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discoukulele
Jan 16, 2010

Yes Sir, I Can Boogie
Alright, I've got an early morning tomorrow, so just one episode for tonight. And goddamn, what a great start to the season.

s04e01 – The Hour of the Wolf

  • Oh poor Ivanova. As much as I was like “clearly, Sheridan and Garibaldi are ultimately fine”, I didn't really think through the fact that she’s truly alone now.
  • I love G’Kar’s empathy for Londo’s loneliness, too
  • Delenn is fasting
  • It’s 2261 - “It was the year of fire.. The year of destruction. The year we took back what was ours. It was the year of rebirth. The year of great sadness. The year of pain and the year of joy. It was a new age. It was the end of history. It was the year everything changed.” This time we have multiple people doing the intro, including Zack and Lyta (according to subs)
  • and after the events of the season 3 finale, everyone’s recalling their ships because “the war is over” and the war council is falling apart. Everyone wants to defend themselves now to ensure their own survival.
  • None of the other species on the war council want to look for Sheridan because they think it’s just a personal quest for Ivanova and Delenn
  • We haven’t ever really seen Centauri Prime under sunny skies before lmao
  • Oh poo poo, Vir just coming out and admitting that Londo is getting messages from the Shadows
  • Oh gently caress, Morden is hosed up, but somehow survived (Vir still needs to see his head on a pike)
  • Morden: “I’m just a shadow of my former self” haaa I see what you did there :haw:
  • the Shadows are looking for outside help and they’re scattering from Z’Ha’Dum again. Emperor Cartagia has offered them a “piece” of Centauri Prime. Londo is sorta stuck helping them because otherwise someone worse might step in. Everyone who has opposed this move has disappeared.
  • Delenn has been shut out from the Vorlons. Lyta got her hair done.
  • lmao look at this Freddy Krueger looking motherfucker -

  • aw yay, G’Kar’s gonna step up! Have I mentioned that he’s one of my favorites now?
  • “We’ll be in the saaaaand gardens!” :gay: (I'm a gay, I can make this joke)
  • oh gently caress it’s the Shadow ship flyover from Londo’s vision. Also, Emperor Cartagia is giving me major Caligula vibes
  • Lyta doin more eyeball sex with the new Kosh – “Is there anywhere else you needed me to carry you?” 🤔 Lyta says that it feels darker than the original Kosh. I’m getting vibes from this episode that the Vorlons might not be as angelic and holy as they appear, so there might be some truth to what the Shadows said about them manipulating people.
  • I love this development in Londo and Vir’s relationship; Londo truly needs him now instead of using him as a useful idiot.
  • also, Vir has lost a poo poo ton of weight in seven days 🤔
  • oh gently caress the “talking to the heads” thing is true lmao
  • Lyta’s hosed up eyes scene is creepy af. And also it’s much more effective than her “fighting Shadows with my mind” scene from last season.
  • Ah gently caress, the Shadows know their names. What was the deal that they mentioned earlier? Once they target someone they never stop their pursuit, I think?
  • lmao “getting the hell out of here maneuver”
  • So, the Shadows seem to have some infinite sadness, or at least that’s what Delenn and Ivanova felt
  • Vir’s one of my other favorite characters, and it’s been really interesting to see him much less naive this time around.
  • Aw gently caress, Londo + Vir gonna attempt a coup
  • Sheridan is alive (duh) and meets mysterious person in the caves.


Anyways, gently caress yes, I'm so hyped for where this season is headed. I can also tell already that I'm definitely going to want to do a re-watch soon.

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Vavrek
Mar 2, 2013

I like your style hombre, but this is no laughing matter. Assault on a police officer. Theft of police property. Illegal possession of a firearm. FIVE counts of attempted murder. That comes to... 29 dollars and 40 cents. Cash, cheque, or credit card?
For movies:

In the Beginning was a prequel designed to help get new viewers up to speed, because the show changed networks between Season 4 and Season 5. As I understand it, the way the new network aired things was: In the Beginning, The Gathering, and then just a marathon of Seasons 1 through 4, before starting to show Season 5 weekly. It's well-designed for that purpose. I'd watch it between Season 4 and Season 5. (That's where I watch it when going through the series.) Sometimes people suggest watching it first, before the whole show, because it was made to hook people, but it also massively spoils things because it was made on the understanding that those people would be watching Season 5 in a few weeks.

