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peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


EccoRaven posted:

seeing pera and PMush both flip the heck out at suggesting "hey maybe we should no-vote again" and "hey maybe there's something to this setup being a pieC9" is also not very comforting.

GREAT

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EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


pera it's ok to scumclaim, you gave it a really good shot and you genuinely had me thinking it was BK there for a while.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


Kashuno posted:

Jeez there is a real lack of death

Day 3

does the game end if nobody loving dies two days in a row?

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


Hold on

Hold the gently caress on

Something just clicked.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


EccoRaven posted:

pera it's ok to scumclaim, you gave it a really good shot and you genuinely had me thinking it was BK there for a while.

put a vote down. bk will join you.

and for GOD'S sake, AA and AYC had better loving agree.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


I'm going to yoga I'll be back in a bit.

good luck everyone remember that no-voting is also a valid option!

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


BK never even pretended to believe that I actually targetted AYC. He never even pretended to believe HIS OWN CLAIM. The rest of this is bullshit that doesn't matter. BK didn't just slip about what he planned tonight, he completely fumbled his defense today.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


PMush Perfect posted:

BK never even pretended to believe that I actually targetted AYC. He never even pretended to believe HIS OWN CLAIM. The rest of this is bullshit that doesn't matter. BK didn't just slip about what he planned tonight, he completely fumbled his defense today.

just stop please nothing either of us say is going to loving matter

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


His accusation was that I WITHHELD THE NIGHT KILL

Why is THAT where someone's brain goes first? He said his action was a success. He came back into the game with no death. He, in his narrative, already stopped me once. Why, oh why, would he not believe he did that again? Why would he not even entertain the possibility?

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


PMush Perfect posted:

Why, oh why, would he not believe he did that again? Why would he not even entertain the possibility?

because you claimed first.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


EccoRaven posted:

I'm probably dead tonight so good luck everyone, remember: logic is power, the answer is there you just have to find it.

god bless.

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


EccoRaven posted:

because you claimed first.
what

How does that follow, Ecco? I'm getting a little overhype here, but I do not understand what you're saying here at all.

"Ha, I jailed BK."
"No you didn't, you withheld the night kill."

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


oh yeah duh, brain fart

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


In what universe does BK's defense make sense for town to say?

"My action didn't fail, therefore you're not a jailor?"
Fine, sure. Redundant and worthless argument, but fine. Mediocre town play.

"There was no kill, I protected AYC. Scum would target AYC because [reasons]."
Sensible casing, maybe try to puzzle out who my potential scumbuddy is. Find reasons for why I'd want AYC dead, or why my buddy would. Good town play.

"There was no kill, they must have just not done anything!"
That's what he went with. That is what you're seriously entertaining the idea is a town train of thought.

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


Uuuugh I'm being stupid and emotional again and I don't even care

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


gently caress, I even already talked about the BK/Quid thing, way back at the start of D2 when my logic was at its sharpest. I KNOW how loving bizarre that makes D1.

But the alternatives aren't exactly much more sensible at this point, considering that almost of them are predicated on "Town Quid self-hammered in a flipless game"

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


I've self-hammered as town when I'm super salty. I've done that, it's lovely, but I get it. But I do it because when the flip comes a few minutes later, I get the brief, selfish satisfaction of proving that everyone who was piling on me was either scum or an idiot.

Quid wouldn't get that payoff. gently caress it not being bad play, there's not even any catharsis for town Quid in a self-hammer. No one gets proven wrong, it's just a "taking my ball and going home" tantrum.

That's what calling me and pera scum is predicated on.

Hell, that's what me calling YOU scum was predicated on.

gently caress, you can't even be deliberately obtuse scum. You're town, Ecco. Pera says it. I believe it. I know you love your gambits, sometimes they even work. I'm sorry I thought you were scum before, you're welcome for accidentally saving your life. Please stop being so obtuse about this and help me win this game.

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


Mafia edit:

pera

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


gently caress, I forgot you went AFK because you posted after it. Sorry.

I sure would love to see AA and/or AYC drop by!

(Psssst. If y'all are lurking, that's your cue.)

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


I am legit upset but trying to hide it behind shitposting and it is turning into the weirdest poo poo.

Corey in the House may not have been the worst outcome here.

girl dick energy
Sep 30, 2009

You think you have the wherewithal to figure out my puzzle vagina?


