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Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008



The movie had problems but Rey wasn't one of them. As far as I'm concerned all women had was Princess Leia and aside from a handful of moments, she wasn't as pro-active as Han or Luke in accomplishing things, so it's nice to have a woman be an equalizing presence. The only argument I could understand was the whole jedi mind trick scene but then again, prodigies are an actual thing.

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The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

Lady Naga posted:

It means "woman who is competent at things."

Or a monkey, as we learned from this review.

Indolent Bastard
Oct 26, 2007

I WON THIS AMAZING AVATAR! I'M A WINNER! WOOOOO!


Lady Naga posted:

You don't know what a Mary-Sue is.

A Mary-Sue is any character that is too perfect and makes the story worse/boring for their lack of flaws. What did I get wrong?

fatherboxx posted:

The Victor Frankenstein burns were great what are you talking about

I'll give you the Victor Frankenstein stuff is funny but they do belly ache about Mary-Sue's for a bit during Russell Madness. They get a little too enthusiastic about dumping on the concept of a Mary-Sue. I gave up listening to TFA episode because of their heated fanboy discussion of why the TFA "haters" are idiots.

Lady Naga
Apr 25, 2008

Voyons Donc!


Indolent Bastard posted:

A Mary-Sue is any character that is too perfect and makes the story worse/boring for their lack of flaws. What did I get wrong?

Not it isn't. A Mary-Sue is a blatant self-insert that is used as a type of power fantasy for the author. I could further restrict the definition specifically to fanworks wherein the original cast is completely deferential to the self-insert but I think there can be some leeway with the definition.

weekly font
Dec 1, 2004


Everytime I try to fly I fall
Without my wings
I feel so small
Guess I need you baby...





If that's the reason you hate TFA you are an idiot, hth

sub supau
Aug 27, 2007



Indolent Bastard posted:

A Mary-Sue is any character that is too perfect and makes the story worse/boring for their lack of flaws. What did I get wrong?
Your definition.

Indolent Bastard
Oct 26, 2007

I WON THIS AMAZING AVATAR! I'M A WINNER! WOOOOO!


Lady Naga posted:

Not it isn't. A Mary-Sue is a blatant self-insert that is used as a type of power fantasy for the author. I could further restrict the definition specifically to fanworks wherein the original cast is completely deferential to the self-insert but I think there can be some leeway with the definition.

You are correct, but for the current discussion changing the popularly accepted definition of a Mary Sue.

"Mary Sue today has changed from its original meaning and now carries a generalized, although not universal, connotation of wish-fulfillment and is commonly associated with self-insertion. The negative connotation comes from this wish-fulfillment implication: the Mary Sue is judged as a poorly developed character, too perfect and lacking in realism to be interesting."

Regardless, the whole discussion is fruitless and I have now managed to do what I wish WHM stop doing and that is bringing up the topic in the first place.

weekly font posted:

If that's the reason you hate TFA you are an idiot, hth

I liked TFA. The only things that pulled me out of the movie was Rey as super pilot of the Falcon, Rey as a force using savant in the scenes where she was on the interrogation table, and Fin and Rey as competent light saber users from the moment they touched one. Otherwise it was a pretty great film.

sub supau
Aug 27, 2007



It's a movie about space wizards.

Lady Naga
Apr 25, 2008

Voyons Donc!


Literary terms are specifically not meant to change meaning so that everybody knows exactly what you're talking about at all times. "Dramatic irony" means the same thing it did hundreds of years ago even if the colloquial use of "irony" doesn't.

Indolent Bastard
Oct 26, 2007

I WON THIS AMAZING AVATAR! I'M A WINNER! WOOOOO!


TetsuoTW posted:

It's a movie about space wizards.

Agreed, and an enjoyable one at that.

Part of me wants to keep discussing this just for fun, but I know it can not go anywhere good or useful so I won't.

Are there any of their old pre iTunes episodes that are specifically worth checking out?

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?


Indolent Bastard posted:

You are correct, but for the current discussion changing the popularly accepted definition of a Mary Sue.

"Mary Sue today has changed from its original meaning and now carries a generalized, although not universal, connotation of wish-fulfillment and is commonly associated with self-insertion. The negative connotation comes from this wish-fulfillment implication: the Mary Sue is judged as a poorly developed character, too perfect and lacking in realism to be interesting."

I liked TFA. The only things that pulled me out of the movie was Rey as super pilot of the Falcon, Rey as a force using savant in the scenes where she was on the interrogation table, and Fin and Rey as competent light saber users from the moment they touched one. Otherwise it was a pretty great film.

Mary Sue literally came from a Star Trek fan fiction with a character that was named after the author and was loved by everyone.

Luke was a great pilot and all he ever flew was a land speeder. I am also sure she mentioned that she flew things before, but was not allowed to leave orbit.
Luke using the force when he blew up the deathstar
Finn having training as a stormtrooper and was almost defeated by one
Rey had to survive on her own and used a staff.
They also were facing a man who was just shoot and bleeding all over the place.

