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infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

This month, with ammo prices through the roof and availability a gamble, I wanted to try a skills test that used a lower round count.

Allow me to introduce Ken Hackathorn's "Wizard Drill". Here's a copy-paste from a Greg Ellifritz article:

[Hackathorn] calls his skill evaluation the ďWizard Drill.Ē The drill requires only five rounds, a holster, a shot timer, and an IDPA-style silhouette target. All stages begin with the firearm in a concealed holster. Each string of fire has a maximum time limit of 2.5 seconds.


Stage 1) 3 yards, one head shot strong hand only

Stage 2) 5 yards, one head shot using both hands on the gun

Stage 3) 7 yards, one head shot using both hands on the gun

Stage 4) 10 yards, two body shots using both hands on the gun.


At the completion of the exercise, you should have three head shots and two body shots on your target. Each string of fire must have started with the gun in the holster and must be completed within the 2.5 second time limit. Any misses or shots after the time limit indicate a failure of the drill.


TL;DR: the drill takes five rounds and one target. Running it once is a fast and frugal shooting skills test. A box of ammo will get you ten reps at it. If you're passing it easily at the given par time, push the distances, or the par times. Or both!

I am declaring the following divisions:

Rimfire
Backup Gun (anything that can be covered by five standard chicken nuggets)
Carry (larger than five chicken nuggets, up to seven)
Fullsize (larger than seven chicken nuggets)

Results are to expressed in number of passing scores versus number of attempts. For example: 2/3.

Link to article:

https://www.activeresponsetraining....ns-wizard-drill



Leaderboard:

Rimfire
Bogon - 1/1
poeticoddity - 1/2
Davin Valkri - 1/2
tarlibone - 2/5??


Backup
poeticoddity - 1/2


Carry
Bogon - 1/1
infrared35 - 3/25
poeticoddity - 0/2


Fullsize
Bogon - 1/1
tarlibone - 3/10
poeticoddity - 0/2
Davin Valkri - 0/4


And because two of you have run a .44 Magnum, I'm adding another division: Hand Cannon.

tarlibone - 1/2?
Bogon - 1/3

infrared35 fucked around with this message at 00:24 on Nov 5, 2020

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MantisClaw
Jun 3, 2011


Just to confirm cause Iím going to need to jury rig targets, IDPA scoring zones are 6Ēx 6Ē for the head and 8Ē circle for the body?

bausOfSauce
Nov 5, 2005
master of string cheese

Here's the image I have for idpa spec targets. I think it's correct, but make no guarantee.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

MantisClaw posted:

Just to confirm cause Iím going to need to jury rig targets, IDPA scoring zones are 6Ēx 6Ē for the head and 8Ē circle for the body?

Yeah, that's correct. My computer's acting up and I have no idea where my previous reply went.

Loan Dusty Road
Feb 27, 2007


infrared35 posted:

All stages begin with the firearm in a concealed holster.


If you're passing it easily at the given par time, switch from an open holster to drawing from concealment.

Clarification please.

Hoping to make this challenge this month. I always intend to but Iím a horrible procrastinator.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Loan Dusty Road posted:

Clarification please.

Hoping to make this challenge this month. I always intend to but Iím a horrible procrastinator.

Yeah, my bad. I forgot it started from concealed.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

My wife assured me that my chicken nugget dimensions were off so after some scientific eating research, I have revised the size requirements in the OP.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Glock 26:

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

<this space left intentionally blank, will be updated later. Fuck Lowtax>
Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

infrared35 posted:

My wife assured me that my chicken nugget dimensions were off so after some scientific eating research, I have revised the size requirements in the OP.

OK, good, because my wife's LCP2 was either a bit too big or just barely small enough for a backup gun, and other than those weird little revolvers from NAA (I think), I can't think of a modern gun that's much smaller.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five

My AMG Lab timer is supposed to arrive this weekend and I have ordered IDPA targets which are supposed to arrive in a week or two.
It's finally not "I'm melting" weather, so this should be a fun activity for after I've finished my midterms.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

tarlibone posted:

OK, good, because my wife's LCP2 was either a bit too big or just barely small enough for a backup gun, and other than those weird little revolvers from NAA (I think), I can't think of a modern gun that's much smaller.

