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Lowen SoDium posted:Intel, nor anyone else, has ever claimed that hyperthreading is 2x cores. 1gnoirents posted:Yeah but the difference is Intel specifically never called them cores. Well except for a real 8 core Intel of course that probably costs over $1000. Yeah, they actually have said that they're "logical processors" or "logical cores". quote:Architecturally, a processor with Hyper-Threading Technology consists of two logical processors, each of which has its own processor architectural state. After power-up and initialization, each logical processor can be individually halted, interrupted or directed to execute a specified thread, independently from the other logical processor on the chip. Unlike a traditional dual processor (DP) configuration that uses two separate physical processors (such as two Intel® XeonTM processors), the logical processors in a processor with Hyper-Threading Technology share the execution resources of the processor core. These resources include the execution engine, the caches, the system-bus interface and the firmware. Each Bulldozer processor/core also has its own processor state.
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Nov 10, 2015 04:49
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logical versus physical?
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Nov 10, 2015 05:06
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Paul MaudDib posted:Yeah, they actually have said that they're "logical processors" or "logical cores". The difference is Intel never marketed desktop i7s as 8-core processors
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Nov 10, 2015 07:28
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Paul MaudDib posted:Yeah, they actually have said that they're "logical processors" or "logical cores". While I do appreciate this cause it is actually interesting to me, the lawsuit is about marketing unfortunately. And I just have to plain agree with it, since its overwhelmingly the #1 feature stated over Intel when people ask about which brand to go for. http://www.amd.com/en-us/products/processors/desktop/fx http://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/processors/core/core-i7-processor.html http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819113284 http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819117559 Although what I dont agree with is the money grab part of it, rather than just forcing a definition of core.
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Nov 10, 2015 17:06
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Nice build quality on this Carrizo laptop: http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Toshiba-Carrizo-Laptop-Noise
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Dec 2, 2015 17:14
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Rastor posted:Nice build quality on this Carrizo laptop: How on earth is a grown-rear end man so puzzled about a broken exhaust fan? This guy is really the founder of Phoronix?
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Dec 2, 2015 17:55
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Rastor posted:Nice build quality on this Carrizo laptop: Man, Carrizo looks like a legitimate i3 competitor, but it really seems like you can only get it in laptops that are enormous pieces of poo poo. Whens the last time that Thinkpad T / X had AMD options? Or anything like an XPS 13? A Carrizo laptop with good build quality would actually be a valid option, but none seem to exist.
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Dec 2, 2015 17:58
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Twerk from Home posted:Man, Carrizo looks like a legitimate i3 competitor, but it really seems like you can only get it in laptops that are enormous pieces of poo poo. Whens the last time that Thinkpad T / X had AMD options? Or anything like an XPS 13? A Carrizo laptop with good build quality would actually be a valid option, but none seem to exist. Dell Inspiron 3656 Although not worth the price (what the hell Dell), nor the form factor (no seriously, what the hell, this should be Mini or Nano slim) I really want someone to bench this to see how close Excavator gets to i3s/5s when it doesn't have a thermal limit. Also since Dell is making a desktop out of the platform, fingers crossed for an XPS13 with good thermals. I've really been enjoying my Nexus but I'm been edging closer to the idea of just a phablet (Asus Zen, or Memo if I can get my hands on one) and a decently sized laptop.
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Dec 2, 2015 19:26
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Twerk from Home posted:Man, Carrizo looks like a legitimate i3 competitor, but it really seems like you can only get it in laptops that are enormous pieces of poo poo. Whens the last time that Thinkpad T / X had AMD options? Or anything like an XPS 13? A Carrizo laptop with good build quality would actually be a valid option, but none seem to exist.
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Dec 2, 2015 19:34
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Scott Wasson is stepping down as Editor-in-Chief at The Tech Report to work for Raja Koduri over at Radeon Technologies Group. http://techreport.com/blog/29390/into-a-new-era As Scott did both the heavy lifting on CPUs and GPUs, this is probably of interest to all AMD product stacks. Twerk from Home posted:Man, Carrizo looks like a legitimate i3 competitor, but it really seems like you can only get it in laptops that are enormous pieces of poo poo. Whens the last time that Thinkpad T / X had AMD options? Or anything like an XPS 13? A Carrizo laptop with good build quality would actually be a valid option, but none seem to exist. Man, you couldn't pay me to use anything Lenovo these days. Being owned by the Chinese is just bad news, period.
