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JethroMcB
Jan 23, 2004

We're normal now.
We love your family.


The long, dark punchline of "They're lemons! They never start."

:smith:

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kalel
Jun 19, 2012



We're really zooming to the finish line now! I guess work slowed up Jerusalem?

(I'm not complaining :D)

kalel fucked around with this message at 16:21 on Dec 1, 2021

GoutPatrol
Oct 17, 2009

*Stupid Moddie*



The jaguar scene is the most darkly comedic scene in TV history.

The Don/Lane firing scene is something that shows up in my YouTube algorithm every couple months and I always watch it. Same with Dow. Why would you ever expect Republican millionaires to have a negative opinion on napalm? This is still 67, people's opinions on the war have only started to turn against it... and those kinds of people never did.

ram dass in hell
Dec 29, 2019

posting power flows from an av with the barrel of a gun




Jerusalem posted:

I believed with all my heart that after the failed suicide attempt with the Jaguar, Lane hit a moment of clarity and was going to pull something, maybe even something monstrous, to basically force Don's hand and somehow secure his position at SCDP while burning his bridge with Don as a friend forever or something. Even when Scarlett said that his door was locked, I took it at face value when she said he hadn't arrived to work yet. It wasn't until Joan tried to open the door and it resisted that I grasped what was happening and it was loving devastating.

The scene where they break into the office and see his corpse is just... gently caress. Jesus Christ.

Incredible show, incredible episode. I am going to miss Lane so much.

That got me the same way on my first watch too, ugh.

sebmojo
Oct 23, 2010


Legit Cyberpunk







quote:

A hollow eyed Lane suggests they sit down, and when Don asks what happened, 

P spry, for a dead fella

Torquemada
Oct 21, 2010

Drei Gläser


I think weve all been waiting for you to get to this one, well the last few in this season anyway. Monumental episodes.

Gaius Marius
Oct 9, 2012



All Lane had to do was ask Don for a loan. Dude woulda given it in a heartbeat

Gaius Marius
Oct 9, 2012



In the end Lanes fatal flaw was being British

kalel
Jun 19, 2012



This episode is a real gut punch. Suicide is difficult to address in television in a way that feels honest; I think the show did a very good job being completely naked and unafraid in its portrayal of the psychological path one undergoes towards ending one's own life.

On a lighter note, I never get tired of Roger's line about Baxter being a "wax figurine." I wonder how Ray Wise feels about that line...

ulvir
Jan 2, 2005



these last two episodes are a real one-two kick in the gut.

ram dass in hell
Dec 29, 2019

posting power flows from an av with the barrel of a gun




ulvir posted:

these last two episodes are a real one-two kick in the gut.

have we gotten all the stuff about Dick's brother and how he died yet? idr when that gets fleshed out but it's pretty hosed up the way the suicides in Don's life both have a direct connection to money, and with Don's line about gratitude not mattering because "that's what the money's for!!", throwing money in Peggy's face, i dunno man, yikes on yikes on yikes. The alchoholic meltdown spiral that's coming up for Don makes a lotta sense, since he's not exactly going to therapy

ulvir
Jan 2, 2005



ram dass in hell posted:

have we gotten all the stuff about Dick's brother and how he died yet? idr when that gets fleshed out but it's pretty hosed up the way the suicides in Don's life both have a direct connection to money, and with Don's line about gratitude not mattering because "that's what the money's for!!", throwing money in Peggy's face, i dunno man, yikes on yikes on yikes. The alchoholic meltdown spiral that's coming up for Don makes a lotta sense, since he's not exactly going to therapy

I had to check, and god drat if it doesn't come up the very next episode. I forgot how relentlessly bleak the end of season 5 is.

JethroMcB
Jan 23, 2004

We're normal now.
We love your family.


ram dass in hell posted:

have we gotten all the stuff about Dick's brother and how he died yet? idr when that gets fleshed out but it's pretty hosed up the way the suicides in Don's life both have a direct connection to money, and with Don's line about gratitude not mattering because "that's what the money's for!!", throwing money in Peggy's face, i dunno man, yikes on yikes on yikes. The alchoholic meltdown spiral that's coming up for Don makes a lotta sense, since he's not exactly going to therapy

Next episode is the one with Don's "Hot tooth" where he winds up in the dentist's office hallucinating a visit from Adam, wounds around his neck visible.

ram dass in hell
Dec 29, 2019

posting power flows from an av with the barrel of a gun




jesus christ!

JethroMcB
Jan 23, 2004

We're normal now.
We love your family.


Just remembered another miserable moment from the next episode, when Joan muses that maybe Lane would still be here if she'd just "given him what he wanted." Don, the beautiful idiot, asks her what that was, and she just shoots him A Look.

Of course, there's also "The world cannot support that many ballerinas" and "Oh yeah? Well I'm President of the Howdy-Doody Army!" so it's not all doom and gloom.

