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Mr. Lobe
Feb 23, 2007

... Dry bones...




Maarak posted:

Assuming you've already got a cutting tool, use the advanced inventory tool to move the acid zombie corpse to a square without an acid pool then chose the dismember option from the butchering menu. Nearly as fast as smashing but without the splashback.

Since I don't like the idea of lugging a spear around this is probably the best option. Thanks!

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Telsa Cola
Aug 19, 2011

No... this is all wrong... this whole operation has just gone completely sidewaysface


Steamroller

The Lone Badger
Sep 24, 2007



If people want a fun thing to craft that isn't about to be pulled (because it's Aftershock), try the Murdersaw. Messy, loud and awkward but oh man does it carve things up.

Vib Rib
Jul 23, 2007

God damn this shit is
fuckin' re-dic-a-liss


Is there a guide anywhere on getting started with Magiclysm or should I just turn it on and wing it?

A Festivus Miracle
Dec 19, 2012

I have come to discourse on the profound inequities of the American political system.



Telsa Cola posted:

Steamroller

I looted a gun store and a PD in a HMMWV and I've realized that when you're surrounded by corpses, running over as many as you can before you have to get back on the turret is an excellent move. I tried night raiding (and walked literally right by a shrieker right as I was about to start smash and grabbing). I tried zombie pheromone (turns out that activating it has a failure chance). But a HMMWV with a gun worked the best. I'm trying to rationalize it via the fact that HMMWV spawns are so common place and they more than likely have guns and ammo. The only real hard part of the HMMWV is that they're diesel powered, and finding diesel is such a pain in the rear end. I suppose I could swap out the V8 diesels for a variety of gasoline V6s. I just have had really crappy luck finding any good engine out and about. Are gasoline V8s a thing? Or is it only a muscle cars where I'm gonna find that?

My survival van is coming along nicely though. I took a van, plopped another motor in it, and added a sleeper cabin in the back, and subbed out all the seats for trunks. I'd like to get enough motors on it to comfortably armor it up, but for now, I'm relying more on pulling out into the country before I take a nap.

Inglonias
Mar 7, 2013

I WILL PUT THIS FLAG ON FREAKING EVERYTHING BECAUSE IT IS SYMBOLIC AS HELL SOMEHOW



Mr. Lobe posted:

Is there a special trick to smashing acid zombies without hurting yourself? Seems like fire doesn't work very well, and shooting them from a distance seems like a waste of ammo.

Last I checked a quick butchering or dismemberment does not splatter.

Tin Tim
Jun 4, 2012

Live by the pun - Die by the pun



A White Guy posted:

Are gasoline V8s a thing? Or is it only a muscle cars where I'm gonna find that?
Yeah they should be in ambulances, fire/cargo trucks and everything of that size iirc. You can also find gas V12 engines in sports cars but they are fairly rare. Usually they turn up tucked away into a garage

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!


I've been thinking about doing a new playthrough specifically designed to go post-threshold mouse, does anyone have any experience with this because I've been looking up info on exactly how the mutations work and it's not particularly consistent.

Like can you wear any breathing apparatus (a la survivor mask) once you have the snout mutation or does the tiny size mean you can't wear the XL one which mutated characters usually wear?

Also I've read that one of the mutations reduces the encumbrance on downsized clothing which sounds cool but OTOH it also says that you basically can't wear any backpacks etc which sounds extremely poo poo since they can't be downsized

I just want to mouse kung fu people :saddowns:

Inglonias
Mar 7, 2013

I WILL PUT THIS FLAG ON FREAKING EVERYTHING BECAUSE IT IS SYMBOLIC AS HELL SOMEHOW



I find that using the debug menu to mess around and answer these questions yourself is generally the fastest way to get those answers.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!


Inglonias posted:

I find that using the debug menu to mess around and answer these questions yourself is generally the fastest way to get those answers.

That's my backup plan but it does kind of take out of my game playing time and I'm at work at the moment so I thought someone might effortpost at me in the meantime if I was lucky

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!


