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SwissArmyDruid
Feb 14, 2014




There was zero chance I was going to do anything *but* watercool my threadripper. This just reinforced it.

Heck, confession time: I have never owned a Hyper 212. All my computers since around 2007-ish have been AIOs, because that was when the industry was at its absolute worst with poo poo like this

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Palladium
May 8, 2012


You should have seen the early 2000 era where peak heatsink design is basically a block of metal slapped with a 7000+ rpm Delta fan on top.

SwissArmyDruid
Feb 14, 2014



You mean, "what I had *before* I switched over to AIOs exclusively? =P

well why not
Feb 9, 2009





does this mean that there'll have to be a new form factor for AIO coolers, due to the plate size
?

eames
May 9, 2009



Yeah definitely, if AMD is smart about cooling then TR will have two dies arranged diagonally across the package (one top left, other bottom right) to best spread the heat output.*
Current blocks have their microfins in the center where the die usually is, so the TR cores would only touch the unoptimized edges of the cooler where no water flows.
I guess you could still cool a TR with a AM4 cooler as long as the baseplate covers the dies but performance would be bad.

on a second thought maybe they'll arrange them in a line, who knows, but then TR optimized coolers would have to differ from Epyc optimized coolers.


Palladium posted:

You should have seen the early 2000 era where peak heatsink design is basically a block of metal slapped with a 7000+ rpm Delta fan on top.

Alpha PAL8045 with Delta fans.

Only registered members can see post attachments!

BangersInMyKnickers
Nov 3, 2004

I have a thing for courageous dongles




looking forward to the motherboard delamination

Combat Pretzel
Jun 23, 2004

No, seriously... what kurds?!

Why? The plate is large, the radiator itself seems to be same size as others. If things like the NH-D15 or the Dark Rock Pro 3 don't kill mainboards, that TR cooler won't either.

Also, perspective in the picture.

PC LOAD LETTER
May 23, 2005
WTF?!

Slippery Tilde

eames posted:

Alpha PAL8045 with Delta fans.
The slot A version was even more impressive though I rocked out with the VOS32 since it was much cheaper and performed surprisingly close. That and it didn't weight so much the cartridge wouldn't flop over on me.
http://imgur.com/a/MHcwY

Alpha P7125's were primo for their time though.

GRINDCORE MEGGIDO
Feb 28, 1985


isndl posted:

What's the average life expectancy of an ordinary vertically-mounted motherboard using that giant cooler?
I think a TR deserves a full ATX cube with a horizontal mobo. Make it look evil as gently caress.

eames posted:

Yeah definitely, if AMD is smart about cooling then TR will have two dies arranged diagonally across the package (one top left, other bottom right) to best spread the heat output.*
Current blocks have their microfins in the center where the die usually is, so the TR cores would only touch the unoptimized edges of the cooler where no water flows.
I guess you could still cool a TR with a AM4 cooler as long as the baseplate covers the dies but performance would be bad.

on a second thought maybe they'll arrange them in a line, who knows, but then TR optimized coolers would have to differ from Epyc optimized coolers.


Alpha PAL8045 with Delta fans.


Yep, those were good at the time.

Nomyth
Mar 15, 2013

And if a Nyto get a attitude
Pop it like it's hot
Pop it like it's hot
Pop it like it's hot



Have we seen the inside of a Threadripper package yet? I keep seeing this shot of Epyc and it's making me wonder if people are getting the wrong idea of where the dies are located under the heat spreader.

16 cores = 4 CCXs = only 2 dies, right?

Rastor
Jun 2, 2001



Sidesaddle Cavalry posted:

Have we seen the inside of a Threadripper package yet? I keep seeing this shot of Epyc and it's making me wonder if people are getting the wrong idea of where the dies are located under the heat spreader.

16 cores = 4 CCXs = only 2 dies, right?

I think that's right, Ryzen = 1 die, Threadripper = 2 dies, Epyc = 4 dies

eames
May 9, 2009



Sidesaddle Cavalry posted:

Have we seen the inside of a Threadripper package yet? I keep seeing this shot of Epyc and it's making me wonder if people are getting the wrong idea of where the dies are located under the heat spreader.

