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Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


Quote is not edit.

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Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


frumpsnake posted:

I'm sure they're fine for your porn drive but performance isn't exactly encouraging:



What kind of disk was that, and why was the Firewire performance so abysmal? I thought 1394a tended to be a bit faster than USB 2.0 after all the overhead was taken into account.

Then again, the last time I checked that was like... 2001.

Whimsy
Jan 8, 2001


Factory Factory posted:

What kind of disk was that, and why was the Firewire performance so abysmal? I thought 1394a tended to be a bit faster than USB 2.0 after all the overhead was taken into account.

Then again, the last time I checked that was like... 2001.

Apple used to hype it more. 1394 has been upgraded from the 400mbps version to 800, which doesn't seem to have caught on anywhere else except for Apple hardware, while USB has had two major revisions. I also recall that most of the USB overhead was on the processor, which has gotten exponentially faster. Add better drivers and wider adoption, and USB2 has definitely matured.

Spatial
Nov 15, 2007



The USB2/FW results in the graph are pathetically low. If you benchmark them yourself you'll get around 32MB/sec on USB2 and 40MB/sec on FW400.

That's 256/480Mbit and 320/400Mbit respectively. FW400 is so much more efficient it significantly outperforms USB2 even though it has lower theoretical bandwidth.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Hmm, has anyone put out a H67-based board with the following?

- PCIe lanes from CPU broken out to 2 x8 electrical slots
- implementing Intel PHY for integrated ethernet controller
- 1 or 2 PCIe x1 slots (brownie points if they do a x4 electrical slot with ganged lanes from the chipset)

This would be basically perfect for me for a server upgrade in the future. (running a i5-2500S, or i7-2600 if I really want extra threads). Integrated video, and 2 x8 electrical slots to support two LSI 1068E or LSI 2008 based controllers, with motherboard SATA ports to throw at the rest of the disks. Extra PCIe slots can be populated with more ethernet cards (or the x4 with a quad-port NIC) when I get a switch that can do LACP and such.

I suppose 3 x8 slots would be even better, but I'd need to go back to a X58 board for that, I suppose (and even then, I'd still need my PCI video card). I'm waiting for Z68, aren't I?

frumpsnake
Jan 30, 2001

The sad part is, he wasn't always evil.

Spatial posted:

FW400 is so much more efficient it significantly outperforms USB2 even though it has lower theoretical bandwidth.
First of all, it depends on whether you have a good (TI) or lovely (VIA) implementation.

But while faster and lower in CPU utilisation, it really doesn't *significantly* outperform USB2, and often in some cases like HDTach benchmarks, can end up slower on writes and about the same on reads.

But yeah, no idea why HardOCP's benchmark was *that* low.

vvv: Agreed, it's just that USB implementations seems to be more better in the PC world, no doubt boosted by the fact it's on the chipset.

frumpsnake fucked around with this message at 20:41 on Feb 14, 2011

Star War Sex Parrot
Oct 2, 2003



Muldoon

frumpsnake posted:

First of all, it depends on whether you have a good (TI) or lovely (VIA) implementation.
Everything comes down to implementation. It's no different on USB2. Unless it's got an Oxford controller, most enclosures use garbage JMicron adapters with absolute poo poo performance.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Star War Sex Parrot posted:

Everything comes down to implementation. It's no different on USB2. Unless it's got an Oxford controller, most enclosures use garbage JMicron adapters with absolute poo poo performance.

It's honestly more effort for the engineers of those devices too. JMicron datasheets are awful compared to what you can get from Silicon Image or others. Then again, they are dirt cheap

I don't mind TI and LSI Firewire controllers (from a EE standpoint), VIA can go get bent.

Alereon
Feb 6, 2004

Dehumanize yourself and face to Trumpshed

College Slice

movax posted:

Hmm, has anyone put out a H67-based board with the following?

- PCIe lanes from CPU broken out to 2 x8 electrical slots
That's not possible on H67, the lack of PCI-E port bifurcation is one of the main product differentiators for P67. I think you're boned until Z68 comes out.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Alereon posted:

That's not possible on H67, the lack of PCI-E port bifurcation is one of the main product differentiators for P67. I think you're boned until Z68 comes out.

poo poo, really? I thought both could do that.