So if anyone cares about the mouse thing here's what I found out:

None of the mouse mutations give reduced encumbrance as far as I can see, it's just an erroneous description of one of the traits

Being tiny means you have to resize your gear or get extra encumbrance penalties, but you can't resize anything with the "large and accomodates mutated anatomy" trait. Which means if you get a mutation which restricts a body slot (such as rodent muzzle) then you're stuck being unable to wear anything on that item slot entirely except for oversized "huge" gear which gives gigantic encumbrance penalties (I think 3x base). This gear is specifically disallowed from being downsized for some dumb reason. I have a bad feeling that it might actually be impossible to make gear which both fits mutated anatomy and isn't too large to resize properly (the game seems to use the "oversize" tag for both of these properties together even though that doesn't really make sense). This generally feels like a bug / oversight rather than an intentional part of the design.

You also can't get any decent storage options at reasonable encumbrance levels because none of the backpacks etc. have the tag which allows them to be resized. This usually means that they always fit, but because you need to resize your gear due to being tiny, it means that they never fit and can't be made to fit. So you either wear nomad gear or don't carry anything ever, or have like 100 torso encumbrance from your backpack. This also feels very oversight-y.

If you go full post threshold mouse you get hit with multiple stacking penalties to carry weight and hp which is pretty bad, however, you also get a rediculous increase in stamina, tons of dodge and stealth buffs and reduction to move / attack cost, plus no direct penalty to strength so you are actually very effective in melee as long as you don't get hit. Plus you get big morale boosts from eating sugary foods which is surprisingly useful.

Caidin
Oct 28, 2011


The thing about going full mouse mutant to me at least is that there's just a lot of poo poo your probably going to have to decide if you need to fix in the game files yourself or if it's just a reasonable trade off. Like the oversized gear not being downsizable thing means you straight up cannot make a gas mask that isn't that isn't a vice around your windpipe. Even the light survivor model is gonna run you like 60 encumbrance. it precludes junk like cloaks and subject suits and other weird discrepancies. Back packs are an issue so get used to divebags, drop pouches and whatever else you can cram on your body for efficient storage, so you should probably get used to the idea of keeping a shopping cart or something more elaborate on hand.

But as RabidWeasel notes the only combat debuff a mouse suffers is low hp, the dodge bonus stacks so high that your almost invulnerable to any melee combatant provided you don't let yourself get winded and you have the speed to trivially drat near anything at a walking pace, nevermind a sprint. Your thirst bar is permanently disabled and you can eat zombie meat and junk food, so drat near anything is on the menu, though toxicity from mutant meat still applies. You essentially become an extremely mobile night predator that needs to carefully assess and disable the presence of problematic special zombies and/or angry things with guns, then rush in and slaughter the zombie children for their flesh and candy since junk food is so massively satisfying you'll never frown if you keep some pop tarts on hand.

Also you can downsize a suit of plate easily enough so maybe consider becoming a mouse knight.

RabidWeasel
Aug 4, 2007

Cultures thrive on their myths and legends...and snuggles!


Yeah honestly it's the arbitrariness of the stuff that you're not capable of doing which feels frustrating rather than the actual gameplay implications (the gas mask thing is pretty awful though)

Getting mutated to tiny without being a post-threshold mouse would be total poo poo though

Wolfechu
May 2, 2009

All the world's a stage I'm going through



Vib Rib posted:

Is there a guide anywhere on getting started with Magiclysm or should I just turn it on and wing it?

Turn it on and wing it. Grab any spellbooks you find, read what the spells do, decide if it sounds like something you'd use. Don't worry about conflicting spell schools, because unless you're badass enough to raid a wizard's tower and deal with a dozen plastic golems, you're not going to see enough books to have that be an issue.

Talking of Golems, you're going to want to keep the hell away from any you meet in the wild until you have a firearm or a car to deal with it. They're not fast, but they regen health and take a fair bit of knocking over, even the plastic ones.

Likewise Owlbears you're going to want to avoid early on. Trolls (are trolls Magiclysm or vanilla?) are even worse news, like dealing with a regenerating zombie hulk. Both roam about in the woods fairly often.

Bonus content: Lead any of these into town and let it deal with the zombies or the zombies deal with it.

Goblin camps have been added recently, and I've still to actually set foot in one, but I'm told by Korg they're a good source of all kinds of loot.

What I've seen of artifacts, they're actually very useful, but you're only going to see them in 'magical' instances like the camps and wizard towers, and extremely rarely elsewhere. Stuff like belts with large carrying capacity, rings that give stat bonuses, or even just everburning torches or cooking sources, basically fantasy-skinned variants of Aftershock atomic tools. There's probably loads more stuff kicking around I've never seen.

Mr. Lobe
Feb 23, 2007

... Dry bones...