Okay, I'm giving myself a headache. Yelling at an empty room isn't going to do anything. I've said my piece. AA, AYC, if you get back before I do, please consider what I said to Ecco about the possibilities about who's scum and why. We have this game on lock. We have him dead to rights. Let's please, please, PLEASE not waste this victory by believing this doc counterclaim that he's been making up as he goes.

sephiRoth IRA
Jun 13, 2007

"Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."

-Carl Sagan


84 posts and I learned nothing new. It still comes down to whether we believe pmush or bk.

BK if you're telling the truth, thanks buddy!

If you're lying, how dare you try to buy my friendship!

I need to read through today again. I skimmed but I'm leaving more towards bk being scum. Eccos point about flipless games having no penalty for scum to stick their necks out for each other isn't 100% solid imo- bk could have been on quid specifically to back up his town cred on later days.

Let me think about it. I will be posting less frequently today :/

sephiRoth IRA
Jun 13, 2007

"Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."

-Carl Sagan


That said, you know what else I don't like? Pmush is calling for a turbo when I actually agree with bk and Ecco soon the no kill today. It gives time to get more info from the power roles.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


areyoucontagious posted:

Eccos point about flipless games having no penalty for scum to stick their necks out for each other isn't 100% solid imo- bk could have been on quid specifically to back up his town cred on later days.

except why would BK have town cred from voting out quidnose?

"because quidnose played a scummy game and then self-hammered, he was obvi scum."

but unless they planned it to happen that way (unlikely), then BK would have had no idea the day would go down like it did. if the day had ended with quid dead but everyone still uncertain about him he'd have gotten no cred at all.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


areyoucontagious posted:

That said, you know what else I don't like? Pmush is calling for a turbo when I actually agree with bk and Ecco soon the no kill today. It gives time to get more info from the power roles.

pmush and pera are both calling for it really aggressively. in a vacuum their play really does feel like scum trying to rush us.

their play honestly feels like scum in general.

the only thing that gives me pause is the jailor claim is so dumb for scum to make.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


11:11 make a wish



also yoga was really good today, I feel all loosey goosey now.

sephiRoth IRA
Jun 13, 2007

"Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."

-Carl Sagan


EccoRaven posted:

11:11 make a wish



also yoga was really good today, I feel all loosey goosey now.

I slept in and just had a nice shave. Also feeling pretty good.

sephiRoth IRA
Jun 13, 2007

"Science is not only compatible with spirituality; it is a profound source of spirituality."

-Carl Sagan


PMush Perfect posted:

Jesus Christ, please don't.

This is in response to your no dunk proposal. Pretty strong reaction, right?

And then when you explain, she pulls her vote.

PMush Perfect posted:

Hmmm

##unvote

Not totally convinced, having this kind of mexican standoff WIFOM bugs me, but willing to hear it out.

But then there's this post, which rings all kinds of alarm bells for me.




PMush Perfect posted:

Ecco what do you think of the possibility that we're at 4/2?

Consider the following possibility: We don't vote anyone today. Tonight, they either kill me or pera. Tomorrow, it's 5/3. One town vote on anyone means that BK and whoever come out and hammer.

The more I think about it, the more i'd much, much rather bet on my BK to put us at either 4/1 or winning, rather than I would at being put at either 4/1 or 3/2.

The reason this pings so hard is because of the last sentence in the first paragraph, worrying about a vote on anyone allowing bk to hammer.

Mush, dude, if you or pera die bk is going next. Then, if we don't win, whoever didn't die of you and pera gets killed D4 to control for the possibility that scum nked their own.

I really really don't think AA or Ecco is scum, but if they are well played everyone. I strongly believe the scum is contained in pera/mush/bk.

So mushs post worrying about this feels super scummy.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


so breaking it down into simpler bits.

BK has played a town game. He's posting well, making cases, responding to them. He clearly went into day 2 planning on counterclaiming PMush, and in a vacuum nothing about his play is untoward. If he's scum he's doing a good job.

PMush and pera have not played a town game. pera's posts day 1 were filled with padding, and her posts + claim day 2 felt really ad hoc. PMush likewise was essentially absent day 1 but the little she was here she shatposted and made a nonsense argument against my jokevote on quidnose. Her day two claim she comes in guns blazing, never even considering the extremely obvious possibility that I was the nightkill target. PMush is excitable yes but it seems like there's no way a town PMush would have made such a glaring oversight.


