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VikingofRock
Aug 24, 2008




I'm looking for a work laptop to last me a while (five years if possible). My boss is buying it for me, and the only requirement cost-wise is "something reasonable" (she didn't specify further when asked). My guess would be something around the $1200 mark would make sense. Here's what I would like from it, in decreasing order of importance:

  • Compatibility with most astrophysics software packages. This makes my OS preferences Linux > OSX >>>> Windows.
  • Comfortable to work on for long periods of time.
  • Powerful enough processor to do some moderate-intensity data crunching in a reasonable time.
  • Customizability. This is the one thing leading me away from a MacBook, but maybe I've been misinformed on this front.

Any recommendations? I noticed that it seems to be difficult to find laptops without Windows / OSX already installed, so maybe that makes a Linux laptop infeasible--although maybe I'm wrong here too.

VikingofRock fucked around with this message at 21:53 on Aug 6, 2013

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Packstand
Sep 22, 2012


I'm looking for a good laptop for my mom. I can't find any decent resources as it seems like everything goes obsolete so quickly in the laptop realm.

She's mainly going to be using it for youtube, facebook.

The hitch is that she wants a decent amount of storage and the computer can't be slow at all so it needs like 2gb RAM and a fast processor.

Budget is around $400-$700.

Anyone have any good recommendations?

Packstand fucked around with this message at 22:15 on Aug 6, 2013

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!



-Blackadder- posted:

Ok, cool, thanks. So would this and this be good choices?

Get the Mushkin Chronos, not the Callisto. That's a last-generation drive.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004





agarjogger posted:

In six months of use in every possible setting, I've found the 2x2 nothing special, and rarely did it find a network that my T61's ThinkPad a/b/g wouldn't have . I would have done much better with the 6300 3x3. Thread pros will remember that I spent many a post trying to justify my choice of the webcam, but I've come to regret it since an external wireless card is so much dumber than an external camera, and I find myself needing one if I want to keep streaming internet radio with the lid closed.

3x3 ultimate-n owns bones, at $25 upgrade it's probably the single most useful upgrade you can get on any laptop, period. If you can't get online, about 90% of your laptop's usefulness drops off a cliff. Dollar for dollar it's invaluable. You can access gmail just as fast on an i3 vs an i5, but if you can't connect to the wifi at the airport you can't read your email.

I got caught on the wrong side of a landslide in rural colombia ready to miss my flight back to the sates, but one of the buses in range of me had an open wifi access point connected to 3G, I was able to reschedule my flight and save myself about $750 in airfare. I would have never spotted the wifi signal in the mountains without my trusty 3x3 ultimate n.

agarjogger posted:

I get by just fine on the 4GB RAM, 8GB would be cool too. When I popped a stick in from another x230, I didn't notice a difference. Buy some on your own and search for Hadlock's post w/photos on installing it.

This image (along with a bunch of others!) are dumped in one of the first few posts of this new thread.

Hadlock fucked around with this message at 23:04 on Aug 6, 2013

pistolshit
May 15, 2004



I have a Toshiba QX410 that I got like a year ago. It's been a solid laptop thus far and when I got it with the OEM windows on it the battery life was stellar. However, ever since upgrading to vanilla windows 8 (and on vanilla 7 as well) the battery life is poo poo. I've tried looking on google for battery managers but everyone seems to say that windows does power management well. Am I just functionally retarded?

Any thoughts or help are appreciated. I would love to get back to a solid 6-8 hrs of battery life. It's gotta be possible, because once I got Ubuntu tweaked right it would be good for 6 hours.

PlesantDilemma
Dec 5, 2006

The Last Hope for Peace

Any reason not to buy a Lenovo Yoga 13? They have a sale on the website that ends tomorrow. The flip-around style seems really cool to me. It's GPU seems pretty weak, but I don't really play video games outside of Starcraft 2 and old emulators.

-Blackadder-
Jan 2, 2007

Game....Blouses.


Bob Morales posted:

Get the Mushkin Chronos, not the Callisto. That's a last-generation drive.