Thirdspace was aired between S5E17 and S5E18, but technically takes place during Season 4. But here's why: they just got all the actors who were available to do a TV movie, and then figured out "when were all these characters actually on the station at the same time?" and it turns out that's somewhere in the first half of Season 4. It doesn't fit into the S4 story at all. I'd watch it either when it aired in S5, or just after Season 5 if you want some more Babylon 5 in your life.

The River of Souls apparently aired just before the end of S5. (Thirdspace aired in July 1998 during a hiatus; River of Souls was in November, right in the middle of the show's last five episodes. Weird.) I always think of it as taking place after the show is over, and wouldn't put off finishing Season 5 to watch River of Souls. I remember kind of liking the movie. It has Martin Sheen!

A Call to Arms is the pilot for Crusade. Watch it if you're interested in Crusade. Also, if you're interested in Crusade, look up something about episode order. There was significant meddling in the structure of Crusade, and the best way to watch the episodes is not the order in which the network broadcast them.

The Legend of the Rangers was meant to be a pilot for a new show. I have never in my life been drunk enough to watch The Legend of the Rangers.

ultrafilter
Aug 23, 2007

It's okay if you have any questions.


discoukulele posted:


also, Vir has lost a poo poo ton of weight in seven days 🤔


Stephen Furst was basically told that if he didn't lose a lot of weight in very short order that he was going to die in the very near future. Fortunately he was able to pull it together and not die.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007



Stopped the clock for a while at least.

Vitruvian Manic
Dec 5, 2021

by Fluffdaddy
I thought what I said was fine but I'll happily amend.

Vitruvian Manic fucked around with this message at 07:08 on Dec 16, 2021

MrL_JaKiri
Sep 23, 2003

A bracing glass of carrot juice!
Spoiler thread, Vitruvian Manic

discoukulele
Jan 16, 2010

Yes Sir, I Can Boogie
s04e02 – Whatever Happened To Mr. Garibaldi? 🤔
  • So the League is completely broken up at this point and everyone is waiting for the final attack
  • Sheridan has a dream where a glowing entity asks him “Who are you? What do you want?” ala Morden
  • Sheridan apparently is dead because he doesn’t have a pulse and hasn’t eaten in 9 days. (he still sleeps tho, hmm). Oh no, apparently he’s in some sort of in-between state
  • Marcus ex Machina poppin up out of nowhere yet again
  • ahahahahaha at the bit with G’Kar extending the Minbari staff thing
  • I haven’t really said this before, but everything about Marcus feels forced to me. I hope he becomes more 3 dimensional or something.
  • ah poo poo, gonna just straight-up attack Z’Ha’Dum
  • G’Kar got captured and taken to Centauri Prime, he’s continuing his search for Garibaldi
  • I love this scene between G’Kar and Londo in the cell
  • The person Sheridan is with is “the first one”
  • Vorlons can break off parts of their consciousness and put themselves into other creatures in order to travel (like what Lyta was doing with New Kosh)
  • there’s that “breathe on the remaining embers” quote
  • we still don’t know whatever happened to Garlibaldi :colbert:



s04e03 – The Summoning
  • lmao at Ivanova attempting to learn Minbari
  • god drat it’s going to be so satisfying when Cartagia gets killed off
  • ugh, this scene with Cartagia’s bloody hands (but also lmao at this dude’s expression behind him when he tosses his handkerchief back)
  • “the Vorlons have plans of their own” 👀
  • Garibaldi is back but under the influence of a program of some kind.
  • major falling out between New Kosh and Lyta. She got blasted for attempting to scan him.\
  • G’Kar gets whipped 39 times, the same number as Jesus
  • A ship comes through the jump gate and hacks the docking bay as a Drazi rallies people against Delenn
  • lmao and on queue Sheridan returns and he brought Cave Guy (Lorien)
  • Vorlons (order/discipline) and Shadows (conflict) were charged with monitoring the evolution of lesser species.
  • The Vorlons destroyed an entire planet of 4 million people because there was a Shadow base. All of the “lesser species” are about to get caught up in a war between the Vorlons and Shadows.


feels like this season is escalating very quickly! There hasn't really been any down time so far.

discoukulele fucked around with this message at 05:17 on Dec 16, 2021

Vavrek
Mar 2, 2013

I like your style hombre, but this is no laughing matter. Assault on a police officer. Theft of police property. Illegal possession of a firearm. FIVE counts of attempted murder. That comes to... 29 dollars and 40 cents. Cash, cheque, or credit card?
[Redacted pending review.]

