Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Boksi
Jan 11, 2016

Einander posted:

But on the other hand, WhiteNight is a controlling monster of incredible power whose most notable feature is its many wings. Once it was beneficial, but once it amassed enough power it showed its true face and used its previous blessings to assert control over everything, down to restricting basic tools you use to interact with the world. It has many pawns with which it exercises that power. That sounds a lot more like the Head to me.

Reading symbolism like this is mostly tea leaves, really.

But Apocalypse Bird is already the Head, you can't double dip on narrative theming like that... Can you?

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

NullBlack
Oct 29, 2011

I'm as confused as you are.

Boksi posted:

But Apocalypse Bird is already the Head, you can't double dip on narrative theming like that... Can you?

possibly; if what's represented by the symbols is sufficiently different. The Birds symbolize the division of power and roles within the Head, and possibly that the Head started out with noble intentions. WhiteNight could represent the self-righteous/"Big Brother"ish nature of the Head's rule, if you believe that's an accurate description of the Head. If.
It could be a double dip, but I personally think it's more likely WhiteNight (and One Sin) symbolize someone/something else

GilliamYaeger
Jan 10, 2012

Call Gespenst!
Considering the poo poo Carmen's seemingly doing right now, especially the correlation between WhiteNight's monstrous, formerly-human apostles and her apparent guidance of Argalia's Distortion squad, the resemblance WhiteNight has to Carmen's nervous system (bulbous head and a multitude of "wings" branching off a singular "tail"...complete with red eyes), how Roland gets the impression that she's a cult leader from how the Sephirah describe her, how her goal is to cure the people of the City of a nebulous disease while WhiteNight first appears as a plague doctor that grows more angelic as it gains more followers, and finally how her plan to bring salvation to the City was ruined at the last moment by the last member of the LobCorp cult to be born betraying the plan at the last moment? A betrayal that was enabled/prompted by Ayin, represented by One Sin?

I'm pretty sure that WhiteNight represents Carmen and/or LobCorp itself, not the Head.

Einander
Sep 14, 2008

"Yeh've forged a magnificent sword."

"This one's only practice. The real sword I intend to forge will be three times longer."

"Can there really be a sword as monstrous as that in this world?"

"Yes. I can see that sword... Somewhere out there..."
The big hole in the "WhiteNight = LobCorp" analogy, as I see it, is that the traitorous Apostle Confessing to One Sin isn't the only answer to a WhiteNight breach. The better answer, presented by the game, is to stand and fight, by which you win the real reward of the Paradise Lost EGO weapon. And what's the analogue to that, if WhiteNight is Carmen, Ayin and their plan? It can't be for Angela to have confronted them, because the traitorous apostle has no key role in the "stand and fight" ending. It can't involve the Sephirah either, they're the Apostles and the Apostles don't help you beat WhiteNight. What is the happier ending the game is suggesting could and should have happened that didn't involve Angela or the Sephirah changing roles? Especially since the most likely people to stand and fight against an unveiled LobCorp would be the powers that be of the City, who are very definitely worse.

The "WhiteNight = Head" analogy has a more satisfying answer to that question, I think: the answer isn't to accept death and trust other people to find an actual solution. Angela does say that she betrayed the plan at the last moment in part because she had no acknowledgment in its "happy ending." She didn't have to in Ayin's plan, because he could tie a neat bow on everything by ending it all. He chose the easy way out, because he was tired.

Analogies are always something of a "square peg in a round hole" situation, but that version of the analogy feels a little more complete to me.

TeeQueue
Oct 9, 2012

The time has come. Soon, the bell shall ring. A new world will come. Rise, my servants. Rise and serve me. I am death and life. Darkness and light.
Philosophy—830.40—Big Bird

Music: Lobby


So those are the masks you have chosen for yourselves today?

The mask doesn't matter. What's underneath is ultimately the same.

Aww… but the shiny gold bits make it easier to keep my thinking all straight and stuff… and this pose makes me look super intimidating!

Yeah. I'm like… "Don't mess with me, or you're going through a wall," or something?

I see… Then, come.

Today we're taking all three of the named Liu Key Pages out for a spin. Our loadout is also all things from Liu, with a slight splash of Thumb in each deck as well. As this is an Abnormality Battle, we're focused on SR recovery and Solidarity's +1 Strength from turn 2 onward.



You've arrived. In that case, I'll send you inside now.