Will the Chronos work with the x120e? I wasn't sure because the x120e is SATA II and the Chronos is SATA III.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006


Just wear the fucking mask, Bob

I don't care how many people I probably infected with COVID-19 while refusing to wear a mask, my comfort is far more important than the health and safety of everyone around me!



-Blackadder- posted:

Will the Chronos work with the x120e? I wasn't sure because the x120e is SATA II and the Chronos is SATA III.

SATA is backwards compatible so you can mix drives and buses. The connectors are exactly the same and the drive will just run at the slower of the two speeds.

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull


VikingofRock posted:

  • Customizability. This is the one thing leading me away from a MacBook, but maybe I've been misinformed on this front.

Any recommendations? I noticed that it seems to be difficult to find laptops without Windows / OSX already installed, so maybe that makes a Linux laptop infeasible--although maybe I'm wrong here too.

What kind of customizability are you concerned about with OS X? Hardware, software, both?

If you choose Linux you really need to do careful research. Especially if you're going to buy a Mac to run Linux. With laptop hardware it may pay to buy one generation (or more) behind so that you aren't one of the pioneers. It's that or buy from one of the handful of Sager / Clevo rebadging operations which specialize in Linux, such as System76. (You'll probably end up doing your own support in the long run with these operations anyways.)

Depending on what your astro software needs it may be feasible to run it inside a Linux virtual machine. In which case buy what you like and get more RAM than you otherwise would.

icantfindaname
Jul 1, 2008




How feasible is using windows on a macbook with bootcamp? I hear it thrown around very often, but is it actually manageable or is it a pain in the rear end? Do windows games and programs play well with the custom mac GPUs and poo poo? Am I better off just getting a thinkpad if I want a windows laptop? If I got a macbook I wouldn't use windows exclusively, but having it as an option would be very nice.

AntennaGeek
May 30, 2011



I'm looking for a cheap, Linux-friendly laptop to use around the house since I accidentally introduced the kids to Minecraft, thus making it nearly impossible to get access to the main 'family' desktop during the day.

I'm just planning to do some light coding and websurfing; any heavy lifting I'd be doing code wise would be via ssh to my server in the basement.

I haven't had to consider laptop purchases for some time; my previous job issued me a series of Dell Latitudes until I left in 2011; I've used a Google CR48 Chromebook since then.

I'm not averse to the idea of using a Chromebook... but honestly, I'd like just a little more oomph. ( Not much, but some. )

What's the current sweet spot for netbooks that play well/are supported well by Linux?

DrDork
Dec 29, 2003
commanding officer of the Army of Dorkness

icantfindaname posted:

How feasible is using windows on a macbook with bootcamp? I hear it thrown around very often, but is it actually manageable or is it a pain in the rear end? Do windows games and programs play well with the custom mac GPUs and poo poo? Am I better off just getting a thinkpad if I want a windows laptop? If I got a macbook I wouldn't use windows exclusively, but having it as an option would be very nice.
It's not too bad at all, really. Getting it set up may take a little bit of time (and a good bit of hard drive space), but once you've got it up and running most things work just fine. The mac GPUs are virtually identical to their PC counterparts, so it's not like drivers are problematic. The biggest issue most people have is poor battery life due to a variety of battery-saving features not working correctly under Windows. So just keep in mind you'll likely want to be plugged in for any extended Windows session.

Twerk from Home
Jan 17, 2009

This avatar brought to you by the 'save our dead gay forums' foundation.


Packstand posted:

I'm looking for a good laptop for my mom. I can't find any decent resources as it seems like everything goes obsolete so quickly in the laptop realm.

She's mainly going to be using it for youtube, facebook.

The hitch is that she wants a decent amount of storage and the computer can't be slow at all so it needs like 2gb RAM and a fast processor.

Budget is around $400-$700.

Anyone have any good recommendations?

Did you read the OP? You described what any current laptop in the world will do, including chromebooks and small tablets. 4GB is now the standard amount of RAM, with 8GB as a larger option. Youtube and facebook are really low demands and any modern processor can handle them comfortably. You say that she needs a fast processor, what would this be for?

