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ShadowGlass
Nov 13, 2012



Algid posted:

We don't know if that was the wish or the cost though.

Strange, I can't find the reference to this in the book, but I was sure I'd read somewhere that forgetting his wife was not the curse. Maybe it was an interview or something.

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wellwhoopdedooo
Nov 23, 2007

Pound Trooper!

ShadowGlass posted:

Strange, I can't find the reference to this in the book, but I was sure I'd read somewhere that forgetting his wife was not the curse. Maybe it was an interview or something.

Yeah, I swear I remember Dalinar himself saying or thinking it.

Tunicate
May 15, 2012





ShadowGlass posted:

Strange, I can't find the reference to this in the book, but I was sure I'd read somewhere that forgetting his wife was not the curse. Maybe it was an interview or something.

Other way around, it's confirmed that the forgetting was his curse, but we have no idea what the boon is. Curses are all neurological in origin, but boons can be anything, it seems, since at least one guy got a bunch of grain/

Narmi
Feb 26, 2008


ShadowGlass posted:

Strange, I can't find the reference to this in the book, but I was sure I'd read somewhere that forgetting his wife was not the curse. Maybe it was an interview or something.

He says the visions he gets during a highstorm aren't part of his wish/curse when they ask him about the wish he made. He won't tell the others (I think it was his sons and sister-in-law) what either the wish or curse is, except that he's ashamed he sought out Old Magic and the curse that came along with it s completely separate.

casa de mi padre
Sep 3, 2012
Black people are the real racists!

Maybe his curse is that he can break the fourth wall and he's getting tired of readers who don't get it.

ShadowGlass
Nov 13, 2012



Narmi posted:

He says the visions he gets during a highstorm aren't part of his wish/curse when they ask him about the wish he made. He won't tell the others (I think it was his sons and sister-in-law) what either the wish or curse is, except that he's ashamed he sought out Old Magic and the curse that came along with it s completely separate.

Yeah, I know that part. What I was talking about was definitely not in a dialog. It was something that he was thinking to himself (sorry, still can't find it). Or I'm totally misremembering it. Might be a good time for a re-read.

mossyfisk
Nov 8, 2010

FF0000


There's nothing in the book that shows either way of his wife being the curse or boon. But then Brandon just told everyone which it was.

That is seriously my biggest problem with BS; he did it constantly with TWoT as well. It's really bad form to tell people anything significant outside of books because then you end up killing the guessing game, and potentially thinking your other readers know more than they really do.

cheese
Jan 7, 2004

Shop around for doctors! Always fucking shop for doctors. Doctors are stupid assholes. And they get by because people are cowed by their mystical bullshit quality of being able to maintain a 3.0 GPA at some Guatemalan medical college for 3 semesters. Find one that makes sense.


Narmi posted:

It hasn't really been explained yet, but there is a witch called the Nightwatcher who has the ability to grant wishes using the Old Magic. Dalinar visited the Nightwatcher, and in exchange for something (maybe battle prowess? his abilities seem to border on the superhuman, even when you take his shardplate into consideration.) everything about his wife is kept from him - all memories he has of her have been removed (or she's been removed from them) and whenever someone talks about her he can't hear anything, not even her name.
Actually, that would kind of make sense. I could see Dalinar wishing for the strength to avenge his brother, only to have that strength be twisted into an endless war that he must always fight.

mossyfisk posted:

There's nothing in the book that shows either way of his wife being the curse or boon. But then Brandon just told everyone which it was.

That is seriously my biggest problem with BS; he did it constantly with TWoT as well. It's really bad form to tell people anything significant outside of books because then you end up killing the guessing game, and potentially thinking your other readers know more than they really do.
I can confirm that I dislike this as well and think it was a bad idea. It would have been so much more interesting to have it be ambiguous.

Odette
Mar 19, 2011



cheese posted:

Actually, that would kind of make sense. I could see Dalinar wishing for the strength to avenge his brother, only to have that strength be twisted into an endless war that he must always fight.

But Dalinar was already renowned for being pretty kick rear end before all that happened though.

BananaNutkins
Aug 26, 2004

I'll split you open and I don't even like coconuts.


It would make sense if his wish was "What are the most important words a man can say?"

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs



So he never thought to ask his kids about their mother? Or did the person who took his memories tell everybody to just not let dalinar in on the secret, a la eternal sunshine of the spotless mind?

NinjaDebugger
Apr 22, 2008


uh zip zoom posted:

So he never thought to ask his kids about their mother? Or did the person who took his memories tell everybody to just not let dalinar in on the secret, a la eternal sunshine of the spotless mind?

He's not capable of thinking of asking his kids about their mother, nor is he capable of receiving the information from them.

