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Hot Diggity!
Apr 3, 2010

SKELITON_BRINGING_U_ON.GIF


Get Scarpa Vapor Vs

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jiggerypokery
Feb 1, 2012

...But I could hardly wait six months with a red hot jape like that under me belt.

The best pair of shoes are the pair that actually fit you. Same as buying a harness. You need to actually go into a shop and try them on, and try a lot of them on. If the shop doesn't have little footholds for you to try the shoes out on, go to a different shop. Lots of companies do boot demos at climbing walls now and then, they are worth scoping out too.

Eventually, you'll find a pair you absolutely love and you'll want to keep replacing. Even then, the sizes and even shape often vary slightly from production batch to production batch and you can still end up disappointed buying online.

https://www.ukclimbing.com/articles/skills/series/neil_gresham_technique_and_training/technique_-_choosing_your_footwear-10488

asur
Dec 28, 2012


Sizing down only really matters for aggressive shoes so if you don't get one of those I'd pick whatever is reasonably comfortable after it's stretched out.

pokie
Apr 26, 2008

IT HAPPENED!



I am thinking of getting a pair of shoes slightly smaller than my normal size just for problems with a lot of heel hooking. My current ones are just loose enough that a serious engaged heel hook makes them slip. Any thoughts on what good candidate shoes could be?

I currently have miuras, solutions, anasazis and katanas because I am an insane person.

Also I just started an easy hangboarding routine. I am pretty excited about getting out of my plateau.

Cannon_Fodder
Jul 17, 2007

"Hey, where did Steve go?"
Design by Kamoc

My gym had a pair of the same shoes so I tried them on. They were super comfortable despite going down from a 44 to a 43. I forgot how slippery new shoes feel at first, but I seem to like'em.

Thanks for the advice, I tried 'em out on 3-4 routes before making the decision to buy.

Meaty Ore
Dec 17, 2011

My God, it's full of cat pictures!


I went to the Red this weekend and did some trad. I toproped a few short 5.7s and practiced gear placements on my way up, then led another. I used only passive protection, and according to my trad-experienced mentor most of my placements were good, and all of them would have held if I had fallen. A few placements could have been better, but I certainly seemed to have a decent grasp of how to place gear. But goddamn I can see why people use cams as their main protection these days.

Tactical Lesbian
Mar 31, 2012



pokie posted:

Also I just started an easy hangboarding routine. I am pretty excited about getting out of my plateau.

Obviously I don't have an answer to your questions but I'm real stoked to see your progress! :D

Electoral Surgery
Mar 19, 2010


pokie posted:

I am thinking of getting a pair of shoes slightly smaller than my normal size just for problems with a lot of heel hooking. My current ones are just loose enough that a serious engaged heel hook makes them slip. Any thoughts on what good candidate shoes could be?

I currently have miuras, solutions, anasazis and katanas because I am an insane person.

Also I just started an easy hangboarding routine. I am pretty excited about getting out of my plateau.

why do you own loose solutions

Ubiquitus
Nov 20, 2011



Electoral Surgery posted:

why do you own loose solutions

Solutions suck at heel hooking

Still B.A.E
Mar 24, 2012



If your heel is slipping out of a pair of solutions, they're too big. The heel is by no means amazing, but it shouldn't come off.

To be a bit more helpful, Scarpa instincts are probably the best shoes I've had for heel hooking. I had the old lace up ones, but I'm sure any of the newer ones are as good. Depends though, generally a soft heel like on pythons are good for slopers, harder heel like solution or that cheat ridge on the anasazi heel are better for hooking edges ime.

Still B.A.E fucked around with this message at 08:12 on May 30, 2018

Cannon_Fodder
Jul 17, 2007

"Hey, where did Steve go?"
Design by Kamoc

Sent 3 new routes at the gym!

I'm starting to break into v3 range consistently. v4s remain a crapshoot. Still, I'm very excited. I had been putting off going back consistently because of my shoe losing rubber but new ones have given me a bit of confidence in my equipment back.

I got a pat on the back for figuring out how to (slowly) static a problem that was meant to be a dyno.

Not sure about the culture in other climbing gyms, but I heavily endorse Terra Firma in GR, MI. The people there are good people.

pokie
Apr 26, 2008

IT HAPPENED!



Electoral Surgery posted:

why do you own loose solutions

I didn't know that any of my shoes were loose until I tried doing some weird v6 slopery heel hook where my foot was very high and bore a great enough load that my shoes started slipping off. This hasn't been a problem for 4 years. My shoes hurt my toes already. I don't want tighter shoes for regular climbing.