Will she be saving video on this laptop? Video, games, or .RAW photos from a DSLR are the only things that take up significant amount of hard drive space. If she is really willing to spend $700, then a T430 would be a really excellent laptop but it also sounds like significant overkill for her. My mom has a $300 terrible consumer Dell Inspiron and she loves it, so if requirements are really low then any machine will do.

Really, for youtube, facebook, email and browsing a $200 Nexus 7 tablet would work. It even has the 2GB of RAM!

Twerk from Home fucked around with this message at 12:46 on Aug 7, 2013

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004





Weinertron posted:

Did you read the OP? You described what any current laptop in the world will do, including chromebooks and small tablets. 4GB is now the standard amount of RAM, with 8GB as a larger option. Youtube and facebook are really low demands and any modern processor can handle them comfortably. You say that she needs a fast processor, what would this be for?

Will she be saving video on this laptop? Video, games, or .RAW photos from a DSLR are the only things that take up significant amount of hard drive space. If she is really willing to spend $700, then a T430 would be a really excellent laptop but it also sounds like significant overkill for her. My mom $300 terrible consumer Dell Inspiron and she loves it, so if requirements are really low then any machine will do.

Really, for youtube, facebook, email and browsing a $200 Nexus 7 tablet would work. It even has the 2GB of RAM!

Agreed 110%, your mom needs a $200 Nexus 7, possibly with the case + bt keyboard mentioned in the OP (it's like a laptop, but more mom-friendly!). If she needs a bigger screen, the Nexus 10 is $399. Alternately, the Nexus 7 has HDMI out for use on her TV with a mouse.

icantfindaname
Jul 1, 2008




Okay then, when are haswell macbook pros and thinkpads expected to be released? I need the laptop by the first of September or thereabouts, should I just buy now and not bother waiting? THe internet says that the T430 haswell refresh will be out "soon". I feel like this is a pretty lovely time to buy a laptop.

icantfindaname fucked around with this message at 02:43 on Aug 7, 2013

FISHMANPET
Mar 3, 2007

Sweet 'N Sour
Can't
Melt
Steel Beams


Intel sure is dropping the ball on hitting what I think would be a pretty large back to school market. Or they're trying to burn through Ivy Bridge inventory before releasing the lower end Haswells.

mewse
May 2, 2006




Why are lenovo ideapads like $100 more expensive than a couple months ago? Does this happen every year to fleece the university crowd?

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004





FISHMANPET posted:

Intel sure is dropping the ball on hitting what I think would be a pretty large back to school market. Or they're trying to burn through Ivy Bridge inventory before releasing the lower end Haswells.

Yields may be low on Haswell chips. not only are they cramming a poo poo ton of L3 Cache, a GPU powerful enough to make a 3 year old CPU cry, and a pocket supercomputer on the chip, but they're doing it at bleeding edge 22nm lithography process. All the while trying to feed global demand for desktop and laptops, since they're pretty much muscled AMD out of the market.

My last tennant was an EE PHD specializing in semiconductor technology and his jaw dropped when I told him the atom processor in my $109 nettop used a 32nm processor. The company he worked for (TI) was just gearing up to go to 38nm at the time. TI was just barely getting to 28nm in the lab, let alone in a commercial process.

To put it another way, the lithography used in Haswell is 11x the width of a DNA molecule. I can't confirm or deny it, but if Intel isn't having some teething problems with their 22nm process, I'd be shocked.

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull


It's actually not too likely that Intel is experiencing yield problems. Since Core 2 Duo, Intel has been on a plan of introducing new manufacturing process nodes roughly every other year, and roughly one new CPU generation per year. So each process node gets used for two CPU generations. To minimize the risk of debugging CPU design problems at the same time as they're debugging a cranky new process node, the first CPU generation on a new process node is a shrink or minor tweak of the last generation. The second CPU on a process node is where they introduce bigger design changes which might require more debugging.

