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MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012


Nitrousoxide posted:

What LN did the Anime leave off at?

We should be at arc 5 now, Here is hoping season 3 comes this year or the next.

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LostRook
Jun 7, 2013


If you just want to read from where the anime ended start at volume 16.

I'd recommend starting in volume 4 though, which is the start of arc 3 which is where the anime started having to really make cuts. Two or three major plot lines were completely dropped from that arc, as well as a lot of smaller things.

And while this episode was completely positive, just like season one it's only because a lot of the plot hooks were dropped to make for a feel good finale.

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

I am trying to do better.


If there are to be OVAs and a Season 3 in the nearer future, we'll know by the 27th when the show has a panel event.

I rate this season a 9/10. I can't say anything else mods won't let me.

Annointed
Mar 2, 2013



Canít believe RE:Zero is allowing everyone to be happy. Like drat that final shot would have been a perfect ending for many an anime.

egg tats
Apr 3, 2010


I'd be shocked if Re:Zero didn't get picked up for a season 3. I've been flabbergasted all season that most (all???) episodes were a full 30 minutes long, usually without an OP or ED. that's 1) really expensive and 2)completely devoid of advertisements at all.

Unless crunchyroll was getting extended cuts and on TV they're getting shorter episodes, that's a lot of money not just left on the table, but shoveled backwards out of the window.

Basically, unless japan's desire for horny rem statues dried up over the last year, or the original author gets caught doing something real shameful, like murdering someone, or smoking 1(one) joint, I don't see them not making another season

marumaru
May 20, 2013





I didn't look it up, but I'm sure Re:Zero sells a ton of merch.

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone





LostRook posted:

The description from the LN specifically states that the woman in the coffin is in her mid twenties, and Emilia wonders if she is Echidna's older sister. Echidna in the dream world even states that she died at 19 years of age.

Never ask a lady her age.

Blaze Dragon
Aug 28, 2013
LOWTAX'S SPINE FUND



LostRook posted:

And while this episode was completely positive, just like season one it's only because a lot of the plot hooks were dropped to make for a feel good finale.

I hope that means we get a Director's Cut of this season before S3 just like before, S1's was really good to remind me of what had happened before after so many years.

Nate RFB
Jan 17, 2005



Clapping Larry

LostRook posted:

If you just want to read from where the anime ended start at volume 16.

I'd recommend starting in volume 4 though, which is the start of arc 3 which is where the anime started having to really make cuts. Two or three major plot lines were completely dropped from that arc, as well as a lot of smaller things.

And while this episode was completely positive, just like season one it's only because a lot of the plot hooks were dropped to make for a feel good finale.
I started reading the LNs near the start of season 2 and while I don't doubt that there were cuts once I caught up I couldn't tell you what any of them were, the LNs just seemed more detailed and a hell of a lot slower paced.

Nitrousoxide
May 30, 2011

do not buy a oneplus phone





LostRook posted:

If you just want to read from where the anime ended start at volume 16.

I'd recommend starting in volume 4 though, which is the start of arc 3 which is where the anime started having to really make cuts. Two or three major plot lines were completely dropped from that arc, as well as a lot of smaller things.

And while this episode was completely positive, just like season one it's only because a lot of the plot hooks were dropped to make for a feel good finale.

Looks like the anime caught up with, and even surpassed the english LN's then.

LostRook
Jun 7, 2013


Nitrousoxide posted:

Looks like the anime caught up with, and even surpassed the english LN's then.

I think they delayed the translation of the LNs to not step on the toes of the anime.

They did release the EX side story books as well, which I quite enjoyed.

LostRook fucked around with this message at 20:20 on Mar 25, 2021

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012


Annointed posted:

Canít believe RE:Zero is allowing everyone to be happy. Like drat that final shot would have been a perfect ending for many an anime.

Rem's still in a coma and no one remembers her but Subaru.

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

0.000% of Communism has been built. Evil child-murdering billionaires still rule the world with a shit-eating grin.

MonsterEnvy posted:

Rem's still in a coma and no one remembers her but Subaru.

If no one remembers you, did you ever really exist?

Subaru doesn't count because he's not a native of their world.

MonsterEnvy
Feb 4, 2012


Ytlaya posted:

If no one remembers you, did you ever really exist?

