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PsychedelicWarlord
Sep 8, 2016




Really excited to see the discussion of this song/poem. I still get chills every time I think of the line "and the moment of consummate disaster when the puppets turn to face the puppetmaster"

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uber_stoat
Jan 21, 2001





Pillbug

for those of you who haven't heard it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lxZpEFJhO6k

two utterly unique weirdo artistic geniuses got together and made this mind melter for you. listen to it.

No. 1 Juicy Boi
Jun 1, 2003

#1 JUICY BOY



Buglord

Hell yeah gonna listen to it again tomorrow and have two ruined pessimistic days in a row

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010







Gun Saliva

hallelujah posted:

i am of polish descent. because there is no polish-australian literature, my parents got me polish-american literature instead. usually this had a high population of italian characters as well, because the poles and the italians have historically got on like a house on fire except when they find themselves on opposite sides of a world war, and they usually gravitated to the same kinds of industrial immigrant communities (like detroit!) and were victims of a similar sort of racism back in the day, being white but not anglo. so i always thought of poles and italians as the yin and yang of working-class immigrant americana

anyway, as i grew up i ended up with lots of polish friends and lots of italian friends, most of whom have also noticed the weird kinship of our races. a few years ago, my friend (italian) and i were discussing how italians and poles live in the same places, get on well with each other, have cultures that coexist peacefully, have similar religious practices, and generally share the same philosophies on life... but you never, ever hear about them getting married. why? we didn't know. we speculated that there is some unwritten law that if the poles and italians should ever pick the forbidden fruit and join together in holy matrimony, a weird chemical reaction of the spirit would occur and the offspring would be forever cursed

so you can imagine my joy when i finally discovered a family that broke the law, and the cursed progeny was lugubrious tom

At first I was like "eh makes sense but kinda weird wtf poles and italians get married"

Then you mentioned the curse and everything started coming together that adds up a little, lol

I still think it's about retrogenisis though because I think he's talking about disestablishing the illusion that there are any things like people and returning to the unmade pool of pantheisms or w/e. The plan for which there are no words is the actual method of doing this.

It's a plan that can be accomplished because unlike the other plans it's self contained and you change your self which is the only thing you have access to

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010







Gun Saliva

TOOT BOOT posted:

It's kinda thrilling to see people discuss it, I Have A Special Plan is extremely my jam and has been for like 20 years and I've never seen anyone discuss it online.

Try talking to anyone about it irl, it'll instantly become like one of the vignettes


PsychedelicWarlord posted:

Really excited to see the discussion of this song/poem. I still get chills every time I think of the line "and the moment of consummate disaster when the puppets turn to face the puppetmaster"

this world is a mistake

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010







Gun Saliva

also here are some evangelions (I presume, def get a born again vibe) trying to understand Ligotti's special plan. I thought it was half interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxdz3Y5FQDM

obviously you have to be prepared for the Got Religion brainwave situation, but i'm sort of curious about the dude and I feel like he also is getting the retrogenisis vibe. I thought about posting some comments or something but eh . Apparently this came out something like 8 months ago and already I thought it's been more than two years.

ps I wanna say imo phrases like "Our God is x" are huge red flags and anyone coming from an Abrahamic religion situation talking like that has an insanely weakly set up philosophy. It is the kind of phrasing that doesn't preclude other gods and I feel like they have a super fuckin weird credulity in the power of satan as an independent entity and this is not like what I ever learned and I was raised fairly catholic.

Bilirubin
Feb 16, 2014

The sanctioned action is to CHUG!!!




Bleak Gremlin

Heard a phrase recently that stuck with me, along the lines of American evangelical Christianity is the best argument against letting theological decisions be made by the laity

Skyscraper
Oct 1, 2004

Hurry Up, We're Dreaming






you really got my hopes up here for the evangelion / ligotti crossover

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010







Gun Saliva

Bilirubin posted:

Heard a phrase recently that stuck with me, along the lines of American evangelical Christianity is the best argument against letting theological decisions be made by the laity

that poo poo is a death cult and has very little to do with any coherent interpretation of the bible I think. Without question some of the worst people I've ever known have been that kind of capital C Christian. I know plenty of vile people but I don't gently caress with those types tbh. If someone comes out with the planet is 6000 years old they're more often than not liable to have a really hosed up sense of morality.


Skyscraper posted:

you really got my hopes up here for the evangelion / ligotti crossover

Basically the plan is to dive into the a.t. fluid pool imo.

