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Choco1980
Feb 22, 2013

I fell in love with a Video Nasty


wow, even for GI Joe, that was an action packed issue.

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Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013







wat :psyduck:

DivineCoffeeBinge
Mar 3, 2011

Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company


So let's talk about Herb Trimpe.

Herb Trimpe got his start on The Incredible Hulk and then was the main penciller of that book for about seven years, which is a pretty impressive run. As the main Hulk artist he co-created a huge number of long-running supporting cast members like Jim Wilson (who later was one of the first HIV-positive characters in comics and whose death, written by Peter David, was actually a really positive and heartfelt depiction of a man with HIV at a time when those were pretty hard to come by in pop culture) and Doc Samson. He was also the first guy to ever draw Wolverine, which in retrospect is sort of a big deal. He has also been credited with inventing the idea of, and style of, the "Hulkbusters" - a division of the U.S. Army that was tasked with hunting down the Hulk, led by General "Thunderbolt" Ross - and his experience in thinking of military units in a comic book setting pretty clearly influences his work on G.I. Joe. He co-created Captain Britain (with Chris Claremont) and his work on the Hulk was so iconic that when Rolling Stone did a story on how Marvel was becoming a cultural juggernaut they tapped Trimpe to draw the Hulk for the cover.

Trimpe's artwork was heavily inspired by the style used in EC Comics back in their heyday, and was a big fan of EC's Jack Davis, who was an amazing goddamn artist that more people should know about. Trimpe said that one of his early Hulk issues was actually rejected by Stan Lee, who made another artist do the layouts for him to pencil over, not because there was a problem with his storytelling, but because it was "too EC"!

Anyways, Herb Trimpe was what was called a "quota artist" - he had a set number of pages he was expected to deliver each week, and he got a regular salary instead of being paid a page rate, as well as benefits. It wasn't a contracted gig, but it was a pretty sweet system, because if he exceeded his quota he was allowed to voucher the excess pages for freelancer rates. This is how despite getting his start in 1968 he was still doing G.I. Joe books in the '80s - and, in fact, was still regularly pencilling comics for Marvel in the mid-90s when the company went bankrupt. He was essentially Marvel's go-to guy for licensed properties, working on Godzilla, Shogun Warriors, G.I. Joe, The Further Adventures of Indiana Jones, NFL Super-Pro, Robocop, Star Wars, and Planet of the Apes! Oh, and a couple issues of Transformers now that I think about it. When Ron Perelman drove Marvel into the ground and started fighting it out with Carl Icahn in court (yes, these things happened), Trimpe found himself out of work for the first time in decades... so the dude went to college, got his master's degree, and taught art for a couple of years. Oh, and he kept getting comics work here and there - his last Marvel work (I think, I could be wrong) was an eight-page story in a Hulk special in 2008.

Oh, and along the way he was ordained as an Episcopal deacon and spent a month as a volunteer chaplain at the site of the World Trade Center after 9/11.

Herb Trimpe passed away in 2015 and the dude was a giant; one of those unsung heroes who never quite manages to stick in the consciousness like a Kirby or a Romita but who's always there, year in and year out, churning out quality work. He mattered as much to comics as anyone, and he seems like he was a pretty awesome dude, and I want more people to know about him. So now you do.

robziel
May 31, 2011

>10 THRUST "ROBO_COX"
>20 GOTO 10


:science:

DivineCoffeeBinge posted:

So let's talk about Herb Trimpe.

...

Herb Trimpe passed away in 2015 and the dude was a giant; one of those unsung heroes who never quite manages to stick in the consciousness like a Kirby or a Romita but who's always there, year in and year out, churning out quality work. He mattered as much to comics as anyone, and he seems like he was a pretty awesome dude, and I want more people to know about him. So now you do.

Holy poo poo that's awesome, thank you I had no idea.

Taerkar
Dec 7, 2002

kind of into it, really



That's some rather short ranged weapons that they have. Not even a mile?

Dareon
Apr 6, 2009


Those SEA Legs are ridiculous and I love them. :allears:

GPTribefan
Jul 2, 2007
Something witty yet inspirational about the Cleveland Indians

robziel posted:

:science:


Holy poo poo that's awesome, thank you I had no idea.