VVV Uh, fair. I'm unsure where to consider The Line to be and may have stepped over The Line. My apologies.

Vavrek fucked around with this message at 07:06 on Dec 16, 2021

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









Vavrek posted:

I'm not sure where/when all the details about his character and backstory that I'm thinking of come out. I think you've seen them all, but I'm not sure. I think there's a decent amount to the character, but it's all in a handful of little details and sketching together what picture that implies. Sheridan's character and past (for example), get a lot of exploration that give you a sense of who he is and where he comes from that, with Marcus, shows up only in a handful of passing lines of dialogue.

But you're not wrong, really.


SEASON FOUR SAYS HEEELLLOOOO

But also: Season 4 is slightly compressed, compared to the plan. The network Babylon 5 was airing on, PTEN, was at risk of no longer existing. (This risk came true! That's why Season 5 was on TNT.) If it had been known the network would still be around, and that Season 5 was guaranteed, the final episode of Season 4 would be what is now S4E18, and the events told in the last few episodes of Season 4 would've been the start of Season 5.

There's more to the story, but that's the basic explanation of why Season 4 just hits the ground running and never stops to breathe.


Even with spoiler blocks, this is not the thread for talking about what's coming up.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007



Vavrek posted:

[Redacted pending review.]

VVV Uh, fair. I'm unsure where to consider The Line to be and may have stepped over The Line. My apologies.

A large battle was fought over that but it ended abruptly.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk









There is a spoiler block in your mind

discoukulele
Jan 16, 2010

Yes Sir, I Can Boogie
s04e04 – Falling Towards Apotheosis
  • The Vorlons are continuing their campaign and leaving a lot of innocent refugees in their wake
  • Everyone's starting to act like Sheridan is a literal messiah since he came back from the dead, so it's like he's... falling towards apotheosis? 🤔
  • And so yeah, obviously Centauri Prime has a giant target on it. The Emperor is fine with that happening in his quest for godhood.
  • lmao yeah just gonna ask New Kosh to leave. E: oh no nevermind, gonna just try to kill him if they have to
  • “ Londo's probably calling collect” - good lord that's a dated reference lmao
  • Sorry, somehow I don't think I realized Lyta has gils now until just now.
  • Lyta is a terrible liar ffs
  • It's really interesting that New Kosh isn't appearing as an angelic form to anyone in this room
  • Not only did Sheridan have Kosh inside of him (which we knew), but he also had a little bit of Loriel inside him, too 👀
  • Sheridan as 20 years left at most. He and Delenn get engaged
  • aaaand G'Kar loses his eye (like we saw in the flash-forward)



s04e05 – The Long Night
  • The Shadows basically have Cloudkill
  • oh gently caress that Vir's the one who actually did the kill
  • Cloudkill is another planet destroyer
  • Oh poo poo, Sherdian's going to bring the Shadows into the conflict
  • Sheridan's basically sending Ericsson to his death
  • G'kar turns down the throne.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


discoukulele posted:

s04e04 – Falling Towards Apotheosis
  • It's really interesting that New Kosh isn't appearing as an angelic form to anyone in this room


It takes effort to do that, he was kinda busy. The glowy squid thing is what Vorlons actually look like.

ultrafilter
Aug 23, 2007

It's okay if you have any questions.


discoukulele posted:

s04e05 – The Long Night
Sheridan's basically sending Ericsson to his death

That's Bryan Cranston in one of his early TV roles.

Assepoester
Jul 18, 2004
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
Melman v2

Grand Fromage posted:

You might want to be bonus high for Legend of the Rangers.
:nws: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RPrYRXKhCN4 :nws:

Powered Descent
Jul 13, 2008

We haven't had that spirit here since 1969.

Hello again folks! After a hiatus of a month or so (the one I'm doing the watch-through with was out of town for a few weeks), I'm finally back and resuming season 1. Except instead of picking up right where we left off (we've seen up through Believers), we took this opportunity to go back to the very beginning and watch the original pilot, The Gathering!

My main reaction: it wasn't nearly as bad as I'd been led to believe, but the actual series is a big step up from this in a lot of ways. The cast changes were, I think, for the best. The costuming, hair, and even the alien makeup were all noticeably improved after the pilot. But this was a perfectly serviceable story that would have been a decent introduction to the B5 world if it had been what I'd seen first.