Still B.A.E posted:

If your heel is slipping out of a pair of solutions, they're too big. The heel is by no means amazing, but it shouldn't come off.

To be a bit more helpful, Scarpa instincts are probably the best shoes I've had for heel hooking. I had the old lace up ones, but I'm sure any of the newer ones are as good. Depends though, generally a soft heel like on pythons are good for slopers, harder heel like solution or that cheat ridge on the anasazi heel are better for hooking edges ime.

Cool, I will check them out Instincts at my local REI.

M. Night Skymall
Mar 22, 2012



pokie posted:

I didn't know that any of my shoes were loose until I tried doing some weird v6 slopery heel hook where my foot was very high and bore a great enough load that my shoes started slipping off. This hasn't been a problem for 4 years. My shoes hurt my toes already. I don't want tighter shoes for regular climbing.

People's heels are all different shapes so it's a little hard to give specific shoe advice, basically what I do if I want a shoe that won't slip on a hard heel hook (and I'm pretty flexible so I can hook over my head and haul myself up off my foot if my shoe will stay on for it) is try on shoes and then try as hard as I possibly can to take them off pulling on the heel while curling my foot, if it moves at all it's probably not going to work. Once I find a shoe I ask the person working, if they seem knowledgeable, how much they think that shoe'll stretch or I google it until I get a good range, then size down that far. Generally getting a shoe that tight hurts to wear, like a couple attempts on a problem max at a time before I take it off hurts to wear, and digs into my achilles. Doesn't slip on heel hooks though. If you're already at the "man I have a lot of pairs of climbing shoes" stage, it's probably worth finding a pair of shoes that works for you and just wear them if you need to do a heinous heel hook, or I dunno maybe your heel's shaped different than mine and it won't be so bad.

Hot Diggity!
Apr 3, 2010

SKELITON_BRINGING_U_ON.GIF


Caldwell and Honnold set a new speed record on the Nose

Mons Hubris
Aug 29, 2004

fanci flup :)




I'm sick of Alex Honnold. Whatever man you're good at climbing we get it

pokie
Apr 26, 2008

IT HAPPENED!



M. Night Skymall posted:

People's heels are all different shapes so it's a little hard to give specific shoe advice, basically what I do if I want a shoe that won't slip on a hard heel hook (and I'm pretty flexible so I can hook over my head and haul myself up off my foot if my shoe will stay on for it) is try on shoes and then try as hard as I possibly can to take them off pulling on the heel while curling my foot, if it moves at all it's probably not going to work. Once I find a shoe I ask the person working, if they seem knowledgeable, how much they think that shoe'll stretch or I google it until I get a good range, then size down that far. Generally getting a shoe that tight hurts to wear, like a couple attempts on a problem max at a time before I take it off hurts to wear, and digs into my achilles. Doesn't slip on heel hooks though. If you're already at the "man I have a lot of pairs of climbing shoes" stage, it's probably worth finding a pair of shoes that works for you and just wear them if you need to do a heinous heel hook, or I dunno maybe your heel's shaped different than mine and it won't be so bad.

That makes sense. Thanks for the specific advice. I definitely intend to only use these shoes for specific nasty heel hooks, so I am fine with them being miniature iron maidens.

Boner Pill Connoisseur
Apr 23, 2002

I took the blue pill.



I've got two shoes, ones for edgy/hooky bullshit on basalt, the other for smeary jammy bullshit on granite

as both pairs suck I can see the impulse to keep buying them

SeaborneClink
Aug 27, 2010

MAWP... MAWP!


Tim Klein and Jason Wells died while simul-climbing Freeblast (5.7) El Cap on Saturday morning.

:smith:

Investigation still ongoing and rampant rumors about one being peeled off the wall by another party's falling gear. YOSAR & NPS are pretty tight lipped and none of the witness reports seem to corroborate it, but that's the statement one of the deceased' spouse made.

SeaborneClink fucked around with this message at 08:02 on Jun 4, 2018

Hot Diggity!
Apr 3, 2010

SKELITON_BRINGING_U_ON.GIF


Caldwell and Honnold went sub two hours on the Nose :stare:

Boner Pill Connoisseur
Apr 23, 2002

I took the blue pill.



we get it alex, you can climb the nose

Colonel J
Jan 3, 2008


Bouldered for a while, just got into top roping and gosh darn that poo poo is fun. I can't wait to try lead now.