Subaru doesn't count because he's not a native of their world.

Her body is still there, Ram knows they are related cause they look near identical.

paragon1
Nov 22, 2010

FULL COMMUNISM NOW


MonsterEnvy posted:

Rem's still in a coma and no one remembers her but Subaru.

That means she doesn't have to see him getting close to another woman.

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005

"すやぁ~じゃなくて!"



That ending theme loving slapped. Holy poo poo.

And they didn't even credit it! ;_;

The Black Stones
May 7, 2007

I POSTED WHAT NOW!?


AlternateNu posted:

That ending theme loving slapped. Holy poo poo.

And they didn't even credit it! ;_;

The ending theme for the final episode was just the OP. Itís hard to remember that when the OP only got played like, twice?

AnoHito
May 8, 2014



MonsterEnvy posted:

Rem's still in a coma and no one remembers her but Subaru.

Eh, the better twin is still fine.

Ytlaya
Nov 13, 2005

0.000% of Communism has been built. Evil child-murdering billionaires still rule the world with a shit-eating grin.

AnoHito posted:

Eh, the better twin is still fine.

Finally, someone with correct opinions

Takoluka
Jun 26, 2009

Don't look at me!





They both enjoy declaring their love for pseudo-immortal dudes who are obsessed with someone else, so they're equally good/bad.

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005

"すやぁ~じゃなくて!"



The Black Stones posted:

The ending theme for the final episode was just the OP. Itís hard to remember that when the OP only got played like, twice?

marumaru
May 20, 2013





AnoHito posted:

Eh, the better twin is still fine.

yeah she's been sleeping all season so she'll be well and rested when the next one starts

Nullsmack
Dec 7, 2001
Digital apocalypse

Is there another one announced yet?

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005

"すやぁ~じゃなくて!"



https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wp7l9oolXS0

Played a grand total of 2 1/2 times over 12 episodes. Gotta love a team that's willing to animate an extra 11 minutes or so over the course of a season.

Tamba
Apr 5, 2010



It's a lot more than that, all episodes were around 29 minutes instead of the usual ~24

AlternateNu
May 5, 2005

"すやぁ~じゃなくて!"



Tamba posted:

It's a lot more than that, all episodes were around 29 minutes instead of the usual ~24

I can't wait for the inevitable Director's Cut.

Shere
Mar 26, 2006

It's shrine maiden, not shrine maid!


AlternateNu posted:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wp7l9oolXS0

Played a grand total of 2 1/2 times over 12 episodes. Gotta love a team that's willing to animate an extra 11 minutes or so over the course of a season.

It's such a good opening, too.

My friend got me started on this series about a month ago and I just got caught up to the current season finale. Good show, no complaints here. Kind of crazy how different everyone is by the end, feels like a proper journey.

I had the benefit of having every episode available to watch as I pleased so I can't really speak to anything regarding pacing, but the extra long episodes definitely gave a lot of things more room to breathe. This show had some of the more intense, natural-sounding conversations (and arguments) I've seen in anime and it's definitely just because they had time to play things out fully.

Brownieftw
Nov 23, 2011

Fluff master


AlternateNu posted:

I can't wait for the inevitable Director's Cut.

I don't think director's cut for s1 really changed much, unfortunately. It was really weird to me. There was a couple scene composition changes but that was about it iirc

Hogama
Sep 3, 2011


The biggest Director's Cut change (beyond the bit they used from the first episode of season 2) was the Subaru v. Julius fight getting some major redraws. Pretty much everything else was small stuff you'd never really notice without a stopwatch comparison (these cuts linger for fractions of a second longer over the broadcast!, etc.) Well, that, and actually getting to play the OP/EDs more often.

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

I am trying to do better.


Isn't there a panel/event going on with Re:Zero this/last week?

Raenir Salazar
Nov 5, 2010


College Slice

Hogama posted:

The biggest Director's Cut change (beyond the bit they used from the first episode of season 2) was the Subaru v. Julius fight getting some major redraws. Pretty much everything else was small stuff you'd never really notice without a stopwatch comparison (these cuts linger for fractions of a second longer over the broadcast!, etc.) Well, that, and actually getting to play the OP/EDs more often.