Paper Lion
Dec 13, 2009






outside of the original airing, ive never been able to watch this episode and the season finale spaced out at all. they really do feel the closest mad men ever gets to a 2 parter

ulvir
Jan 2, 2005



Paper Lion posted:

outside of the original airing, ive never been able to watch this episode and the season finale spaced out at all. they really do feel the closest mad men ever gets to a 2 parter

apart from the actual two-part premiere of the next season :ssh:

Annabel Pee
Dec 29, 2008


God, having gone through some money troubles and stressful times this year due to COVID, it was hard even reading the recap. :( RIP lane.

Bismack Billabongo
Oct 9, 2012

Wet


Paper Lion posted:

outside of the original airing, ive never been able to watch this episode and the season finale spaced out at all. they really do feel the closest mad men ever gets to a 2 parter

Jet Set and The Mountain King IMO. Not to argue just for the sake of it.

Finale episode thoughts

Episode is arguably the bluntest and least subtle of the season which Isnt inherently a bad thing but I feel like the episode is largely not great until the final scene which is flawless. Im also excited to go to bat for the S6 twoparter, I know S6 catches a lot of poo poo from people but its actually insanely good and The Doorway is my favorite of the season.

Paper Lion
Dec 13, 2009






i also forgot about the literal two parter at the start of this season because even at initial airing it was just a big two hour block lmao.

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



RIP Lane Pryce. This episode demolished me when it aired, Lane had become one of my favorite characters.

Bismack Billabongo posted:

Episode is arguably the bluntest and least subtle of the season which Isnt inherently a bad thing but I feel like the episode is largely not great until the final scene which is flawless. Im also excited to go to bat for the S6 twoparter, I know S6 catches a lot of poo poo from people but its actually insanely good and The Doorway is my favorite of the season.

Yeah, I think people hate on S6 because it feels so repetitive. It's Don making the same mistakes, repeating the same cycles as things that happened in his marriage to Betty or in his alcoholic binges from S4. But I agree that it's a good season, because the tediousness is the point. He IS falling into the same patterns, only now it's so much sadder and more pathetic, so much harder to watch because S5 had him doing so well.

It's hard to praise a TV show for frustrating its audience, but I think that's a necessary thing to do in a show that's so interested in Don's tendency towards avoidance, addiction, and his still totally unresolved emotional problems. Of course I don't want to see Don gently caress his neighbor or pour a fifth of vodka into his morning OJ. But that downward spiral is kind of necessary to set up the last season.

Paper Lion
Dec 13, 2009






if theres any season i hope we can get jerusalem to go back and immediately rewatch once hes done the whole series, its 6. im sure there will be a lot of vitriol to don in some of those recaps and getting all the way to the end and having that knowledge when you see it all really shows just how sad and in pain he is. season 6 don is at his core a man that is utterly convinced that no one will ever love him, no matter what effort he puts in or how honest he is, because he is fundamentally broken, so why bother trying anymore? but to a first time viewer it doesnt look that way at all, even with some of the backstory we already have.

Blood Nightmaster
Sep 6, 2011

“また遊んであげるわ!”


the only thing I didn't really care for in s6 was Sylvia, looking back. Like Don having another affair made sense from a narrative perspective but she had to be one of the least interesting people he'd been with IMO

kalel
Jun 19, 2012



Blood Nightmaster posted:

the only thing I didn't really care for in s6 was Sylvia, looking back. Like Don having another affair made sense from a narrative perspective but she had to be one of the least interesting people he'd been with IMO

her being completely whatever might be part of the point. Don is just reaching out for something, anything to hold on to to keep himself from falling into the gaping maw of his own security. which makes man with a plan and the crash back-to-back in the middle of the season so painful to watch

Solkanar512
Dec 28, 2006



You know, speaking of things that could have been done but weren't, it's really odd to me that Lane wasn't sponsored for a green card. He was a partner and having that would have given him some breathing room.

aBagorn
Aug 26, 2004


Blood Nightmaster posted:

the only thing I didn't really care for in s6 was Sylvia, looking back. Like Don having another affair made sense from a narrative perspective but she had to be one of the least interesting people he'd been with IMO

honestly it was a complete waste of Linda Cardellini

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



Blood Nightmaster posted:

the only thing I didn't really care for in s6 was Sylvia, looking back. Like Don having another affair made sense from a narrative perspective but she had to be one of the least interesting people he'd been with IMO

Counterpart: Diana Bauer

I like Sylvia, I guess because I really like Linda Cardellini, but definitely there's something super boring about Don cheating on his wife with his neighbor's wife. His past affairs are kind of glamorous or interesting, celebrities or clients or at least countercultural types like Midge. Then he married his secretary, but at least she was a really interesting secretary who became a copywriter and then an actress. Now, he's an absolute cliche as an aging drunk who fucks the bored housewife next door.

Similar to my point upthread, though, I'd guess the boring-ness is also the point. Don could've had an affair with Megan's co-star or another client or someone else who'd be complicated but interesting. But this isn't interesting, it's sad. Don is fixated on this very old-fashioned woman, whose husband is his friend, because she literally reminds him of the vaguely maternal abuser who molested him as a child. There's just nothing sexy about it anymore.

Until Diana, of course, who takes it from pretty unpleasant to actively gross. Don having mechanical, depressed alley sex with a self-destructive woman punishing herself for her child's death is peak "ugh, just stop, Don."