If the claims didn't exist I'd vote for PMush or pera without any struggle.

===

It doesn't make sense for a scum PMush to claim jailor. It doesn't make sense for scum BK to bus the hell out of Quidnose (or alternatively perform the kill at all, knowing town-PMush would jail him).

One of them has to be lying. That necessarily means one of them has to have made a misstep as scum.

I've been racking my brain trying to figure out which misstep is more believable, but I don't think it's possible to get an answer to that. Whoever in this relationship is town, they hosed up. Whether it's PMush for fullclaiming jailor and not considering all the possibilities, or pera for fullclaiming cop when it didn't look like PMush was going to be the day's execution, or Quidnose deciding to throw a tantrum and self-hammer. Y'all shouldn't do those things in the future. It would behoove whomever is town among those three to be more patient and thoughtful with your approach to the game in the future.



I still support not voting right now but if I did vote it'd probably be against PMush/pera. If they're town they both played their roles extremely sub-optimally, but it would be in line with their erratic play all game. If BK is scum he's been putting in effort and being reasonable, and ultimately he should win the game if that's the case.

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope

Here's the one thing, that really as far as I see it, is a linchpin to solving the game.

Quid sacked himself. Was he scum though?

If your answer is yes, I think it makes BK and Ecco look worse. If your answer is no, it certainly makes them both look worse.

BK in spite of ecco's praise, has actually done very little aside from further confusing the game.

Id also wager that ecco's posts, much like the claim raised against pera, are significantly fluff.

I think it's them and I think quid just gave into rage.

Anomalous Amalgam
Feb 13, 2015

by Nyc_Tattoo


Doctor Rope



On phone, but look over the vote spread for d1 and how it played out and tell me Quid doesn't look like he's been setup. Look at the votes and how reasoning was found later for the votes.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


Anomalous Amalgam posted:

BK in spite of ecco's praise, has actually done very little aside from further confusing the game.

BK has been making cases and posting in a way that suggests he's town. How has he "further confused the game" aside from claiming he's a doctor (which, if he's town, he should have done anyway)?

Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Id also wager that ecco's posts, much like the claim raised against pera, are significantly fluff.
they're not, sorry.

Anomalous Amalgam posted:

On phone, but look over the vote spread for d1 and how it played out and tell me Quid doesn't look like he's been setup. Look at the votes and how reasoning was found later for the votes.
if you think my reasons for voting for quidnose were fabricated then please go through them and say so. If you think BK's reasons for voting for quidnose were fabricated then please go through them and say so.

Just saying "look, BK and Ecco first voted for quidnose as a joke, and then as time passed they made cases on quidnose and in ecco's case voted for him AGAIN!" isn't really dispositive of anything.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


Anomalous Amalgam posted:

On phone, but look over the vote spread for d1 and how it played out and tell me Quid doesn't look like he's been setup. Look at the votes and how reasoning was found later for the votes.

I'm laughing my rear end off at this because I'm working on a post for you about D1 Quid & BK and I hit preview as I'm shuffling some quotes in, and there's Kash's avatar big as hell, Bottleknight highlighted and then Kash going "Night 1" and so I scrolled down expecting a big fake conspiracy post with a lot of red circles and arrows. Certainly not what you intended, but there's a little light left in me yet.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


EccoRaven posted:

Just saying "look, BK and Ecco first voted for quidnose as a joke, and then as time passed they made cases on quidnose and in ecco's case voted for him AGAIN!" isn't really dispositive of anything.

You're not scum, but I'm working on it. Quid had no hope and BK didn't bus him, you and I drove a spear into Quid and that was that. BK got lucky and dropped a jokevote on his scumbuddy knowing very well that Quid is Quid. Switch me and Quid in your mind and picture the same strategy with me. I'd almost recommend that my scumbuddies put jokevotes on me - just in case I get nuked day 1 because I am who I am and I break the gently caress down.

Returning to d1 review.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


Anomalous Amalgam posted:

Here's the one thing, that really as far as I see it, is a linchpin to solving the game.

Quid sacked himself. Was he scum though?

If your answer is yes, I think it makes BK and Ecco look worse. If your answer is no, it certainly makes them both look worse.