Yeah, I was imagining a Glock 26 or J-frame when I wrote it up, but chicken nuggets are smaller than they were when I was a kid. Or Iím bigger. Or both.

Bogon
Nov 7, 2006


So a couple of issues I did this match all 4 stages at 15 yards with a b-29 target. It was busy at the range and I didn't want to screw with people on the range.

Security Six DA only:

(Extra shot right of the head was someone on the range thinking it was his target)

P99c:


Q5 Match:


EAA Witnesses 10mm:


S&W Model 41:


Now for lol 44mag DA only

300gr with lil gun:


240gr Trail Boss:


180gr 31.4gr ww296:


Edit: B-29 target not B-27

Bogon fucked around with this message at 14:14 on Oct 5, 2020

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Dang, is that a half size silhouette? At fifteen yards?

Bogon
Nov 7, 2006


Yea it was fun also I think I could have done better with the trail boss loads but since it's been a while doing DA only with the Redhawk I kinda screwed that up. Also, the people on the range did not appreciate going from trail boss to full house 44 mag loads few of them step away from me I guess double-tapping 44mag is unpleasant for them but fun as hell for me.

Davin Valkri
Apr 8, 2011

Maybe you're weighing the moral pros and cons but let me assure you that OH MY GOD
SHOOT ME IN THE GODDAMNED FACE
WHAT ARE YOU WAITING FOR?!


Took advantage of a dentist's appointment today to take the rest of the day off, go shooting, and run this drill, and familiarize myself with using the shot timer in the process.

This range doesn't allow for concealed carry draws (and I'm not equipped for that anyway), so I did a couple picking the gun up off the bench and a couple starting from low ready. I also don't have any IPDA targets, so I used a small paper plate for the "head" and a larger one for the "body"--hits on the raised portion count.

Ruger Mark IV: Got it in two!


Ruger SR1911: four tries and it didn't work

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

<this space left intentionally blank, will be updated later. Fuck Lowtax>
Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

I actually figured out how to use Splits, and once I turned the volume on my phone up, it was usually good enough. I won't post the times because the range was a little busy and I can't 100% guarantee I got all my shots in on time. Seriously, the parts where I'd shoot once would end up with 3 shots being recorded. I planned on doing this with most of my handguns, but it ended up being just a revolver day--and not my snubby. My wife's LCP2 drops magazines when it's in my hand, and at this point I'm starting to wonder if there's a defect, because I'm pretty sure I'm not hitting the mag release. And I was out of time (only had one hour) before I got to my M&P 9c. So, those I shot just for a bit of fun. Still, I still had a blast. Get it? BLAST. And, I ran through 50 wadcutters in 38 special, and they were Unique powered, so I now have my Dirty rear end Cyrano Load shells ready.

My range doesn't allow drawing from a holster, so all of these runs had the gun on the bench.

First up: Smith & Wesson Model 63, .22/32 Kit Gun. J-frame, 3" barrel, 22 LR. It took a few practice runs and a lot of masking tape, but I eventually got a good run. This is a fun gun, and with a 400 pound DA trigger and a 3" barrel, well, let's just say that precision shooting ain't its forte. But God drat, did I have fun passing this drill. I was also going to try with 22 Shorts, but I ran out of time.


Next, the gun I spent the most time with, and sadly, the one I've been neglecting a little, my Model 686. I ran this with 38 special double-ended wadcutters, handloaded of course with 148 grain lead bullets from Missouri Bullet Company and 3.2 grains of Unique. Needless to say, these are a little dirty. I did a bunch of runs with these, even a few after this particular run, because I love shooting these cartridges. If you have the means, I highly recommend loading them up. (I circled one impact because I wasn't sure if it was clear. I'm counting it as a hit.) I really need more DA practice with this one.