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Dec 3, 2015 08:19
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Man, you couldn't pay me to use anything Lenovo these days. Being owned by the Chinese is just bad news, period. They've certainly been blundering lately but I would still be all over it if they released a Retro Thinkpad.
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Dec 3, 2015 16:31
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Scott Wasson is stepping down as Editor-in-Chief at The Tech Report to work for Raja Koduri over at Radeon Technologies Group. It's not like Dell or anyone else is much better. Dell has gotten caught installing no less than three root CA certs with the signing keys included in the package. Who can you really recommend anymore? At this point you almost have to take it on a model-by-model basis IMO - f.ex as far as I know Lenovo hasn't been reported to install anything on the top-shelf Thinkpad T/W/X model lines. I'd still really like a nice 3K 15.6" with an expresscard slot and modular drive bay. Any alternatives besides Lenovo or Dell? A gaming or SLI GPU might be nice too. Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 16:50 on Dec 3, 2015 |
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Dec 3, 2015 16:46
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Lol if you don't format and do a fresh install after buying a PC. Then again, lenovo has some poo poo in bios that reinstalls itself these days, so I guess that doesn't help either unless you use something not windows. 
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Dec 3, 2015 17:09
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Paul MaudDib posted:It's not like Dell or anyone else is much better. Dell has gotten caught installing no less than three root CA certs with the signing keys included in the package. No, Dell *isn't* any better. But I don't know where else you can get business-class laptops these days. I am just as likely to grab a Sager/Clevo/MSI over a Dell/Lenovo, if it has the workstation graphics my job requires, these days. Truga posted:Lol if you don't format and do a fresh install after buying a PC. Even that is insufficient. Lenovo has been accused of BIOS-level backdoors. Your only option, if you care about security and privacy, is to not use them, as they've patently demonstrated bad faith.
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Dec 3, 2015 17:30
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Microsoft Store sells laptops and PCs now that are MS "Signature Edition" which remove all vender bloatware/trialware and other shenanigans. Really nice to crack open a new PC and not have to do a fresh reformat
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Dec 3, 2015 18:37
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SwissArmyDruid posted:Scott Wasson is stepping down as Editor-in-Chief at The Tech Report to work for Raja Koduri over at Radeon Technologies Group. Looks like Raja will at least turn the Radeon Group into something good. I'm super impressed so far with what he's done, and it's likely down to Lisa Su giving him as much room as he wants. Now I want them to bring back the Phenom name in the CPU division because that has a lot of good things associated with it, while a blank "FX" does not. Also, bring back Duron for unlocked low end. EmpyreanFlux fucked around with this message at 20:22 on Dec 3, 2015 |
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Dec 3, 2015 18:45
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Phenom Z/Athlon Z branding please
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Dec 3, 2015 20:14
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:Phenom Z/Athlon Z branding please Z for Zen? Phenom/Athlon/Duron, then basically replace the AX-XXXX with ZX-XXXX, so Z4, Z6, Z8, Z10 for dual, quad, hex, and octacores. Bring back Black Edition types, maybe as Red Edition. But then you'd have the weird future lawsuit involving AMD and Games Workshop about "Red ones go faster".
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Dec 3, 2015 20:35
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FaustianQ posted:Z for Zen? Phenom/Athlon/Duron, then basically replace the AX-XXXX with ZX-XXXX, so Z4, Z6, Z8, Z10 for dual, quad, hex, and octacores. Bring back Black Edition types, maybe as Red Edition. But then you'd have the weird future lawsuit involving AMD and Games Workshop about "Red ones go faster". I thought they were doing away with bulldozer modules? Isn't Zen shipping as Dual - Quad on normal mainstream sockets, just like Intel? I'd take a quad core that performed like a 4770K over anything Bulldozer descended.
