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escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

Slow train coming


melon farmer posted:

Dope = heroin, e.g. when McNulty is talking to Phelan or whoever (I can't remember the exact reference) and is talking about 24/7 dope and coke in the towers. Not sure where crack fits in, all the vials they sell look like they are crack-cocaine, unless they just refer to it as coke - I can't remember them selling, nor do I remember anyone using, powdered cocaine in the show.

They do sell powdered coke. Also, don't you remember when Cutty and the underlings snort coke in the third season? Cutty says he can't do it because he's on paper, but then they take him down to an old man selling clean piss, which he gets from the day care center.

In Hamsterdam, Dee-Dee asks for an 8-ball of coke at some point.

DarkCrawler posted:

That brings it to mind, is it cocaine or heroin that the crews sell in the show? I remember Prop Joe talking about some old timer who sold heroin a lot and I think the Greeks gave Nick heroin too, but isn't crack cocaine? Do they sell both?

They sell both. In Season 2, when Cheese and Bodie are trying to undercut each other for Bubble's money, Bodie says something like 2 hits (of heroin) for $15 with the ice on top (cocaine) for free.

They snort the coke and they shoot the coke. I don't believe we ever see anyone smoking crack, though we know it is alluded to-- Michael's mother, for example.

Actually we might see people smoking crack in Hamsterdam. I don't remember.

escape artist fucked around with this message at 17:27 on Mar 12, 2013

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MrBling
Aug 21, 2003

Oozing machismo

I believe the proper spelling is heh-rawn.

escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

Slow train coming


Jerusalem, I don't know how to link to individual posts, so if you could link to all of your recaps, I'll update the OP with them.

Diabolik900
Mar 28, 2007



escape artist posted:

Jerusalem, I don't know how to link to individual posts, so if you could link to all of your recaps, I'll update the OP with them.

Just click the "#" icon under a post and it will put a link to that post in your address bar.

Token Female
Apr 2, 2007

If I hear the music...


Episode 6 the wire
Episode 7 one arrest

If you click the '#' symbol under the avatar, it gets you to that exact post.

edit: beaten

geeves
Sep 16, 2004



escape artist posted:

Jerusalem, I don't know how to link to individual posts, so if you could link to all of your recaps, I'll update the OP with them.

It's the # between the Paper and ? link. Just don't copy the link when you're on a reply page. The link will go to the Reply page.

escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

Slow train coming


Okay, that was easy. When I linked my own posts, I edited them, without changing anything, at just hit "save changes" which brought me to a link.

The # button is so much easier.


OP is updated!

It can't be reiterated enough, Jerusalem, you are doing an amazing job with these write-ups.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?



I don't know whether to be embarrassed or relieved that I always struggle to differentiate between cocaine and heroin by sight alone :laugh:

I was confused because I know they definitely sell both, but I've kind of always taken the shallow view that heroin is for injecting and cocaine is for snorting (or smoking in a pipe if it is crack cocaine).

In regards to Bird seemingly being fine after taking the bottle shot to the head, he had just been doing drugs so is there the possibility that he was still high in the interview room and somewhat buffered from the pain of the shot?

DarkCrawler
Apr 6, 2009
GRANNY RUINING YOUR VIBES? CUT HER ASS OUT OF YOUR LIFE!


Or he is just a tough motherfucker.

escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

Slow train coming


Jerusalem posted:

I don't know whether to be embarrassed or relieved that I always struggle to differentiate between cocaine and heroin by sight alone :laugh:

I was confused because I know they definitely sell both, but I've kind of always taken the shallow view that heroin is for injecting and cocaine is for snorting (or smoking in a pipe if it is crack cocaine).

In regards to Bird seemingly being fine after taking the bottle shot to the head, he had just been doing drugs so is there the possibility that he was still high in the interview room and somewhat buffered from the pain of the shot?

You can't differentiate just by looking at the powders. I mean, that's a huge plot point in Pulp Fiction.

You can shoot, snort, or smoke either substance.

What you look for to determine what is what, is the effects. Wallace-- after he snorted the powder, smiled and sort of nodded out, and then slumped over on his bed. He would do the exact opposite if it was cocaine.