Next, the pistol that's becoming my favorite because large pistol primers are inexplicably easier to find these days: my Model 629. This early run went so well that I took a picture, since I figured it wouldn't get much better. It didn't, but I was starting to run short on time, so I did maybe one more run after this. These are handloaded 44 specials that are astonishingly slow, but really fun to shoot.


Finally, the handcracker run, 44 magnum. Magtech FMJs aren't as bad as many factory loads, but they do pack a wallop, and shooting this drill was quite the challenge. Because of how often I've been shooting the Sledged Hammer here, my aim was pretty good, but full disclosure: I probably had both hands on the gun for this particular run. I did a couple runs by the book, but... yeah, this is a both-hands-kinda exercise.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

I'll be updating the leaderboard in a bit, but I wanted to add that in lieu of running from concealed you can run from a Level II retention or higher duty holster if you want. Because I suspect that may be all I have time to do.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Did it from concealment and it sucked. My IWB holster sits kinda deep and my cover garment was really snaggy. I did six runs with a G19, and only
Got all five hits on two of the runs. And those two runs were sightly over par so they donít count.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Okay, sorry about the delay. Things got fucky. Let me know if there are any scoring errors so far.

Tarlibone - Do you know how many runs you did on each gun, and how many times you passed the drill with each gun?

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

<this space left intentionally blank, will be updated later. Fuck Lowtax>
Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

I'm not sure about the 629, but I only passed it the one time, and I was holding on with both hands that time. I probably ran it three or four times, max.

With the 686, I ran the drill 10 times, and I passed thrice. (I know I used 50 rounds.)

With the 63, I ran it at least five times, passing twice. I'm not sure exactly how many times I ran it.

I gotta do more work on these speedy runs.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

tarlibone posted:

I'm not sure about the 629, but I only passed it the one time, and I was holding on with both hands that time. I probably ran it three or four times, max.

With the 686, I ran the drill 10 times, and I passed thrice. (I know I used 50 rounds.)

With the 63, I ran it at least five times, passing twice. I'm not sure exactly how many times I ran it.

I gotta do more work on these speedy runs.

Updated! Every stage is two-handed except the very first.

I'm planning on doing a subcompact run with a snubbie and the G26. And probably a fullsize run with a G17.

Ideally, all of the above with a cover garment that doesn't significantly slow me down.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Did the drill again with the G19; same cover garment but with an OWB holster instead of AIWB.

And I failed.

The first three facings were fine - good accuracy and under par times with the head shots - and then the last stage my accuracy was good but I went barely over par at 2.56 seconds.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

I ran the drill six times from a Level III duty holster today. And still didnít pass.

I had two clean runs out of the six, but that last stage was always a little over par on every run.

infrared35 fucked around with this message at 22:23 on Oct 30, 2020

Bogon
Nov 7, 2006


I'm going to run this drill Sunday with a bunch of different guns. One of them I know this is impossible and I'm happy being an Idiot but ill try my best with a TOZ-35M in the "I'm a loving moron thinking I can do this under 2.5 seconds class".

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

<this space left intentionally blank, will be updated later. Fuck Lowtax>
Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

I might try this one last time with my Mk IV 22/45, but only without the red dot.

Gives me an excuse to shoot it. Not that I need one.

Ha... and I just noticed the "Hand Cannon Division." Any other takers?

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

tarlibone posted:

Ha... and I just noticed the "Hand Cannon Division." Any other takers?

I should do it. I havenít shot my Model 29 in years.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five

G44 - 1 pass, 1 fail (primer failure)
G17 - 1 fail time, 1 fail accuracy
G19 - 1 fail time, 1 fail time and accuracy
G26 (with 12 round mag) - 1 pass, 1 fail time

This is my first time using a shot timer, so I'm learning a lot about where I need to improve.
Thanks for setting this up, OP.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

poeticoddity posted:

G44 - 1 pass, 1 fail (primer failure)
G17 - 1 fail time, 1 fail accuracy
G19 - 1 fail time, 1 fail time and accuracy
G26 (with 12 round mag) - 1 pass, 1 fail time

This is my first time using a shot timer, so I'm learning a lot about where I need to improve.
Thanks for setting this up, OP.