I have only one question that's specific enough to spoiler-tag, and I admit it's nitpicky as hell: How exactly did that nicotine patch get the poison to Kosh's body? Isn't his suit a full environmental isolation thing, basically a spacesuit?

Vitruvian Manic
Dec 5, 2021

by Fluffdaddy

Powered Descent posted:


I have only one question that's specific enough to spoiler-tag, and I admit it's nitpicky as hell: How exactly did that nicotine patch get the poison to Kosh's body? Isn't his suit a full environmental isolation thing, basically a spacesuit?

Non-spoiler answer but since this is the newbie thread, click at your own risk:

https://youtu.be/4Ugebzq3juE

I said come in!
Jun 22, 2004


I wish I could forget this happened. But it keeps me humble and reminds me that there are things about B5 that are loving terrible.

SlothfulCobra
Mar 27, 2011

Powered Descent posted:

I have only one question that's specific enough to spoiler-tag, and I admit it's nitpicky as hell: How exactly did that nicotine patch get the poison to Kosh's body? Isn't his suit a full environmental isolation thing, basically a spacesuit?

They do sort of explain indirectly. I guess the relevant data is in season 2.

The vorlons have organic living technology, which you can kind of see just from their aesthetic.

Midjack
Dec 24, 2007




I lol every time.

ozmunkeh
Feb 28, 2008

hey guys what is happening in this thread
I haven’t seen that lotr sequence since it came out. Incredibly it’s actually much worse than I remember.

Delsaber
Oct 1, 2013

This may or may not be correct.

For all Babylon 5's strengths in its writing and performances, it's good to remember sometimes that it also had some extreme FMV game energy, even in the later spinoffs

discoukulele
Jan 16, 2010

Yes Sir, I Can Boogie
s04e06 – Into the Fire
  • I feel like everyone trusts Loriel way too much.
  • Londo finds out the truth about Adira's murder
  • Morden's face is back to normal
  • Londo just straight up nuking one of his own islands to remove the Shadows
  • RIP Morden
  • The Vorlons are going to destroy Centauri Prime because Londo had a connection to the Shadows
  • Lyta gets possessed by the Vorlons and do some weird poo poo to Sheridan and Delenn. Sheridan has a psychic conversation with the Vorlons while Delenn meets the Shadows.
  • The Vorlons and Shadows don't know themselves anymore. The current races don't need them to guide them anymore. Sheridan tells them to get off his lawn.
  • Then everyone just leaves the battlefield and goes to the Rim so I assume the series is over now.
  • It's the humans turn to foster the next species. Loriel and all of the First Ones will wait for humans beyond the Rim
  • Well anyways, happy ending, I guess?


s04e07 - Epiphanies
  • lmfao at this cheeseball jazz at the end of the war party
  • gently caress yes there hasn't been nearly enough Psi Corps stuff lately
  • I'm assuming Garibaldi just got sleeper activated by that screensaver that someone sent him. He resigns.
  • aw yay Lyta gets to decorate now
  • The secret Black Omega group is going to do a false flag against an Earth base and pin it on B5. Best requests help rescuing his partner from Z'ha'dum
  • Z'ha'dum explodes
  • Lyta was involved in the destruction of Z'ha'dum through mind magic
  • oh poo poo, the parasites have arrived on Centauri Prime

Powered Descent
Jul 13, 2008

We haven't had that spirit here since 1969.

Resuming where we left off in season 1.

s01e12* - Survivors - AKA The one where Garibaldi is accused of sabotage.
*Note that from this point, I'm using HBO Max viewing order and episode numbering.
  • Through an unfortunate coincidence, having just gone back to watch the original pilot, we've gotten two "falsely accused" plots in a row. Not the fault of the show itself, of course, and I've tried not to let it color my reaction.
  • The element of this story that I found least believable is that the head of the Presidential security detail is like 25 years old.
  • As usual in TV land, fighting the cops and escaping is perfectly fine and dandy, and has no repercussions at all, regardless of whether or not you were innocent of the original thing they were arresting you for.
  • Time for an inevitable Star Trek comparison! I have to say, Babylon 5 feels like a bigger place than Deep Space Nine. For example, it has more than one bar. It's big enough to have "bad parts of town", actual places a character can go to hide which are still part of society and aren't just a cargo bay or a maintenance crawlway.
  • The plot was pretty standard, complete with cheesy character tropes -- e.g. Lianna had literally let her hair down for the final scene where she finally loosened up.
  • That said, this was a really good character-building episode for Garibaldi. G'Kar and Londo each got a really good scene too.
  • Still not sure how I feel about the whole "Home Guard conspirators lurking under every rock" plot thing.
  • I think the giant praying mantis guy that does generic Underworld Stuff is becoming my favorite recurring character.