Guess I'm waiting for Z68 or going workstation then (I kind of want to do ECC). Any idea if Intel will do ECC + desktop hardware like some AMD boards do?

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Heh, my SATA 3Gbps ports just went, had 6 drives 10 minutes ago, now I have 2.

Probably a lot of overnight file copying to and fro that killed it.

Alereon
Feb 6, 2004

Dehumanize yourself and face to Trumpshed

College Slice

movax posted:

Heh, my SATA 3Gbps ports just went, had 6 drives 10 minutes ago, now I have 2.

Probably a lot of overnight file copying to and fro that killed it.
Anyone who was relying on Intel's quoted failure rate estimates for a sense of security should definitely think carefully about that after reading this post.

Ryokurin
Jul 14, 2001

Wanna Die?

You just have to look at the numbers. They were on sale for what like four weeks and they made 8 million of them? that's well over a million units and I'm sure they were looking at it under common users, not early adopters who will likely run it full blast for hours on end.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Ryokurin posted:

You just have to look at the numbers. They were on sale for what like four weeks and they made 8 million of them? that's well over a million units and I'm sure they were looking at it under common users, not early adopters who will likely run it full blast for hours on end.

aside, I definitely don't consider myself an "average" user. I just wasn't expecting failure in literally 30 days (I ordered parts on 1/9, system went online 1/16 roughly). I was doing rough 100MB/s from local system drives across the network to my NAS for hours at a time.

Side-effects: had to reset CMOS and play the cold boot game to get system to POST again. OCing suffered as well, I had to increase Vcore by .1V to regain stability.

Marvell drivers have already blue-screened three times with RDS_FILE_SYSTEM (Stop 0x00000027), so that is pretty irritating as well.

This is a question more suited for the Packrats/NAS thread, but any suggestions for cheap PCIe RAID controller? Got a lot of spare 1.5TB drives from my NAS upgrade, so thinking about maxing out drives in my case by doing 2 RAID 1s of 'em. Thinking Highpoint perhaps...

movax fucked around with this message at 04:37 on Feb 18, 2011

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


Recently been some hubbub about getting Dell Perc5/i or 6/i controllers off of eBay, though that was intended for a corporate FrankenNAS. There is no set recommendation south of ~$400 AFAIK, since the thread shies away from FakeRAID. Pure software or pure hardware in that thread.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



Factory Factory posted:

Recently been some hubbub about getting Dell Perc5/i or 6/i controllers off of eBay, though that was intended for a corporate FrankenNAS. There is no set recommendation south of ~$400 AFAIK, since the thread shies away from FakeRAID. Pure software or pure hardware in that thread.

Yeah, I suggested a PERC 5 to a guy in the NAS thread, definitely overkill in my case. I was just thinking RAID would be nice, I'm a-ok with just JBOD'ing some spare drives. Maybe I'll do Intel RAID once my replacement P8P67 arrives.

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


movax posted:

Yeah, I suggested a PERC 5 to a guy in the NAS thread, definitely overkill in my case. I was just thinking RAID would be nice, I'm a-ok with just JBOD'ing some spare drives. Maybe I'll do Intel RAID once my replacement P8P67 arrives.

Derp, hi I read your posts

But honestly I think a PERC's the best value for your dollar. SATA add-in cards seem to almost universally get terrible reviews until you get to about $130, at which point you might as well buy a PERC.

Hok
Apr 3, 2003

Cog in the Machine

Factory Factory posted:

Derp, hi I read your posts

But honestly I think a PERC's the best value for your dollar. SATA add-in cards seem to almost universally get terrible reviews until you get to about $130, at which point you might as well buy a PERC.

Just be aware that a perc can't present individual drives, it has to be a raid.

If you want individual drives you need to create a 1 drive raid 0 on each and use that.

Not a huge problem unless you're running something like zfs which wants raw drives to work best.

Longinus00
Dec 29, 2005
Ur-Quan

Alereon posted:

Anyone who was relying on Intel's quoted failure rate estimates for a sense of security should definitely think carefully about that after reading this post.

Perhaps what people don't realize is that "15% in X years" doesn't mean that it takes X years before anything happens to those 15%.