I just thought of another example of someone snorting coke. When Sherrod is about to attack Namond in Season 4, he is told to "pump himself up"-- and he snorts some powder out of a vial. Then you can see he's wired out of his mind (as Cutty recognizes) when he attacks Namond.


edit:

One thing I just noticed, when Orlando is arrested in Episode 10. Orlando says "I'm good for 4" and the narcotics cop says "almost isn't worth it for 4." Orlando takes this to mean it isn't worth his time/money/risk as drug dealer's time to wholesale to a guy for 4 (whatever) units of coke. Orlando insists that if the poo poo is right, he'll come back for more. However, upon second viewing, the line takes a second meaning. "It almost isn't worth it for 4..." as in, it's almost not worth it to go to jail for the money he would make off of flipping 4 wholesaled packages of coke. Just a nice little piece of dramatic irony and a line with two meanings.

I love this show :allears:

escape artist fucked around with this message at 23:48 on Mar 12, 2013

Hammy
May 26, 2006
umop apisdn

Bird could be the highest, toughest motherfucker in Baltimore, there's still no way he gets hit like that and shows up looking aces a few hours later. He could have still been just as much of an rear end in a top hat to the cops with a broke rear end face, and it would probably have fit the tone of the show better anyway. Plus we'd get an early impression that even the great Lester is complicit in some of the darker aspects of BPD culture. Obviously a minor detail, it's just something that stuck out to me because The Wire is normally good about getting those things right.

escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

Slow train coming


Hammy posted:

Bird could be the highest, toughest motherfucker in Baltimore, there's still no way he gets hit like that and shows up looking aces a few hours later. He could have still been just as much of an rear end in a top hat to the cops with a broke rear end face, and it would probably have fit the tone of the show better anyway. Plus we'd get an early impression that even the great Lester is complicit in some of the darker aspects of BPD culture. Obviously a minor detail, it's just something that stuck out to me because The Wire is normally good about getting those things right.

His face is bloodied and bandaged on the side that he was hit with the bottle. I just watched the episode. I don't see the problem?

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?



escape artist posted:

His face is bloodied and bandaged on the side that he was hit with the bottle. I just watched the episode. I don't see the problem?



He does look pretty good for a guy who just got clocked in the side of the face with a glass bottle full of liquid, I have to say.

Hammy
May 26, 2006
umop apisdn

I've looked worse than that after getting clocked once at the bar. Then again I'm as far from Bird as possible on the toughness spectrum so there's that.

SpookyLizard
Feb 17, 2009


MrBling posted:

I believe the proper spelling is heh-rawn.

Sold it like it was water. I love prop joe.

Frostwerks
Sep 24, 2007

by Lowtax


escape artist posted:


What you look for to determine what is what, is the effects. Wallace-- after he snorted the powder, smiled and sort of nodded out, and then slumped over on his bed. He would do the exact opposite if it was heroin.

Nodding off is something that happens with opiates and opioids though.

escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

Slow train coming


Frostwerks posted:

Nodding off is something that happens with opiates and opioids though.

I meant cocaine. Which is what Jerusalem initially thought it was. Fixed the post.

Trust me, I'm a recovering opiate addict. . . I know all too well.

I actually nodded out during the beginning of Season 3 Episode 11 and woke up to see Stringer Bell's murder out of context.

Frostwerks
Sep 24, 2007

by Lowtax


To be fair though given the nature of his condition I'd recommend pretty much anything other than cocaine lol.

melon farmer
Oct 28, 2009

My boy says he can eat fifty eggs, he can eat fifty eggs!


escape artist posted:

They do sell powdered coke. Also, don't you remember when Cutty and the underlings snort coke in the third season? Cutty says he can't do it because he's on paper, but then they take him down to an old man selling clean piss, which he gets from the day care center.

In Hamsterdam, Dee-Dee asks for an 8-ball of coke at some point.

poo poo, you're right...quoting things from memory in this show is a constant challenge even after two watches.

Fragmented
Oct 7, 2003

I'm not ready =(



It would be a lot easier if it was the west coast where pretty much all heroin is brown powder/tar. And while on the subject i thought a g-pack was 1000 vials not $1000? I mean Stringer is surprised when D brings in $23000 or something from one day at the pit. At $10 a vial that would be either 23 g-packs or 2 and change. When they stop Weebay going into the pit and catch the runner it's only for 4 g-packs, that would be like 6 re-ups a day if 4 g-packs is only 400 vials.

Edit: Either way holy poo poo that is a lot of heroin to sell in a day.

Grumpwagon
May 5, 2007
I am a giant assfuck who needs to harden the fuck up.



Fragmented posted:

It would be a lot easier if it was the west coast where pretty much all heroin is brown powder/tar. And while on the subject i thought a g-pack was 1000 vials not $1000? I mean Stringer is surprised when D brings in $23000 or something from one day at the pit. At $10 a vial that would be either 23 g-packs or 2 and change. When they stop Weebay going into the pit and catch the runner it's only for 4 g-packs, that would be like 6 re-ups a day if 4 g-packs is only 400 vials.