So, Ivy Bridge was the first CPU on Intel's 22nm process, and it was mostly a shrink of the 32nm Sandy Bridge ("mostly" because the GPU had to change quite a bit thanks to Intel needing to play catch-up in that department). Haswell is the second 22nm CPU design. By now their 22nm process should be quite stable, and in fact the steady supply of Ivy confirms it.

The most likely culprit for Haswell delays is validation. Every new chip design has to go through a lot of validation testing, where you take lots of engineering sample chips, assemble them into systems, and go looking for bugs. (And when serious bugs are found, then it's time to spend a couple months on fixes. After which it's time to repeat validation!)

With so many Haswell variants to test, even an Intel can't test them all in parallel. You can see from what Intel chose to validate and roll out first -- desktop quadcores and 15W GT2/GT3 ultrabook dualcores -- which market segments Intel views as being most important, easier to validate, or both.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004





Oh, welp, that's right Ivy Bridge was the die shrink. Broadwell will be the next shrink.

QuarkJets
Sep 8, 2008

It's a handshake in progress


BobHoward posted:

What kind of customizability are you concerned about with OS X? Hardware, software, both?

If you choose Linux you really need to do careful research. Especially if you're going to buy a Mac to run Linux. With laptop hardware it may pay to buy one generation (or more) behind so that you aren't one of the pioneers. It's that or buy from one of the handful of Sager / Clevo rebadging operations which specialize in Linux, such as System76. (You'll probably end up doing your own support in the long run with these operations anyways.)

Depending on what your astro software needs it may be feasible to run it inside a Linux virtual machine. In which case buy what you like and get more RAM than you otherwise would.

Scientific computing is mostly Linux, especially astronomy, so he'd be spending all of his time with the virtual machine. It'd be easier to just put Linux on it.

Most modern Linux distributions have already listed benchmarks on Haswell, so no issue there. Just buy whatever Windows laptop you like and then install Linux on it. This is a painless process with most configurations and most major distributions. Battery gains won't be as good as with a Windows 8 laptop, keep that in mind. No harm in buying an Ivy Bridge

dissss
Nov 10, 2007

I'm a terrible forums poster with terrible opinions.

Here's a cat fucking a squid.

Hadlock posted:

3x3 ultimate-n owns bones, at $25 upgrade it's probably the single most useful upgrade you can get on any laptop, period. If you can't get online, about 90% of your laptop's usefulness drops off a cliff. Dollar for dollar it's invaluable. You can access gmail just as fast on an i3 vs an i5, but if you can't connect to the wifi at the airport you can't read your email.


The Advance N card with the 2x2 antenna is far from bad - it still an order of magnitude better than a Macbook

Anti-Derivative
Aug 12, 2003
Beware of Squirrel


I wish Lenovo would hurry up and release some Haswell x-series laptops. I'm going to be waiting until Christmas for that though, aren't I?

Anti-Derivative
Aug 12, 2003
Beware of Squirrel


Hadlock posted:

3x3 ultimate-n owns bones, at $25 upgrade it's probably the single most useful upgrade you can get on any laptop, period. If you can't get online, about 90% of your laptop's usefulness drops off a cliff. Dollar for dollar it's invaluable. You can access gmail just as fast on an i3 vs an i5, but if you can't connect to the wifi at the airport you can't read your email.


As I understand it, the difference between 2x2 and 3x3 is not a greater ability to connect to access points, rather the 3x3 can leverage a higher throughput through access points which allow 3x3 connections (ie: it doesn't increase your range or ability to connect). You're hardly likely to come close to hitting that throughput on any public wifi connections.

Uziel
Jun 28, 2004

Ask me about losing 200lbs, and becoming the Viking God of W&W.

Weinertron posted:

Did you read the OP? You described what any current laptop in the world will do, including chromebooks and small tablets. 4GB is now the standard amount of RAM, with 8GB as a larger option. Youtube and facebook are really low demands and any modern processor can handle them comfortably. You say that she needs a fast processor, what would this be for?

Will she be saving video on this laptop? Video, games, or .RAW photos from a DSLR are the only things that take up significant amount of hard drive space. If she is really willing to spend $700, then a T430 would be a really excellent laptop but it also sounds like significant overkill for her. My mom has a $300 terrible consumer Dell Inspiron and she loves it, so if requirements are really low then any machine will do.