Yeah wasn't there like cut content that would've been relevant for the current season? It's weird to not add that stuff back in.

Hogama
Sep 3, 2011


Raenir Salazar posted:

Yeah wasn't there like cut content that would've been relevant for the current season? It's weird to not add that stuff back in.
Here's some stuff that was cut ( spoiler content warning: things from the first four arcs - it's possible the anime will bring some of this back for more immediate context if it continues in the future, but otherwise these are things a reader could be aware of by this point in the story).

Firstly, going back to S1, we missed out on some Al development: he was also summoned to the world from Japan, 18 years earlier than Subaru. Priscilla knows about this story, and says there's been claims of people coming from "beyond the Great Waterfall" (the world is known to be a flat plane, surrounded by water on all sides that falls off into void - the Great Waterfall, in other words), and although these claims are usually lies she believes that Al and Subaru are genuinely different from other claimants.

He also, for uncertain reasons, mistakes Rem for Ram (he'd met the latter off-screen during the first arc), and then gets very upset upon hearing that both Rem and Ram are alive. He doesn't take any hostile action but does ask Subaru and Rem to leave, and when they're gone he reflects that he's "disgusted" about this new information.


We also had some truncated Rem and Subaru scenes: before the battle with the White Whale, Subaru admits to her over their conversation that even though he loves Emilia, his heart feels a flutter at Rem's presence. After the fight, Rem pretends to be grievously wounded to get Subaru to admit out loud that he loves her (daisuki) and wants her by his side and no one else's. This is what prompts Rem to say "proposal accepted." This is perhaps still all implicit in the anime, so maybe not the biggest cut, but him openly acknowledging that he loves both informs a lot of further development of the series (it's why he was so nervous on the carriage talking to Emilia, after all, and relevant to why Rem is part of his trials, and why Carmilla appears as her when she's trying to keep him from killing himself during the second trial - not to mention being a constant concern about the mansion situation).

A bit on Wilhelm (technically S1 and S2, but it's mostly confined to the arc 3 epilogue): He's been suffering silently because an old shoulder wound of his has reopened. It's the result of an injury inflicted by someone with a certain Divine Blessing - it can never fully heal, and the closer that person is geographically to their victim, the more the wound reopens. He reveals to Subaru that the one who gave him this wound was the former Sword Saint - Theresia van Astrea, his wife. The reason he wants to keep the alliance between Crusch and Emilia's camps going is because he needs to investigate the Witch Cult more to find out how this is possible.

Some Satella (both S1 and S2): After a late death in arc 3, he says that he loves Satella while he's between death and returning to his checkpoint. When she interrupts the last tea party, all the other witches besides Echidna are relieved that it's Satella visiting because they make a distinction between her and the Witch of Envy. Echidna doesn't believe in that division.

Some other witch stuff in S2: After Subaru's gone, they wonder amongst themselves if he could be a sage candidate. Mostly as an open question since they don't elaborate much on what that entails.

The video game that recently came out (on Switch, PS4, and Steam) actually mentions some of these threads the anime skipped as well, so I'd suppose some forewarning on that if you're interested in checking it out in the near future.
Again, the anime could very well touch on these as they become more relevant in the Light Novel - it feels like White Fox has been somewhat conservative on foreshadowing details in the event the anime doesn't get picked up for further seasons.

I'll note for myself that I have yet to finish reading Arc 4 or even start Arc 5 and beyond because I was waiting for the anime to finish and to see if there's any announcements coming soon.

Brownieftw
Nov 23, 2011

Fluff master


Hogama posted:

Here's some stuff that was cut ( spoiler content warning: things from the first four arcs - it's possible the anime will bring some of this back for more immediate context if it continues in the future, but otherwise these are things a reader could be aware of by this point in the story).

A bit on Wilhelm (technically S1 and S2, but it's mostly confined to the arc 3 epilogue): He's been suffering silently because an old shoulder wound of his has reopened. It's the result of an injury inflicted by someone with a certain Divine Blessing - it can never fully heal, and the closer that person is geographically to their victim, the more the wound reopens. He reveals to Subaru that the one who gave him this wound was the former Sword Saint - Theresia van Astrea, his wife. The reason he wants to keep the alliance between Crusch and Emilia's camps going is because he needs to investigate the Witch Cult more to find out how this is possible.