Edit: Either way holy poo poo that is a lot of heroin to sell in a day.

IIRC they say "23," which I assumed was $2300. I always got the impression that the high rises were the big money makers, and the pit was just sort of a hanger-on, so not making that much.

EDIT: But that's all totally uninformed speculation, so I could be totally wrong. Typing it out, it doesn't seem like enough.

Grumpwagon fucked around with this message at 04:27 on Mar 13, 2013

Fragmented
Oct 7, 2003

I'm not ready =(



Ahhh i guess that makes sense. When they get hit for the 4 g-packs don't they hear them talking on the wire about getting hit "for 40" though? Oh god i'm going to start another rewatch again aren't i. It's for research i swear!

Edit: So 23,000 times 365 is 8,395,000, which is less than 10 percent of the hundred million a year they thought Avon and co were clearing. I still think i'm right.

Fragmented fucked around with this message at 04:34 on Mar 13, 2013

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?



Fragmented posted:

It would be a lot easier if it was the west coast where pretty much all heroin is brown powder/tar. And while on the subject i thought a g-pack was 1000 vials not $1000? I mean Stringer is surprised when D brings in $23000 or something from one day at the pit. At $10 a vial that would be either 23 g-packs or 2 and change. When they stop Weebay going into the pit and catch the runner it's only for 4 g-packs, that would be like 6 re-ups a day if 4 g-packs is only 400 vials.

Edit: Either way holy poo poo that is a lot of heroin to sell in a day.

Everything I've read (I have no personal experience!) says that a G Pack is a package worth $1000, and is about 50 vials of heroin. So 4 G Packs would be 200 vials - depending how pure or not the heroin is, one vial will probably do a junkie for a least half a day? The "stepped on poo poo" won't even keep a junkie quiet for an hour, which perversely means they come back for more, chasing the high, and the dealer makes more money.

The Pit does good business, but not as good as the Towers or some of the prime corners (like Stinkum spotted), so D'Angelo making so much money out there really impressed Stringer who, much as he might personally dislike D, appreciates a man who can make money.

Edit: D making so much money in the pit goes to show how poorly it was run in the past, as evidenced by the changes D'Angelo makes when he gets there. He runs it like an assembly line, creating specialized roles that serve to run things more efficiently AND keep the police from being able to get everything on film in one spot. He makes the assumptions that the police are A) Lazy and B) Don't care about small fish like The Pit Crew, and 9 times out of 10 he would probably be right. Before he got there, I imagine the place ran very chaotically, with junkies just going to whichever dealer was closest, handing him money and getting the drugs right then and there. Daniels' speech at the end of the season to Carver can be translated over to the drugs side of things as well - if you have somebody running things who doesn't care, who takes shortcuts and doesn't think things through, you end up with the people underneath him taking that cue and doing the same. Carver goes on to be a better cop, and Bodie takes a lot of what he learned from D'Angelo (despite their adversarial relationship) into the future as well.

Jerusalem fucked around with this message at 04:48 on Mar 13, 2013

escape artist
Sep 24, 2005

Slow train coming


^^ Reading urban dictionary too, huh?

I just wrote a long rear end post doing some math and I still don't know what the gently caress.


The "we just lost 40" when they picked up 4 g-packs confused me too. I watched the back end of season 1 today, so I know exactly what you're talking about.



When g-packs are wholesaled in bulk, they probably cost a lot less than $1,000 each, which is how you make profit on it.

EvilTobaccoExec
Dec 22, 2003

Criminals are a superstitious, cowardly lot, so my disguise must be able to strike terror into their hearts!

The "just lost 40" probably refers to the 40 hundred lost in sales revenue, $4000 phrased weirdly.

Considering our trouble cracking code and slang, if this thread were Major Crimes then Avon would still be a free man.

:)

melon farmer
Oct 28, 2009

My boy says he can eat fifty eggs, he can eat fifty eggs!


To add to the funky math, white mike sells to Nick at "4 a pack for you" which is the extreme friend price - he tried to wholesale at 5 until Sergei vouched for him. I think even if they're "worth" $1000, they probably sell $10000 worth of drugs off them, which would make sense with the "we just lost 40" (I think prop joe even mentions $40k when omar brings the drugs to him) and Lester/McNulty's estimate for how much money they pull in could be right.

edit: though white mike only ever says "4" and "5" which I suppose could be 400/500 respectively. ugh...

melon farmer fucked around with this message at 14:35 on Mar 13, 2013

Randomly Specific
Sep 22, 2012

My keys are somewhere in there.

