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Jazerus posted:the fandom reached a self-sustaining critical mass and subsists entirely on fans being fans of fan works. even rowling being a complete shitter can't really affect it because the fandom isn't about the original work anymore really - if anything it has just pushed the community to include more trans characters in their stories because gently caress rowling she's not allowed to decide that HP is a symbol of bigotry Online fandom maybe, but there's still a shitload of branded HP tat for kids in the shops, especially coming up to Halloween. Someone's buying it or they wouldn't be bothering to sell it.
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Oct 21, 2024 14:21
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It’s an eternal IP thing like Star Wars right now, at least from a corporate POV. I do wonder how well that strategy will hold up if they can’t produce new stuff to hook another generation soon though. The tv series could work in theory, but I don’t know how they’ll deal with a series full of child actors when the current production cycle for tv is reaching a point where there’s multiple years between seasons comprised of 5-8 episodes. Assuming they want 1 season per one book, that is. It’s going to be 9 years by the time the fifth and final season of Stranger Things is done and the actors in that are already visibly twentysomethings playing high school freshmen and looking too old for the parts.
Nuns with Guns fucked around with this message at 14:35 on Oct 21, 2024 |
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Oct 21, 2024 14:31
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Evil Ronbledore
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Oct 21, 2024 14:54
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Nuns with Guns posted:It’s an eternal IP thing like Star Wars right now, at least from a corporate POV. I do wonder how well that strategy will hold up if they can’t produce new stuff to hook another generation soon though. The tv series could work in theory, but I don’t know how they’ll deal with a series full of child actors when the current production cycle for tv is reaching a point where there’s multiple years between seasons comprised of 5-8 episodes. Assuming they want 1 season per one book, that is. It’s going to be 9 years by the time the fifth and final season of Stranger Things is done and the actors in that are already visibly twentysomethings playing high school freshmen and looking too old for the parts. Hey it might be a modern 2 seasons and some sort of deal, bypassing the aging kids problem. Or set it in a college so you can just have adult actors with full time schedules. The kids should be getting nonmagic educations anyway.
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Oct 21, 2024 15:13
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Khanstant posted:Hey it might be a modern 2 seasons and some sort of deal, bypassing the aging kids problem. If we're hypothesizing a practical way to adapt it, they could maybe do books 1 & 2 as one season, then 3 & 4 together and have books 5, 6, and 7 be one season each? Or really speedrun it and put books 1+2+3 together as one season, 4 & 5 together, and 6 & 7 together. But you're losing the "appeal" of making this a TV series vs the extant movies if you're cutting the available run times down to be at or below the movies. Not to say that wouldn't happen, since WB is in dire financial straights right now, and streaming services are cutting budgets and season lengths on a lot of the prestige fantasy shows they're trying to get people hooked on. (WB just dicked over the new House of the Dragon season with that!) But man, what a funny, sad mess that would be.
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Oct 21, 2024 19:22
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There are still lots of shows that do a season every year, and for Harry Potter they don't have to spend a lot of time planning out seasonal arcs or reworking plots because they already have a fairly precise outline for everything.
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Oct 21, 2024 19:31
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Marketing this as a "more faithful" take is all they have, I really don't think they'll make big adaptional changes outside of probably the casting.
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Oct 21, 2024 19:40
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sounds like lycanthropy op
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Oct 21, 2024 19:51
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living in Edinburgh I have just accepted that I will be surrounded by endless mountains of harry potter tat for sale until I die, which will probably be from jk rowling breaking into my bedroom at night to feast on my soul or whatever she's doing these days
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Oct 22, 2024 00:19
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Air Skwirl posted:There are still lots of shows that do a season every year, and for Harry Potter they don't have to spend a lot of time planning out seasonal arcs or reworking plots because they already have a fairly precise outline for everything. What prestige IP type streaming shows still do that? House of the Dragon aside, The Witcher and Wheel of Time shows are following the outlines of the stories and still take 2 years between seasons. The Rings of Power is adapting the LotR appendixes and also had a 2 year gap. The closest equivalents I can think of are the His Dark Materials (HBO) and A Series of Unfortunate Events (Netflix) shows. His Dark Materials had a 1-year gap between season 1 (book 1) and season 2 (book 2), then a 2-year gap for season 3 but granted that was right when COVID hit. And A Series of Unfortunate events was 3 seasons a year apart, too. Both series have the advantage of being shorter (His Dark Materials being 3 books of HP size, and A Series of Unfortunate Events had 13 books, but they were all short enough that they could adapt each one in ~2 episodes or so.) A Series of Unfortunate Events being pre-COVID and His Dark Materials being able to wrap up right after people could be pushed back to work helped, too. Before the bottom started falling out of streaming services. Besides those there is the Percy Jackson series Disney is doing right now. That had its first episodes come out in 2023, and the last D23 news was that season 2 would air at some point in 2025. Nuns with Guns fucked around with this message at 03:40 on Oct 22, 2024 |
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Oct 22, 2024 03:33
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If a Harry Potter show wanted to make the material work in the long term it would need to be *less* fateful to the source material, not more. It would need to build up the Horcrux/Hallows stuff from the last two books much much earlier, for one thing. If they had the green light to make significant changes they’d be tons of stuff that could make the story far more interesting. Not portraying young Tom Riddle as a British Jeffrey Dahmer, for one.
