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MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

El Gallinero Gros posted:

Apparently an idea ESPN is floating is thus

OKC receives:
#4 Pick
Aron Baynes for salary purposes


TOR receives:
Shai Gilgeous-Alexander, then offers him mad duckets

This would be insanely stupid for OKC. Shai is really good there is no reason for them to not just max him themselves. Jalen Suggs is a nice prospect but he'd have to hit his like 99.9% outcome to give them what Shai does.

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Metapod
Mar 18, 2012
Shai is not being traded I don't know why anyone thinks 22 year old star isn't in okcs time-line

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
The hardest part of a rebuild is finding a legit star to build around and they already have that part done, why would they be trying to go backwards?

Also yeah SGA is like two months older than Davion Mitchell who is about to go top 10 in this draft.

Declan MacManus
Sep 1, 2011

damn i'm really in this bitch

sga is not going anywhere and he triple especially isnít going to fuckin toronto

morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming
I feel like that SGA thing has been posted like three times. It was like one of six fake trades in a garbage filler article, relax

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010

morestuff posted:

I feel like that SGA thing has been posted like three times. It was like one of six fake trades in a garbage filler article, relax

I'd just seen it, my bad!

What's the story with this Sengun guy?

Dejan Bimble
Mar 24, 2008

we're all black friends
Plaster Town Cop

El Gallinero Gros posted:

I'd just seen it, my bad!

What's the story with this Sengun guy?

Check the draft thread, we've been posting about him over the last few days

morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming

El Gallinero Gros posted:

I'd just seen it, my bad!

What's the story with this Sengun guy?

No worries, I should also relax

Veryslightlymad
Jun 3, 2007

I fight with
my brain
and with an
underlying
hatred of the
Erebonian
Noble Faction

El Gallinero Gros posted:

I'd just seen it, my bad!

What's the story with this Sengun guy?

He's an incredibly intriguing throwback prospect.

The best thing about him is his ability to score in the low post. Once drafted, his post footwork would be among the best in the NBA immediately. This is a teenager with a full-on torture chamber. He prefers his dominant hand, but his footwork is so good he can usually get a shot off with the preferred hand regardless. Keep in mind, he can still score with the other hand. He just prefers not to. He's ridiculously patient. He's got some nasty up and unders and drop steps and spin moves without picking up his wrong foot. He'll toss a succession of post moves at a guy to dig out his shot.

Making this even better is his second best trait, his passing and general feel for the game. I'll talk about passing first. Sengun is a willing passer, but he's also an audacious and creative passer. He'll throw from really weird angles and just completely blindside the defense. He'll throw no-look and behind the back passes as a big man. He'll throw those wide side-arm whip passes to get angles. He can angle a bounce pass. He'll pass from the post, he'll pass from outside to cutters or an open corner, and he'll pass from the short roll. While he's definitely better if he has a second to make a read, he shows flashes of making a rapid decision touch pass. If he has a drawback with passing, it's that sometimes he can be a little too gutsy or cute, and it might cause a turnover. If he can apply the discipline he shows in the post to his approach to passing, he could take a big jump here, too.

Feel of the game is the other big thing he has going for him. Sengun seems to have a knack for knowing where players are on the court, as well as how the ball is going to travel. He's a very good rebounder, is quick to box out, and frequently shifts just a little bit during a box out because he's guessed the angle before the ball comes off the rim. This predictive ability makes him quite solid on tip ins. On defense, he's got a knack for finding angles and controlling himself--going straight up and not fouling, or sticking with his man when he's beaten and getting the angle and timing right for a block from behind. He's gotten a lot of blocks. I talked about passing up above, and his floor awareness is another thing that helps with it. He seems to know where his teammates are, and what weird angle he'd have to use to hit them, and he has the balls to actually try it if he thinks he can pull it off. All these things make him fun to watch. Like, at this point, as long as he's good enough, I want him in the league just because he's fun.

He's not super explosive, but he can take off if he's given room to. Given an open lane, he can and has dunked on guys with some nasty power finishes with either or both hands. He has blocked perimeter players attempting 3s on closeouts a couple of times. (Although, that he had enough space to get that much of a run at it speaks to one of his negatives, I'll talk about that in a sec)

From a raw statistics standpoint, as a teenager going against grown men in the Turkish Super League, a pretty good basketball league, (better than NCAA, at any rate) Sengun led the league in Points, Offensive Rebounds, and Field Goal Percentage (and effective field goal percentage), while being second place in Total Rebounds, Blocks, True Shooting Percentage and Free Throw Attempts. And third in Free Throws Made. He shoots 81% from Free Throw range, which hopefully indicates he can extend his range in time. At any rate, he put up those stats on only 28 minutes per game, making him way outside the top 10 in minutes per game. For this, he was named the Turkish Super League's MVP.