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Dec 3, 2015 20:49
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FaustianQ posted:Z for Zen? Phenom/Athlon/Duron, then basically replace the AX-XXXX with ZX-XXXX, so Z4, Z6, Z8, Z10 for dual, quad, hex, and octacores. Bring back Black Edition types, maybe as Red Edition. But then you'd have the weird future lawsuit involving AMD and Games Workshop about "Red ones go faster". Pretty sure you could trademark the similar but distinct "The red one goes faster". Besides, the WH one is usually a clipped, "RED WUNZ GO FASTA" anyways.
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Dec 3, 2015 21:29
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Twerk from Home posted:I thought they were doing away with bulldozer modules? Isn't Zen shipping as Dual - Quad on normal mainstream sockets, just like Intel? I'd take a quad core that performed like a 4770K over anything Bulldozer descended. They are, but they're going to be doing independent dual, quad, hex and octacore chips each with hyperthreading, so 4, 8, 12 and 16 threads. From what we know, Zen looks like a fusion of K10 and Ivy Bridge. I don't know if cores will can be independently disabled but AMD is likely to disabled them in pairs as that's just too much pointless marketing and serialization for 1/2, 3/6, 5/10 and 7/14 core/thread chips. Heck, if some have issues running hyperthreading the best place to stuff them isn't in a new branding scheme but rather pair them with iGPUs and sell them as APUs, considering how intensive hyperthreading can be. SwissArmyDruid posted:Pretty sure you could trademark the similar but distinct "The red one goes faster". Besides, the WH one is usually a clipped, "RED WUNZ GO FASTA" anyways. Games workshop is composed of IP lawyers and game designers (read: rules lawyers), I think they could get the lawsuit to stick since they'll claim memetic appropriation. It'd still be a drat good slogan for Zen regardless because of that.
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Dec 3, 2015 21:41
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if you're making an 8 core processor as your flagship part, it's much less hell to retailers and vendors to bin by twos instead of having 8 separate product stacks for odd numbers of cores eating poo poo. Intel just doesn't sell the odd number of bum-cores out of the quad core chips in the first place (actually I think they stopped selling anything with bum cores since Ivy Bridge) and instead processes them for recycling, but AMD has to play fast and loose. Anime Schoolgirl fucked around with this message at 01:45 on Dec 4, 2015 |
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Dec 4, 2015 01:41
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:if you're making an 8 core processor as your flagship part, it's much less hell to retailers and vendors to bin by twos instead of having 8 separate product stacks for odd numbers of cores eating poo poo. AMD could do the old Phenom II X2/3 reenabled core capability with motherboard manufacturers. I'm sure some assholes would leave 1 star reviews on Amazon or Newegg about how terrible AMD is for selling a dual core chip that you can't magic into a quad for cheap because you ate poo poo on chip lottery, but it might help sales to allow people to unlock cores in the bios.
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Dec 4, 2015 01:47
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Sorry for the double post, interesting stuff on Bristol Ridge just dropped. That's some impressive gains right there, not only 5-10% more than Steamroller, but also considerably cooler. With DDR4 memory, the 8 CUs should have fairly acceptable performance and should be just under Iris Pro, and at the very least he R7 240 should be fully obsolete. Really wish AMD had snuck HBM1 on there, even a slice of 256MB would have made the top end compelling. Also, some iGPU less versions apparently, so looks like it might be the last hurrah of "Performance CMT" and with those power targets it wouldn't surprise me to see FX-9000 series performance under 150W. Still not great but at least not bugfuck insane if priced right.
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Dec 8, 2015 14:30
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FaustianQ posted:Sorry for the double post, interesting stuff on Bristol Ridge just dropped. Do we have a confirmation on the AM4 being an upgrade path for Zen yet?
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Dec 8, 2015 15:22
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A Bad King posted:Do we have a confirmation on the AM4 being an upgrade path for Zen yet? Yes? AM4/FP4 has long been confirmed to be the Zen/Zen+ platform, but AMD clearly wants to get bulk out for AM4 motherboards and needs processors for that to work, hence the last hurrah for CMT. Think of it as a kind of LGA775 parallel. Also considering what materials we've seen so far, wondering if AMD is going to have a unified Server/Desktop socket, maybe building off G34/C32. This would give them the real estate to muck about with HBM and allow no compromise on iGPU size, although it'd be completely incompatible with current consumer cooling solutions.