The saddest thing about Herb is the way he was pushed out the door. He would literally get turned away by the receptionist, who would tell him there was no work for him and to stop asking. He even tried a completely new style to try and fit in with the 90's EXTREME look, which unfortunately led a generation of fans to look upon his work with utter contempt. He did a few issues of Fantastic Four Unlimited and an FF Annual in this style - I used to think it was pathetic, but after learning more about the guy's situation I realized it was a veteran artist's last attempt at trying to hang on in an industry he helped shape.

Chances are, if you liked a licensed property in the 80's, you have Herb Trimpe to thank.

DivineCoffeeBinge
Mar 3, 2011

Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company


GPTribefan posted:

The saddest thing about Herb is the way he was pushed out the door. He would literally get turned away by the receptionist, who would tell him there was no work for him and to stop asking. He even tried a completely new style to try and fit in with the 90's EXTREME look, which unfortunately led a generation of fans to look upon his work with utter contempt. He did a few issues of Fantastic Four Unlimited and an FF Annual in this style - I used to think it was pathetic, but after learning more about the guy's situation I realized it was a veteran artist's last attempt at trying to hang on in an industry he helped shape.

Chances are, if you liked a licensed property in the 80's, you have Herb Trimpe to thank.

This is an article from the New York Times consisting almost entirely of Herb Trimpe's journal entries from the time when Marvel gave him the boot. It's heartbreaking and kinda uplifting, actually.

GPTribefan
Jul 2, 2007
Something witty yet inspirational about the Cleveland Indians

DivineCoffeeBinge posted:

This is an article from the New York Times consisting almost entirely of Herb Trimpe's journal entries from the time when Marvel gave him the boot. It's heartbreaking and kinda uplifting, actually.

I remember reading that article years ago, still depressing to read it :(

The worst part of all of it is he was still a competent artist when he did his own style. When you look at some of the absolute garbage Marvel was putting out in that 1994-1996 period, it's hard to believe that they couldn't put him on a book and let him work. You cant tell me he wouldn't have been better than 25% of the artists they had working at the time....

Nipponophile
Apr 8, 2009


So here's the last real "stand alone" comic to come up for a while. Like the last issue, this one was also not written by Larry Hama.





As the Joe team executes a no-knock raid on a Cobra safehouse, the Cobra techs attempt to dump their data.



Cobra Commander briefly gloats before remotely detonating the cabin, but Breaker escapes with some critical computer tapes. They mention an upcoming assassination attempt involving U.S. diplomat Brian Hassell, who is conducting talks with the Middle Eastern nation of Al-Alawi. Hassell's talks are crucial to moving Al-Alawi into the U.S. sphere of influence, so the Joe team is assigned to his defense.



Cobra Commander receives the bad news that the Joes are escorting Hassell, but he seems strangely excited at this news.

As we catch up with the diplomat, he is playing out the last of his vacation time on the French Riviera while his escorts attempt to convince him to maintain a low profile. As they hit the beach, Cobra frogmen attempt an assault only to be repelled by Clutch's well-hidden ordinance.



Scarlett and Hassell make a quick retreat to their hotel room for Hassell to retrieve his bags. When they go to exit, the door is locked, and there is a distinctive ticking sound outside...





Meanwhile, in London, some of the other Joes are following up on the trail of a known arms dealer...



But only seconds after this exchange, Sutherland is on the radio to Cobra command, reporting his situation. The address delivery was planned all along! As a reward, Sutherland receives a fatal shock in order to minimize loose ends.

Clutch and Scarlett approach their rendezvous point at an airfield in France, only to be pursued by Cobra troopers. While Scarlett discourages pursuit with a few grenades, Clutch drives their car up the cargo ramp as the plane begins to lift off. Just moments into the flight, Scarlett notices that the plane is headed the wrong way! The pilot is a Cobra plant! She quickly knocks him out, but...