Shmoogy
Mar 21, 2007


Longinus00 posted:

Perhaps what people don't realize is that "15% in X years" doesn't mean that it takes X years before anything happens to those 15%.

Yeah, mine has been showing problems since week 2. I just unplugged the drives I was using in the broken ports and when I need them, I'll switch drives around I guess.

Such a pain but I don't want to buy a sata card I'll literally never use again after April.

JerleMinara
Jan 22, 2011


I'm curious, for those of us with only one or two drives who are looking to upgrade, is there anywhere that's still selling the 'faulty' motherboards? I really don't care about the fact that I'll only have two ports instead of six.. I'd never use the latter :P

Whimsy
Jan 8, 2001


Everyday Potato posted:

I'm curious, for those of us with only one or two drives who are looking to upgrade, is there anywhere that's still selling the 'faulty' motherboards? I really don't care about the fact that I'll only have two ports instead of six.. I'd never use the latter :P

There is some hope. in Canada, Canada Computers is still selling them while explaining the issue to clients so they have some informed consent going on. And the recall should still be available to buyers, so you should have little trouble getting a return done as it applies, should you need it.

jagdtiger00
Jul 20, 2007



Everyday Potato posted:

I'm curious, for those of us with only one or two drives who are looking to upgrade, is there anywhere that's still selling the 'faulty' motherboards? I really don't care about the fact that I'll only have two ports instead of six.. I'd never use the latter :P

http://www.compuplus.com/MSI-MB-INT...55-1177827.html micro in stock maybe?

http://www.eworldsale.com/msi-p67s-...5753_57884.html (looks iffy)

http://www.alvio.com/xABK_PID104610...eferrer=froogle (Low inventory!)

http://www.buildyourowncomputer.com/product/92561Y.html (5 Available for immediate delivery!, Pricey!)

I would say the last 2 might send the things out, anyone want to try it out and if they send you one I'll buy one too!

jagdtiger00 fucked around with this message at 16:26 on Feb 19, 2011

Vermouth
Sep 16, 2004


i've had a really hard time getting a straight answer to this question, hopefully someone here can tell me - will a coolermaster 212+ fit on an asus p8p67 LE (with ram in a2/b2), or not?

would really appreciate an answer before i order the hsf if someone knows. thanks!

Wedesdo
Jun 15, 2001
I FUCKING WASTED 10 HOURS AND $40 TODAY. FUCK YOU FATE AND/OR FORTUNE AND/OR PROBABILITY AND/OR HEISENBURG UNCERTAINTY PRINCIPLE.



Vermouth posted:

i've had a really hard time getting a straight answer to this question, hopefully someone here can tell me - will a coolermaster 212+ fit on an asus p8p67 LE (with ram in a2/b2), or not?

would really appreciate an answer before i order the hsf if someone knows. thanks!

The good thing about the 212 is that you can move the fan up a little bit if the fan is blocking the RAM slots. I have a GA-P67A-UD3, which also puts the CPU socket close to the RAM slots, and my 212 works fine after a little fan position adjustment.

Vermouth
Sep 16, 2004


ok cool. forgot to mention, i have the g.skill ripjaws. the heatspreaders aren't totally obscene, but they add a centimeter or so to their height.

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


On my Pro with a Hyper 212+, it only blocks the first DIMM slot (A1) for huge-heatspreader RAM, and even then a centimeter may fit (if you take off the cooler to install it). The LE has a little extra clearance compared to the Pro, so there may not be any interference or limitations at all.

glitch77
Apr 22, 2006


Just letting anyone that cares to listen know;

The heatsink that comes with the i7 2600K is absolute garbage. It it smaller than the old Pentium 3 coolers and at stock speeds (3.8ghz turbo) with Prime95 running 8 threads it instantly starts to throttle because of temps (98C !?!).

Buying a cooler with an i7 is a complete must if you don't want it running at 200+F during high loads.