MightyJoe36
Dec 29, 2013

:minnie: Cat Army :minnie:


GoutPatrol posted:

The jaguar scene is the most darkly comedic scene in TV history.


I remember when it first ran, the next day Jaguar wrote a letter to the editor (or something like it) about how they were glad the car didn't start.

Sash!
Mar 16, 2001




I've always wondered what the repercussions would have been if Lane had just been like "I live in America now" and told the Crown to bother someone else.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Would you be my new best friends?



Annabel Pee posted:

God, having gone through some money troubles and stressful times this year due to COVID, it was hard even reading the recap. :( RIP lane.

Yeah, it's hard enough when you are just trying to live a normal life and are dealing with not knowing if you'll be able to support you and yours, the added stress of trying to force the appearance of a financially successful life/status on top of that must just eat away at a person. I have known people with gambling problems and it's frightening to see just how easy it is for otherwise intelligent people to make terrible decisions in their bid to continue to present a a successful facade.

MightyJoe36 posted:

I remember when it first ran, the next day Jaguar wrote a letter to the editor (or something like it) about how they were glad the car didn't start.

That's pretty incredible :laugh:

sebmojo posted:

P spry, for a dead fella

Fixed, thanks!

kalel posted:

We're really zooming to the finish line now! I guess work slowed up Jerusalem?

(I'm not complaining :D)

Happily, mostly yes. There's still all the basic day-to-day stuff but all the major work has been done and all the deadlines met, so I have a fair bit more time to actually relax now, which puts me in the right headspace to write these. :)

People raved so much about season 5 and through the first half of the season I enjoyed it as much as any other season of Mad Men, but it REALLY hit its stride here in this back half, it's been a loving rollercoaster of emotions and incredibly high quality television these last few episodes.

Xealot
Nov 25, 2002

Showdown in the Galaxy Era.



Sash! posted:

I've always wondered what the repercussions would have been if Lane had just been like "I live in America now" and told the Crown to bother someone else.

I don't know how immigration law looked in the 60's, but I'd be surprised if that worked. It wouldn't now, I don't think; Lane is almost definitely not a US citizen, and probably granted residency through a company-sponsored visa of some sort. I guess it'd be up to US authorities if they'd cooperate with extraditing a British citizen or not, but if you take Lane's accountant at face value, Britain was "keen to make an example of an expatriate."

He definitely should've just asked Don, who has more money than he'll ever use and doesn't particularly care about it. But, you know, masculine pride and a stiff upper lip. :britain:

WampaLord
Jan 14, 2010



Sash! posted:

I've always wondered what the repercussions would have been if Lane had just been like "I live in America now" and told the Crown to bother someone else.

If the UK's version of the IRS is anything like our IRS, that would probably be a terrible idea

Xealot posted:

He definitely should've just asked Don, who has more money than he'll ever use and doesn't particularly care about it. But, you know, masculine pride and a stiff upper lip. :britain:

Yeah the real tragedy of Lane's situation is there was the easiest out possible (as well as many other realistic outs like admitting the truth to his wife and reducing their spending a bit to cover the debt) and he simply refused to take it because it would be humiliating to ask. Much more humiliating than being fired for embezzlement.

kalel
Jun 19, 2012



quote:

What follows is an incredible scene, one in which Jared Harris as Lane Pryce runs the gamut of emotions, as he races through each of the five stage of grief in shockingly quick order.

Speaking of the five stages of grief, I want to rewind slightly and point out Hamm's incredible performance during the final scene of the last episode.



Denial.



Anger.



Bargaining.



Depression.

Scallop Eyes
Oct 15, 2021


RIP Lane, died in a pretty sad way. I got spoiled on this on my first watch, and I was still surprised when it happened.

Also really disturbing that it's the second time someone on Don's life hanged themselves because of him (not only, but he was a big part).

feedmegin
Jul 30, 2008



Jerusalem posted:

Ted Chaough is a bit of a blowhard, and certainly somebody with an overinflated opinion of himself (either that or just an insane dedication to self-promotion for PR purposes), but he also comes straight to the point. He doesn't care if she doesn't want to get married, he's also not overly fussed about how much money she wants. His biggest interest is in why she would want to play for the other team when she must have heard some horrible things about him from Ted Chaough (and what those might be he is VERY interested in).

You're getting a bit Keyser Soze again :shobon:

JethroMcB
Jan 23, 2004

We're normal now.
We love your family.


I like the idea that Ted Chaough is so bad at advertising that he has routinely publicized bad things about himself. That would've been a great direction for the character.

Sash!
Mar 16, 2001




This fits in all over the show: Don Draper would have never worked with anyone other than Hamm, because he plays "sweaty desperate man" better than anyone else ever has.

stromboni
Dec 22, 2008


Its impossible to imagine anyone else that couldve done such a compelling job selling both the commanding genius persona and the scared little boy who lives behind the mask

kalel
Jun 19, 2012



I'll have you know my "sweaty desperate man" is quite convincing

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Sash!
Mar 16, 2001




kalel posted:

I'll have you know my "sweaty desperate man" is quite convincing

Yeah but that ain't acting

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