Clutch manages to crash-land the plane on a flat stretch of mountain, allowing Haskell and the Joes to continue onwards in their car. Meanwhile, Stalker and Snake-Eyes are investigating the Amsterdam address they got from Sutherland. It leads them to a brothel, and when Stalker heads upstairs, he is greeted by a hologram of Cobra Commander!



Stalker manages to contact Snake-Eyes with his last breath, and Snake-Eyes blows open the door with a placed charge. Clutch and Scarlett, unaware of the position they are in, continue to drive Haskell through the French Alps in the face of stiff opposition.



With the pursuing cars out of the picture, enemy helicopters drop gas grenades on the car. One manages to land inside the vehicle, unnoticed...





Haskell restrains the Joes with the intention of pinning the assassination on them after he escapes, but Clutch and Scarlett immediately set to freeing themselves from their bonds. As Haskell heads downhill to the chateau to meet the Al-Alawi ambassador, the Joes fight their way free and locate a pair of skis in the process.





While it seems everything has gone wrong...



At Cobra HQ, Cobra Commander receives the news. He is not angry, for "It was only a game, and there will always be... another game!"

With this issue under wraps, we move onto a new level of the G.I. Joe comic. Issue #10 begins the long form narrative that Hama is remembered for. Hold onto your asses, rear end-holders. poo poo's about to get real*.

*real involved with ninjas, car crashes, two-fisted military action, ninjas, shocking betrayals, blatant merchandising, ninjas, 80s jingoism, and also ninjas

DivineCoffeeBinge
Mar 3, 2011

Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company


So continuing my theme of "let's do infodumps on the people who wrote these comics other than Larry Hama" (because we're going to have pleeeeenty of time to talk about Larry Hama), let's talk about Steven Grant.

(not the dude who murdered his wife, if that's where Google brought you, BTW; the one who wrote comics)

Steven Grant was a big deal in the 1980s for Marvel - never the guy who got name recognition, but definitely someone who wrote comics that, if you were reading Marvel at the time, you almost certainly read. One of my favorite little things he did was a quick two-issue story in The Defenders that served to wrap up Steve Gerber's bizarre and wonderful Omega the Unknown - a series that got 10 issues before being cancelled due to low sales about a weird little kid and his friend the superhero who might be a robot from outer space. Anyways, fans kept writing in demanding to know how the story ended, because Gerber never had the chance to finish it, so Marvel had Steven Grant wrote a story where the Defenders met most of Omega's supporting cast and then a bunch of them died. It did wrap up most of the loose ends, and while Gerber apparently didn't care for the story, he never said it was bad - just that he didn't like it. A strange little coda to a strange little book.

Anyways, Steven Grant's biggest comic book claim to fame is probably that, more than anyone, he's probably the guy responsible for The Punisher not being a forgettable former Spider-Man antagonist. In 1986 he wrote, and Mike Zeck pencilled, a Punisher miniseries that was 5 issues (it was originally intended to be 4 issues with a double-sized final issue, but production proved to be a pain in the rear end so they turned the final issue into two issues - only that screwed up more of the production, so issues number 1, 3, and 4 advertise it as being a 4-issue miniseries while numbers 2 and 5 advertise it as being a 5-issue mini - look, it was a whole thing).

quote:

Originally Mike and I wanted to do the 4th and 5th issues as one double-sized like the first one, but Marvel wasn’t keen on it, so we split it in two. But that was long before production started, so it shouldn’t have been a factor. I think the first issue reads “of a four-issue limited series” and Mike and I raised holy hell over that so the second issue has “five” on it. But production couldn’t keep it straight because nobody DID five issue series. People did four issue series. Mike and I had a bet with each other that the fifth issue would read “#5 In A Four-Issue Limited Series,” but they managed to get it right that time.

This miniseries was a roaring success, and soon the Punisher had his own ongoing monthly series. And then another. And then another, because it was the '80s.