My gym has a huge wall with an auto belayer (really just a pulley up top with a seatbelt-like brake that catches and lowers you if you fall). I never saw that before. Are they common? It's real scary but also pretty cool.

I'm going camping at the end of summer at a lake that has a rock face that we saw people climbing on last year. I know there's at least one anchor at the top for a top rope, so we intend on bringing a rope and harnesses and trying it out this year. My friends and I have only climbed in gyms, what's a good resource for us to prepare before we try the outdoor climb?

Baronash
Feb 29, 2012

So what do you want to be called?

The best resource to prepare is to head out with someone who has climbed outside before. Building anchors isn't difficult, but it is definitely a skill that needs to be learned by doing it under the supervision of a knowledgeable person. Videos aren't that great of a substitute, because they don't give you any of the feedback that a person would.

Electoral Surgery
Mar 19, 2010


Your gym or another one in your area may teach a basic outdoor toprope class - this can be a great resource, especially if you find a couple other people to split the cost.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!


Please do not build a top rope anchor without the input / oversight of at least one person who knows what they're doing.

Auto belays are pretty common and I wish my local wall had more of them, if you just want to get yourself good and hosed up climbing in a short space of time then they're a great way to do it, and more fun than doing boulder circuits etc.

Levitate
Sep 30, 2005

randy newman voice

YOU'VE GOT A LAFRENIÈRE IN ME


SeaborneClink posted:

Tim Klein and Jason Wells died while simul-climbing Freeblast (5.7) El Cap on Saturday morning.

:smith:

Investigation still ongoing and rampant rumors about one being peeled off the wall by another party's falling gear. YOSAR & NPS are pretty tight lipped and none of the witness reports seem to corroborate it, but that's the statement one of the deceased' spouse made.

Reading now that they're speculating, also based on eye witness account, that they weren't placing protection nearly enough or even at all...

Morbus
May 18, 2004



Climbers of their skill going for a speed attempt aren't gonna spend much time placing pro on 5.7

People have been pushing times lower and lower in both rock and alpine climbing for awhile now, and I don't think there's any question that it's being done at the expense of safety. I think there's definitely a debate to be had over whether or not this is a good direction to be pushing the cutting edge of the sport, but I think they were placing exactly as much protection as they intended or as was warranted for their goal.

That being said, staying roped together on pitches were you *know* you aren't gonna be placing pro strikes me as maybe just reckless.

asur
Dec 28, 2012


Isn't Freeblast a 5.11? I havent climbed it, but going off Mountain Project two of the pitches are 5.8 and 5.9 and then the rest are 5.10 and 5.11.

I've always though simul climbing without pro seemed reckless as you're doubling your chance of getting ripped off the wall, but ive never heard of anyone unroping probably because it defeats the point of saving time.

I'd be curious to know if people setting speed records try to keep a piece of gear between them or not? At 2 hours up the Nose it seems pretty likely that they skip a bunch of placements to save time.

asur fucked around with this message at 16:37 on Jun 11, 2018

armorer
Aug 6, 2012

I like metal.

asur posted:

Isn't Freeblast a 5.11? I havent climbed it, but going off Mountain Project two of the pitches are 5.8 and 5.9 and then the rest are 5.10 and 5.11.

I've always though simul climbing without pro seemed reckless as you're doubling your chance of getting ripped off the wall, but ive never heard of anyone unroping probably because it defeats the point of saving time.

I'd be curious to know if people setting speed records try to keep a piece of gear between them or not? At 2 hours up the Nose it seems pretty likely that they skip a bunch of placements to save time.

It is a 5.11, but the info I've seen says they peeled off a section of it that is 5.7. Any pitch may really only have a few moves that warrant the grade, with the rest of the pitch being easier.

Levitate
Sep 30, 2005

randy newman voice

YOU'VE GOT A LAFRENIÈRE IN ME


I thought they weren't trying to set a speed record or anything and were just doing a "chill" climb

Morbus
May 18, 2004



I mean, I don't think they were trying to set any records, but they were very much trying to climb as quickly as possible. One can argue that the risk/benefit ratio of forgoing protection while roped together on that climb is just obviously not worth it...but it's ultimately a personal decision. My point is just that it was a deliberate risk on their part and not really out of line with the current norms of high-level speed climbing, where minimal/no pro is not uncommon even on "chill" climbs.