If you deliberately mis-interpreted his last name (Pronounced Shen Goon) as a Japanese "Shin" and the English word "Goon" (instead of Turkish) his name would mean something like "True Holy Sainted Hero of the Goons". (I think the real meaning of Sengun is closer to something like "happy day." So Heroic Saint of the Happy Day is still pretty good.)

The big drawbacks and question marks he has are fairly big:

His side-to-side movement is fairly limited. His hips don't have the same fluidity of the rest of him. There's serious questions on his defense, especially in a league as explosive and movement heavy as the NBA. He's got some trouble closing out when he has to switch to a perimeter threat. There's a serious question mark on if he could be played right off the court in the NBA.

Personally, I think his positioning reads outweigh this, and he has the potential to be a fairly good NBA defender. Not an actually good defender, mind you, but a guy that wouldn't necessarily be a big net negative. As it stands, I'm still in the corner that "His offense probably already makes up for his defense" and he could have a long, productive NBA career. His current offense with the floor of his defense is still probably a guy that could come off the bench and find you points. I think his floor looks something like if Luis Scola came into the NBA 10 years earlier in his career and was a better passer. He doesn't have the Scola Scoop though.

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
Turkish league is probably the second best domestic league in Europe behind the Spanish league which would make it the third best in the world (or fourth depending on how you count the Euroleague I guess). Being that good in a league like that when he's 18 pretty much guarantees that he isn't going to be a bad NBA player, even if his style of play and athleticism probably limits the upside a fair bit unless he's going to be literally Jokic which is probably not a path you want to bet on anyone following. I think best case is probably something in the valanciunas or vucevic mold, a very good regular season starter who is going to get less valuable the deeper into the playoffs you get, which is still a good player. I would personally swing on a higher ceiling wing in the lottery but he probably has the highest floor in the draft short of the obvious guys like Cade.

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010

Veryslightlymad posted:

He's an incredibly intriguing throwback prospect.

The best thing about him is his ability to score in the low post. Once drafted, his post footwork would be among the best in the NBA immediately. This is a teenager with a full-on torture chamber. He prefers his dominant hand, but his footwork is so good he can usually get a shot off with the preferred hand regardless. Keep in mind, he can still score with the other hand. He just prefers not to. He's ridiculously patient. He's got some nasty up and unders and drop steps and spin moves without picking up his wrong foot. He'll toss a succession of post moves at a guy to dig out his shot.

Making this even better is his second best trait, his passing and general feel for the game. I'll talk about passing first. Sengun is a willing passer, but he's also an audacious and creative passer. He'll throw from really weird angles and just completely blindside the defense. He'll throw no-look and behind the back passes as a big man. He'll throw those wide side-arm whip passes to get angles. He can angle a bounce pass. He'll pass from the post, he'll pass from outside to cutters or an open corner, and he'll pass from the short roll. While he's definitely better if he has a second to make a read, he shows flashes of making a rapid decision touch pass. If he has a drawback with passing, it's that sometimes he can be a little too gutsy or cute, and it might cause a turnover. If he can apply the discipline he shows in the post to his approach to passing, he could take a big jump here, too.

Feel of the game is the other big thing he has going for him. Sengun seems to have a knack for knowing where players are on the court, as well as how the ball is going to travel. He's a very good rebounder, is quick to box out, and frequently shifts just a little bit during a box out because he's guessed the angle before the ball comes off the rim. This predictive ability makes him quite solid on tip ins. On defense, he's got a knack for finding angles and controlling himself--going straight up and not fouling, or sticking with his man when he's beaten and getting the angle and timing right for a block from behind. He's gotten a lot of blocks. I talked about passing up above, and his floor awareness is another thing that helps with it. He seems to know where his teammates are, and what weird angle he'd have to use to hit them, and he has the balls to actually try it if he thinks he can pull it off. All these things make him fun to watch. Like, at this point, as long as he's good enough, I want him in the league just because he's fun.

He's not super explosive, but he can take off if he's given room to. Given an open lane, he can and has dunked on guys with some nasty power finishes with either or both hands. He has blocked perimeter players attempting 3s on closeouts a couple of times. (Although, that he had enough space to get that much of a run at it speaks to one of his negatives, I'll talk about that in a sec)

From a raw statistics standpoint, as a teenager going against grown men in the Turkish Super League, a pretty good basketball league, (better than NCAA, at any rate) Sengun led the league in Points, Offensive Rebounds, and Field Goal Percentage (and effective field goal percentage), while being second place in Total Rebounds, Blocks, True Shooting Percentage and Free Throw Attempts. And third in Free Throws Made. He shoots 81% from Free Throw range, which hopefully indicates he can extend his range in time. At any rate, he put up those stats on only 28 minutes per game, making him way outside the top 10 in minutes per game. For this, he was named the Turkish Super League's MVP.