16 cores = 4 CCXs = only 2 dies, right?

No we haven't and yes, four dies for Epyc and two dies for TR but the package size/socket is the same. The question is how AMD will arrange the dies?

Rastor
Jun 2, 2001



Every Threadripper is actually an Epyc with two dies lasered off, you can reconnect them with a graphite pencil

nerox
May 20, 2001


Rastor posted:

Every Threadripper is actually an Epyc with two dies lasered off, you can reconnect them with a graphite pencil

Does it have a slot to attach a golden fingers device?

Stanley Pain
Jun 16, 2001

Bit. Trip. RIP.


Rastor posted:

Every Threadripper is actually an Epyc with two dies lasered off, you can reconnect them with a graphite pencil


nerox posted:

Does it have a slot to attach a golden fingers device?


Lowen SoDium
Jun 5, 2003

Highen Fiber


Clapping Larry



Combat Pretzel posted:

Why? The plate is large, the radiator itself seems to be same size as others. If things like the NH-D15 or the Dark Rock Pro 3 don't kill mainboards, that TR cooler won't either.

Also, perspective in the picture.


http://i.imgur.com/mnkAMKE.mp4

Cygni
Nov 12, 2005

raring to post



I'm mostly sure thats just a Noctua NH-14S with a wider contact plate...? I've got a Bequiet Dark Rock 3 that is def a much bigger heatsink than that.

Sormus
Jul 24, 2007

PREVENT SPACE-AIDS
sanitize your lovebot
between users


Thiccripper - Return of Pizzabox form factor.

SwissArmyDruid
Feb 14, 2014



Yeah, except the Cryorig Taku is DOA.

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


Probably won't get threadripper but I'm interested in those coolers, I was thinking about doing this project involving high-powered LED arrays and that massive contact plate would be perfect for cooling them.

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


MaxxBot posted:

Probably won't get threadripper but I'm interested in those coolers, I was thinking about doing this project involving high-powered LED arrays and that massive contact plate would be perfect for cooling them.

(I'm assuming these are like 100W or something and will melt themselves in no time without cooling?)

How do you get the heat from the LEDs into the coldplate? Do you have some kind of machined heatspreader block which orients the LEDs and spreads heat for the coldplate?

Apropos of nothing but... I've always loved the Cray-2 with its total-immersion Fluorinert cooling for really high-density designs, and there's some other situations where total immersion might simplify design problems. For example if this was a commercial product you could put your LEDs in an acrylic block and force Fluorinert over them. Heck the Fluorinert is probably translucent enough to shine through in some use-cases.

I think a few supercomputers might use Fluorinert cooling nowadays (they fill the whole cabinet), the other way you can go is a modular system with blocks on each part. Obviously that is also a lot of work, but Asetek does make a pretty cool rack for this. It even avoids contamination between the rack loop and the master loop using a heat exchanger.

It's basically the same thing NVIDIA did with the Drive PX module, given the power/heat density (4+ GP100 per 1U/2U) that modern machine-learning racks are going to it seems like an obvious next move.

Watermelon Daiquiri
Jul 10, 2010




didnt alienware or someone make a computer immersed in mineral oil?


^^ oh wait, THATs the Abyss stuff

Watermelon Daiquiri fucked around with this message at 03:29 on Jul 21, 2017

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Watermelon Daiquiri posted:

^^ oh wait, THATs the Abyss stuff

Didn't you wonder why they call it total immersion cooling





Meanwhile on r/cableporn:



Well, you tried to try!

Paul MaudDib fucked around with this message at 05:33 on Jul 21, 2017

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


Paul MaudDib posted:

(I'm assuming these are like 100W or something and will melt themselves in no time without cooling?)

How do you get the heat from the LEDs into the coldplate? Do you have some kind of machined heatspreader block which orients the LEDs and spreads heat for the coldplate?

Yeah they're modules like this that draw a ton of power, they have an aluminum plate on the back so the idea would be just to attach them to the contact plate of the heatsink with some thermal adhesive.

http://www.bridgelux.com/sites/defa...20Rev%20H_1.pdf

The idea would be to attach several of those modules to the contact plate for cooling and power the setup with LiPo batteries to have an absurdly bright flashlight that's still relatively portable. Tons of people have done this on Youtube and a lot of them use water cooling but I figure this would be cheaper and easier.