Lady Naga
Apr 25, 2008

Voyons Donc!


I don't know why people act like you need to have some sort of specialized training to utilize a lightsaber, if you can swing a stick around competently you can hit people with a laser sword.

Tiny Brontosaurus
Aug 1, 2013

by Lowtax


Indolent Bastard posted:

You are correct, but for the current discussion changing the popularly accepted definition of a Mary Sue.

UM excuse me but how could Indolent Bastard pedal backwards so fast if he's never used the force before???? TROPE FOUND: Mary Sue

Jimbot
Jul 22, 2008



Lady Naga posted:

I don't know why people act like you need to have some sort of specialized training to utilize a lightsaber, if you can swing a stick around competently you can hit people with a laser sword.

You have to level up and put specialization points into lightsaber in order to use it. Then you have to travel to the nearest jedi temple and pay credits to learn the default stance from the trainer.

Ror
Oct 21, 2010

😸Everything's 🗞️ purrfect!💯🤟



There must be some unwritten forums axiom that all threads, given enough time, eventually turn into Star Wars threads.

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

MALCOLM SEX


Evil Mastermind posted:

So when the scriptwriter wrote that line, do you think he leaned back with the feeling of a job well done, or eyed the loaded pistol on his desk and tried to decide if today was the day?
Blame it on Rio.

duz
Jul 11, 2005

Come on Ilhan, lets go bag us a shitpost




Ror posted:

There must be some unwritten forums axiom that all threads, given enough time, eventually turn into Star Wars threads.

That money Disney spent on marketing had to go somewhere.

Lady Naga
Apr 25, 2008

Voyons Donc!


Ror posted:

There must be some unwritten forums axiom that all threads, given enough time, eventually turn into Star Wars threads.

Yeah it's strange that something that is popular is talked about a lot.

enigmahfc
Oct 10, 2003

EFF TEE DUB!!
EFF TEE DUB!!

Oh good, this loving stupid, pointless discussion again (in a thread not about the loving movie).

I remember one of their episodes making fun of people who didn't like Superman snapping Zod's neck in Man of Steel. Please stand by while I derail the thread complaining about their opinion...

thrawn527
Mar 27, 2004

Thrawn/Pellaeon
Studying the art of terrorists
To keep you safe



Indolent Bastard posted:

Are there any of their old pre iTunes episodes that are specifically worth checking out?

Gymkata. It's episode 54, so it's relatively early in their run, but it's a fantastic episode. Especially when you consider how much better it was than How Did This Get Made's episode on the same movie, which was only okay. Their bit on how bored the people at the later stations must be, and how surprised they would be when someone finally made it to them, was when I fell in love with the show.

Also, I have no idea when their iTunes episodes start, but their Hard Target episode is my favorite they've ever done.

TheFallenEvincar posted:

Blame it on Rio.

Be warned, this is not an episode for beginners (as they jokingly warn at the beginning). WHM After Dark. And one hosed up movie.

enigmahfc
Oct 10, 2003

EFF TEE DUB!!
EFF TEE DUB!!

Indolent Bastard posted:


Are there any of their old pre iTunes episodes that are specifically worth checking out?


Halloween III. Watch it as sandwichly possible.

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

MALCOLM SEX


thrawn527 posted:


Be warned, this is not an episode for beginners (as they jokingly warn at the beginning). WHM After Dark. And one hosed up movie.
What's weird for me is I'd actually already seen the film as a kid somehow. This was the random not-quite-big-name creepy WHM movie that I'd actually seen for once. It was all the more disturbing bringing back memories of that poo poo.

:pedo::yikes:

kalensc
Sep 10, 2003

Only Trust Your Respirator, kupo!
Art/Quote by: Rubby


TetsuoTW posted:

On the other hand Max Landis is the very definition of being born on third and convinced you hit a triple, and, to stretch the metaphor, he has strong, loud opinions on batting.

Which is too bad because he can be interesting and funny in small(er) doses. I liked his contributions when he appeared on two Red Letter Media episodes, but everything about TFA involving him has been quite cringe-worthy.

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

MALCOLM SEX


I think the mistake was letting Max Landis in your heart even a little bit in the first place. He's like the Noid, or the Krampus.

and have they still not seen Krampus? They keep telling that lame story about some dude being confused about a movie in a movie theater as if that's some great film quality thermometer

MisterBibs
Jul 17, 2010

dolla dolla
bill y'all


Fun Shoe

Indolent Bastard posted:

These guys are awfully upset by the Max Landis Mary-Sue thing. If you don't agree, just move on, but mocking Max and the fact that Rey is a Mary-Sue is really dorky.

I love the guys, but remember: they talked about tears looking at Chewbacca crying after Hans death, as well as some obvious self consciousness over how the best way to make them happy about a Star Wars film was to copy-paste ANH.

Less upset, more defensive. People will bring up Rey As Character Great At Everything And Loved By Everyone, or how TFA is ANH2.0, for as long as the movie is discussed.