MockingQuantum
Jan 20, 2012





Tangentially related to the discussion (very tangentially), I have a couple of recommendation requests:

First, I'm looking for some poetry that's horror-adjacent. I'm not thinking stuff like Lovecraft's space mushrooms or Poe's scary birds, but more poetry that captures a sense of the macabre, dread, or darker side of human existence. Someone on SA (chernobyl, possibly?) recommended The Virginia State Colony for Epileptics and Feebleminded and I'm basically looking for more like that.

Second, I may have asked this in one of the previous horror threads, but if so I can't find it: What are some horror (or horror adjacent) novels with strong gnostic influence or that have a similar sort of cosmology to them? Besides obvious stuff like Blood Meridian.

Bilirubin
Feb 16, 2014

The sanctioned action is to CHUG!!!




Bleak Gremlin

SniperWoreConverse posted:

that poo poo is a death cult and has very little to do with any coherent interpretation of the bible I think. Without question some of the worst people I've ever known have been that kind of capital C Christian.

Oh yeah, I grew up in that world. Its deeply hosed up filled with completely morally rudderless people.

Bilirubin
Feb 16, 2014

The sanctioned action is to CHUG!!!




Bleak Gremlin

MockingQuantum posted:

Second, I may have asked this in one of the previous horror threads, but if so I can't find it: What are some horror (or horror adjacent) novels with strong gnostic influence or that have a similar sort of cosmology to them? Besides obvious stuff like Blood Meridian.

Arthur Machen's White People would suit. He was a Golden Dawn type turn of the last century, and his work is heavily influenced by a hermetic/gnostic world view, colored by Welsh folklore. Some really good stuff.

anilEhilated
Feb 17, 2014

But I say fuck the rain.



Grimey Drawer

Bilirubin posted:

Arthur Machen's White People would suit. He was a Golden Dawn type turn of the last century, and his work is heavily influenced by a hermetic/gnostic world view, colored by Welsh folklore. Some really good stuff.
From the same source: The Great God Pan. I think most people here have already read that, though.

SniperWoreConverse
Mar 20, 2010







Gun Saliva

Bilirubin posted:

Arthur Machen's White People would suit. He was a Golden Dawn type turn of the last century, and his work is heavily influenced by a hermetic/gnostic world view, colored by Welsh folklore. Some really good stuff.

Oh poo poo is this the one where the one guy argues that morality is basically multimodal? Like there is both good and bad and on a different axis there is righteous and evil? Righteous things can be bad etc? If it's the one i'm thinking of it fits with the horror adjacency thing but I think is not ultra intense. Worth reading once or twice.

Or wait I think there's a similarly named one about a guy who falls in love with a inbred woman from wales or some rural anglo zone, and it doesn't go well, but it's not really gnostic. Actually I can't remember the name of that one at all.

Bilirubin
Feb 16, 2014

The sanctioned action is to CHUG!!!




Bleak Gremlin

I haven't yet, embarrassed to admit

chernobyl kinsman
Mar 18, 2007

a friend of the friendly atom



Soiled Meat

SniperWoreConverse posted:

they have a super fuckin weird credulity in the power of satan as an independent entity and this is not like what I ever learned and I was raised fairly catholic.

yeah evangelicals, and in fact a lot of prots, are basically manichaeans. their ideas about satan are wildly at odds with catholicism's


Bilirubin posted:

Heard a phrase recently that stuck with me, along the lines of American evangelical Christianity is the best argument against letting theological decisions be made by the laity

this but unironically

MockingQuantum posted:

Second, I may have asked this in one of the previous horror threads, but if so I can't find it: What are some horror (or horror adjacent) novels with strong gnostic influence or that have a similar sort of cosmology to them? Besides obvious stuff like Blood Meridian.

everyone except me seems to like brian hodge's stuff

chernobyl kinsman fucked around with this message at 17:41 on Mar 5, 2020

Bilirubin
Feb 16, 2014

The sanctioned action is to CHUG!!!




Bleak Gremlin

chernobyl kinsman posted:

yeah evangelicals, and in fact a lot of prots, are basically manichaeans. their ideas about satan are wildly at odds with catholicism's

I caught a buddy of mine, who is a ~master ~ and conservative high Anglican, espousing the Manichean heresy, which did not go over well with him but the rest of that end of the bar had a good laugh.

Bilirubin
Feb 16, 2014

The sanctioned action is to CHUG!!!




Bleak Gremlin

SniperWoreConverse posted:

Oh poo poo is this the one where the one guy argues that morality is basically multimodal? Like there is both good and bad and on a different axis there is righteous and evil? Righteous things can be bad etc? If it's the one i'm thinking of it fits with the horror adjacency thing but I think is not ultra intense. Worth reading once or twice.