If you deliberately mis-interpreted his last name (Pronounced Shen Goon) as a Japanese "Shin" and the English word "Goon" (instead of Turkish) his name would mean something like "True Holy Sainted Hero of the Goons". (I think the real meaning of Sengun is closer to something like "happy day." So Heroic Saint of the Happy Day is still pretty good.)

The big drawbacks and question marks he has are fairly big:

His side-to-side movement is fairly limited. His hips don't have the same fluidity of the rest of him. There's serious questions on his defense, especially in a league as explosive and movement heavy as the NBA. He's got some trouble closing out when he has to switch to a perimeter threat. There's a serious question mark on if he could be played right off the court in the NBA.

Personally, I think his positioning reads outweigh this, and he has the potential to be a fairly good NBA defender. Not an actually good defender, mind you, but a guy that wouldn't necessarily be a big net negative. As it stands, I'm still in the corner that "His offense probably already makes up for his defense" and he could have a long, productive NBA career. His current offense with the floor of his defense is still probably a guy that could come off the bench and find you points. I think his floor looks something like if Luis Scola came into the NBA 10 years earlier in his career and was a better passer. He doesn't have the Scola Scoop though.

This is a restaurant quality writeup, thanks

He sounds like Kevin McHale, kinda

R.D. Mangles
Jan 10, 2004


Lol
https://twitter.com/CAlexander/status/1412773555750776839?s=20

Dexo
Aug 15, 2009

A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.

https://twitter.com/chicagobulls/status/1412775599907782659

Vinestalk
Jul 2, 2011
I know I'm late to the post and the hallmark tier welcome posts are probably whatever for almost everybody, but Welcome Hawks fans.

Trae young is a ridiculously good player and he is not the only young, ridiculously good player in Atlanta. I'm not even worried about shooting foul rule changes because Trae is too smart to let those hold him back. This team is fun and one of the most entertaining in the league. Losing this close to the finals is always going to hurt but this team was 18-27 before Nate took over and there is no reason to believe this hawks team couldn't be the "Bubble Suns," of the East.

Grand Theft Autobot
Feb 28, 2008

I'm something of a fucking idiot myself
Plus the East is full of fraud teams, so Atlanta should be feasting for years.

R.D. Mangles
Jan 10, 2004


Grand Theft Autobot posted:

Plus the East is full of fraud teams, so Atlanta should be feasting for years.

a person who hasn't considered what might happen if the bulls are BACK

Lockback
Sep 3, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.

R.D. Mangles posted:

a person who hasn't considered what might happen if the bulls are BACK

Play-in teams take notice!

Lockback
Sep 3, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.
Crud, Anthony Edwards limping out of Team USA practice:
https://streamable.com/dx7wmo

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?

Lockback posted:

Crud, Anthony Edwards limping out of Team USA practice:
https://streamable.com/dx7wmo

He sprained his ankle. Doesn't sound like it's anything too bad he just won't be able to do Team USA stuff.

Lockback
Sep 3, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.

MourningView posted:

He sprained his ankle. Doesn't sound like it's anything too bad he just won't be able to do Team USA stuff.

Yeah, its not a torn ACL or anything but some Team USA reps would have been a good opportunity for him I think.

Azathoth
Apr 3, 2001

Well, my heart just lept up into my throat for a second there. Good to hear it's just a sprain though...

Salvor_Hardin
Sep 13, 2005

I want to go protest.
Nap Ghost

Lockback posted:

Yeah, its not a torn ACL or anything but some Team USA reps would have been a good opportunity for him I think.

This is true. I also assume a big benefit toward being in those things is the glad-handing with other star players and totally legal and cool tampering opportunities.

Telluric Whistler
Sep 14, 2008


Salvor_Hardin posted:

This is true. I also assume a big benefit toward being in those things is the glad-handing with other star players and totally legal and cool tampering opportunities.

That and Ant seems like a confidence elemental and I can only assume dunking on 4th/5th string national team players would bring him into next season in peak form

Paracaidas
Sep 24, 2016
Consistently Tedious!
I've been out of touch with the NBA hivemind lately due to life and other things---how unmoveable is Tobais Harris after the season he had? I know coming off of last year he was on :lol:island with Love and Blake, but has this season built him back to simply a bad contract?