Anarchist Mae
Nov 5, 2009

by Reene


Lipstick Apathy

AMD Ryzen 5 1600; 96% of the performance at 85% of the watts for 50% off the price of an Intel Core i7-7800X.

Also it you overclock to 4GHz and 4.7GHz respectively they are about equal in these games on average.

Cygni
Nov 12, 2005

raring to post



Anarchist Mae posted:

AMD Ryzen 5 1600; 96% of the performance at 85% of the watts for 50% off the price of an Intel Core i7-7800X.

Also it you overclock to 4GHz and 4.7GHz respectively they are about equal in these games on average.

I like that the best looking CPU in that comparison is the one not in the title.

7800x is gonna be essentially redundant next month with Coffee Lake, too. Woof. SKL-X is a mess.

EmpyreanFlux
Mar 1, 2013

The AUDACITY! The IMPUDENCE! The unabated NERVE!


Intel is promising a lot with Coffee Lake but I'm just assuming it's going to be Skylake with 50% more cores and the accompanying thermal and power issues, and I feel it's success depends on if it's compatible with 1151.

wargames
Mar 16, 2008

official yospos cat censor


FaustianQ posted:

Intel is promising a lot with Coffee Lake but I'm just assuming it's going to be Skylake with 50% more cores and the accompanying thermal and power issues, and I feel it's success depends on if it's compatible with 1151.

so will we be looking at 1151 V3 but can't use other 1151 cpus?

Cygni
Nov 12, 2005

raring to post



FaustianQ posted:

Intel is promising a lot with Coffee Lake but I'm just assuming it's going to be Skylake with 50% more cores and the accompanying thermal and power issues, and I feel it's success depends on if it's compatible with 1151.

They've said a "30% performance increase" over Kaby, but it has 33% more cores so yeah, it's pretty much Kaby Lake with 2 extra cores at 95W. If it is close to 7700K clocks though, thats pretty drat formidable. The leaks had the 8700k at 3.7ghz base.

EmpyreanFlux
Mar 1, 2013

The AUDACITY! The IMPUDENCE! The unabated NERVE!


Cygni posted:

They've said a "30% performance increase" over Kaby, but it has 33% more cores so yeah, it's pretty much Kaby Lake with 2 extra cores at 95W. If it is close to 7700K clocks though, thats pretty drat formidable. The leaks had the 8700k at 3.7ghz base.

I don't doubt that it'll hit similar clocks as Kaby Lake, but 6C/12T running at 5Ghz is no joke on power consumption based on what we've seen and it's possible Coffee Lake needs ridiculously overengineered Z270/370 boards, and that's if is shares a socket and isn't the start of the new socket for Intel 10nm generation.

Otakufag
Aug 23, 2004


Hi somebody from the future told me Zen 2 will be AMD's Sandybridge, is it true??

SourKraut
Nov 20, 2005

POST QUALITY UNDER CONSTRUCTION




Otakufag posted:

Hi somebody from the future told me Zen 2 will be AMD's Sandybridge, is it true??

That'll be Threadripper. Rip and Tear.

PC LOAD LETTER
May 23, 2005
WTF?!

Slippery Tilde

Otakufag posted:

Hi somebody from the future told me Zen 2 will be AMD's Sandybridge, is it true??
I'd say that is overly optimistic based on the rumors so far. Maaaaybe comparable to the early K7 vs late PIII era overall performance wise (I'm assuming Intel will be able to keep a OK advantage in clock speed)? Which wouldn't be a bad thing at all for AMD but not the blow out that was Sandybridge vs early BD/late PhII.

IMO right now seems reminds me of the K6 or K6-2 vs PII era with Intel having a (minor) performance advantage but AMD having a (large) value advantage.

Scarecow
May 20, 2008

3200mhz RAM is literally the Devil. Literally.


Lipstick Apathy

Isnt the only thing holding ryzen back atm is the higher clock speed advantage intel has? So moving to a production that would match clocks with intel would force intel to price match?