A moment, if you would.

…Yes?

There is more meaning in their struggle should these three children handle the fight themselves. I would stay behind and observe alongside you.

There isn't any precedent for this. Should they not be able to finish the battle alone…

I don't mind a bit! Monopolizing the cuties is a-OK by me~

Miss Binah needs a break anyways. She did all of the work fighting The Red Mist, before.

…Very well. If you insist, we'll give it a try.

SNAP

Music: AbnormalityBattle02


Cutie spotted! Dibs! I have dibs! You all heard me!!

It's awake. That means trouble.

So we've got to put it to sleep, then?

Ehhh..? But I wanna feel its sharp teeth clamping right down around our neck again! That's how it shows love, you know.

Its love leads it to 'save' us, by killing us before anything else can. We've learned it 73 times. We don't need any more.

Miss Binah would be sad if we failed. Let's take care of our work properly, okay?

Boooooo.

Big Bird posted:

No one has to worry. You’ll be safe as long as I’m here.

It’s time to patrol the forest.

Let’s brighten the road ahead, so I can have a good view of the lives I must save.

I always roam the forest. Who knows, maybe there are children out there who need my help?

I should do something for the safety of creatures in the forest.



Big Bird has Ineffective resistances to everything, and its attacks cannot be redirected in any way. Because of this, it is a very obvious non-target whose abilities we'll have to manage as we fight its two sidekicks.



The Eyeball Chicks are simple opponents as well, and when defeated they'll add a unique Combat Page to the hand of whoever landed the final blow. The flow of the battle is nice and simple… so what's the catch?



The catch is Dazzle. Lobotomy Corporation veterans likely remember Big Bird's gimmick of hypnotizing Agents to walk right up to it so it can instantly bite their heads off. This page is part 1 of that process, instantly enchanting an ally to approach so the bird can finish them off.



Its other dice are both copies of Patrol, which gives Big Bird a massive number of Block dice, only able to be overcome by our strongest attacks. We really have no reason to be attacking this thing.




The Eyeball chicks are each using the same two attacks this turn. Ocular Stab is the first one, and its first die imposes a hefty Bind penalty on whoever it hits. Get used to that, as most of their attacks are based on speed manipulation somehow.



Nip is their other attack this turn, a 3-hit combo that gains +3 Power if the Eyeball Chick is outspeeding its target. We're all resistant to Pierce damage, so it's not a major concern.



Eeehehehehe… the cutie's coming right at me! Let's see what you've got for me today, you big palooka~ :swoon:



You always loved being sung to sleep, didn't you? Then accept my feelings as well!

A counter die from a page like Emotional Turbulence will handle the 1 damage from Big Bird's Dazzle, but it's really not worth it.



Your arms can't fit around that bird, silly! It's too big.

It's okay… the cutie's just excited right now! And now I'm feelin' all kindsa funny, too…

The block die will bonk us for some big Stagger damage when we run into it with a Counter. Still, we wanted the damage output of Emotional Turbulence elsewhere.



Hey! This one just stabbed me right in the eye! That means… Um…



Stab. It. Back.



Oh yeah! I guess it's an eye for an eye. :keke:



This mini-cutie's only got one of them, though! We'll wind up with eyes to spare…

Wait, am I forgetting something?



Oooh, quit your looming! I'll remember it jiffy-quicklike!



That's right! I'm supposed to be hypnotized! Oh cutie, please wait over there for meeee..!

Is she just playing along with it..?

Does it matter?

Mmm, I guess not! Let's help out.

Big Bird but someone is enchanted posted:

If I kill them first… then no one would be killed by the beast!

A big, scary monster lives in this forest! Be careful.

Come over here… I’ll watch over you.

I’ll be sad if you got hurt. I’ll protect you.

It’s my job to protect children in peril.



Enchanted is a special status effect that's applied by Big Bird's Dazzle, and it launches us into the main phase of the fight: one of our Librarians becomes uncontrollable, and tries to attack Big Bird with a special combat page that is…



…Not the best. Meanwhile, Big Bird waits with a special surprise for them when they get close.



Salvation is a chunky 30-30 Counter Slash die that instantly kills Enchanted Librarians on hit. If Just Mizu walks up to it, she's 100% dead.

So… how do we stop her?



For those who the Abnormalities have corrupted, there's only one fate.

Beat her up it is!