BK in spite of ecco's praise, has actually done very little aside from further confusing the game.

Id also wager that ecco's posts, much like the claim raised against pera, are significantly fluff.

I think it's them and I think quid just gave into rage.

BK says himself he's a doc that can neither doc himself nor the same person twice in a row. I've heard of one or either but not of both.

If we no-lynch tonight, best case scenario? You or AYC dies. I would expect another no kill. Then we're right back here.

I hear you on Quid and I'll be the first one to tell you the dude goes off the handle just as easily as I do. There's this discussion of BK bussing Quid. What is that based on? Because that's not how I remember it.


BottleKnight posted:

This is one of the emptiest accusation posts I've seen. The game's barely started, to the point that you had just posted a content game, and you feel the need to say someone else is "controlling the narrative" ???

Seems as if you're trying to conjure up stuff.

BottleKnight posted:

This is a scumpost. Specifically that last sentence. It's not scummy, it's not an accusation, it's just "weird." Quid is above questioning, and he is manipulatively trying to say with this post that "picking at him" is suspicious and weird. You shouldn't do it.

I think I'm gonna keep my vote on Quid.

BottleKnight posted:

I literally [have] the exact opposite reads of this post.

Here are his d1 posts on Quid.

They are: a jokevote; a response to a remark about Ecco controlling a narrative (which she and I both do); he's keeping his vote right where it is; bam. I think I might be confused on what a bus means. This is supporting Ecco and myself being fierce and intense against Quid, not... leading a charge against him for towncred, or whatever the hell a bus is supposed to do.

I'm just gonna grab one of my posts.

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


if we no-vote, I want every power role to make an obvious but unbreakable breadcrumb as to whom they will target during the night, and then the next day claim it.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


peramene posted:

quid if you're town, drop the loving shovel. christ

[quidpost]

This is you trying to make me laugh and think of you as less threatening to town, and you are failing miserably. "pera is most definitely town" - WHY? not to FOS myself or anything but for fucks' sake, quid, if this were any usual game I'd vote you twice.

Is your play to get me to overreact to you so they think we're scumbuddies?

preview edit - I just wanna be clear that noticing there was momentum on Quid didn't impact my reading of his posts. You're joking/putting pressure on him for your own reasons, I'm flanking him. 's much as I take your opinion seriously, you'll surely note I haven't dropped the vote on his rear end. I'm not gonna lose Gaugamela just 'cuz your cavalry goes early.

This is the thing tho, this is Quid - play nice w/ me, hit you. You're picking up on his grumpiness towards me but cite it. He's being chill, he's joking, he's dropping that "oh, pera being pera" (as are you - but compare the difference in how you two do it) like I'm not much of a casebuilder based on [past] experience so I don't want reins but are other people seeing this poo poo?

EccoRaven
Aug 15, 2004

there is only one hell:
the one we live in now


by obvious I mean it's not hidden (to prevent you from sneaking in a bunch of fake breadcrumbs), and by unbreakable I mean coding it in such a way that one cannot reasonably think it's anything but what you are trying to do.

something like a rough and dirty vigenere cipher, or even just a sentence with a letter shift.

like let's say I'm a tracker and I'm planning on targeting pera tonight, I could go:


ueukkytsvjortsyibuhgy


...which, if you consider the letters of a standard QWERTY keyboard and cut it in half between the G and H, and every letter to the left half gets shifted to the right by one, and on the right half shifted to the left by one, it should (barring a mistake) spell:


iwilltrackperatonight


You are all creative people I am sure you can come up with your own code.

peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


EccoRaven posted:

if we no-vote, I want every power role to make an obvious but unbreakable breadcrumb as to whom they will target during the night, and then the next day claim it.

I'm a big fan of this idea, but all kidding aside;

everything about the cop role requires cooperation with the observer;

I mean, actually, all of this is starting to make a ton of sense to me;

pera has been exaggerating her feelings ridiculously and it's annoying;

Potentially, my ultimate scumtell is hating no-lynches.

Time me. With sincere effort, I know you and BK are both clever enough to bake these in enough that you could ride them.

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peramene
Oct 13, 2015

Just peramene.


EccoRaven posted:

like let's say I'm a tracker and I'm planning on targeting pera tonight, I could go:

This is me crossing my fingers.

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