Alright, that bit in particular is extremely interesting.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.


So something doesn't sit right to me. I had an idea about what it might all mean, but there are enough points that weaken or contradict my theory that I can't call it a slam dunk either, so instead I'm going to pose some questions.

Q: What is the purpose of the Sanctuary?

There's a saying in systems theory that goes "the purpose of a system is what it does." So what does the Sanctuary do?

It traps people who are exactly one-half demihuman. (Garfiel is able to leave because he's only one-quarter beastman, so we know it's pretty choosy.)

It violently repels (almost) anyone who gets near the tomb. It is particularly hostile to people with high levels of mana (Roswaal is nearly killed, because he's such a powerful magician.)

It permits a handful of people to enter and undergo trials that require them to make peace with their past, confront horrifying alternate present timelines, and witness dire warnings about the future. Most people who experience this are too traumatized to continue. The qualification to undergo this process is seemingly based on Echidna's* whims (she's able to extend and then remove Subaru's qualification at will) but is not based on whether or not she likes you (she despises Emilia and lets her complete the trials anyways.)

This doesn't sound to me like it has anything to do with preserving Echidna's memories or soul (Betty thinks her mother's attempt at soul transcription failed anyways, and she was there for the founding of the Sanctuary, so she shouldn't be confused about that).

To me, that sounds like a prison. Specifically, a prison for half-demihumans -- or maybe one half-demihuman in particular. In flashback we see Echidna create the Sanctuary at the last possible minute in response to an approaching enemy. You would think Hector was this enemy -- but where was Echidna when Roswaal fought him? Was Hector not alone?

Could the Sanctuary have been, specifically, a prison for Satella, who attacked alongside Hector?

Echidna* tells Subaru that the Witch of Envy "devoured" or "used for sustenance" the other Witches. But Echidna's body is still safe and intact in the Sanctuary, powering the barrier. So if this is true, she must mean that they were devoured in some other sense besides physically -- maybe their souls or powers were taken into Satella.

We know Echidna was working on soul transcription as a way to preserve her existence, but again, per Betty, that process failed. It's also pretty strange that Echidna appears alongside the other seven witches in her dream construct; if they were devoured, what are they doing there? They could just be Echidna's memories of them (after all, the main thing the construct does is reconstruct people from memories) but that doesn't explain Echidna's own presence, and there's another potential explanation:

The dream world is inside Satella, and that's why the witches she devoured are all there.

Q: Who is the person who first introduces herself to Subaru as "Echidna"?

Throughout this season Echidna's face is hidden in flashbacks and when her physical body is shown, up until the very last season where it's revealed that while she closely resembles the person in the dream construct, they don't look quite the same. The difference really is very slight -- the dream construct is obviously meant to be Echidna, or at least someone closely related to her -- but the show goes to tremendous lengths to obscure that small difference until the big reveal. Why?

Another weird thing: Roswaal ostensibly worships the ground Echidna walks on. His Gospel ostensibly relays information and commands from Echidna in order to bring about some desired goal.

Echidna, again ostensibly, didn't know about Subaru's ability to Return by Death until he told her. She was excited by the potential it represented, if not all that surprised that something like that was possible in theory.

But Roswaal has known what Subaru could do since before this season even began. How does he know that?

Possibility 1: Echidna is lying by omission and knew about Return by Death before Subaru said anything. In which case, how did she know that?

Possibility 2: Roswaal's book doesn't actually relay information from Echidna. It relays information from someone else, someone who is either passingly familiar with Return by Death and told Roswaal everything they knew -- since we know Roswaal doesn't have the full picture re: how it works -- or someone who was intimately familiar with how it works but withheld important details from Roswaal because he doesn't need them to do his job.

I kind of need a rewatch to confirm the exact details of what happened then, but last season Roswaal reacted very negatively when the person he worships was referred to as "The Witch of Greed."

Was that because he resents the title of Witch? But that's strange, as Echidna* gleefully wears that title and jokes about it.