Wedesdo
Jun 15, 2001
I FUCKING WASTED 10 HOURS AND $40 TODAY. FUCK YOU FATE AND/OR FORTUNE AND/OR PROBABILITY AND/OR HEISENBURG UNCERTAINTY PRINCIPLE.



glitch77 posted:

Just letting anyone that cares to listen know;

The heatsink that comes with the i7 2600K is absolute garbage. It it smaller than the old Pentium 3 coolers and at stock speeds (3.8ghz turbo) with Prime95 running 8 threads it instantly starts to throttle because of temps (98C !?!).

Buying a cooler with an i7 is a complete must if you don't want it running at 200+F during high loads.

check to make sure all the pins of the heatsink are secured in the motherboard. It shouldn't get that hot even with the stock HSF, as long as it's correctly installed.

R1CH
Apr 7, 2002

The Ron Jeremy of the coding world

Yeah that's definitely not installed properly. Had the same issue with my E8400 heatsink when one of the pushpins was broken.

glitch77
Apr 22, 2006


I reseated it three times (first time was with the stock goo, second with AS3, third with ASC) and got the same results every time. Installed a new (huge) cooler master cooler and now it idles at 22C and never gets above 70c at 4.2ghz.

Maybe a bad heatsink? I dunno.

movax
Aug 30, 2008



glitch77 posted:

Just letting anyone that cares to listen know;

The heatsink that comes with the i7 2600K is absolute garbage. It it smaller than the old Pentium 3 coolers and at stock speeds (3.8ghz turbo) with Prime95 running 8 threads it instantly starts to throttle because of temps (98C !?!).

Buying a cooler with an i7 is a complete must if you don't want it running at 200+F during high loads.

Something is definitely wrong, you can hit 4.4GHz or so and still be within thermal spec with the stock cooler. Like R1CH said, maybe broken pushpins.

Your load temps are way too high as well, especially if your idle is 22C. I idle at 32C and load at 65C at 4.8GHz. Having that large of a delta between idle and load is a sign of improper/"Weird" HSF installation.

Zhentar
Sep 28, 2003

Brilliant Master Genius


It could also be an issue with the fan/fan speed control.

Nazattack
Oct 20, 2008


How much did the motherboards cost before they got pulled?

incoherent
Apr 24, 2004

01010100011010000111001
00110100101101100011011
000110010101110010


High end ones that most people here were running 130-200~ dollars.

Nodoze
Aug 17, 2006

If it's only for a night I can live without you

Any ETA on when the new boards will ship ? I am stuck using my laptop cause I parted out my tower right before the defect was discovered and running a Pentium M for a month has been a groan.

olaf2022
Feb 19, 2003


Fun Shoe

Nodoze posted:

Any ETA on when the new boards will ship ? I am stuck using my laptop cause I parted out my tower right before the defect was discovered and running a Pentium M for a month has been a groan.

Fixed boards are expected to be available in April.

source: http://www.anandtech.com/show/4154/...cement-programs

Pharnakes
Aug 14, 2009


So if you're looking to upgrade with an intel cpu about now, do you just have to wait untill april or can you just buy a motherboard now and get it replaced if and when problems arise?

Also if you do wait untill april what would be the next greatest thing around the corner, and would it be worth waiting for it if you've already waited a month and a half?

olaf2022
Feb 19, 2003


Fun Shoe

Pharnakes posted:

So if you're looking to upgrade with an intel cpu about now, do you just have to wait untill april or can you just buy a motherboard now and get it replaced if and when problems arise?

Also if you do wait untill april what would be the next greatest thing around the corner, and would it be worth waiting for it if you've already waited a month and a half?

Someone can correct me if I'm wrong, but if you've bought or are planning to buy a Sandy Bridge CPU then I think you've got the following options:

- Attempt to find a "bad" P67 or H67 motherboard now and don't use the SATA II (3.0 Gbit/sec) ports (or use them at your own risk) and eventually get it replaced (or not)
- Wait for the fixed P67 (which allows overclocking but does NOT allow use of the CPU's graphics) or the fixed H67 (which does NOT allow overclocking but allows use of the CPU's graphics) motherboards to come out in allegedly April
- Wait for the Z68 motherboards to come out in allegedly Q2 of this year (which allows overclocking AND the use of CPU's graphics)

olaf2022 fucked around with this message at 18:31 on Feb 22, 2011

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Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


H67 boards are also affected.

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