(The Punisher, Punisher War Journal, and Punisher War Zone, for the record, plus the semi-regular Punisher Armory specials and the assorted one-shots and mini-series and guest appearances; for a while there putting the Punisher into a book was basically a license to print money)

One of the things that Grant always strove to do when writing the Punisher was pay attention to the gear the guy was using - he specifically chose real-world weaponry and equipment. Frank Castle never fired "a machine gun" or "an assault rifle" - he fired an M16A2 with attached M203 grenade launcher, dammit! Marvel even had technical artist Eliot Brown draw up photorealistic depictions of the weapons that Frank Castle used and write up accompanying text blurbs and sold them as the aforementioned Punisher Armory specials - no story, no plot, just "here are guns the Punisher uses and some of the things he thinks about them." They made like a dozen of these things! And people bought the poo poo out of them! The '80s, man...

At any rate, you can really see the parallels between those early Punisher books - which so often involved shadowy cartels and double-crosses and the bad guy never being quite who you thought they were - and this G.I. Joe story; the ambassador being the real assassin is classic Grant. The bickering Clutch/Scarlett team is, too, and honestly I'd always wished we got to see more of these two working together; Clutch was probably my favorite of the first wave of Joes, and I always thought this was a really fun story.

Grant also wrote two columns for the website Comic Book Resources about the comics industry, called "Master of the Obvious" and "Permanent Damage." He also also wrote, believe it or not, several of the Hardy Boys books, and his story 2 Guns was made into a motion picture with Denzel Washington and Mark Wahlberg which I never saw.

So that's Steven Grant. You know the Punisher? Yeah you do. And it's because of Steven Grant. So there's that.

Choco1980
Feb 22, 2013

I fell in love with a Video Nasty


I like the classy way the credits are integrated into the splashpage art. It's always fun when that sort of thing is pulled off

Mr. Maltose
Feb 16, 2011

The Guffless Girlverine


DivineCoffeeBinge posted:

Marvel even had technical artist Eliot Brown draw up photorealistic depictions of the weapons that Frank Castle used and write up accompanying text blurbs and sold them as the aforementioned Punisher Armory specials - no story, no plot, just "here are guns the Punisher uses and some of the things he thinks about them." They made like a dozen of these things! And people bought the poo poo out of them! The '80s, man...

In defense of the Armory Specials, #2 still has one of the best single pages in the history of the character.

Yvonmukluk
Oct 10, 2012

Everything is Sinister



Mr. Maltose posted:

In defense of the Armory Specials, #2 still has one of the best single pages in the history of the character.

Is that the one with his son's cap-gun?

Mr. Maltose
Feb 16, 2011

The Guffless Girlverine


Yup. Every issue had a stinger on the last page, I think the first issue had Frank reminiscing about trying to convince his wife to get a gun herself and how it would have done absolutely nothing to keep her alive in the end.

robziel
May 31, 2011

>10 THRUST "ROBO_COX"
>20 GOTO 10

Haskell's gun always amused me because as a child all I could see was Megatron and I half expected it to transform and start ranting about the Autobots.

I also liked that Cobra Commander is only in the issue twice, I enjoyed the idea that Cobra was so big and was active in so many places that the Joes could be going all out to foil a plan that the Commander only tangentially cares about because it amused him.


Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013







What the poo poo are "brashers"? Those aren't a thing as far as I could find.

(and yes I know "rashers" are a thing, but that's just bacon. And even for an American, French Fries and bacon are a weird, weird thing to have for lunch)

Siivola
Dec 23, 2012



Nipponophile posted:

*real involved with ninjas, car crashes, two-fisted military action, ninjas, shocking betrayals, blatant merchandising, ninjas, 80s jingoism, and also ninjas
I owned scattered second-hand issues of this stuff but never read the whole thing. You're the best for doing this.

Psion
Dec 13, 2002

:colbert::colbert:




The guy's expression on the last panel as he gets hauled away. Still fantastic.

Alacron
Feb 15, 2007

-->Have tearful reunion with your son
-->Eh

Fun Shoe

Psion posted:

The guy's expression on the last panel as he gets hauled away. Still fantastic.

It really is :allears:

CzarChasm
Mar 14, 2009

Blah Blah Blah
Look at me
I'm the Goddamn Batman
Blah Blah Blah


Where are you getting these scans from? I didn't see it mentioned in the OP. Are these collected anywhere?

Nipponophile
Apr 8, 2009


CzarChasm posted:

Where are you getting these scans from? I didn't see it mentioned in the OP. Are these collected anywhere?

