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beejay
Apr 7, 2002



Toilet Rascal

the panacea posted:

I'm building a PC for a friend. For 1080 gaming is it worth it to get a 770 if he has the spare change? Or should he rather get a 760 and save for the next gen?

movax posted:

Mod Note: This thread is for general GPU and videocard discussion, head over to the parts picking megathread if you just need help picking a card to buy.

Anyway, I'm not really sure why you'd buy a card now and plan on upgrading within the next several months. Seems like poor value to me.

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wargames
Mar 16, 2008

official yospos cat censor


the panacea posted:

I'm building a PC for a friend. For 1080 gaming is it worth it to get a 770 if he has the spare change? Or should he rather get a 760 and save for the next gen?

760 should be good for now but yeah I'd wait to see the 800 series.

the panacea
May 10, 2008



beejay posted:

Anyway, I'm not really sure why you'd buy a card now and plan on upgrading within the next several months. Seems like poor value to me.

Ah sorry wrong thread, then. thanks!


wargames posted:

760 should be good for now but yeah I'd wait to see the 800 series.

Yeah, I told him to wait, but I get the feeling he needs his gaming fix quite soon.
Sorry for the derail.

afkmacro
Mar 29, 2009





beejay posted:

RMA it, why would you not RMA it?

Turns out I can't RMA it But good news is that bumping memory clock down from 1600 to 1550 has solved all artifacting.

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


Does anybody have experience altering nvidia bios to allow the hardware 1.21v limit? I'm thinking about going for that again (MSI 780ti) but it very weirdly did not work for me the first time despite doing exactly the same thing I've done on other cards, and the flash reported successful. I did just use someone else's bios (skyn3t?) but I'd have no issue doing it myself if it was feasible

Guni
Mar 11, 2010


Goons! What's the ETA on 20nm cards? Is it still around January next year? What's the gooncensus - will AMD & nVidia release new (old) cards before then?

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


I dont think there is a real ETA for 20mm. 28mm maxwell should be released late this year

Rime
Nov 2, 2011



1gnoirents posted:

I dont think there is a real ETA for 20mm. 28mm maxwell should be released late this year sometime in 1993

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


haha woops. That'd be a big loving chip

Panty Saluter
Jan 17, 2004

Making learning fun!


1gnoirents posted:

I dont think there is a real ETA for 20mm. 28mm maxwell should be released late this year

Don't feel bad, I didn't notice that until that until it was pointed out. I do the same thing with mega/giga/terabytes all the time, referring to the new 3 and 4 GB hard drives and such

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


Just for fun:

GK110 is a 550 mm2 chip at 28 nm. Scaled up to 28 mm feature size, that's a 550 km2 chip, or nearly exactly the size of Guam, including reefs.

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


Factory Factory posted:

Just for fun:

GK110 is a 550 mm2 chip at 28 nm. Scaled up to 28 mm feature size, that's a 550 km2 chip, or nearly exactly the size of Guam, including reefs.

finally be able to run 4k with a single card

HalloKitty
Sep 30, 2005

Adjust the bass and let the Alpine blast


1gnoirents posted:

finally be able to run 4k with a single card

295X2 is fairly good for that, but presumably you mean single GPU

Proud Christian Mom
Dec 20, 2006


Factory Factory posted:

Just for fun:

GK110 is a 550 mm2 chip at 28 nm. Scaled up to 28 mm feature size, that's a 550 km2 chip, or nearly exactly the size of Guam, including reefs.

Watch Dogs would still run like poo poo

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


HalloKitty posted:

295X2 is fairly good for that, but presumably you mean single GPU

I imagined me sitting on top of GuamGPU with a small desk and a single 4k monitor playing Battlefield 4 at 100 fps, with a tsunami going on behind me from the gigantic fan from the cooler

Krailor
Nov 2, 2001
I'm only pretending to care

Taco Defender

1gnoirents posted:

I imagined me sitting on top of GuamGPU with a small desk and a single 4k monitor playing Battlefield 4 at 100 fps, with a tsunami going on behind me from the gigantic fan from the cooler

C'mon you've got free water cooling in the pacific.