Really, for youtube, facebook, email and browsing a $200 Nexus 7 tablet would work. It even has the 2GB of RAM!
I posted earlier in the thread and based on advice given and the OP I was considering a Thinkpad T530 series but it seems like power and price overkill for what my wife would need it for, so I'm in the same boat as the person you quoted. Access to MS Word is a deal breaker since my wife is an English teacher and while a Chromebook would seemingly be perfect, lackluster editing options for Google Docs won't cut it. I thought about a Surface RT but once you add the type cover, the price starts to creep closer to a Thinkpad anyways.

Brut
Aug 21, 2007

Герой Советского Союза



Uziel posted:

I posted earlier in the thread and based on advice given and the OP I was considering a Thinkpad T530 series but it seems like power and price overkill for what my wife would need it for, so I'm in the same boat as the person you quoted. Access to MS Word is a deal breaker since my wife is an English teacher and while a Chromebook would seemingly be perfect, lackluster editing options for Google Docs won't cut it. I thought about a Surface RT but once you add the type cover, the price starts to creep closer to a Thinkpad anyways.

Well you're also looking for a laptop larger than a 14 inch which you said feels cramped, with a 15+ inch are you planning to spring for a 1920x1080 screen? If not, 1600x900 at 14 and 15 inch is the same screen real estate and unless your vision is terrible should be fine with a T430. (But wait for a T440 unless you're in a hurry)

sourdough
Apr 30, 2012




The Ativ Book 9 Plus, Samsung's 3200x1800 Haswell ultrabook, is set for a shipping date of August 20 for $1400, which I think is a base model (i5, 4GB RAM, 128GB SSD), but I'm not positive. I'm looking forward to reviews on it, but I expect it will be the top ultrabook for awhile, given Samsung's previously well-revied high end Series 9 laptops.

E: Oh, that release date is just based on a B&H shipping estimate, now that the thing is up for preorder there. Hrmm.

Uziel
Jun 28, 2004

Ask me about losing 200lbs, and becoming the Viking God of W&W.

Brut posted:

Well you're also looking for a laptop larger than a 14 inch which you said feels cramped, with a 15+ inch are you planning to spring for a 1920x1080 screen? If not, 1600x900 at 14 and 15 inch is the same screen real estate and unless your vision is terrible should be fine with a T430. (But wait for a T440 unless you're in a hurry)
Well, I could probably go smaller than 14" as my wife's current broken laptop is under 12" and a netbook. I unfortunately can't wait, I need it before August 20th.

Inspector_666
Oct 7, 2003

benny with the good hair


RVProfootballer posted:

The Ativ Book 9 Plus, Samsung's 3200x1800 Haswell ultrabook, is set for a shipping date of August 20 for $1400, which I think is a base model (i5, 4GB RAM, 128GB SSD), but I'm not positive. I'm looking forward to reviews on it, but I expect it will be the top ultrabook for awhile, given Samsung's previously well-revied high end Series 9 laptops.

E: Oh, that release date is just based on a B&H shipping estimate, now that the thing is up for preorder there. Hrmm.

I got to play with a few of the earlier model Ativ Books that came into my shop for work (OS/software, not hardware) and holy poo poo they are thin and light as all hell. I would totally pick one up if I had the money for it.

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust


Grimey Drawer

"Ativ Book 9 Plus" sounds like a Google Translate disaster. I would have tried to extend their Galaxy name to the laptops.

Naffer
Oct 26, 2004

Not a good chemist

Inspector_71 posted:

I got to play with a few of the earlier model Ativ Books that came into my shop for work (OS/software, not hardware) and holy poo poo they are thin and light as all hell. I would totally pick one up if I had the money for it.

Asus had better hurry up and get the Zenbook Infinity out the door, because this one looks like a really nice competitor. It's really interesting how the sum of Haswell and high DPI displays has really made this new laptop generation quite a step forward.

bull3964
Nov 18, 2000

DO YOU HEAR THAT? THAT'S THE SOUND OF ME PATTING MYSELF ON THE BACK.