Or wait I think there's a similarly named one about a guy who falls in love with a inbred woman from wales or some rural anglo zone, and it doesn't go well, but it's not really gnostic. Actually I can't remember the name of that one at all.

vOv
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_White_People

Black Griffon
Mar 12, 2005


Can you add "Ligotti" to the black in like rgb (1, 1, 1) or something so that it only shows up when you tilt your phone just so or when the death of a pixel does something strange to your monitor?

Also for my doom gangtang I think we just whined at the games mod and then they did it.

SniperWoreConverse posted:

It sort of reminds me of uh, what's that one where aliens appear and a linguist figures out their language and it breaks her sense of time and causality? I get the same kind of feeling from special plan were there's some kind of extremely weird woldview that cracks... idk some kind of logical relationship that people take for granted.

Arrival.

Skyscraper
Oct 1, 2004

Hurry Up, We're Dreaming





Black Griffon posted:

Can you add "Ligotti" to the black in like rgb (1, 1, 1) or something so that it only shows up when you tilt your phone just so or when the death of a pixel does something strange to your monitor?

Also for my doom gangtang I think we just whined at the games mod and then they did it.


Arrival.

no but that sounds awesome and if you did that I'd get it

Black Griffon
Mar 12, 2005


010101


030303


The second one is easier to see but more, uh, accessible? The first one is possible to see, barely. It's nigh impossible to see any of them against the white forum background, but if you open them in a new tab it's easier.

Edit: Also should they be narrower, maybe? I feel like a lot of gangtangs are a little more narrow.

anilEhilated
Feb 17, 2014

But I say fuck the rain.



Grimey Drawer

I'd go with the more visible one but that's just me.

anilEhilated fucked around with this message at 21:29 on Mar 5, 2020

uber_stoat
Jan 21, 2001





Pillbug

SniperWoreConverse posted:

also here are some evangelions (I presume, def get a born again vibe) trying to understand Ligotti's special plan. I thought it was half interesting.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oxdz3Y5FQDM

obviously you have to be prepared for the Got Religion brainwave situation, but i'm sort of curious about the dude and I feel like he also is getting the retrogenisis vibe. I thought about posting some comments or something but eh . Apparently this came out something like 8 months ago and already I thought it's been more than two years.

ps I wanna say imo phrases like "Our God is x" are huge red flags and anyone coming from an Abrahamic religion situation talking like that has an insanely weakly set up philosophy. It is the kind of phrasing that doesn't preclude other gods and I feel like they have a super fuckin weird credulity in the power of satan as an independent entity and this is not like what I ever learned and I was raised fairly catholic.

"Then in a great new darkness
You will finally execute your special plan"
*recording ends*
...
"this guy is an active shooter!"

Skyscraper
Oct 1, 2004

Hurry Up, We're Dreaming





Black Griffon posted:

030303


The second one is easier to see but more, uh, accessible? The first one is possible to see, barely. It's nigh impossible to see any of them against the white forum background, but if you open them in a new tab it's easier.

Edit: Also should they be narrower, maybe? I feel like a lot of gangtangs are a little more narrow.

wow that's solid

I think a lot of gangtags are narrower, but a lot are wider also at 180 pixels, I went 20 pixels short of that

No. 1 Juicy Boi
Jun 1, 2003

#1 JUICY BOY



Buglord

It's beautiful, I can't wait for payday tomorrow, I just need to think up a good new av

ravenkult
Feb 3, 2011




gonna need one of those tags

Black Griffon
Mar 12, 2005


Gonna see if I can beg some favors before any of you go on spending money. We could be lucky.

Skyscraper
Oct 1, 2004

Hurry Up, We're Dreaming





I PMed Hieronymous Alloy about the first one, he hasn't got back to me yet. Is someone friends with the mods, and could they make that new thing into a gangtag? Or tell us how to make it one? I think you have to have plat?

edit:

Black Griffon posted:

Gonna see if I can beg some favors before any of you go on spending money. We could be lucky.

oh thanks!

Black Griffon
Mar 12, 2005


So PMing Hieronymous is a legit way to get it handled according to my buddy, but if they're slow on the response or won't play ball, my sources tell me entering a week of Thunderdome is a free ticket to a gang tang, even in perpetuity (if someone gives you new av, for example, you can get the tag amended, if you lose and get one of our famous losertars, the tag stays).

So yeah, wait for a reply from HA, or join our rotten ranks. Quid pro quo, mon amis.

Skyscraper
Oct 1, 2004

Hurry Up, We're Dreaming





Black Griffon posted:

So PMing Hieronymous is a legit way to get it handled according to my buddy, but if they're slow on the response or won't play ball, my sources tell me entering a week of Thunderdome is a free ticket to a gang tang, even in perpetuity (if someone gives you new av, for example, you can get the tag amended, if you lose and get one of our famous losertars, the tag stays).