On Bird, it's probably a stylistic choice. Having him have that bandage and bruise while still being in good enough shape to be spicily belligerent takes a bit of the edge off the beating he gets later. If he's got half his face bandaged while he's lolling and slurring his words in proper post-concussive form then you couldn't have Daniels go all dramatic with the polaroid without the beating becoming something truly sick.

I'm pretty sure Burns and Simon have a good idea of the results of somebody taking a good smash to the face with a bottle.

Basebf555
Feb 29, 2008

The greatest sensual pleasure there is is to know the desires of another!



Fun Shoe

melon farmer posted:

To add to the funky math, white mike sells to Nick at "4 a pack for you" which is the extreme friend price - he tried to wholesale at 5 until Sergei vouched for him. I think even if they're "worth" $1000, they probably sell $10000 worth of drugs off them, which would make sense with the "we just lost 40" (I think prop joe even mentions $40k when omar brings the drugs to him) and Lester/McNulty's estimate for how much money they pull in could be right.

edit: though white mike only ever says "4" and "5" which I suppose could be 400/500 respectively. ugh...

Yea theres two values, how much a street dealer would pay for the g-pack wholesale, and how much money can be made from a g-pack once its split up into vials. So when White Mike is selling a g-pack for "4 or 5", he means Nick will buy it from him for $400 and then get $1000 back once its sold on the street. So for each g-pack he gets a profit of $600, a hundred more than if he wouldn't have gotten the "friend price". So the "g" in g-pack refers to the money that it is worth to someone who is willing to split it into vials and take the risk of going out in the street and selling it.

Protocol 5
Sep 23, 2004

"I can't wait until cancer inevitably chokes the life out of Curt Schilling."

Street level crews like D's are shown as basically being salaried. They get their packages at no cost and turn over all their cash, then get paid a fixed amount at the end of the week. This is why getting points on the package is a big deal, you have a much higher earning potential when you can easily do $10-15,000 a week in sales. When street sales were mostly dominated by neighborhood gangs, this is how it worked. When it's mostly freelance slingers, as it has been in a lot places since the late 80s, what you get instead is the typical 60/40 split in favor of the financial backer. So if he sets you up with a g-pack, you give him $600 and you eat the cost of paying your crew and any spillage, theft, or police seizures out of your $400. While you can potentially earn more this way, you don't have a steady supply, and you have no organization backing you if a rival crew decides they want to kill you and take you dope/cash/corner.

Pretty much any illegal activity works in a pretty similar way, be it gambling, prostitution, highjacking, whatever. If you're part of an organization, you need to pay your dues before you starting seeing any real money, and if you're a freelancer, you earn more to start with, but you're still taking the short money and you also take 95% of the risk.

Hammy
May 26, 2006
umop apisdn

Protocol 5 posted:

Pretty much any illegal activity works in a pretty similar way, be it gambling, prostitution, highjacking, whatever. If you're part of an organization, you need to pay your dues before you starting seeing any real money, and if you're a freelancer, you earn more to start with, but you're still taking the short money and you also take 95% of the risk.

To add to this, people working for an organization would not be allowed to mark up their packs. If D sells a pack for $1200 and pockets the extra he is in deep poo poo if he gets found out, similar to Orlando's rebuke for trying to put his own package out in the pit. The higher ups want each pack to sell for exactly $1000 to facilitate easy accounting for each crew and to avoid internal competition.

Redundant
Sep 24, 2011

Even robots have feelings!

I finished watching the first season for the second time last night and it's just great. I wanted to come and give a pithy summary to first the entire season, then the final episode and then just the final few scenes but they cram so much into each shot that it felt like I was doing it a disservice since one of the major points to come out of the season is "all the pieces matter". So instead I have decided to comment on my favourite part of the entire episode which is how pretty much everyone on the case regards it as their best work, but that pride is tempered by the knowledge that with just a bit more time and support they could have made a much bigger case and actually taken down a major organisation instead of just weakening it. Along with that the show does a good job showing that even if that was the case, and they did completely destroy the Barksdale organisation, nothing much would really change when looking at the big picture. New dealers would move in, a small organisation would become a big one by taking advantage of the power vacuum and it would all start ticking over again back from the beginning. I think I am enjoying my second viewing more than my first one.

DarkCrawler
Apr 6, 2009
GRANNY RUINING YOUR VIBES? CUT HER ASS OUT OF YOUR LIFE!