One leg up the Zenbook infinity has is the HD5100 graphics as opposed to the HD4400 in the Sony.

I think at even 1600x900, this will have issues with semi-modern games.

Noah
May 31, 2011

Come at me baby bitch


movax posted:




Yes it's a piece of poo poo, the screen quality ruins an otherwise excellent generation of Thinkpads.

Is there any likelihood that the 440s will be just as bad?

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust


Grimey Drawer

The T440s will have IPS 1080p options.

Optiquest
Feb 8, 2004



Is the T430 alright for school? I just transferred as a engineering student and found out I am expected to have a laptop. They recommend Windows 7 Professional, 64-Bit, Intel Core i5 2.0 GHz or faster, 8 GB RAM, 500GB, and 7200 rpm hard drive.

Does the $15 screen upgrade make the display not "terrible"? I'd mainly be using this for labs, web browsing and maybe some gaming (I know, I have a desktop and am not expecting a lot from a laptop in this area). Is there anything else I should be looking at this price point? Around $800 something sounds nice right now, but I could spend a little more if it was worth it.

gman14msu
Mar 10, 2009


Regarding the T440s release date, the last few pages this thread on Notebookreview.com are keeping up with updates to the Lenovo site. Recently, a page for Japanese corporate sales was put online (or recently it was found). Plus the T440 English websites seem to be up for some other countries but without ordering options.

For those who know more about this stuff, does that shed any additional light on the release date? Or is it still just sometime between now and October 31st?

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004





If you need something right now with a good screen and you can live with 1366x768 the x230 has a fantastic IPS screen, it's good for taking notes and watching netflix but not writing code due to the resolution.

arisu
Apr 11, 2003


Got my Lenovo Ideapad y410p today. I'm looking forward to slapping in an SSD tonight.

First impressions:

Screen isn't very good. Colors look a little bit washed out. 1440x900 is a good resolution for a 14" screen though so I'm okay with this. Fortunately, I'm pretty tolerant of a mediocre screen. It's definitely a step up from my old Dell Inspiron 15R crap machine though, but I loaded up a webpage on my new Nexus 7 and put it side by side, and the contrast is very striking.

Build quality isn't the greatest I've ever seen, but I'm fairly impressed with it. It's pretty quiet, and doesn't get very warm at all. I'll do more stress and gaming testing tonight to see how much it goes up, but for the most part I'm happy with what I've got. I like that I can use the integrated HD4600 for 90% of the time I'm using the laptop, and kicking in the GeForce GT 750m just for games though.

I'm sure the trackpad sucks based on what basically everyone says, but the first thing I do with any laptop is plug in a wireless mouse and never look back, so I'm not the best judge of these things.

Speakers are pretty nice for a laptop. Again, much better than my old Dell.

I'm pretty impressed with this machine. It's not perfect, but again, the specs you get with this at $800 is pretty insane, similar specs from competitors seem to run at least $1000.

Uziel
Jun 28, 2004

Ask me about losing 200lbs, and becoming the Viking God of W&W.

Uziel posted:

I posted earlier in the thread and based on advice given and the OP I was considering a Thinkpad T530 series but it seems like power and price overkill for what my wife would need it for, so I'm in the same boat as the person you quoted. Access to MS Word is a deal breaker since my wife is an English teacher and while a Chromebook would seemingly be perfect, lackluster editing options for Google Docs won't cut it. I thought about a Surface RT but once you add the type cover, the price starts to creep closer to a Thinkpad anyways.
We went to Best Buy and tried a bunch of different options: Chromebook, Nexus 7, Surface RT, Surface Pro and a Yoga 11S. My wife fell in love with the Yoga 11S. She kind of liked the XPS12 but was concerned with the flip screen and cost compared to the Yoga.

Is the Yoga a Haswell? If not, does anyone know if it would be refreshed at the same time as the ThinkPad line?

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icantfindaname
Jul 1, 2008




Okay, one more question. Is the screen on the Thinkpad T530 better quality than the T430?

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