Some people would argue that, at their level of skill, it wasn't inherently more dangerous than when a regular schlubbo goes unroped on exposed class 3/4. My personal feeling is that failure/injury rate for these guys is quantitatively high enough that you can't really argue that the increased risk is compensated for by their commensurate increase in skill level--at least not to the extent people imagine it to be. But that may or may not be the case once you normalize for the time they spend climbing...

armorer
Aug 6, 2012

I like metal.

When you add in factors out of their control, like the possibility of a falling haul bag from a party higher up, then the accident starts to make a lot of sense.

I think a lot of folks tend to think it is just them and the rock, but in many areas that's really not the case.

Syncopated
Oct 21, 2010


Guess who led his first 5.10a on gear today? This guy!

pokie
Apr 26, 2008

IT HAPPENED!



Syncopated posted:

Guess who led his first 5.10a on gear today? This guy!

Nice job. Keep it up!

jet_dee
May 20, 2007
Blah blah blah Nationstates is cool blah blah blah

12 months of indoor bouldering weekly, and three weeks of 3x/week. Woo!

I kinda wish I was climbing better than v2-v3 by now but I think I had (and still have) weaknesses around upper body strength, core strength, flexibility and of course, fear of slipping/falling.

I also started incorporating some training on the campus board set up, a bit like this:
https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/785455991233885425/

but only with my feet on rungs supporting my body weight - and sometimes I practice dead-hanging or doing pull-ups using the round wooden holds.

Is it too soon to be doing this sort of training, and should I just be patient?

I also do some campusing on v0-v1 boulder routes, to finish off a training session. I couldn't seem to find any information on Google as to whether this is a quick route to injury - what are other climbers' experiences with this?

Mokelumne Trekka
Nov 22, 2015

Soon.


Me and someone else have been teaching ourselves lead climbing at the gym. Bad idea. A mixture of arrogance and stupidity led me to believe it is simple. Needless to say we pissed off some employees after several errors. Feeling discouraged but I suppose most take classes.

Electoral Surgery
Mar 19, 2010


Mokelumne Trekka posted:

Me and someone else have been teaching ourselves lead climbing at the gym. Bad idea. A mixture of arrogance and stupidity led me to believe it is simple. Needless to say we pissed off some employees after several errors. Feeling discouraged but I suppose most take classes.

Take a class.

Ravenfood
Nov 4, 2011


Mokelumne Trekka posted:

Me and someone else have been teaching ourselves lead climbing at the gym. Bad idea. A mixture of arrogance and stupidity led me to believe it is simple. Needless to say we pissed off some employees after several errors. Feeling discouraged but I suppose most take classes.
What kind of sketchy gym lets you climb lead without checking that you have any idea what you're doing?

Mahlertov Cocktail
Mar 1, 2010

I ate your Mahler avatar! Hahahaha!

If you mean that you and another person without lead experience are trying to figure it out on your own, do NOT do that. Swallow your pride and take a class, for your own and others’ safety.

interrodactyl
Nov 8, 2011

you have no dignity


jet_dee posted:

12 months of indoor bouldering weekly, and three weeks of 3x/week. Woo!

I kinda wish I was climbing better than v2-v3 by now but I think I had (and still have) weaknesses around upper body strength, core strength, flexibility and of course, fear of slipping/falling.

I also started incorporating some training on the campus board set up, a bit like this:
https://www.pinterest.co.uk/pin/785455991233885425/

but only with my feet on rungs supporting my body weight - and sometimes I practice dead-hanging or doing pull-ups using the round wooden holds.

Is it too soon to be doing this sort of training, and should I just be patient?

I also do some campusing on v0-v1 boulder routes, to finish off a training session. I couldn't seem to find any information on Google as to whether this is a quick route to injury - what are other climbers' experiences with this?

You're better off limit bouldering and trying hard on moves that are just out of your reach. Maybe do some hang boarding if you want to incorporate some off the wall training.

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Mokelumne Trekka
Nov 22, 2015

Soon.


Ravenfood posted:

What kind of sketchy gym lets you climb lead without checking that you have any idea what you're doing?

Fair question. We did a lot of research beforehand and know top roping, so I think we appeared competent at a surface level, only upon close scrutiny did it turn out we kinda sucked. One gym worker eventually (our third day, tbh) analyzed our every move.

Mahlertov Cocktail posted:

If you mean that you and another person without lead experience are trying to figure it out on your own, do NOT do that. Swallow your pride and take a class, for your own and others’ safety.

Yeah agreed, totally. It was a dick move to not take a class first.

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