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Oct 22, 2024 20:05
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British Jeffrey Dahmer would be a good username
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Oct 22, 2024 20:39
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Doctor Who is doing the 'eight episodes a year every year' since Disney threw some money at it - eight episodes this year, eight more, all but ready, for 2025, and waiting on the greenlight to start season 3
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Oct 23, 2024 00:02
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bobjr posted:I thought evil Dumbledore was one of the theories she hates, but I could be mixing that up with Ron Dumbledore. She hates the poo poo out of it because she didn't think of it first. Kind of like how she sees Molly Weasley as her self-insert and despises that a lot of the fan works show her being overbearing at best and plotting with evil Dumbledore to rob Harry after he gets himself killed for the cause to better her family's fortunes at worst.
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Oct 23, 2024 13:31
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To my recollection it's specifically Dumbledore having a Horcrux that she has a particular and weirdly visceral disgust for. Like a "how could you dare to even say that to me" style of reaction.
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Oct 23, 2024 14:17
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………..but he literally did in HBP?
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Oct 23, 2024 14:46
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Regalingualius posted:………..but he literally did in HBP? I think they meant having created a Horcrux for himself, not just having Voldemort's Horcrux in order to destroy it. In any event, it's pretty conclusive Dumbledore didn't have one. Source? Harry chilling out with Dumbles' spirit in the end of Book 7. Tiny, flayed baby Voldemort is what happens when you split your soul. Dumbledore is perfectly whole and happy, like Harry himself.
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Oct 23, 2024 14:53
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NikkolasKing posted:I think they meant having created a Horcrux for himself, not just having Voldemort's Horcrux in order to destroy it. Tbf Voldy's little gollum fetus body is one eighth of his soul. Dumbledore could probably have split his once and been fine.
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Oct 23, 2024 15:20
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I don’t think Dumbledore would’ve been interested in shaving pieces of his soul off and murdering in cold blood and whatever other hosed poo poo the horcrux ritual had. This is like debating about whether or not Gandalf was a wuss for rejecting The One Ring because he was an angel and should’ve been badass enough to tank the psychological chip damage long enough to fly over and OHKO Sauron’s eyeball tower.
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Oct 23, 2024 15:28
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For all his faults Dumbledore seems more like the kind of guy tempted by suicide rather than immortality
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Oct 23, 2024 15:35
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YaketySass posted:For all his faults Dumbledore seems more like the kind of guy tempted by suicide rather than immortality Dumbledore talked the Flamels into committing suicide, in fact quote:“Not the Stone, boy, you – the effort involved nearly killed you. For one terrible moment there, I was afraid it had. As for the Stone, it has been destroyed.”
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Oct 23, 2024 15:38
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That isn’t even so much talking them into suicide as it is him being implied to tell them “Voldy went as far as grafting his face onto the back of a teacher’s head to get the Stone itself, draw your own conclusions on what he’d be willing to do to get his hands on you”.
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Oct 23, 2024 16:01
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"To the well-organized mind, death is but the next great adventure." I also just realized how similar that line is to Peter in in Hook: "to die would be a great adventure." Both stories are just saying to cling to mortality is p dumb, though. Hook and Voldemort are terrified of it beyond all reason while our wise hero accepts it. It is a consistent theme in HP from Book 1 to 7. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 16:25 on Oct 23, 2024 |
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Oct 23, 2024 16:22
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It's a theme all the way through, but there's a definite evolution from book 1's "next great adventure" to book 7's "saint peter is waiting off-screen to stamp your heaven ticket"
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Oct 23, 2024 16:24
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It's funny how the aesop over being fine with death is the biggest thing Yudkowsky took offense to in HPMOR.
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Oct 23, 2024 19:31
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Voldemort being afraid of death is an objectively weird plot point in a book series where ghosts are a thing that people regularly interact with.
