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can't you just c&p ypur cover letter basically, it's what I would do that said, even if I don't have as much experience as some here the "lovely interview process=lovely employer" equation does seem to hold true for me
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Aug 6, 2020 00:50
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The Fool posted:please tell me you included the sucker line in your actual response nah i'm a coward and don't burn bridges. even though this time it was INCREDIBLY tempting my actual response was just: I understand. Good luck
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Aug 6, 2020 00:54
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PIZZA.BAT posted:nah i'm a coward and don't burn bridges. even though this time it was INCREDIBLY tempting Honestly you gave it exactly the amount of effort it deserved
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Aug 6, 2020 01:04
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is there a downside to naming and shaming here that i'm not seeing
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Aug 6, 2020 01:05
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raminasi posted:is there a downside to naming and shaming here that i'm not seeing https://www.glassdoor.com/Interview/Veeva-Systems-Interview-Questions-E459351.htm?sort.sortType=RD&sort.ascending=false
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Aug 6, 2020 02:21
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Yikes! It sucks that companies are starting to wise up to Glassdoor and turfing the reviews. There's been a noticeable uptick in positive reviews at my org with superficial complaints.
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Aug 6, 2020 04:31
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what sociopathic hiring person writes an email like that to a candidate i wonder if it's the same letter sent in the identical step of the process to everyone who applies and the hiring team sits around huffing their own farts laughing at the people who reply in the affirmative
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Aug 6, 2020 05:43
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just realized i should have replied with this and nothing else ah well
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Aug 6, 2020 06:48
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just read the last couple pages saga, that is incredible
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Aug 6, 2020 06:59
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PIZZA.BAT posted:just realized i should have replied with this and nothing else i was thinking email them a heartfelt story that segues into the fresh prince of bel air intro
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Aug 6, 2020 10:44
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could have negged em harder and been all pick up artist on them or something “I don’t commit and put out on the first night. I’m not a slut. Sad to see your company is.”
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Aug 6, 2020 12:04
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send brazil.txt as your compelling story
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Aug 6, 2020 12:16
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jesus WEP posted:send brazil.txt as your compelling story Did you know? brazil.txt is actually an .rtf!
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Aug 6, 2020 14:36
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Don’t fall for the trap of consulting at Apple imo Other companies will have their contingent staff sign an NDA and then tell them about the project. Apple does not do this. They do not tell the contingents anything except what is deemed strictly necessary to work. There is no visibility as to where the technical tasks come from, what they are for, or whether they are ever integrated. They fall out of the ticket system predigested and with not much to do except investigate and type. After I did contingency at microsoft, I was able to point out the feature of Office that I had worked on. With Apple I did not and never would have any idea. Consulting apologists will say that it gets you exposure to different tech skills. However it is not the kind of experience that impresses anyone in interviews. Nobody is impressed that a candidate investigated and typed behind a wall of secrecy. The Apple team lead assured me that this was not just my experience but is how Apple generally handles contingency. Interviewers also should understand that when a candidate’s experience includes technical “body shops,” they were not in the situation of a direct employee who planned out the project. The job was probably some variation of “investigate and type.” This does not necessarily indicate limitations on the candidate’s part. In case you didn't know, people do things for a paycheck. That has lessons beyond contingency btw: the recruiting ideology of the bay skews toward finding “superheroes” who were the boss of every project they worked on and called every shot. Contingents are farthest from this ideal, but it’s a poor match for the reality of most direct employees too. So ask candidates about a “challenging project” if that’s your thing but also get some idea of the organizational structure in which they faced that challenge. Gazpacho fucked around with this message at 15:00 on Aug 6, 2020 |
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Aug 6, 2020 14:51
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Just reading the most recent page of that, I have no idea why anyone would actually apply. The reviews are another bad sign for the number of astro-turfed reviews. Man cult indeed.