Leaderboard updated.

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

<this space left intentionally blank, will be updated later. Fuck Lowtax>
Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

I squeezed in a range session instead of a bike ride. It was a just barely 60 degrees Freedomheit, which is good for a ride, but the wind was chilly, and I blasted my legs yesterday anyway. So, a shootin' I went.

About the image gallery below: I didn't want to mess with masking tape, so I figured I would just take a picture after every single run, and then I'd upload them to my computer and just mark the new holes. Sounds simple, right? Here's the thing: I had to hunt for the new holes, and especially with the 9c run, I was hitting a lot of the same spots as time went on, so that wasn't so simple. I should have marked the holes with a pencil or, you know, taped them up like a normal person to avoid confusion. It saved a bunch of time at the range, but it cost me a lot more in GIMP.

Rimfire: Ruger Mark IV 22/45: Beat it on my first try! And that's when I stopped trying. After this, it was target shooting with the stock sights. I didn't need to adjust them, but that front site has got to go.


Snub nose revolver: Taurus 605, 357 magnum, firing light 38 special handloads. It took 5 tries to pass. I only brought 30 rounds; the first 5 were shot at a target to see where the gun was printing with these bullets. (Just a little low.)


1: ; 2: ; 3: ; 4: ; 5:

Compact carry pistol: Smith & Wesson M&P [mk 1] 9c: I just barely passed the drill--on my one successful run, I'm counting the borderline hit that broke the circle, although if it's too much of an edge case, I'm OK with this not counting. I kept running the drill afterward, but with not-so-great results. I shoot way better with the magazine that has the pinky extension. Switching from one to the other is where the real fun begins, though.


1: ; 2: ; 3: ; 4: ; 5: ; 6: ; 7: ; 8:

tarlibone fucked around with this message at 00:15 on Nov 1, 2020

Bogon
Nov 7, 2006


So last rounds for me this is still like last 15 yards.

Not sure what to call this class but

Fusion long slide 10mm



I forgot how fast this pistol is i was averaging .9 from the draw the double from the draw total was 1.1 i always forget how fast the trigger is on this pistol.

Now for the im a loving idiot round for speed shooting a free class pistol.



gently caress i tried so god drat hard. While working out a technique to do this in 2.5 seconds and i just couldnít do it. While training for a technique that world work I managed a 3.1 on the double from laying on the table hands up to draw bang reload bang. The singles i was able to manage 1.1. In the above i averaged 1.3ish on the singles 3.8 on the double as the second shot hung up on the reload. I Failed and tore the sit up out of my hand slipping it in and out of the grip loading and cocking it but i had fun on it. I failed the but fun times trying to speed shoot a single shot breach loaded pistol.

poeticoddity
Jan 14, 2007
"How nice - to feel nothing and still get full credit for being alive." - Kurt Vonnegut Jr. - Slaughterhouse Five

Bogon posted:

So last rounds for me this is still like last 15 yards.

Not sure what to call this class but

Fusion long slide 10mm



I forgot how fast this pistol is i was averaging .9 from the draw the double from the draw total was 1.1 i always forget how fast the trigger is on this pistol.

Now for the im a loving idiot round for speed shooting a free class pistol.



gently caress i tried so god drat hard. While working out a technique to do this in 2.5 seconds and i just couldnít do it. While training for a technique that world work I managed a 3.1 on the double from laying on the table hands up to draw bang reload bang. The singles i was able to manage 1.1. In the above i averaged 1.3ish on the singles 3.8 on the double as the second shot hung up on the reload. I Failed and tore the sit up out of my hand slipping it in and out of the grip loading and cocking it but i had fun on it. I failed the but fun times trying to speed shoot a single shot breach loaded pistol.