Tunicate
May 15, 2012





uh zip zoom posted:

So he never thought to ask his kids about their mother? Or did the person who took his memories tell everybody to just not let dalinar in on the secret, a la eternal sunshine of the spotless mind?

In one ear, out the other.

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs



NinjaDebugger posted:

He's not capable of thinking of asking his kids about their mother, nor is he capable of receiving the information from them.

You know… That would've probably made the movie better.

Strategic Tea
Sep 1, 2012

Please ensure incidental bones are logged under the appropriate cost code.


He just hears silence when someone so much as says her name, if I remember.

AllTerrineVehicle
Jan 8, 2010

I'm great at boats!


I think it's mentioned when Navani says Dalinar's wife's name that he hears some sort of static instead of whatever is said.

Subvisual Haze
Nov 22, 2003

The building was on fire and it wasn't my fault.

She also said that they were happy together, which unlike her name he was able to understand. Which is pretty vague, but maybe other people can fill in Dalinar's old memories of her to a certain extent?

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


cheese posted:

I can confirm that I dislike this as well and think it was a bad idea. It would have been so much more interesting to have it be ambiguous.

This is something that bothers me, as well. There's SO much worldbuilding and cosmology that is released through fucknowswhat gateways, I certainly don't have a clue, which ties all of Sanderson's work together in the most intricate of ways, and it bugs me that I don't know where it's all coming from, and am missing some really significant details in the stories as a result - for instance, I'm pretty sure that all 16 non-God metals from Mistborn have actually been detailed somewhere (at least in what their Allomantic forms do), but it drat sure wasn't on the pages of any of the novels. It's kinda irksome. I know from his podcast how much planning he does, but I'd kinda prefer if he kept it away from the public except when he's releasing it in books.

Dravs
Mar 8, 2011

You've done well, kiddo.

thespaceinvader posted:

This is something that bothers me, as well. There's SO much worldbuilding and cosmology that is released through fucknowswhat gateways, I certainly don't have a clue, which ties all of Sanderson's work together in the most intricate of ways, and it bugs me that I don't know where it's all coming from, and am missing some really significant details in the stories as a result - for instance, I'm pretty sure that all 16 non-God metals from Mistborn have actually been detailed somewhere (at least in what their Allomantic forms do), but it drat sure wasn't on the pages of any of the novels. It's kinda irksome. I know from his podcast how much planning he does, but I'd kinda prefer if he kept it away from the public except when he's releasing it in books.

Are you sure? I am almost positive that he listed them in a glossary at the back of one of the Mistborn books. I will need to dig them out to check. Is it in Alloy of law maybe? (The epilogue set 200 years in the future)

Kwyndig
Sep 23, 2006

Heeeeeeey




I know the uses of all 16 metals in both Feruchemy and Allomancy is laid out in the Mistborn RPG, and it might be in the back of Alloy of Law. But I know it's in the RPG for sure.

computer parts
Nov 18, 2010

PLEASE CLAP

The known ones for each book are in the back of each Mistborn novel. Alloy of Law has all of them and what a bunch of the combinations do.

Tunicate
May 15, 2012





thespaceinvader posted:

This is something that bothers me, as well. There's SO much worldbuilding and cosmology that is released through fucknowswhat gateways, I certainly don't have a clue, which ties all of Sanderson's work together in the most intricate of ways, and it bugs me that I don't know where it's all coming from, and am missing some really significant details in the stories as a result - for instance, I'm pretty sure that all 16 non-God metals from Mistborn have actually been detailed somewhere (at least in what their Allomantic forms do), but it drat sure wasn't on the pages of any of the novels. It's kinda irksome. I know from his podcast how much planning he does, but I'd kinda prefer if he kept it away from the public except when he's releasing it in books.

It was definitely in the RPGs, and there were some two-sentence descriptions in the back of Alloy of Law.

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


Ah, I need to get the RPG then.

But really that's just an example (and not a very good one) - the mere existence of the Cosmere as a thing is something you only pick up from outside any of the books AFAIK, not to mention the fact that Hoyd is anything special at all, with all that that specialness implies.

AllTerrineVehicle
Jan 8, 2010

I'm great at boats!



Holy poo poo, I had no idea about either of these things and just spent a bunch of time going down the wiki rabbit hole after reading up on them :psyduck:

veekie
Dec 25, 2007

Dice of Chaos


Stuff like the Cosmere stuff I think, are just a hardcore fan bonus. The story works just fine without knowing, but once you know, you can see more happening under the surface.