To stop an Enchanted Librarian, we have two options. The first is to have someone run into the 30 Counter die before she can hit it. This plan is dumb, and will get us killed. The second plan is Birdcage.



Bonking a Librarian with this will break one of their Speed Dice, and immobilize them for the next turn. Because Just Mizu has two Speed Dice, each of our two remaining Mizus will have to use a copy. This leaves them with only two dice to defend against four dice of attacks from the Eyeball Chicks, all of which are Nip this turn.

We also got a little lucky here, Huge Mizu's 4 Bind could have left her Speed at nothing but 1s this turn, making it a crapshoot whether or not she'd be able to intercept Just Mizu before she smacked facefirst into a Bird.



We'll be relying on Counter dice to keep the Eyeball Chicks from overwhelming us, while we make sure Just Mizu can't get herself killed next turn either.



It's our fault, you know. It's always been, at least in part.



Gh… don't be silly, Patchy! You know I'm the one that's lemony fresh. I don't know anything at all.

If we hadn't helped. Hadn't stood in the way of our friends. Maybe none of this would be happening.



You're the reason why everyone hates us!

Owies!



Aww… go easy on her. She just wanted to live and do the things she loved.



And it made us a perfectly useful little tool to the end. Our hands held a scythe that reaped their hope. A hundred deaths wouldn't be enough.



…You're just unlucky, bird. If I didn't have orders, I'd let you "save" us as much as you wanted.



Awawawawa… Everything's all spinny…!

Looks like she's finally done being a problem.

Then now's our chance! I think we scared those eyeball thingies.



All of the Eyeball Chicks' dice are using Clumsy Jog this turn, a pair of decent Evade dice that will inflict 2 bind on the Chicks should they lose a clash. Sturdy Defense is ideal for handling them, as the first die will guarantee an Evade vs Evade draw, and the second die will deal big Stagger damage as it can't lose to their second Evade die. The attack at the end is just a bonus.



They can run, but they can't hide!

Why let them pick either?



Hey, good point! Sit right there and take it, you!



Hey… mask. Shouldn't you be awake by now? Enough playing around.



Mmm… but I was having fuun! Lookatit! So majestique!

But we're supposed to beat it up! Or would that be 'saving' it, in this case?

Saving a cutie by stomping all over it…



Okee-doke! I'll help out!

After two turns of being Enchanted, our Librarian is back to normal and Big Bird swaps back to its Dazzle attack. This time, it's Punished Mizu's turn.



Don't like how it's staring at me.

Just open your arms and accept it! The brain-tinglys feel amazing.



I'd rather die.



Good news! I beat this one up… and it made a little tune as it died!

Really? I didn't hear anything at all!

It's a catchy li'l ditty, but it was really quiet.



Ooh, ooh, I wanna' hear it!

You held back…

Well, yeah. It's a cutie? Duh??

If you want to kill… you can't play around.



You have to commit.

Aww! No fair! I still can't hear it.

The big one was right. It is catchy…



I'll throw myself in this thing's mouth to get it out of my head.

Hey! No fair skipping ahead!

The light… is so calming.



I'll try singing it to sleep. Hold Patchy back, okay?

Darn tootin' I will! Nobody's getting nommed on today but ME!

Lullaby is a 3-cost page that Staggers Big Bird next turn. When hit by Lullaby, any current Enchantment will end instantly, meaning that it's optimal to try and clash Salvation with Lullaby and not hit our Enchanted Librarian at all.



I didn't know that at the time, so instead here's some trivia: Our non-Enchanted Librarians always get exactly enough Birdcages to completely stop the Enchanted Librarian, no matter how many Speed Dice they have.



Hands off the cutie!



Ooh, it fell right asleep as soon as I got the first three notes!

Aww… it's got such a pretty li'l sleeping face!

Both Salvation and Patrol are reduced down to 1 Power when clashing against Lullaby, making it nearly always safe to use.



You're right… it is pretty.

Then let's beat the heck out of it! I don't usually get to do this kind of work on this cutie… so exciting~!

You don't? Why not?

Lullaby doesn't leave our deck once we've gotten it, so between Punished Mizu and Huge Mizu both having one, it's trivial to draw our way into having one any time we need it. This fight is basically over.