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Aug 6, 2020 14:55
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taking final exams and graduating this month. boss said months ago that when that happens i dont have to leave good company to do what i really want. been bringing up the desire to transition to more engineering responsibilities ever since. nothing has really changed at all. my work experience is more cloud infrastructure related, but my education is more customer facing app garbage development. Willing to do either for real now. not sure how to stress the point to make them hold up their end of the bargain without blacklisting myself somehow. company is really good and well off and times are uncertain. school has not prepared me at all for the interviewing process so id have to spend months cramming algo problems probably to make good on any place willing to interview a new grad rn. also this has been a long road to get the degree, working full time etc etc so i am not sure i have a job hunt in me rn. real answer is to bail out but ive only been hearing from poor opportunities that cannot compare with my current position which is discouraging.
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Aug 6, 2020 15:43
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Bored Online posted:their end of the bargain Unless you have something in writing, they haven't made a bargain. Your boss might have the best of intentions, but unless they take some action to back up what they say, it's just talk, and talk is cheap.
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Aug 6, 2020 15:48
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PIZZA.BAT posted:https://www.glassdoor.com/Interview/Veeva-Systems-Interview-Questions-E459351.htm?sort.sortType=RD&sort.ascending=false there is no excuse for a 4-6 month interview process barring us federal government jobs requiring a high security clearance where they interview everyone you've ever known since kindergarten, and even those don't usually take that long
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Aug 6, 2020 15:50
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Bored Online posted:also this has been a long road to get the degree, working full time etc etc so i am not sure i have a job hunt in me rn. if you don’t have bandwidth to do a full job hunt now, at least start doing hacker rank problems. practice doing them on a whiteboard at first too. if you start getting good at the bullshit now you’ll have a much easier time if/when you do go into full hunt mode. also when you apply, just spam applications. apply everywhere, including places that don’t seem really interesting, because it’s all interview practice and you might be surprised. also (assuming you’re in the US), a job that you hate that lets you eat and have health insurance while you look for a better one is a million times better than no job while you look.
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Aug 6, 2020 15:58
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Arcsech posted:also (assuming you’re in the US), a job that you hate that lets you eat and have health insurance while you look for a better one is a million times better than no job while you look.
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Aug 6, 2020 16:12
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FMguru posted:being unemployed sends the strong signal to many potential employers that you are damaged goods in some way 
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Aug 6, 2020 16:19
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oh yeah, I did Veeva a few months ago. the impression I had is that they hire coders almost exclusively straight out of college and wanted me to coordinate them and teach them best practices (like powerpoint?) it wasn't the worst interview I've had in any sense but after spending a day on site I never heard from them again. I didn't reach out to them either because I didn't want a hands-off job.
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Aug 6, 2020 16:42
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Gazpacho posted:oh yeah, I did Veeva a few months ago. the impression I had is that they hire coders almost exclusively straight out of college and wanted me to coordinate them and teach them best practices (like powerpoint?) That was literally the job description they gave me as well. They wanted to mentor & herd junior devs
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Aug 6, 2020 17:26
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in other news a local customer down the street from me that tori works for just reached out to me and that call was like peanut butter and chocolate. i have everything their director is looking for in spades and they'll be giving me domain over a project that's everything i want in a job. also since i know the market i was able to anchor high enough to the point that hr initially rejected my resume and the director had to override them to get me in the door 
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Aug 6, 2020 17:29
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what i said above about apple, btw, that was not my first time going through their contingent hiring process. the first time i went on site and spoke to two people who represented themselves as a dev manager and product manager. They did tell me a little about the goals of the project, and said that they had chosen a software stack, but they weren't sure what it was.  Generally the dev manager went blank any time I asked him what technology would be involved, or if I mentioned particular technologies he'd say "yeah, we got some of that"then I got into this loop with the recruiter/broker: "They want to make you an offer." "OK, that's great, but I'd like to know what framework they use." (I've loaded up my resume with bespoke or marginal tech that nobody cares about, gotta turn that around.) "I'll ask them." .... "They said they can use whatever you want." "They told me in the interview that they had already chosen a framework." "That's right." "So what is it?" "It's whatever you want." This proves typical of Apple staffing agencies (and Intuit btw), that they set up a very brief interview with someone who either doesn't know or can't answer the kind of questions a dev would normally have about a position, and then they make an offer almost for showing up with a pulse, which is then your duty to accept (so the agent can get their commission) or pound sand. Gazpacho fucked around with this message at 17:33 on Aug 6, 2020 |
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Aug 6, 2020 17:30
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i genuinely don't understand how it's even possible to work on code while having no idea what it does. like do they tell you: 'we need an object that does x,y,z in this language' and then refactor whatever you give them? how is that better or cheaper than having internal guys just write it?