FWIW, if those targets are the ones I'm thinking of, they're significantly smaller than IDPA targets.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

poeticoddity posted:

FWIW, if those targets are the ones I'm thinking of, they're significantly smaller than IDPA targets.

Yeah, those are half-size at best. Crazy.

Wa11y
Jul 23, 2002

Did I say "cookies?" I meant, "Fire in your face!"

infrared35 posted:

Yeah, those are half-size at best. Crazy.

I have some 1/3 (and 1/4 size) IPSC targets I cut out, can I do the test at 1 yard, 1.6 yards, 2.3 yards, and 3.3 yards with the 1/3 IPSC? I may have to use my pocket knife for the first test at 1 yard.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Wa11y posted:

I have some 1/3 (and 1/4 size) IPSC targets I cut out, can I do the test at 1 yard, 1.6 yards, 2.3 yards, and 3.3 yards with the 1/3 IPSC? I may have to use my pocket knife for the first test at 1 yard.

Go hog wild! The only real difference is that your bullets are effectively three times larger on the target, so tagging a scoring ring is easier. But I say do it. In fact, do it with a big-bore handgun if you can, for maximum hilarity.

Wa11y
Jul 23, 2002

Did I say "cookies?" I meant, "Fire in your face!"

infrared35 posted:

Go hog wild! The only real difference is that your bullets are effectively three times larger on the target, so tagging a scoring ring is easier. But I say do it. In fact, do it with a big-bore handgun if you can, for maximum hilarity.

I was just joking, but if I get any range time, I may bring along some of the mini IPSCs and give it a try. I might start with my suppressed Ruger 22/45, which is hilariously long, and I'm certain I could touch the target with the muzzle at 1 yard.

I think the biggest bore I have is .45ACP. Might have to bring a couple targets, since I'm thinking muzzle contact may blow them apart.

gently caress, I suck at math. I'm looking at my decimal distances, and trying to make it easier with a fractional tape measure, when after doing all the math I realize that 1 yard is 3 feet, so if reducing the target to 1/3 reduces the distance to 1/3, just replace yards with feet. 3 feet, 5 feet, 7 feet, 10 feet.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

I did twelve more runs at this drat drill, finally passing three times by the end.

Edit: crap, Iíve been using 4.75Ē circles instead of a 6Ē square for the head, and Iíve been using the same 4.75Ē circles for my body shots at seven yards instead of a 8Ē circle at ten yards. An 8Ē circle at ten yards translates to a 5.6Ē circle at seven yards, so Iíve probably been passing more than Iíve been giving myself credit for. Story of my life, making things harder on myself.

I have an idea for another match - one that doesnít require a timer. I can make a new post, or save it for later if someone else has something.

infrared35 fucked around with this message at 00:34 on Nov 5, 2020

Tyro
Nov 10, 2009


I'm going to try to go to the range tomorrow, I was only planning to zero some rifles but if I have time l'll try to run this a few times too.

tarlibone
Aug 1, 2014

<this space left intentionally blank, will be updated later. Fuck Lowtax>
Am I a... bad person?
AM I??




Fun Shoe

Eye, four won, am awl fore a match with know thyme limit.

infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

Bogon posted:

In the above i averaged 1.3ish on the singles 3.8 on the double as the second shot hung up on the reload.

I just wanted to give props to this again. Thatís really not bad for a single shot with a reload. On the MDFI qual, youíre shooting a fist-sized target at five yards, and you have to draw-shoot-reload-shoot in less than six seconds.

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infrared35
Jan 12, 2005

border patrol qt


Plaster Town Cop

And just to cement my shame: I picked a five-round drill to conserve ammo. I then proceeded to fail it over and over. I finally passed it three times after having burned through nearly three boxes of ammo. And then I discovered I had largely been wasting ammo trying to pass the test since I was using targets that were too small.

Silver lining is that I can pass the drill on a smaller target?

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