Not a great episode, but a pretty decent one.

Grand Fromage
Jan 30, 2006

L-l-look at you bar-bartender, a-a pa-pathetic creature of meat and bone, un-underestimating my l-l-liver's ability to metab-meTABolize t-toxins. How can you p-poison a perfect, immortal alcohOLIC?


Powered Descent posted:

  • Time for an inevitable Star Trek comparison! I have to say, Babylon 5 feels like a bigger place than Deep Space Nine. For example, it has more than one bar. It's big enough to have "bad parts of town", actual places a character can go to hide which are still part of society and aren't just a cargo bay or a maintenance crawlway.


Yeah, it's a lot bigger. DS9 is about a kilometer in diameter, B5 is eight kilometers long and a bit over 400 meters in diameter.

Powered Descent
Jul 13, 2008

We haven't had that spirit here since 1969.

Grand Fromage posted:

Yeah, it's a lot bigger. DS9 is about a kilometer in diameter, B5 is eight kilometers long and a bit over 400 meters in diameter.

Googled it, and you're not kidding, there's a big difference there.

Erulisse
Feb 12, 2019

A bad poster trying to get better.
^ Also, DS9 is all about promenade (the ring itself that appears to be what, ~500m dia tops?) whereas B5 entire inside surface appear to be inhabited, that is apparent from a few shots.

Jedit
Dec 10, 2011

Proudly supporting vanilla legends 1994-2014

Erulisse posted:

^ Also, DS9 is all about promenade (the ring itself that appears to be what, ~500m dia tops?) whereas B5 entire inside surface appear to be inhabited, that is apparent from a few shots.

DS9 is the size of a suburb. B5 is the size of a city.

Winifred Madgers
Feb 12, 2002

Not really spoilers to talk about the size of the station, it's said to be five miles long in the opening credits. Also has about a quarter million inhabitants whereas DS9 is a few thousand iirc.

Chevy Slyme
May 2, 2004

We're Gonna Run.

We're Gonna Crawl.

Kick Down Every Wall.
DS9 is an office building with a barracks, a commissary and some basic recreational facilities.

B5 is an actual city in space.

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




Chevy Slyme posted:


B5 is an actual city in space.

Ruled by a military dictatorship.

Rudeboy Detective
Apr 28, 2011


A benevolent, enlightened military lord of the rings dictatorship.

I wonder what the actual demographic makeup of those living on the inside of the tube are. Mostly landowning earthlings? It's clear there's a significant non-human population beyond diplomats, traders, and associated staff, but why would they live in the space Green Zone?

Lawman 0
Aug 17, 2010

Alhazred posted:

Ruled by a military dictatorship.

A space station is like the perfect example of a hydraulic despotism so really it's a highly realistic space show. :hmmyes:

Farmer Crack-Ass
Jan 2, 2001

this is me posting irl
I think at least a couple of the effects guys have said that the CGI is scaled on the assumption that just the habitable cylinder is five miles long, so the whole thing (from reactor stem to cargo pylons) is even bigger if you go by what they say.

Rudeboy Detective posted:

A benevolent, enlightened military lord of the rings dictatorship.

I wonder what the actual demographic makeup of those living on the inside of the tube are. Mostly landowning earthlings? It's clear there's a significant non-human population beyond diplomats, traders, and associated staff, but why would they live in the space Green Zone?

I think a good chunk of the interior is supposed to be agriculture, with some parks, and the occasional high-end restaurant.