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Oct 23, 2024 22:29
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Doesn’t Nick explain that it’s actually not all that great because it intrinsically means that you had some regrets that keep you from passing on, and also have a gnawing feeling that you led a life unfulfilled as a result of that?
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Oct 23, 2024 22:55
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Regalingualius posted:Doesn’t Nick explain that it’s actually not all that great because it intrinsically means that you had some regrets that keep you from passing on, and also have a gnawing feeling that you led a life unfulfilled as a result of that? Yes, that's the end of Book 5. He explains that a man like Sirius would not pick such a "feeble imitation of life." quote:"I was afraid of death,” said Nick. “I chose to remain behind. I sometimes wonder whether I oughtn’t to have . . . Well, that is neither Remember, Voldemort was already kind of a ghost+ in the first books. He could touch stuff and possess people and actually eat food. Ghosts can do none of those things. Yet even this was not really satisfactory for him. I don't know if it's death itself he fears...maybe he fears being powerless. He's always been strong, even as a child, insisting on carving out his own destiny. Death is the one thing which he had no power over. Being a ghost - an utterly powerless and impotent being for eternity - would not be desirable.
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Oct 23, 2024 23:07
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Yeah Voldemort is a pretty paint by numbers evil guy but he’s got two pretty universal bad guy traits: wants power and wants to live forever. If Voldemort did primarily just want to live forever while still enjoying the pleasures of being alive (so like not being a ghost who can’t taste food or anything) he could have made a single horcrux out of a pebble, then buried it in a random forest and then just become like a powerful wizard businessman and retired wealthy. The “wants power” is the crucial second part which leads him to amass a truckload of Horcruxes because he knows he is going to have enemies since he wants to install himself as the tyrant lord of the world eventually and he knows people will try to kill him for that.
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Oct 23, 2024 23:51
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It might have made for a fun twist of the knife for him if he found out that horcruxes can’t extend the user’s natural lifespan like the Stone could; at best, all you get is a few extra seconds of life as you’re revived in exactly the same state/age you were in before the diseases and whatnot catch up with you again.
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Oct 24, 2024 04:05
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It's implied in book 6 that there are some downsides to having a horcrux, let alone multiple, that are measurable in a way that isn't "Can't move on to the afterlife", so I'm wondering how much that could have been a factor. Really Dumbledore just did a poo poo job preparing Harry in book 6, he knew he was dead by the end of the year and his best hope was hoping a 17 year old would figure it out.
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Oct 24, 2024 04:44
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muscles like this! posted:Voldemort being afraid of death is an objectively weird plot point in a book series where ghosts are a thing that people regularly interact with. I mean it's also part of the issue that it doesn't quite fit with the story Rowling arguably was telling - but does fit in with her accidentally creating the greatest and most insightful political satire of the 20th and 21st centuries. The Death Eaters are supposed to be a racist, fascist, movement. And they are. But while Voldemort seems to have some racist sentiment, sure, his racism is by no means his driving motivation at all. As a child he was just a generic lazily written serial killer, and as an adult his overwhelming motivation is very clearly the fear of death. "Voldemort is Trump" is an insightful and correct comment, only insofar as both are men who co-opt an existing fascist movement and 'pervert' it into a cult of personality centered on themselves, while being largely apolitical in their own hearts. And likewise, once they are defeated, all the liberals celebrate and cheer despite neither the preexisting fascist movement, nor the circumstances that birthed it, having been meaningfully addressed in the slightest. Like Voldemort being who and what he is would be fine if she was willing to reckon with it or if she intended the books as political satire of liberalism, but yeah, as it stands you have the issue of the Death Eaters being led by a villain who clearly does not share their ideology is not really addressed. Like for all their insane and countless problems, at least the Fantastic Beasts movies properly frame the race issue as the core conflict and the motivating ideology of its villain. Harry Potter can't decide whether it's about racism or the mad quest for immortality.
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Oct 24, 2024 06:16
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bobjr posted:It's implied in book 6 that there are some downsides to having a horcrux, let alone multiple, that are measurable in a way that isn't "Can't move on to the afterlife", so I'm wondering how much that could have been a factor. The old gently caress knew he had less than a year to live and didn't even think to teach Harry any advanced spellwork, or get Mad-Eye to come by and train Harry to fight. Dumbledore and Voldemort were going at it during the end of book 5 with all sorts of high-level spells and transfiguration and he expects Harry to win against Voldemort? The same Harry who only knew how to fight with Stunners or Expelliarmus? If there hadn't been that stupid bullshit with the Elder Wand, Voldemort would have straight up murked Harry in book 7.