Sleeping Big Bird posted:

……



………



The Eyeball Chicks do have one final attack in Intense Stare, which can force us to target them and thereby stop us from keeping our Enchanted Librarian from ramming facefirst into a Salvation and dying… but so long as we win the clash it's not a problem. Sturdy Defense is really good here, as well.



Oh, that's 'cuz this isn't the best way to produce Enkephalin… For that you wanna' pet it gently and coo in its ear while you tell it that it's doing a good job. That makes it just kaboosh, you know?



And if you handled it while it was awake?



We haven't done that in a few thousand deaths. It was too inefficient.



I miss the old days of having to keep it between the light and you before it fries your senses and chomps you right in two! But all the running made me dizzy. The things you do for cuties~



It sounds like a real handful to take care of… but a fulfilling job, overall!

It was super fulfilling!

Aside from getting a limb bitten off.



Ultimately, Big Bird is pretty easy as long as we take down the Eyeball Chicks as quickly as possible. In an absolute worst-case scenario, we can clash Salvation with a Block die to try and blunt the blow—two of them will probably Stagger a Librarian, but it's better to eat one instance of big damage than to lose a Librarian outright. The Philosophy floor's ability to get to Emotion Level 5 from the very start helps a lot with keeping up with the tempo of the fight, so there's no need to be as conservative as on the Middle Layers' first Abnormalities.

VIDEO
Music: BinahStory


Why don’t you take a seat and have a cup of tea first.

I’m not too used to this kind of occasion.

In time, you will grow accustomed to it, as with anything else. What is the Library like from what you have seen?

Again with that question? I thought I told you my answer already. Or are you a bit wacky in the head?

Viewpoints are bound to undergo constant change.

Gah, alright, fine. I’ll give you another answer. I got fancy with comparisons like “arena” and “jail” last time, but to put it bluntly, the Library is a perfectly ordinary part of the City where people die out all the time.

I see.

Huh, black tea doesn’t taste too bad. It’s no coffee, but it’s got its own flavor going.




It’s still hard to believe, but you said you were an Arbiter from the Head, right?

I was indeed.

I had a ton of things I wanted to ask an Arbiter if I ever ran into one.

Do you have any faith that I will answer them?

Nope, not at all. Besides, I got a more pressing question now; if you really are an Arbiter, why are you just staying here doing nothing?

I am simply watching from afar. I have long since laid down myself as an Arbiter.

You’re just watching? You seem pretty complacent about helping Angela for a bystander.

I simply take care of the tasks given to me. No more, no less.

What if Angela ordered you to tell her all about the secrets of the City only the Head knows, then?

She has not made such an attempt, possibly because she knows that I will not answer regardless.

No, perhaps she already tried to uncover my secrets before I could realize it.

And what if I tried to kill you and turn you into a book here and now? So I can pull out every little bit of knowledge you have by force?

You are a bold individual. And quite hostile as well. That is what differentiates you from us, perhaps.

Ain’t got any courtesy to show for one of the shady overlords of the City.




However, even when he faced me in person, his anger was directed at what was above and beyond. His gaze never settled on the things right in front of him; he always looked further.

Unlike you or Angela, who are well-nigh blind to anything outside of your immediate sight, as I can see.

Hey, don’t change the topic.

Quite sharp, indeed… You bear a poison, heavy and slow… yet deadly.

I know you well, even though you know nothing about me.

……

My occupation is to simply remain silent and spectate. So worry not.

Guess our conversations will always be parallel.

“O sorrow, I have ended, you see, by respecting you,
because I am certain you will never leave me.”

…“Ah, I realize it: your beauty lies in the force of your being.”

Are you leaving already? You are welcome to stay a little longer and finish your cup of tea.

Lost my appetite.

You may drop by sometimes and be my company. It is rather amusing to talk with you.

Like hell it is.


Music: Lobby


Miss Biinah! We're back from the cutie beating session! Did you have a good talk with Miss Angela?

That one is still not accustomed to my presence, and I soon found there were more pressing matters to attend to.

But you did see us fight, right? Did we do good?

What do you believe?

We got the job done, and nobody died. There's not much to complain about!

So… contentment, is it?

Awww… How should we know, Miss Binah?! You're the one who knows all the words and stuff!

…Hmph.



Another Abnormality, another trio of Abnormality Pages to look at.