So yeah, wait for a reply from HA, or join our rotten ranks. Quid pro quo, mon amis.

I'm not a writer, so won't be thundering anyone's dome. And if Hieronymous doesn't want to do it hopefully he'll at least give some instructions.

No. 1 Juicy Boi
Jun 1, 2003

#1 JUICY BOY



Buglord

The instructions are easy, just buy a new avatar and link it in the text. But it needs to be hosted on SA first

Apsyrtes
May 16, 2004



OP, in the past few pages you have asked for recommendations for:

* must-read early horror or gothic literature that maybe flies a bit under the modern radar
* 18th-19th century stuff
* poetry that's horror-adjacent
* poetry that captures a sense of the macabre, dread, or darker side of human existence
* horror (or horror adjacent) novels with strong gnostic influence


Les Chants de Maldoror by Comte de Lautreamont checks all those. You need to read that. I recommend the Alex Lykiard translation, it's a very nice book.

The fact that I was introduced to this work by way of Current 93 kinda ties it in nicely with the rest of the recent thread.

grobbo
May 29, 2014


Apsyrtes posted:

OP, in the past few pages you have asked for recommendations for:

* must-read early horror or gothic literature that maybe flies a bit under the modern radar
* 18th-19th century stuff
* poetry that's horror-adjacent
* poetry that captures a sense of the macabre, dread, or darker side of human existence
* horror (or horror adjacent) novels with strong gnostic influence


Les Chants de Maldoror by Comte de Lautreamont checks all those. You need to read that. I recommend the Alex Lykiard translation, it's a very nice book.

The fact that I was introduced to this work by way of Current 93 kinda ties it in nicely with the rest of the recent thread.

This is a great recommendation!

Given this thread's fondness for extremely strange people, the works of Hans Henny Jahn might be a good shout as well:

https://www.the-tls.co.uk/articles/hans-henny-jahnn/

No. 1 Juicy Boi
Jun 1, 2003

#1 JUICY BOY



Buglord

Aw man, you can't put images in avatar texts anymore :\

So much for doing the gang tag myself

Skyscraper
Oct 1, 2004

Hurry Up, We're Dreaming





COOL CORN posted:

Aw man, you can't put images in avatar texts anymore :\

So much for doing the gang tag myself

I think the image goes in the custom title?

I think the trick is getting it hosted

No. 1 Juicy Boi
Jun 1, 2003

#1 JUICY BOY



Buglord

Skyscraper posted:

I think the image goes in the custom title?

I think the trick is getting it hosted

It used to, but now it says "[img] and HTML are not allowed in custom titles"

I swear that's how I did it before.

Anyway, I just started Conspiracy... and, yeah, I'm definitely reading a Ligotti book:

quote:

For a brief while, let us mull over some items of interest regarding puppets.

Skyscraper
Oct 1, 2004

Hurry Up, We're Dreaming





COOL CORN posted:

It used to, but now it says "[img] and HTML are not allowed in custom titles"

I swear that's how I did it before.

Anyway, I just started Conspiracy... and, yeah, I'm definitely reading a Ligotti book:

OH, yes, I'm sorry, I didn't realize that was what you meant.

Also, yeah! Conspiracy is good.

MockingQuantum
Jan 20, 2012





I want to read a parody of Ligotti where it's just about a social malcontent dreaming inside a dream about a beautiful woman who turned out to be a puppet, but then he turned out to be a puppet too, and in fact the dream was a puppet

Honestly the strongest recommendation for Ligotti is that in spite of having a pool of imagery and themes that he goes back to pretty frequently, it's almost always pretty distinct and really loving good. There aren't a lot of horror authors who pull that off.

MockingQuantum
Jan 20, 2012





Apsyrtes posted:

OP, in the past few pages you have asked for recommendations for:

* must-read early horror or gothic literature that maybe flies a bit under the modern radar
* 18th-19th century stuff
* poetry that's horror-adjacent
* poetry that captures a sense of the macabre, dread, or darker side of human existence
* horror (or horror adjacent) novels with strong gnostic influence


Les Chants de Maldoror by Comte de Lautreamont checks all those. You need to read that. I recommend the Alex Lykiard translation, it's a very nice book.

The fact that I was introduced to this work by way of Current 93 kinda ties it in nicely with the rest of the recent thread.

Thank you for this! Maldoror is on my to-read list but I don't have any note about it which probably means someone mentioned it in passing somewhere online, I didn't know that it ticked all of those boxes, so to speak.

Also this is telling me I very badly need to check out Current 93

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Big Mad Drongo
Nov 10, 2006







Grimey Drawer

I would pay very good money for a Ligotti commentary track for any Muppet movie/Muppet Show episode.

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