BurritoJustice
Oct 9, 2012



Scarecow posted:

Isnt the only thing holding ryzen back atm is the higher clock speed advantage intel has? So moving to a production that would match clocks with intel would force intel to price match?

Memory compatibility >3000MT/s (not really relevant in the server/datacenter space), 6-7%~ IPC, and dreadful AVX performance off the top of my head. Of those I think AVX is probably the most important in the high margin markets alongside clock speed.

MaxxBot
Oct 6, 2003

you could have clapped

you should have clapped!!


IIRC Zen 2 is supposed to have full speed AVX

Palladium
May 8, 2012


PC LOAD LETTER posted:

I'd say that is overly optimistic based on the rumors so far. Maaaaybe comparable to the early K7 vs late PIII era overall performance wise (I'm assuming Intel will be able to keep a OK advantage in clock speed)? Which wouldn't be a bad thing at all for AMD but not the blow out that was Sandybridge vs early BD/late PhII.

IMO right now seems reminds me of the K6 or K6-2 vs PII era with Intel having a (minor) performance advantage but AMD having a (large) value advantage.

Nah Zen is the 2000-2001 era Durons: outstanding perf/price as long as you are willing to tolerate a slightly flakier platform. K6s were rubbish gaming CPUs running on rubbish chipsets that only ran OK with 3Dnow which was rarely supported even in its heyday, and got massacred six ways to sunday by the integrated L2 cache Celerons. My old Celeron 433A felt light years faster than my K6-2 500MHz, ran far more stable on crash-prone Win98 and had none of the minor AGP bus visual artifacing on a Geforce 2 Ti.

Palladium fucked around with this message at 07:07 on Jul 22, 2017

ConanTheLibrarian
Aug 13, 2004


dis buch is late

Fallen Rib

MaxxBot posted:

IIRC Zen 2 is supposed to have full speed AVX

Intel will just bring out AVX-1024 to stay one step ahead.


Never mind that the chip will have to clock down to 800MHz to avoid spontaneous combustion.

PC LOAD LETTER
May 23, 2005
WTF?!

Slippery Tilde

Palladium posted:

Nah Zen is the 2000-2001 era Durons: outstanding perf/price as long as you are willing to tolerate a slightly flakier platform.
I was only talking about CPU performance.

If you want to bring chipsets and platforms into it everything gets more confused and difficult to compare. For instance the current AMD chipsets are waaay more stable than those old VIA KT133's on up the Durons had to use. They're current ones are just somewhat slower than Intel's current chipsets but not enough to matter much in typical practical use. Even getting to DDR4 3200 speeds is becoming more routine now, though still not a sure thing yet.

Palladium posted:

K6s were rubbish gaming CPUs running on rubbish chipsets
They were solid at everything but gaming, which even then they were still OK enough at and if you had a video card they were close enough not to matter in the big games of the time, and non-gaming mattered more back then than it does now, especially for the money. You could get a whole K6-2 based system for $900-ish, sometimes even under $800 if you got lucky with a good sale, while a PII based one would run upwards of $1400 easy. Yeah the chipsets were real hit n' miss back then and Intel had a big lead there, it was usually possible to get them working though if you were patient.

Palladium posted:

got massacred six ways to sunday by the integrated L2 cache Celerons. My old Celeron 433A
You're supposed to compare the K6-III with the integrated L2 Celerons though. They were out about the same time right? The K6-2 didn't have a integrated L2 but the K6-III did and held up fairly well against the Pentiums of the time. Though I remember it running hot for that era and had poor mobo support, something to do with voltage requirements I think. The L3 cache you could add to the K6-III supposedly mattered enough to make it compete with the early PIII but I could never afford it at the time.

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A SWEATY FATBEARD
Oct 6, 2012

Entering of the person whom the nasty smell does is refused.


Yeah my overclocked celeron 433A was a baller, I ran it on a strange little 440EX board and if you cranked the FSB up to 83MHz it was not only rock-stable but it put many more modern P3 systems to shame. I held onto the system for an incredibly long time because it just went and went. I still miss that computer.

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