Grundulum
Feb 28, 2006


At least, that's how it works until he starts writing the (multiple?) series where the Cosmere is a major factor. Can't look right now, but there was definitely at least one series that would bridge the multiple worlds and really lay bare some of the underlying cosmology.

Jorenko
Jun 6, 2004

I think you're just mad 'cause you're single.

Grundulum posted:

At least, that's how it works until he starts writing the (multiple?) series where the Cosmere is a major factor. Can't look right now, but there was definitely at least one series that would bridge the multiple worlds and really lay bare some of the underlying cosmology.

Way of Kings laid out so many hints that it's hard to imagine this won't be a major factor in Stormlight down the line.

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs



Jorenko posted:

Way of Kings laid out so many hints that it's hard to imagine this won't be a major factor in Stormlight down the line.

The thought of a mistborn surgebinder is… Well… That would be a really interesting passage to read about and would probably make me fully erect.

Edit: he would probably gently caress up and eat his spheres.

Tunicate
May 15, 2012





uh zip zoom posted:

The thought of a mistborn surgebinder is… Well… That would be a really interesting passage to read about and would probably make me fully erect.

Edit: he would probably gently caress up and eat his spheres.

Apparently there's going to be some sort of cross-system battle or something at the end of stormlight 2. Possibly involving awakeners.

404GoonNotFound
Aug 6, 2006

The McRib is back!?!?


Speaking of Mistborn stuff, don't forget that Brandon has hinted heavily that Hoid was behind one of the shattered vases at the Well of Ascension and now has a bead (if not multiple beads) of Lerasium in his possession.

:getin:

Clinton1011
Jul 11, 2007


Audible has a preview of the first 5 chapters of Steelheart for free right now.

uh zip zoom
May 28, 2003

Sensitive Thugs Need Hugs



So wait… Does that mean he already planned out mistborn before he even started writing the way of Kings? That said, what kind of chronology is there for the Cosmere?

Tunicate
May 15, 2012





uh zip zoom posted:

So wait… Does that mean he already planned out mistborn before he even started writing the way of Kings? That said, what kind of chronology is there for the Cosmere?

I think it's roughly publication order, but the newer books are breaking the pattern?

veekie
Dec 25, 2007

Dice of Chaos


uh zip zoom posted:

So wait… Does that mean he already planned out mistborn before he even started writing the way of Kings? That said, what kind of chronology is there for the Cosmere?

The Cosmere extends beyond any particular series I think. He had it in mind since before he started his writing career, and the people who know the most about it are his beta readers. Heck, we even saw Hoid in Mistborn, he was one of the informants.

Dravs
Mar 8, 2011

You've done well, kiddo.

veekie posted:

The Cosmere extends beyond any particular series I think. He had it in mind since before he started his writing career, and the people who know the most about it are his beta readers. Heck, we even saw Hoid in Mistborn, he was one of the informants.

Also in Warbreaker he is the old storyteller that they bring to the palace to recount their history. He pops up all over the place. He is even in Elantris so he has always been a part of the greater scheme of things for Sanderson.

Edit: http://coppermind.net/wiki/Hoid is a good link for him, although I started on that page and a few hours later I was still reading that site. the amount of detail 'behind the scenes' is great to read about.

eszett engma
May 7, 2013


Tunicate posted:

I think it's roughly publication order, but the newer books are breaking the pattern?

More or less (lots of spoilers in link)

Short answer: they happen in order of publication up until Way of Kings, though with unknown timing outside Mistborn. Alloy of Law is roughly contemporary with Way of Kings. Emperor's Soul takes place not too long after Elantris, and before the Mistborn trilogy.

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


veekie posted:

The Cosmere extends beyond any particular series I think. He had it in mind since before he started his writing career, and the people who know the most about it are his beta readers. Heck, we even saw Hoid in Mistborn, he was one of the informants.

Correction: he was ALL of the informants, according to the Wiki; there's one in each book, at roughly the same point in each.

veekie
Dec 25, 2007

Dice of Chaos


Naw, one of the informants was Kelsier.

thespaceinvader
Mar 30, 2011

The slightest touch from a Gol-Shogeg will result in Instant Death!


But the one Kell talked to was Hoid. I'm pretty sure that happened? It's been a while, I'll admit. Certainly the two in the later books, (one of whom Vin never actually talked to) were Hoid according to the wiki.

I should read Mistborn again.

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404GoonNotFound
Aug 6, 2006

The McRib is back!?!?


thespaceinvader posted:

Correction: he was ALL of the informants, according to the Wiki; there's one in each book, at roughly the same point in each.

Actually, he was "busy" in the second book (although his effects were seen, see my earlier post) and Vin cased him out from afar in the third book before choosing not to meet him due to looking untrustworthy.

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