:

I thought that was broadcast loud and clear, in a pretty heavy handed way. In everyone's point of view but her own, Navani is always a world famous inventor and artifabrian. Only she ever makes excuses about not 'really' being one. Plus she's revolutionized science and magical technology. Impostor syndrome, 100%

this 100%

I can't remember a single person who didn't suck (gavilar) claim she was anything but brilliant ASIDE from Navani. she didn't do the work of putting rubies in metal, but she invented flight! that's generally a p big deal.

also she had some hints as to what she was looking for because of the antilight from the start of the book

eke out
Feb 24, 2013



Taffer posted:

Wasn't it destroyed using dawnshards?

seems like some combination of the dawnshards and unbound surgebinding

but yeah a lot of the confusion on this subject is terminology because of things like them talking about Ishar using Bondsmith powers when Bondsmiths didn't exist yet. i assume that means unbound versions of the surges bondsmiths would eventually have, but it's unclear to me how anyone got those powers and which ones they could've got access to

Jorenko
Jun 6, 2004

I think you're just mad 'cause you're single.

Fezz posted:

Magic stuff:
Keep in mind that the names just describe what they can do, not how they do it. Both Hoid and Shallan can Lightweave. Shallan gets hers from Pattern, Hoid gets his from his homeworld magic system. So Ishar is using a different magic system to smith bonds. However his magic doesn't have the safeguards that Roshar's does so while he can do more things, it's more dangerous. Basically Ashyn was destroyed by unrestrained magic where every magic user was a bomb just waiting to go off.

Actually, in both of those cases, it's both! Hoid has both Yolen lightweaving, and has bonded a cryptic. And Ishar had bondsmith powers before coming over from Ashyn (which we don't know anything about yet), as well as having stormlight-powered bondsmithing while he's holding his Honorblade.

ElGroucho
Nov 1, 2005

We already - What about sticking our middle fingers up... That was insane


Fun Shoe

This is all very thrilling, but I still feel like we could have skipped this whole book.

socialsecurity
Aug 30, 2003
please give me anything to talk about besides the fact that democrats are allowing millions of americans to be evicted from their homes

ElGroucho posted:

This is all very thrilling, but I still feel like we could have skipped this whole book.

I dunno about skipping but he could of cut it down greatly, start with the Tower already occupied and instead of Eshonai flashbacks about poo poo we've seen have the flashbacks be how the Tower ended up like this.

Hitch
Jul 1, 2012



Mordiceius posted:

CURRENT SANDERSON RANKINGS -

The Final Empire
The Hero of Ages
The Emperorís Soul
The Well of Ascension
Elantris
The Hope of Elantris

Out of curiosity, have you read any of the Stormlight Archives series or whatever itís called? Iíve only read Elantris by Sanderson and am interested enough to keep going. Was curious if I should start with one of yours listed or switch to what I assume is his premier series.

Mordiceius
Nov 10, 2007

I was terrified at first, but I think I'm okay with it.



Hitch posted:

Out of curiosity, have you read any of the Stormlight Archives series or whatever itís called? Iíve only read Elantris by Sanderson and am interested enough to keep going. Was curious if I should start with one of yours listed or switch to what I assume is his premier series.

Read Mistborn.

Torrannor
Apr 27, 2013

---FAGNER---
TEAM-MATE


Hitch posted:

Out of curiosity, have you read any of the Stormlight Archives series or whatever itís called? Iíve only read Elantris by Sanderson and am interested enough to keep going. Was curious if I should start with one of yours listed or switch to what I assume is his premier series.

Even though I'm not Mordiceius, I'm going to give you reading advice: Don't start with Stormlight Archive (SA) now.

SA is planned to be a 10 book series, with a front half and a back half. We are currently at 4/10 books, so if you start it now, you will likely reach that book before book 5 comes out, so will be left to wait for at least some time before you can read the the mid-series finale.

In contrast, starting with Mistborn is much better. First, The Final Empire is a fantastic book, easily in Sanderson's top 3. Conversely, Elantris is rated as one of his worst books by the fandom. The Final Empire is also a great standalone book, if Mistborn (for some reason) isn't for you. The first Mistborn trilogy is really good, and also has a clear, satisfying ending. The second Mistborn series consists of 4 books, with the fourth book planned to be released next year. So if you're into Mistborn, you won't have to wait long to get the conclusion to the second miniseries (there are 4 series of Mistborn books planned).

It should also be noted that most Cosmere books/series can stand very well on your own, you don't have to read any other to really understand what's happening. Except for the Stormlight Archive books, which get quite a bit better if you have read the other books, starting with Words of Radiance (SA2), and crossovers getting more prominent in Oathbringer (SA3), and really taking off in Rhythm of War (SA4). SA is the crossover series, and so isn't ideal for getting into the Cosmere. Don't get me wrong, the books still work well as a standalone series, but you're missing some things that more Cosmere aware fans will easily (or not so easily) pick up.

So I can only strongly recommend that you get into Mistborn first.

egg tats
Apr 3, 2010


Hitch posted:

Out of curiosity, have you read any of the Stormlight Archives series or whatever itís called? Iíve only read Elantris by Sanderson and am interested enough to keep going. Was curious if I should start with one of yours listed or switch to what I assume is his premier series.

for a bit more detail: probably the best way to read Sanderson is publishing order: he gets noticeably better over time, and while some later books are worse than earlier ones (Well Of Ascension is the worst of the original Mistborn series as an example), you're exactly where you want to be in order to really enjoy his books. And than means reading Mistborn, The Final Empire next.

(if you're not digging a specific series obv you can bounce - if you liked elantris you'll probably dig Mistborn though)

Hitch
Jul 1, 2012



Thanks for the input all. Looks like I'll be starting Mistborn next.

Mordiceius
Nov 10, 2007

I was terrified at first, but I think I'm okay with it.



Hitch posted:

Thanks for the input all. Looks like I'll be starting Mistborn next.

Post your thoughts!

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NikkolasKing
Apr 3, 2010





So I've finally started Rhythm of War. Still just at the start.

Sanderson really seems to like the prologues reshaping everything we thought we knew. I know some folks have speculated before that Gavilar was a poo poo but that was never my impression of him. My feeble grasp of his character was that he understood how things are now wasn't how they should be. It would take a lot to set things aright but setting them right was still his goal.

ROW's prologue makes him out be little more than a gloryhound with an inflated sense of self-worth. So different from Dalinar's picture of how Gavilar had changed to become more...contemplative and honorable in his old age.

Maybe we're too used to myopic thinking these days and the answer really is in the middle. To some people, Gavilar was a good, kind man. To his wife...not so much. She basically does say this, although you can read it as the face he presented to others was a mask and the face Navani saw was the truth.

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