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Oct 24, 2024 07:01
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amigolupus posted:The old gently caress knew he had less than a year to live and didn't even think to teach Harry any advanced spellwork, or get Mad-Eye to come by and train Harry to fight. Dumbledore and Voldemort were going at it during the end of book 5 with all sorts of high-level spells and transfiguration and he expects Harry to win against Voldemort? The same Harry who only knew how to fight with Stunners or Expelliarmus? If there hadn't been that stupid bullshit with the Elder Wand, Voldemort would have straight up murked Harry in book 7. Why have your hero learn and train and better themselves when you can just Deus Ex Machina your ending, in your book for children that they might draw life lessons from?
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Oct 24, 2024 07:38
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Also Harry is stupid as hell and actively refuses to learn new magic if he can get away with it
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Oct 24, 2024 07:45
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I like how the last few books clearly set up the obvious coming of age arc of Harry coming to grips with the fact Dumbledore was a deeply flawed and in many ways bad person and needing to move out from under Dumbledore's shadow and become his own man. And then not actually doing that.
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Oct 24, 2024 07:47
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amigolupus posted:The old gently caress knew he had less than a year to live and didn't even think to teach Harry any advanced spellwork, or get Mad-Eye to come by and train Harry to fight. Dumbledore and Voldemort were going at it during the end of book 5 with all sorts of high-level spells and transfiguration and he expects Harry to win against Voldemort? The same Harry who only knew how to fight with Stunners or Expelliarmus? If there hadn't been that stupid bullshit with the Elder Wand, Voldemort would have straight up murked Harry in book 7. Air Skwirl posted:Why have your hero learn and train and better themselves when you can just Deus Ex Machina your ending, in your book for children that they might draw life lessons from? I'm not saying Harry shouldn't have tried a bit harder, but HP not being a shounen anime is fine by me. Harry is an above average student in one field. He's up against one of, if not the, most powerful wizard in history. A person who was canonically more brilliant and a better student at Harry's own age and now he's had several decades of training on top of that. So if Riddle at Harry's age was already far above Harry, Riddle at...80 or whatever he was is obviously galaxies ahead. And it would be frankly ridiculous to think Harry could outduel him. Obviously, Rowling knew this - she had Snape humiliate him at the end of Book 6. Snape is an exceptional wizard but still far below Voldemort. Harry defeating Voldemort through strength or skill was never in the cards. Now his winning could have been done way, way better, but I don't think I'd be satisfied if he just had a higher power level and beat up Voldemort at the end of Book 7. NikkolasKing fucked around with this message at 08:59 on Oct 24, 2024 |
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Oct 24, 2024 08:56
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it's weird to have a kid who grew up in the mundane world get brought to the magical world and promptly show no interest in learning magic
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Oct 24, 2024 10:07
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Mx. posted:it's weird to have a kid who grew up in the mundane world get brought to the magical world and promptly show no interest in learning magic "Children, today we are learning to mix a muggle draught called methylphenidate." (at least one student cooks meth instead)
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Oct 24, 2024 11:14
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NikkolasKing posted:I'm not saying Harry shouldn't have tried a bit harder, but HP not being a shounen anime is fine by me. Harry is an above average student in one field. He's up against one of, if not the, most powerful wizard in history. A person who was canonically more brilliant and a better student at Harry's own age and now he's had several decades of training on top of that. So if Riddle at Harry's age was already far above Harry, Riddle at...80 or whatever he was is obviously galaxies ahead. And it would be frankly ridiculous to think Harry could outduel him. I'm not saying it needs to be a shonen anime. I'm saying both Dumbledore and Harry know that Wizard Hitler 2 is after Harry's life, and that he has the resources and minions to hunt him down. Dumbledore may have wanted Harry to die in the end, but he still needed Harry to find the Horcruxes and survive until the final confrontation. Maybe spend less time telling Harry how Voldemort was born evil because he was byproduct of rape, and more time teaching Harry necessary skills to battle Voldemort. Hell, Harry would have been caught right after the Death Eaters raided Bill and Fleur's wedding if Hermione didn't know how to cast protective wards to hide their location. Mx. posted:it's weird to have a kid who grew up in the mundane world get brought to the magical world and promptly show no interest in learning magic Yeah, Hermione should be the norm with Muggle-raised students who haven't heard of magic before, not the outlier. I suppose it's yet more evidence to the idea of Rowling reusing a bunch of school tropes (in this case, Harry being a jock who just coasts by academically) without any thought given to how it'd fit in the setting she came up with.
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Oct 24, 2024 11:22
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