Curious what Philly could bring back for him if they attached the pick(s) they get in a Simmons trade. Is that a legitimate starter on a bad deal (as with Wiggins+ for DLo), a legitimate starter + nonmax overpay (Hield + Barnes?), or do those undersell his value with a quality pick?

Telluric Whistler posted:

That and Ant seems like a confidence elemental and I can only assume dunking on 4th/5th string national team players would bring him into next season in peak form
I assume Ant believes he would have posterized the 4th string but for the ankle and picks up the confidence boost that way.

Lockback
Sep 3, 2006

All days are nights to see till I see thee; and nights bright days when dreams do show me thee.

Paracaidas posted:

I've been out of touch with the NBA hivemind lately due to life and other things---how unmoveable is Tobais Harris after the season he had? I know coming off of last year he was on :lol:island with Love and Blake, but has this season built him back to simply a bad contract?

Curious what Philly could bring back for him if they attached the pick(s) they get in a Simmons trade. Is that a legitimate starter on a bad deal (as with Wiggins+ for DLo), a legitimate starter + nonmax overpay (Hield + Barnes?), or do those undersell his value with a quality pick?

Harris's contract is way more neutral than bad. They could probably pretty easily move him if they really wanted to, but you're not getting a star player back or anything. If you traded Simmons and Harris for like Barnes or Hield the 76ers are going to be a pretty bad team.

Harris fits really well next to Embiid, and now that he's playing a more natural position I'm not sure why you'd want to get away from him. How the cap works in the NBA, it's not like giving Harris that contract stopped them from giving it to someone else. He's an overpay but a normal bird-rights overpay you do in that situation.

Redgrendel2001
Sep 1, 2006

you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

https://twitter.com/dribblecity/status/1413374118892904452?s=19

Dexo
Aug 15, 2009

A city that was to live by night after the wilderness had passed. A city that was to forge out of steel and blood-red neon its own peculiar wilderness.

Looks silly, but he worked with Portis on his shot

So maybe that poo poo works.

Bobby Digital
Sep 4, 2009

https://twitter.com/ervcas/status/1413521130535546887?s=21

Rick
Feb 23, 2004
When I was 17, my father was so stupid, I didn't want to be seen with him in public. When I was 24, I was amazed at how much the old man had learned in just 7 years.

Dexo posted:

Looks silly, but he worked with Portis on his shot

So maybe that poo poo works.

Those guys all shot great in certain parts of the season that unfortunately did not include the playoffs.

hifi
Jul 25, 2012


same vibes https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BZIWkhCcU1k

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
Shooting the three is just like shooting a pheasant, you have to lead the target.

morestuff
Aug 2, 2008

You can't stop what's coming
Between "Nikola Jovic" and this guy I'm convinced we're living in a 2K simulated draft

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/1413900928793649156?s=20

MourningView
Sep 2, 2006


Is this Heaven?
For the record Kenneth Lofton Jr is not the son of That Kenny Lofton but he does rule look at this husky king

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010

morestuff posted:

Between "Nikola Jovic" and this guy I'm convinced we're living in a 2K simulated draft

https://twitter.com/DraftExpress/status/1413900928793649156?s=20

Kenny Lofton, eh?

It's funny that they aren't related, especially since Kenny originally attended Arizona to play basketball, I think he's one of a few who played in WS and Final Four

El Gallinero Gros fucked around with this message at 21:47 on Jul 10, 2021

kingcobweb
Apr 16, 2005
Chet is an inspiration to tall skinny guys everywhere

Algund Eenboom
May 4, 2014

https://twitter.com/abovethebreak3/status/1413666627699331075

Redgrendel2001
Sep 1, 2006

you literally think a person saying their NBA team of choice being better than the fucking 76ers is a 'schtick'

a literal thing you think.

https://twitter.com/DaRealSkeet/status/1413842638273396740?s=19

Dejan Bimble
Mar 24, 2008

we're all black friends
Plaster Town Cop
Theres no need for hyperbole. Shes very good. Shes not the best drivbler on planet earth. We should respect what things are without having to imagine them as something theyre not.

Victor is too much. The victor tanking will be egregious

Vinestalk
Jul 2, 2011
I hope we see a YouTube video in a year or two where she crosses Curry at a kids summer camp

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Vinestalk
Jul 2, 2011

Dejan Bimble posted:

Theres no need for hyperbole. Shes very good. Shes not the best drivbler on planet earth. We should respect what things are without having to imagine them as something theyre not.

Victor is too much. The victor tanking will be egregious

I don't think she's getting any more or less hype than other young dribbling phenoms like Jordan McCabe. I think all the tweets and clips are just appreciation of someone who's doing cool things in life.

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