Now that we have Binah with us, Watchful Eyes is an interesting page to put onto her. Her deck's main weakness is its slightly off-balance Light curve that leaves her lacking the energy to pull off full attack chains in longer battles. An extra +1 every turn is enough to offset this, and we can account for it by giving everyone else a higher than normal amount of light regen. The part about restoring the selected Librarian's Light to full almost never matters, since as a Level 1 Abnormality Page this comes up on turns 1 or 2, far too early for us not to be getting a full Light refill from an Emotion Level anyways.

Eternally Lit Lamp is another situationally useful page. It lets the selected Librarian steal attacks even if their Speed Die is tied or lower than enemies. Again it's situationally useful—but it's designed to pair particularly well with Big Bird's Level 2 Abnormality page, Salvation. Salvation gives the Librarian +1 Power as long as their enemy is faster, which is a very simple (if situational) power. Because we can't redirect enemies who are faster under normal circumstances, ELL enables this page. The second effect, meanwhile, is a unique clause: it doesn't require the enemy to be faster to go off, and that's great because it's a doozy. Should the holder of Salvation win a clash against an opponent at 25% or fewer HP, all of their dice are destroyed. This means the rest of the attacks against them will be one-sided, meaning it's at its best when used with a 3 or 4-die attack with a chunky first die. It's got a lot of potential to make boss fights easier, as 25% on a boss is much bigger than 25% on a normal guest.



Binah's next Abnormality Battle will take another pair of books to unlock, same as any of the other floors at this point in the game. I do think this was a missed opportunity—forcing the player to use specific decktypes to win against SotC opponents or having to equip certain Key Pages, or even basic deck construction challenges like back in the beginning of the game would've been an interesting way to force players to change up their strategies and possibly discover new ones. As it stands, there's almost no reason for a player to deviate from whatever strategy they've come up with throughout the entirety of Star of the City unless a fight completely stonewalls it.

And that is a shame.

Anyways, we've got four paths ahead of us. Go for whichever you want to!

Next time, on Library of Ruina



Checking on the current state of the Liu.

Checking in on a campout.

Checking in with Yan.


Meeting a person with a TV for a face.


Videos

Binah 2

TeeQueue fucked around with this message at 09:17 on Mar 21, 2023

Theantero
Nov 6, 2011

...We danced the Mamushka while Nero fiddled, we danced the Mamushka at Waterloo. We danced the Mamushka for Jack the Ripper, and now, Fester Addams, this Mamushka is for you....
There is a common fandom in-joke that Ruina players cannot read. The Big Bird fight is probably the best example of this, because I've seen so many people completely fail to comprehend the gimmick despite every part of it being clearly spelled out.

Legend of Ruina
Sep 29, 2021
Fun fact: the Thumb pages actually let you just short circuit the entire mini-game too. If you throw a single ranged attack into Big Bird’s counter die, it will win the clash, and then the die will dissipate with your librarian taking zero damage. Because it’s a melee page clashing a ranged page, but also stops rolling whenever you do.

MiiNiPaa
Jan 19, 2020

Watchful Eyes is not so good. Im theory it could be given to someone lacking good Light restoration (Binah), but lack of that single Light point will screw you at the worst possible moment. It might be useful if trying a solo run (because double restoration still happens even if there is no one to take Light from).

Eternally Lit Lamp allows you to redirect any attack* no matter yours and their speed. A good thing for a tanky character or for someone who has counter dice-heavy deck.
* Exceptions apply, read enemy passives list.

Salvation is meant to work with Eternally Lit Lamp: you cannot reliably clash with higher speed enemies without it. +1 Power for a 2nd-level page with a condition for activation might not seem to be much, but when you have an opponent, who is at 25% or less HP, you can easily shutdown their strong pages: you just need to win chash with the first die and whole page is cancelled. Enemies do not need to have higher speed to activate this effect.

TeeQueue
Oct 9, 2012

The time has come. Soon, the bell shall ring. A new world will come. Rise, my servants. Rise and serve me. I am death and life. Darkness and light.

Theantero posted:

There is a common fandom in-joke that Ruina players cannot read. The Big Bird fight is probably the best example of this, because I've seen so many people completely fail to comprehend the gimmick despite every part of it being clearly spelled out.

If I had any idea what these squiggles meant, I might feel called out. :v:

Solitair
Feb 18, 2014

TODAY'S GONNA BE A GOOD MOTHERFUCKIN' DAY!!!
Because you can unlock the Big Bird fight before you unlock Binah, you can't bring her to that fight. It wasn't much of a problem for me, though I still had trouble killing those Eyeball Chicks. Last time I did the fight, I'm pretty sure I skipped one part of the procedure out of stupidity and still managed to win.