Don't get too hung up on where exactly the Green/Red/Brown/Gray sectors are located; yes, there are occasional graphics both in and out of the show, and I'm sure JMS would swear up and down it always made perfect sense, but I don't think the show is entirely consistent about how exactly they're arranged.

discoukulele
Jan 16, 2010

Yes Sir, I Can Boogie
s04e08 – The Illusion of Truth
  • President Clark is going after Sheridan’s family
  • Zack has taken over security and it’s, uh, not going so well
  • The frozen telepaths are just kinda stuck in limbo until they can figure out how to deal with the Shadow tech inside them
  • Garibaldi can’t not be a cop even when he’s not a cop
  • First mention of Minbari War Snydrome
  • oh poo poo, the Sheridan farm was burned down and his father is missing
  • I love the completely silent shot of Sheridan’s office after the broadcast


s04e09 - Atonement
  • G’Kar got a synthetic eye, but I’m assuming that he has to lose it again at some point
  • oh hell yes it can work outside of his head
  • Delenn enters The Dreaming so that the other Minbari can determine if she has other motives for her relationship with Sheridan. She and Lennier get to drink some kinda drug.
  • Delenn was a guide for Dukhat
  • Something about Delenn’s heritage made Dukhat interested in her. She’s the only person who’s gotten a reaction from the Triluminary.
  • So I’m pretty sure that until now we didn’t know that Delenn was Dukhat’s aide or that she was there when he died
  • Delenn was responsible for the Minbari response
  • oh gently caress so Delenn is a child of Valen (Sinclair)
  • Humans started being born with Minbari souls 1000 years ago. Because Sinclair had children, Human DNA entered the Minbari gene pool

Powered Descent
Jul 13, 2008

We haven't had that spirit here since 1969.

s01e13 - Signs and Portents
  • I wonder if they'll ever explain the whole "third age of mankind" thing from the opening credits. Presumably they'll get around to it someday?
  • But speaking of explaining things, we got some nice clear examples of how jump points work. Cool.
  • I think one of the shots of a Raider fighter being shot and blown up was an homage to the original 1970s :bsg: -- there was a stock shot of a Cylon Raider being blown up, which got reused in practically every episode, and one of the dogfight CGI shots from this episode was structured exactly like it. It could be a coincidence, just showing a fighter being shot from behind as it tries to veer left, but I like to think it was a deliberate reference.
  • So Centauri can do Vulcan mind melds. I guess it makes sense that humans aren't the only ones who have telepaths here and there.
  • I've heard the name "shadows" in connection with B5 before, so with all the talk of the guy being destined to be killed by shadows, I'm guessing the shadowy ship at the end that blew up the pirates belongs to a species called the Shadows.
  • They deliberately left a few threads hanging, which I'm sure will be picked back up in later episodes. The main one, of course, is who the hell is the "what do you want" guy, and what is his whole deal?
  • Very enjoyable episode. Interesting plot that keeps you guessing, good world building, plenty of pew pew space action, what's not to like?

Vitruvian Manic
Dec 5, 2021

by Fluffdaddy

Farmer Crack-rear end posted:

I think at least a couple of the effects guys have said that the CGI is scaled on the assumption that just the habitable cylinder is five miles long, so the whole thing (from reactor stem to cargo pylons) is even bigger if you go by what they say.


Irrespective of the canon technical manual garbage, B5 goes out of their way to make the station feel huge. DS9 as a suburb and B5 as a city is very real. And, much like real life, the suburb had more money but did so much less with it.

Alhazred
Feb 16, 2011




Rudeboy Detective posted:

A benevolent, enlightened military lord of the rings dictatorship.


Unless Ivanova is in charge

Sweevo
Nov 8, 2007

i sometimes throw cables away

i mean straight into the bin without spending 10+ years in the box of might-come-in-handy-someday first

im a fucking monster

Farmer Crack-rear end posted:

Don't get too hung up on where exactly the Green/Red/Brown/Gray sectors are located; yes, there are occasional graphics both in and out of the show, and I'm sure JMS would swear up and down it always made perfect sense, but I don't think the show is entirely consistent about how exactly they're arranged.

I think he's pretty much said that things are wherever the plot requires them to be.

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mossyfisk
Nov 8, 2010

FF0000
"Just about everyone who lives here works here: the dockers, the shop owners, environmental specialists, that sort of thing. The rest are just short term visitors, businessmen..."

The population is mostly transient, Ivanova's examples of typical residents doesn't sound like it could make up an appreciable portion of a quarter million people. I think most of the aliens who live there do it for the reasons anyone migrates, to find work or escape home - it's easy to find passage there and it has open migration which seems rare in the setting. It's almost the only place to go, so it just collects everyone.

There's a bunch of Minbari in the dockers guild, maybe they prefer loading ships to being a harmonious peasant, or they want to live outside of their caste prescriptions.

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