That's an excellent question and something I should and will add to the OP!

My panels are taken from the IDW re-release of the original Marvel run. The distinguishing feature is that the colors have been completely redone, sometimes to comic effect. I'm pretty sure I remark upon a few times where Stalker is given a white flesh tone.

Regardless, you (and everyone else) can find these collections right here at comixology.

Comixology has long been the go-to source for legit digital comics, and since their purchase by Amazon, there's all kinds of positive interaction going on there.

Anyhow, while I do recommend that everyone buy comics and support the creators, I do also ask that you don't just read ahead to post spoilers and "I know something" posts. No one likes that guy. Don't be that guy.

Nipponophile
Apr 8, 2009


Won't you journey with me now to a little town called Springfield? Let's read Issue #10!



We open in media res as the G.I. Joe team begins an insertion on a suspected Cobra safehouse.





The secondary assault team makes their way through the sewers below.





Snake Eyes and Scarlett try to anchor a rope on the roof fixtures, but it gets cut from above by a Cobra trooper. The rooftop team is knocked cold from their fall into a featureless cell and quickly relieved of their weapons.

When Scarlett misses the scheduled radio check, Hawk realizes they've lost the element of surprise and orders a full-on assault.



Inside the cell, Zap notices an unusual curve to the walls. As he ponders out loud what it might mean, the answer is quickly made apparent.



With no air support, the remaining Joes can only watch as the craft flies into the distance.



:lsd:

A couple of guards outside the cell mention that security detail is so much easier since Dr. Venom started dosing the prisoners' water supply with hallucinogens. People don't even try to escape anymore.



Pfft, what a ludicrous concept! Can you believe they expect us to believe this crazy sci-fi bullsh- Oh. Oh, wait a minute...

Meanwhile, Scarlett and Zap are trippin' balls...



Their kid cellmate seems to have an idea about the water. He holds the container up to the lightbulb hoping that heat will destroy the effectiveness of the drugs.

Back in Dr. Venom's lab, the second phase of the process begins, and Venom attempts to "read" Snake Eyes thoughts. Snake Eyes struggles to scatter his thoughts to avoid giving away the HQ location.



At the prison, Scarlett and Zap start to come out of their fugue. The kid explains that he'd read about drugs losing their potency when exposed to heat in Scientific American or something like that. He claims that he's got a plan to escape, but he'd been waiting on someone else who could help. The Joes agree to go along with his plan, since it seems like their only choice.



As Snake Eyes continues to resist, the prisoners begin their ploy.





Dr. Venom begins to receive glimpses of the Joes' motor pool... their firing range... but nothing to provide a location. Snake Eyes continues to bring up disturbing memories to block the probe, but each one must be stronger and more painful than before to be effective.

Aboveground, we get our first look at the true evil of Cobra.



The boy directs them to an arcade which hides Dr. Venom's labs. The only way in is to brazen it out and walk right through.



Suddenly, some of the arcade-goers speak up. They've never seen these two adults in town, and one of them recognizes the kid as a traitor! The laser turret in the middle of the arcade omninously swings to cover them.

Dr. Venom is approaching his goal, but Snake Eyes' vital signs are becoming irregular. His heartbeat is slowing drastically. Before Venom can take action, he must first respond to the intruder alert sounded in the arcade above.



Pictured above, the first, but not nearly the last appearance of Ninja BullshitTM.



Seeing that the junior officers seem to have things in hand, Venom returns to his lab to find Snake Eyes with no pulse. He begins to pull the body from the brain-wave scanner and ready it for his next prisoner when suddenly...



Snake Eyes bursts upstairs and quickly shoots out the fuse box, depriving the laser of power. They run to the car ahead of the pursuing Cobra kids.



Arriving at the airfield, they spot the strange craft that brought them there. The aircrew is overpowered, and preparations are made to leave. The kid refuses to go with the Joes, stating he has family working in the resistance here and he must get back to them. The Joes coerce a Cobra pilot at gunpoint to take them up, but unfortunately they missed the backup piece he had in his... helmet?