HalloKitty
Sep 30, 2005

Adjust the bass and let the Alpine blast


1gnoirents posted:

I imagined me sitting on top of GuamGPU with a small desk and a single 4k monitor playing Battlefield 4 at 100 fps, with a tsunami going on behind me from the gigantic fan from the cooler

That's not only awesome, but it makes me wonder if one monolithic GPU that was physically enormous and the power of a normal GPU today could have been made 20 years ago. Obviously the resistance through the chip that size would be insane so the heat output would be furnace-like, but if it was cooled with liquid helium or something, the resistance would fall and maybe you could have had the future!

EoRaptor
Sep 13, 2003




HalloKitty posted:

That's not only awesome, but it makes me wonder if one monolithic GPU that was physically enormous and the power of a normal GPU today could have been made 20 years ago. Obviously the resistance through the chip that size would be insane so the heat output would be furnace-like, but if it was cooled with liquid helium or something, the resistance would fall and maybe you could have had the future!

The big problem here is that, as you scale up the size of a transistor, its switching speed slows. This is because electricity is not instant, and it takes time for electrons to move around. The more electrons you are moving to change the state, the longer that state change takes. Switching faster is based on reducing the number of electrons needed through reduced size, or increasing the flow of electrons through increased voltage.

You also run into problems with moving information around, as the timing of information moving between elements on a chip is also strictly controlled, and changing the scale changes the timing. Related to that, is that the longer the timing, the less information you can send in any given time period. A larger chip simply could not move enough information around quickly and reliably.

In answer to your question, no, it would not be possible to take any modern chip design and make it on an older process, it wouldn't function.

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


HalloKitty posted:

That's not only awesome, but it makes me wonder if one monolithic GPU that was physically enormous and the power of a normal GPU today could have been made 20 years ago. Obviously the resistance through the chip that size would be insane so the heat output would be furnace-like, but if it was cooled with liquid helium or something, the resistance would fall and maybe you could have had the future!

Not even the most powerful supercomputer in the world 20 years ago made of separate CPUs could touch a modern desktop CPU/GPU. For reference a quad core i7 would perform around equal to the 140 GFLOPS figure in Linpack, Ivy Bridge-E would probably beat it and a high end Xeon would crush it. The 290X/780ti do around 5000 GFLOPS single-precision and in the non-gimped DP versions (aka Titan) over 1000 GFLOPS double-precision. Trying to match just the sheer compute performance of one Titan 20 years ago would likely have required hundreds of megawatts and hundreds of thousands of CPUs.

quote:

In 1993, Sandia National Laboratories installed an Intel XP/S 140 Paragon super- computer, which claimed the No. 1 position on the June 1994 list. With 3,680 processors, the system ran the Linpack benchmark at 143.40 giGflop/s. It was the first massively parallel processor supercom- puter to be indisputably the fastest system in the world.

MaxxBot fucked around with this message at 16:43 on Jul 30, 2014

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


I wish I knew more semiconductor physics.

I plugged in a bunch of flagship CPUs, comparing process node (X-axis) vs. top retail SKU clock rate (Y axis).



Running that trend line back, which is a statistical no-no but whatever, GuamK110 could be hot-clocked up to 4.1 KHz. About 22 MFLOPS single-precision.

beejay
Apr 7, 2002



Toilet Rascal

My fear is that the whole island will become so overly populated with electrons that it will tip over and capsize.

Proud Christian Mom
Dec 20, 2006


AMD really missed their chance with Tahiti

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


Factory Factory posted:

I wish I knew more semiconductor physics.

I plugged in a bunch of flagship CPUs, comparing process node (X-axis) vs. top retail SKU clock rate (Y axis).



Running that trend line back, which is a statistical no-no but whatever, GuamK110 could be hot-clocked up to 4.1 KHz. About 22 MFLOPS single-precision.

Ooo that would be disappointing, heh



Oh my

eggyolk
Nov 8, 2007




go3 posted:

AMD really missed their chance with Tahiti

Duck and burger
Jul 21, 2006
Never a greater duo

wargames posted:

760 should be good for now but yeah I'd wait to see the 800 series.

http://www.hallels.com/articles/300...ctober-2015.htm

Hm... Thinking of upgrading to a 770 right now. Can I wait 14 months? Probably not...

beejay
Apr 7, 2002



Toilet Rascal

I dunno what is happening on that website but nvidia is most certainly going to release something before October 2015. The editing on that "article" is good for a laugh though.


"What is Hallels?"

quote:

Hallels.com has been running since 2012 for the purpose of serving the Christian community as a Christian music web portal.