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Dec 8, 2015 15:31
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AM4 is their "unified" socket for the desktop market. Unified in the sense they don't need to have 2 separate sockets (for APU's and FX CPU's) anymore. The server sockets are really expensive and not needed if you want on package memory a la HBM. They only need all the pins so the sockets can talk to eachother, the chipset, and have 4 channel memory. At this point though having their desktop products support 4 channels of DDR4 would be exactly the sort of thing the iGPU's would need to fix the bandwidth bottleneck. I think if they could've done it they would've already. Their iGPU's have been bandwidth starved forever.
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Dec 8, 2015 17:17
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SPEAKING OF CARRIZO IN LENOVOS. http://www.pcper.com/reviews/Graphics-Cards/Radeon-Technologies-Group-Update-2016-FreeSync-and-HDR quote:AMD also wanted to point out that FreeSync is also available this holiday in a notebook! The Lenovo Y700 that includes the AMD FX-8800P Carrizo APU and the discrete Radeon R9 M380 GPU has VRR support on its 15.6-in 1080p IPS panel.  Sort of interesting... I'd want to see how good that M380 actually is, but if I trusted Lenovo anymore, I'd give that a fair shake, Y-series or not.
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Dec 8, 2015 20:13
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SwissArmyDruid posted:SPEAKING OF CARRIZO IN LENOVOS. The Y series are unfortunately bulky, plasticky trash, but usually they have relatively powerful hardware for the price. 15.6" is just too huge for a laptop in my opinion, but I'm glad to see them pushing something like this.
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Dec 8, 2015 20:17
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The real question is if they actually let it run at 35w TDP or cripple it down to 15w 
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Dec 8, 2015 22:59
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Prescription Combs posted:The real question is if they actually let it run at 35w TDP or cripple it down to 15w The actual issue really is good VRMs and VRM cooling that use a separate pipe compared to the processors. You can unlock even the 15W Carrizos to run at 35W, but virtually all Carrizo laptops have garbage tier heat management, because reasons I suppose, so the APU throttles to hell and back. Also tests have shown that Carrizo actually operates best around 25W and gets really bad diminishing returns going up to 35W, it's a hyperoptimized design. Maybe with the incoming designs on FP4 their might be some movement to build something of quality. Maybe AMD can work with Mediatek to build reference laptops. I think desktop Carrizo should have better returns at higher TDPs but that remains to be seen.
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Dec 9, 2015 00:20
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So what can goons tell me about the amd A8-7410 because the internet tells me next to nothing.
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Dec 9, 2015 01:46
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wargames posted:So what can goons tell me about the amd A8-7410 because the internet tells me next to nothing. Don't buy it. What reason were you thinking of buying one? It's probably not a good reason.
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Dec 9, 2015 02:08
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FaustianQ posted:Also, some iGPU less versions apparently, so looks like it might be the last hurrah of "Performance CMT" and with those power targets it wouldn't surprise me to see FX-9000 series performance under 150W. Still not great but at least not bugfuck insane if priced right. 
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Dec 9, 2015 02:13
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Anime Schoolgirl posted:i really hope they go with the "z" branding for athlon chips or else there'll be a similar clusterfuck to pentium/celeron mainline vs. atom-trail where there's a Zen Athlon 4300 and CMT Athlon 960k or something Agreed, although the naming scheme could change entirely with Zen considering they've run out of millenarian numbers.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:01
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Twerk from Home posted:Don't buy it. What reason were you thinking of buying one? It's probably not a good reason. it came with a laptop.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:11
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wargames posted:So what can goons tell me about the amd A8-7410 because the internet tells me next to nothing. It's a Carrizo-L, a continuation of the Puma+, processor. It's better than Intel's Atom-based poo poo in terms of performance. On the downside, it has twice the TDP. Notebookcheck did a little review of it. I wouldn't recommend it if you can get an ULV i-core notebook or tablet instead.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:12
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the other option I could afford was a i3-4030u for 20 bucks more with 4gigs of ram compared to the 8 i have now.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:16
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This is a discussion you have BEFORE you purchase a laptop.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:21
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This is mainly a question about the hardware itself since I've been an intel guy for so long and want to know more about what I have on hand.
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Dec 9, 2015 03:23
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