I found an artifact ring that gave super clairvoyance at the cost of noisemaking and -3 dex once. Every playthrough since has felt like an exercise in deprivation.

90s Cringe Rock
Nov 29, 2006
:gay:


Thank god, they've finally made washing kits enormous and heavy.

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020



90s Cringe Rock posted:

Thank god, they've finally made washing kits enormous and heavy.

Finally. That was it, the one thing holding this game back that needed to be fixed.

Broke: Add gameplay and challenges

Woke: Make existing content tedious and boring

Mr. Lobe
Feb 23, 2007

... Dry bones...




why would a washboard and rag be large and heavy?

PiCroft
Jun 10, 2010

I'm sorry, did I break all your shit? I didn't know it was yours



Mr. Lobe posted:

why would a washboard and rag be large and heavy?

Realism. Also "Balance". We don't want the experience of carrying washing kits and soap to a water source to be too easy, now do we?

Caidin
Oct 28, 2011


Sometimes I wonder if some the contributions that make it into the builds are attempts to take the piss that nobody picked up on.

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020



Taking the piss is the only explanation for "realism" only being important when it is boring, but it's not important when it would make things cooler.

I really do not understand what game Kevin and his bore-fetishists are trying to make.

Mr. Lobe
Feb 23, 2007

... Dry bones...




Manager Hoyden posted:

Taking the piss is the only explanation for "realism" only being important when it is boring, but it's not important when it would make things cooler.

I really do not understand what game Kevin and his bore-fetishists are trying to make.

yeah, imagine if they implemented the kind of realism that was, say, slings powerful enough to split open a head in a metal helmet in the hands of a skilled user, as was historically the case

but no, now a thin panel of wood with grooves carved into it with a rag draped over it is now a massive object

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020



Mr. Lobe posted:

yeah, imagine if they implemented the kind of realism that was, say, slings powerful enough to split open a head in a metal helmet in the hands of a skilled user, as was historically the case

but no, now a thin panel of wood with grooves carved into it with a rag draped over it is now a massive object

Large caliber rifles in the hands of an expert marksman have a range of 60 yards in this world, but yes let's address a washboard taking up slightly less space than it would in real life.

90s Cringe Rock
Nov 29, 2006
:gay:


Mr. Lobe posted:

why would a washboard and rag be large and heavy?
Traditional galvanized steel and wood washboards sold online are 24 x 12 inches. However, the in game washboard is a homemade, all wood washboard. This is OK, you could just cut grooves in a 24 x 12 inch board and it would work. However, if you assume the board in 1 inch thick, this gives a volume of 288 sq. in. (4.7 liters). I fiddled with the numbers and settled on 16 x 10 x 0.75 inch as an acceptable (imho) size. As small as possible to store and carry while still being big enough to get the job done. At this size the volume would be 120 sq. in. (aprox. 2 liters). Using 0.4 g/cm3 (the lower end for Pine) gives us a weight of 786g. I went with a lower end of the scale instead of an average to account for the removal of mass when cutting the groves into the plank.

Describe alternatives you've considered

None

Wolfechu
May 2, 2009

All the world's a stage I'm going through



So what does this prevent, exactly? Was anyone carrying a washboard around and doing laundry in the middle of town? You can Make a washing kit with like a plank and a scrub brush, so basically any house ever.

What, I'm basically saying, is even the loving point of this?

Leal
Oct 2, 2009

If you LP what I LP
And if you work retail like I work retail
You would also scream like I scream


I just leave a washing kit by a nearby infinite capacity water puddle in a swamp.

Leal
Oct 2, 2009

If you LP what I LP
And if you work retail like I work retail
You would also scream like I scream


gently caress guys water capacity nerf incoming

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020



Leal posted:

gently caress guys water capacity nerf incoming

Summary:
Fix water volume in natural water bodies

Purpose of change:
Fixes issue where players could reliably get/use water

Describe the solution:
Eliminated infinite water, limited naturally occurring water to 5 units per tile


Kevingarande commented on Jul 10:
This is not an ideal fix as it may provide a player with an in-game way to cross small bodies of water which was never intended. Due to engine limitations this is an acceptable short term solution to players' ability to use water. Consider making water poisonous until it is treated with lab reward chemicals.