Basebf555 posted:

Yea theres two values, how much a street dealer would pay for the g-pack wholesale, and how much money can be made from a g-pack once its split up into vials. So when White Mike is selling a g-pack for "4 or 5", he means Nick will buy it from him for $400 and then get $1000 back once its sold on the street. So for each g-pack he gets a profit of $600, a hundred more than if he wouldn't have gotten the "friend price". So the "g" in g-pack refers to the money that it is worth to someone who is willing to split it into vials and take the risk of going out in the street and selling it.

I thought g-pack means a thousand? So he would buy four g-packs (I think 4 or 5 was referring to the number of packs) for $4000 and then turn it for however much money he can get out from them elsewhere?

EvilTobaccoExec
Dec 22, 2003

Criminals are a superstitious, cowardly lot, so my disguise must be able to strike terror into their hearts!

DarkCrawler posted:

I thought g-pack means a thousand? So he would buy four g-packs (I think 4 or 5 was referring to the number of packs) for $4000 and then turn it for however much money he can get out from them elsewhere?

Nah, the "g" in g-pack does refer to $1000, but that's the value they're worth as retail street ready (capped and cut) drugs for sale at $20 a pop. Mike was selling each pack for $500 (or $400 in Nick's case cause of the wholesale price).

No one really wants people selling at their own prices, or with their own cuts, especially with the same capping (brand) on the vials. It's a bigger deal in an organization like Avon's/Marlos that's all united, but even Mike got pissed at Ziggy for shaking vials and giving his stuff a bad name.

Alec Bald Snatch
Sep 12, 2012

by exmarx


Wait I thought the g-packs were already in vials. They used a house far out near the suburbs for stepping on and packaging it, which the MCU tried to keep from the raid later on in the season. No way in hell they'd be handling uncut heron out in the low-rises.


e: yeah that's the house where Herc and Carver lift the mattress and take the cash sitting underneath.

e2: in season 2 White Mike's selling for Prop Joe, and he cuts his stuff in the warehouse near the docks

Alec Bald Snatch fucked around with this message at 15:43 on Mar 14, 2013

EvilTobaccoExec
Dec 22, 2003

Criminals are a superstitious, cowardly lot, so my disguise must be able to strike terror into their hearts!

They are already in vials. The g-packs are already street ready (capped in vials and cut down in purity), ready to be sold the second they step out the door, a vial for $20.

What they don't want are people like Ziggy (or Cassandra and whats his name Dee caught) cutting them even more, say turning 2 vials into 3, making the heroin weaker but spreading it out in more vials, to earn say $1200 instead of $1000.

Alec Bald Snatch
Sep 12, 2012

by exmarx


That's what I thought.

Cape Cod Crab Chip
Feb 20, 2011

Now you don't have to suck meat from an exoskeleton!


EvilTobaccoExec posted:

What they don't want are people like Ziggy (or Cassandra and whats his name Dee caught)

:eng101: Sterling, the same guy whose kneecap got lit up by Omar.

Lugaloco
Jun 29, 2011


Redundant posted:

I think I am enjoying my second viewing more than my first one.

This was my experience too. I went through seasons one to five at a fair clip and never really took time to contemplate exactly what was going on and, even though I thoroughly enjoyed it, didn't fully appreciate everything that was happening. Second time through I know who everyone is and as a result could devote more brainpower to noticing bigger themes and little subtleties. It also helped that after my first watch I read various reviews and the threads on this site which really opened my eyes to how complex this show is.

Redundant
Sep 24, 2011

Even robots have feelings!

Lugaloco posted:

This was my experience too. I went through seasons one to five at a fair clip and never really took time to contemplate exactly what was going on and, even though I thoroughly enjoyed it, didn't fully appreciate everything that was happening. Second time through I know who everyone is and as a result could devote more brainpower to noticing bigger themes and little subtleties. It also helped that after my first watch I read various reviews and the threads on this site which really opened my eyes to how complex this show is.
I'm a bit sad that I got ahead of the write ups in this thread because I don't want to miss some of the smaller details. I don't suppose anyone has any good resources they could link me to so I can keep on learning do they? I tried googling it but holy balls there's a lot, I tried to filter through them all to find good ones but :effort:

e: VVV This is exactly the kind of thing I was looking for, thanks.

Redundant fucked around with this message at 23:45 on Mar 14, 2013

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Lugaloco
Jun 29, 2011


Redundant posted:

I'm a bit sad that I got ahead of the write ups in this thread because I don't want to miss some of the smaller details. I don't suppose anyone has any good resources they could link me to so I can keep on learning do they? I tried googling it but holy balls there's a lot, I tried to filter through them all to find good ones but :effort:

Here's Alan Sepinwall dissecting every (I think) episode: Link.

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