MisterBibs fucked around with this message at 19:45 on Jan 13, 2016

Sleeveless
Dec 25, 2014
Probation
Can't post for 3736 days!


Indolent Bastard posted:

Agreed, and an enjoyable one at that.

Part of me wants to keep discussing this just for fun, but I know it can not go anywhere good or useful so I won't.

Are there any of their old pre iTunes episodes that are specifically worth checking out?

IMHO in general the old ones are just as good as the ones on iTunes and totally worth listening to. The show pretty much lands on its feet and the only major difference is that they would play clips from the movie and use different songs each ep.

Corek
May 11, 2013

by R. Guyovich


TheFallenEvincar posted:

What's weird for me is I'd actually already seen the film as a kid somehow. This was the random not-quite-big-name creepy WHM movie that I'd actually seen for once. It was all the more disturbing bringing back memories of that poo poo.

:pedo::yikes:

Whoa, they weren't kidding about his dead animal hair.

Terrorist Fistbump
Jan 29, 2009

by Nyc_Tattoo


Indolent Bastard posted:

Are there any of their old pre iTunes episodes that are specifically worth checking out?
All of them, except maybe a handful of their first 20. No joke, this podcast found its footing very quickly and has had an excellent run quality-wise. Even some of the weaker early episodes, like Congo, are full of good jokes.

Ror
Oct 21, 2010

😸Everything's 🗞️ purrfect!💯🤟



Lady Naga posted:

Yeah it's strange that something that is popular is talked about a lot.

I think I'm just cranky because I prefer derails about IG-88 and his brothers.

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD
Sep 14, 2007

everything is yours


TheFallenEvincar posted:

Blame it on Rio.

Blame it on Rio is easily one of my top 5 favorite episodes because there's just so much to talk about in the movie itself.

The Vosgian Beast
Aug 13, 2011

Business is slow

TheFallenEvincar posted:

Blame it on Rio.

It's not Rio's fault! That city has suffered enough from skeevy Michael Caine, goddammit!


TheFallenEvincar posted:

I think the mistake was letting Max Landis in your heart even a little bit in the first place. He's like the Noid, or the Krampus.

and have they still not seen Krampus? They keep telling that lame story about some dude being confused about a movie in a movie theater as if that's some great film quality thermometer

I think it's more that the trailer was tonally confused.

bobkatt013
Oct 8, 2006

You’re telling me Peter Parker is ...... Spider-man!?


The Vosgian Beast posted:

It's not Rio's fault! That city has suffered enough from skeevy Michael Caine, goddammit!

Should have had a crossover with City of God.

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

MALCOLM SEX


HUNDU THE BEAST GOD posted:

Blame it on Rio is easily one of my top 5 favorite episodes because there's just so much to talk about in the movie itself.
it's like an onion of terrible, yeah. like I had no idea going into the episode that Michelle Johnson was underage and her parents had to sign off on her involvement or whatever happened (the wiki says a judge gave her permission???), even though I'd already seen the movie. there are just layers.
it makes looking for gifs of blame it on rio online a risky experience

The Unnamed One
Jan 13, 2012

"BOOM!"

Indolent Bastard posted:

Are there any of their old pre iTunes episodes that are specifically worth checking out?

I think a few of those might have been re-released, but here are some good ones IMO:

The Principal
A Shock to the System
Babycakes
Poison Ivy
Jack Frost
The Adventures of Ford Fairlane
Nukie
Gymkata
The Glass House
Cocoon
Jaws: The Revenge
Kill Crazy
Taking Care of Business
The Pallbearer
Addicted to Love

HUNDU THE BEAST GOD
Sep 14, 2007

everything is yours


Indolent Bastard posted:

Are there any of their old pre iTunes episodes that are specifically worth checking out?

To add to the list, presuming iTunes starts around 100:

Invisible Child
Free Enterprise
Deadly Friend
Halloween III
Hider In The House
No Retreat, No Surrender
976-EVIL
Gone Fishin'
Wired: The Return

Punkin Spunkin
Jan 1, 2010

MALCOLM SEX


I have a soft spot for 18 Again! and Wolf.
they have good?? psychosexual pranking.

Tiny Brontosaurus
Aug 1, 2013

by Lowtax


The Pallbearer is a classic just for Cloudy, David Schwimmer's depression rain cloud who hates him

Terrorist Fistbump
Jan 29, 2009

by Nyc_Tattoo


Don't forget the Ewok movies!

weekly font
Dec 1, 2004


Everytime I try to fly I fall
Without my wings
I feel so small
Guess I need you baby...





Dracula 2000 is an incredible pre-iTunes episode to add to the list.

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MinionOfCthulhu
Oct 28, 2005

I got this title for free due to my proximity to an idiot who wanted to save $5 on an avatar by having someone else spend $9.95 instead.


weekly font posted:

Dracula 2000 is an incredible pre-iTunes episode to add to the list.

The tangent about Dracula being Judas and all the other Biblical characters being monsters still cracks me up when I think about it.

One more pin, doubting Thomas, two more pins, doubting Thomas!

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