PiCroft
Jun 10, 2010

I'm sorry, did I break all your shit? I didn't know it was yours



Manager Hoyden posted:

Summary:
Fix water volume in natural water bodies

Purpose of change:
Fixes issue where players could reliably get/use water

Describe the solution:
Eliminated infinite water, limited naturally occurring water to 5 units per tile


Kevingarande commented on Jul 10:
This is not an ideal fix as it may provide a player with an in-game way to cross small bodies of water which was never intended. Due to engine limitations this is an acceptable short term solution to players' ability to use water. Consider making water poisonous until it is treated with lab reward chemicals.

For Christ sake stop giving them templates you fuckkk

nightwisher
Dec 24, 2004


PiCroft posted:

For Christ sake stop giving them templates you fuckkk

Also water-carrying vessels randomly spring tiny, unfixable leaks all the time that slowly and imperceptibly empty completely. This includes everything from water bottles to water tanks. Also the water is radioactive, has parasites, becomes sentient if so much as a drop of blood touches it and can't be purified because of ______ (fill in your own stupid reason here). I feel that this is a realistic, down-to-earth implementation of water scarcity. Also it's flammable.

World Famous W
May 25, 2007

BAAAAAAAAAAAA

Worse come to worse, you can mostly clean clothes just by slapping them wet against hard surfaces. Should let you do that with a chance of damaging it

Nevets
Sep 11, 2002

Be they sad or be they well,
I'll make their lives a hell


nightwisher posted:

Also the water is radioactive, has parasites, becomes sentient if so much as a drop of blood touches it and can't be purified because of ______ (fill in your own stupid reason here). I feel that this is a realistic, down-to-earth implementation of water scarcity. Also it's flammable.

Cataclysm: Cleveland

Leal
Oct 2, 2009

If you LP what I LP
And if you work retail like I work retail
You would also scream like I scream


If I can make a laser turret with a soda can, a rotten lemon and 2 scraps of iron I should be able to make a washing machine and hook it up to my car.

Wolfechu
May 2, 2009

All the world's a stage I'm going through



I can't tell if anything in the last half dozen posts is real or not.

PiCroft
Jun 10, 2010

I'm sorry, did I break all your shit? I didn't know it was yours



Every turn you have a 10% chance of developing a random (incurable) cancer due to both the background radiation and also if you eat anything except a perfectly balanced Mediterranenan diet.

Purpose of change:
Because I despise the player base and want them to suffer like I do

Kevingranade commented:
Sounds great, but needs to be minimum of 50% (balance reasons)

BlondRobin
May 29, 2005

Sssh! Be vewy vewy quiet. It's wabbit season.

Manager Hoyden posted:

Taking the piss is the only explanation for "realism" only being important when it is boring, but it's not important when it would make things cooler.

I really do not understand what game Kevin and his bore-fetishists are trying to make.

They’re trying to make a game that they can feel smug about. Aside from the incidental purpose of making it harder to get to the end game and also looking like they’re developing the game without requiring them to actually code, it lets they scream “get good” at people. That’s the point. It makes the devs and the fans feel smug and egotistic when someone else “fails” to “handle” the game, and gives them a sense of power over those other people.

It’s the dark souls of roguelikes, except it’s what rear end in a top hat internet commentators who felt the need to tell you about how dark souls is easy and they beat it with a no-equipment no-levels kicking-only run so if you’re ever challenged by it you must be (insert gamer word here) think dark souls is.

Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020



Dark souls but instead of slaying dragons it's miserably foraging tin cans for three hours.

Vib Rib
Jul 23, 2007

God damn this shit is
fuckin' re-dic-a-liss


Wolfechu posted:

So what does this prevent, exactly? Was anyone carrying a washboard around and doing laundry in the middle of town? You can Make a washing kit with like a plank and a scrub brush, so basically any house ever.

What, I'm basically saying, is even the loving point of this?
These decisions are not made for gameplay purposes, or even with gameplay in mind. They're just not. They're made for "accuracy".
Except there's something that would be very easy and sensible and accessible in real life, in which case "we can't be TOO realistic! It would destroy gameplay balance!"

Maarak
May 23, 2007


Cataclysm: Dark Souls Edition sounds like a blast. Throwing your character into combat with abandon knowing that a campfire guarantees another run at a challenge? Killing Hulks and gasoline boomers with high agility spear and dodge tactics?

We should be so lucky to get a dev team on this that cares about fun through gameplay.

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Manager Hoyden
Mar 5, 2020



Hey how about someone makes an end game before meticulously nitpicking gameplay details haha just kidding

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