Duck and burger
Jul 21, 2006
Never a greater duo

Hm. I think I'll get off the internet for a bit.

Wozbo
Jul 5, 2010


So honest question: Do we eventually get to a resolution point where there's a slight percieved boost in perf because AA / AF and the other little resolution based tweaks no longer become as necessary to run as mathematically detailes/ times per frame?

1gnoirents
Jun 28, 2014

ASK ME ABOUT MY MICRO PENIS


I believe so yes. Super sampling looks incredible ... even though its technically AA itself I think it shows what a raw higher resolution can do. Then again, a lot of AA has "effects" that have nothing to do with the resolution so maybe not

Factory Factory
Mar 19, 2010

This is what
Arcane Velocity was like.


Wozbo posted:

So honest question: Do we eventually get to a resolution point where there's a slight percieved boost in perf because AA / AF and the other little resolution based tweaks no longer become as necessary to run as mathematically detailes/ times per frame?

Yes. If you could render native on a Retina-type HiDPI display, things would be aliased, but the aliasing would be smaller than you could see (in principle - YMMV depending on your eyesight and distance from the display).

That said, AF is not AA. Even with perfect rendering with a bajillion times more pixels than you could ever see, you still want anisotropic filtering because it's something totally different and hugely increases visual quality on surfaces that are aren't perfectly perpendicular to the camera (which is pretty much all of them in a game).

creatine
Jan 27, 2012





edit: nevermind i am an idiot

creatine fucked around with this message at 00:43 on Aug 3, 2014

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


The number of GTX 880 rumors seems to be increasing by the day, they seem to be pointing to a late September or October launch at a price under $500. From the specs the performance looks to be slightly above the 780ti and the TDP will likely be somewhat below the current high end cards.

http://videocardz.com/51117/exclusi...eased-september

Don Lapre
Mar 28, 2001

If you're having problems you're either holding the phone wrong or you have tiny girl hands.


looking forward to running a 980ti on a 300w power supply.

Agreed
Dec 30, 2003

The price of meat has just gone up, and your old lady has just gone down



Don Lapre posted:

looking forward to running a 980ti on a 300w power supply.

Same, I will actually be able to build computers again without total agony because small form factor will be totally feasible without sacrificing performance or requiring anything exotic in the way of case adjustments I bet most people are gravitating towards SFF anyway, but I'm looking forward to being able to get in on it without losing poo poo in the trade.

Star War Sex Parrot
Oct 2, 2003



Muldoon

Agreed posted:

Same, I will actually be able to build computers again without total agony because small form factor will be totally feasible without sacrificing performance or requiring anything exotic in the way of case adjustments I bet most people are gravitating towards SFF anyway, but I'm looking forward to being able to get in on it without losing poo poo in the trade.
I crammed a 7970 into a mITX box, then went smaller to a GTX 680, and intend to toss an 880 GTX into it next.

The Lord Bude
May 23, 2007

I'M DISAPPOINTED THAT CORTANA WILL BE A CIRCLE AND NOT THE ACTUAL SEXY WOMAN FROM THE GAME.


I notice Asus has new 6gb gtx780s out. That in itself is boring but they also seem to have used them to debut a new Strix Cooler which they claim is 38% cooler, and is apparently designed to operate in a fanless mode when the GPU is below 65 degrees.

BurritoJustice
Oct 9, 2012



On the subject of the 880, videocardz (yeah I know) has quoted the gigabyte marketing guy slating the release of their GTX 800 G1 Gaming series of cards for late September. Rumour are rumours, but this seems almost semi legit.

Arzachel
May 12, 2012


BurritoJustice posted:

On the subject of the 880, videocardz (yeah I know) has quoted the gigabyte marketing guy slating the release of their GTX 800 G1 Gaming series of cards for late September. Rumour are rumours, but this seems almost semi legit.

Yeah, seems like late September-October it is. Will be really interesting to see how a smaller 880 does against 780ti without the node shrink advantages 580->680 had.

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beejay
Apr 7, 2002



Toilet Rascal

The Lord Bude posted:

I notice Asus has new 6gb gtx780s out. That in itself is boring but they also seem to have used them to debut a new Strix Cooler which they claim is 38% cooler, and is apparently designed to operate in a fanless mode when the GPU is below 65 degrees.

Asus has used Strix on a couple other cards, but yeah it does look like a really great cooler.

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