Or was it because Echidna, the Witch of Greed, is not actually the object of Roswaal's affection and the power behind his Gospel? Roswaal is pretty strident about having dedicated hundreds of years of his life to the pursuit of "just one woman" and "his teacher" but he's remarkably hesitant to actually name who it is he's carrying a torch for. And at the end of the season when he comes face to face with the real Echidna's body he seems so blase about it that Betty remarks on it.

At first I thought Roswaal might not even be Roswaal at all -- for starters, in Echidna's estimate in the flashback to the creation of the Sanctuary, there's no way he could possibly beat Hector, yet here he is. He also pretty obviously speaks with Hector's exaggerated vocal tics. We know that whoever he is, Roswaal is a body-hopper, which inherently calls his real identity into question; we know that there's precedent for body-hopping in the Witch Cult, and that whatever the source of this power is it's not the same as an Authority (Betelgeuse's Authority was his Unseen Hands, which Subaru seems to have inherited in a limited form), which means it isn't necessarily unique or restricted to the Archbishop of Sloth. Roswaal is also working to subject Emilia to a series of trials or ordeals, just like what Betelgeuse said his goals were.

But then at the end of this season Betty recognizes him as the same Roswaal she knew and the way its presented doesn't leave much room for doubt. So he's probably not Hector, and his excuse about being so traumatized by the encounter that he took on his mannerisms, as thin and weird as it sounds, is presumably the truth.

However, the inconsistency in what Roswaal's Gospel tells him and what Echidna knows is still very strange. On a more abstract level, it's also a little odd that Echidna* (in her role as the Witch of Greed) is thrilled and amused by Subaru's intention to save everyone, and offers to help him achieve that goal -- however self-serving her actual means of getting there might be -- while Roswaal is horrified by what he sees as Subaru's naivete and sees single-minded devotion to just one person as the only viable path forward.

Bluntly, I think Roswaal's Gospel relays orders and information from the Witch of Envy, and Roswaal, regardless of exactly who he used to be, is a Witch Cultist. That does raise an interesting tangential question -- who is on the other end of Betty's gospel -- but Betty's gospel has been dead silent for centuries. This could be because Echidna is cruelly letting Betty hang in the wind... but she seemed genuinely affectionate towards Betty in the flashbacks, so that's pretty strange.

I think the more likely explanation is much simpler: Echidna can't relay any information through her gospel, because Echidna is dead.

And the Echidna* in the dream construct is someone -- or something -- else. Like, say, a reconstructed memory of Echidna conjured up by the real animating will behind the dream construct, the prisoner of the Sanctuary -- Satella.

Tuxedo Catfish fucked around with this message at 23:47 on Mar 31, 2021

ninjewtsu
Oct 9, 2012



I mean we know roswaal is a witch cultist, he's specifically one of the ones that murdered rem and ram's village

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.


ninjewtsu posted:

I mean we know roswaal is a witch cultist, he's specifically one of the ones that murdered rem and ram's village

i knew i should have done a complete rewatch before posting instead of just checking a few highlights lol

pedro0930
Oct 15, 2012


ninjewtsu posted:

I mean we know roswaal is a witch cultist, he's specifically one of the ones that murdered rem and ram's village

Ehhhhhhh is he? I thought he just knew the witch cultists would attack but does nothing because the gospel told him not to do anything about it, iirc.

Silver2195
Apr 4, 2012


I don't think it was very clearly explained (like a lot of things in this show, it's discussed in abstract emotional terms), but doesn't Ram say that she was originally planning to get revenge on Roswaal for it? So unless Roswaal just immediately told her, "by the way, I'm indirectly responsible for your parents' deaths," there must have been some clear evidence from Ram's point of view that Roswaal was to blame, so it probably wasn't just inaction. Then again, Roswaal's way of thinking is so bizarre that him telling Ram "by the way, I'm indirectly responsible for your parents' deaths" to manipulate her for some convoluted purpose is within the realm of possibility.

Grouchio
Aug 31, 2014

I am trying to do better.


IIRC Roswaal saw the Oni Village massacre coming (gospel) and did nothing to prevent it; solely to bind Ram/Rem to his bidding.

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HellCopter
Feb 9, 2012


College Slice

Ram sure looked pissed in that flashback when sitting on his lap. I assumed that meant he literally participated and Ram was aware of it.

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