With the radio and navigational panels shot up and a storm blocking out all visual guidance, all Zap can do is keep the ship level and heading away from Springfield. Hours pass and finally the storm breaks, offering a view of a large port city below. Not trusting their ability to land the strange aircraft, the Joes point the craft out to sea and hit the silk.



Those Marvel guys sure are swell, aren't they?

DivineCoffeeBinge
Mar 3, 2011

Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company


Incidentally, the factoid that there is a Springfield in every state is incorrect. There are actually only 34 states with a town or city named Springfield (most named after Springfield, Massachusetts, which was an important manufacturing center once upon a time and is now kind of a shithole). All but 4 states have a town or city named Riverside, though!

Also, the fact that Cobra is actually Evil Amway is just the best drat thing.

Mulva
Sep 13, 2011
It's about time for my once per decade ban for being a consistently terrible poster.

Hey man, American murder was born in Springfield! That's an important legacy.

e: Also the conflict between the rebellion and government troops at the armory was the birth of a strong federal government and it's first act of major hypocrisy. So like, I said, the birth of American murder.

Mulva fucked around with this message at 06:50 on Nov 10, 2017

Bongo Bill
Jan 17, 2012




Seems redundant.

Alacron
Feb 15, 2007

-->Have tearful reunion with your son
-->Eh

Fun Shoe


STELLAAAAAAAAA!!!

Dareon
Apr 6, 2009



Much like Cyclops, Snake-Eyes' gun does not technically shoot lasers.

DigitalRaven
Oct 9, 2012

When I kill you with a motor-car, you should have the common decency to stay dead, you horrid little object




Based on the previous threads, I picked up all the collections on Comixology.

This issue's Ninja Bullshit™? That's nothing. Buckle up kiddos. Where we're going, it gets so deep you're going to need a snorkel.

Pastry of the Year
Apr 12, 2013




There was an extremely minor Marvel-616 character, Volcana, whose real name was Marsha Rosenberg. The namedrop in that panel is so egregious that I have to wonder if there was a real person by that name that was a friend of the 80s Bullpen.

robziel
May 31, 2011

>10 THRUST "ROBO_COX"
>20 GOTO 10

I remember not liking issue #10 as a kid but I honestly don't know why. Looking back on it, it sets up a lot of stories that are coming soon and is a solid issue.

CzarChasm posted:

Where are you getting these scans from? I didn't see it mentioned in the OP. Are these collected anywhere?

I own the entire run and am a little jealous of the coloring in the digital versions everyone else has.

Proteus Jones
Feb 28, 2013





Dareon posted:

Much like Cyclops, Snake-Eyes' gun does not technically shoot lasers.

Apparently it shoots punches. I'm imagining little boxing gloves fired at a high velocity.

Hispanic! At The Disco
Dec 25, 2011




Spirit had a gun that fired arrows, so a punch gun is hardly out of the question.

Ghostlight
Sep 25, 2009

maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me





DigitalRaven posted:

Based on the previous threads, I picked up all the collections on Comixology.

This issue's Ninja Bullshit™? That's nothing. Buckle up kiddos. Where we're going, it gets so deep you're going to need a snorkel.

Nipponophile posted:

I do also ask that you don't just read ahead to post spoilers and "I know something" posts. No one likes that guy. Don't be that guy.

DivineCoffeeBinge
Mar 3, 2011

Spider-Man's Amazing Construction Company



Honestly I don't think I would consider "Hey guys there is SO MUCH NINJA BULLSHIT coming" a spoiler, given that the OP has said as much.

Because there is SO MUCH NINJA BULLSHIT coming. It's glorious.

Ghostlight
Sep 25, 2009

maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me





Not a spoiler, but definitely an "I know something" post.

Bongo Bill
Jan 17, 2012



I'm excited for ninja bullshit.

Nipponophile
Apr 8, 2009


Bongo Bill posted:

I'm excited for ninja bullshit.

Same

Dareon
Apr 6, 2009


Ninja bullshit is my second favorite bullshit, right after mad science bullshit.

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Pastry of the Year
Apr 12, 2013



The cartoon was better than it had any right to be, and got away with some stuff:

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