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Aug 6, 2020 17:53
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PIZZA.BAT posted:i genuinely don't understand how it's even possible to work on code while having no idea what it does. like do they tell you: 'we need an object that does x,y,z in this language' and then refactor whatever you give them? how is that better or cheaper than having internal guys just write it? this is just the present-day extension of charles simonyi's idea of the "metacoder" who codes with people rather than a keyboard e: or for that matter thomas edison's workshop where he'd scribble "try such-and-such" on a slip of paper and hand it off to a chemist the client company gets the benefit of a deniable employment relationship that they can terminate at any time without termination expense Gazpacho fucked around with this message at 18:21 on Aug 6, 2020 |
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Aug 6, 2020 18:13
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PIZZA.BAT posted:i genuinely don't understand how it's even possible to work on code while having no idea what it does. like do they tell you: 'we need an object that does x,y,z in this language' and then refactor whatever you give them? how is that better or cheaper than having internal guys just write it? Yeah, this seems like some "Programming in FedLand from Snow Crash" poo poo?
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Aug 6, 2020 18:14
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I had a friend who worked for lockheed straight out of college, he knew what project he was working on but had no idea what his actual code did, he just got "this needs to do x and y in time z"
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Aug 6, 2020 19:13
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Bored Online posted:taking final exams and graduating this month. boss said months ago that when that happens i dont have to leave good company to do what i really want. been bringing up the desire to transition to more engineering responsibilities ever since. nothing has really changed at all. my work experience is more cloud infrastructure related, but my education is more customer facing app garbage development. Willing to do either for real now. not sure how to stress the point to make them hold up their end of the bargain without blacklisting myself somehow. just be glad you had a job lined up as the floor dropped out. 2008 hosed up a ton of people's career prospects as they graduated and this is looking to be way worse. management knows that the labor market is and will be on firesale for the foreseeable future and will absolutely take full advantage of it
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Aug 6, 2020 19:18
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after getting my rear end kicked 2001-2003 I lucked out in 2008 and 2020, currently sole resource in my role on an insanely profitable uncancelable product with 2-5 year licensing cycles
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Aug 6, 2020 19:22
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i've verbally accepted an offer from the nonprofit I posted about earlier. their contract contains a bunch of stuff about binding arbitration that i dont pretend to fully understand but i do find it annoying and i know it basically eliminates my ability to ever take them to court (not that i'm a litigious person, but still). is it worth it to complain about this? or do i just sign the thing and accept it?
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Aug 6, 2020 22:52
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man this has been a great week for terrible recruiters e: i told her i'd need to think about my hourly rate as a contractor as i'm currently salary and that was her response PIZZA.BAT fucked around with this message at 00:50 on Aug 7, 2020 |
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Aug 6, 2020 23:48
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I got another one of those chatbot "ai" recruiter things, I'm trying to figure out of there's a way to find the company and contact them directly to tell them I'm literally never going to engage with that garbage
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Aug 6, 2020 23:55
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PIZZA.BAT posted:man this has been a great week for terrible recruiters lmao I wonder how many people she’s gotten to screw themselves over with that advice. hopefully not many
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Aug 7, 2020 03:00
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PIZZA.BAT posted:man this has been a great week for terrible recruiters Hahahah holy poo poo I guess things like "insurance" and "healthcare" and "supplies" and "equipment" don't enter the equation She left out the part where you double it after the division
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Aug 7, 2020 03:02
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I also love the assumption that you work 52 weeks a year with zero pto, sick leave or holidays
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Aug 7, 2020 03:04
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Devonaut posted:I also love the assumption that you work 52 weeks a year with zero pto, sick leave or holidays those should be paid as if you were working
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Aug 7, 2020 03:23
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Arcsech posted:lmao I wonder how many people she’s gotten to screw themselves over with that advice. hopefully not many you also pay more in taxes. so even if you ignore all of that you still come out behind
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Aug 7, 2020 04:01
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MononcQc posted:those should be paid as if you were working yes. we call that 'salaried'
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Aug 7, 2020 04:01
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