Tenebrais
Sep 2, 2011

TeeQueue posted:

Binah's next Abnormality Battle will take another pair of books to unlock, same as any of the other floors at this point in the game. I do think this was a missed opportunity—forcing the player to use specific decktypes to win against SotC opponents or having to equip certain Key Pages, or even basic deck construction challenges like back in the beginning of the game would've been an interesting way to force players to change up their strategies and possibly discover new ones. As it stands, there's almost no reason for a player to deviate from whatever strategy they've come up with throughout the entirety of Star of the City unless a fight completely stonewalls it.

And that is a shame.

I'd been thinking similar with the different floors. For the majority of fights you just get free choice of all of the floors you've unlocked, so you're usually incentivised to use one of the early ones you've fully developed. Sure, you could experiment with newer ones, but you're also gambling your books and if you lose the fight you'll have to grind up some more from a previous battle, so you're again incentivised to play it safe. I think it'd be an improvement for each reception (at least each main story one) to only let you choose from specific floors that that fight is tuned to be level with, so you're forced to risk trying something unfamiliar.
Red Mist sort of did this, since only three floors could go up against her without being at a disadvantage and it put big flashing lights over Binah. That was cool.

MiiNiPaa
Jan 19, 2020

Tenebrais posted:

I'd been thinking similar with the different floors. For the majority of fights you just get free choice of all of the floors you've unlocked, so you're usually incentivised to use one of the early ones you've fully developed. Sure, you could experiment with newer ones, but you're also gambling your books and if you lose the fight you'll have to grind up some more from a previous battle, so you're again incentivised to play it safe. I think it'd be an improvement for each reception (at least each main story one) to only let you choose from specific floors that that fight is tuned to be level with, so you're forced to risk trying something unfamiliar.
Red Mist sort of did this, since only three floors could go up against her without being at a disadvantage and it put big flashing lights over Binah. That was cool.

Or add a "rest period", when after using a floor in current chapter reception, it becomes unavailable until after all other floors are used in a current-chapter reception (no bullying Rats for that one).

Tombot
Oct 21, 2008
You know. I'd love to see how two teams of different enemies would fare against eachother, I wonder how many Big Bird could take down.

IMJack
Apr 16, 2003

Royalty is a continuous ripping and tearing motion.


Fun Shoe
The first rule of BookFight Club is that, outside of discussions, you do not talk about BookFight club.

DuoRogue
Jul 19, 2022

My secret? I don't have any bones.

MiiNiPaa posted:

Or add a "rest period", when after using a floor in current chapter reception, it becomes unavailable until after all other floors are used in a current-chapter reception (no bullying Rats for that one).

that sounds genuinely horrendous. no thanks.

anyway, my vote list here is probably... tv face > camping > yan > liu.

Dirk the Average
Feb 7, 2012

"This may have been a mistake."

Tenebrais posted:

I'd been thinking similar with the different floors. For the majority of fights you just get free choice of all of the floors you've unlocked, so you're usually incentivised to use one of the early ones you've fully developed. Sure, you could experiment with newer ones, but you're also gambling your books and if you lose the fight you'll have to grind up some more from a previous battle, so you're again incentivised to play it safe. I think it'd be an improvement for each reception (at least each main story one) to only let you choose from specific floors that that fight is tuned to be level with, so you're forced to risk trying something unfamiliar.
Red Mist sort of did this, since only three floors could go up against her without being at a disadvantage and it put big flashing lights over Binah. That was cool.

It's a tough thing to solve that plagues many RPGs. How many times have you been playing a game and a new character or gimmick pops up, but you've already got a good thing going? Pokemon is a pretty good example; you are constantly getting access to new characters, but at the same time, raising them up requires an investment that just isn't always worth spending if your team is good enough to win.

I think the game that I've played most recently that works well with this is Xenoblade Chronicles 3, and that's because you get to use every single character (6 + 1 hero unit) at once. And because there are 6 characters, you can swap their classes around to try things out without significantly impacting the core of your team, if you so desire.

Deep Dish Fuckfest
Sep 6, 2006

Advanced
Computer Touching


Toilet Rascal
Roland going "I always wanted to ask an Arbiter questions if I met one" instead of "I would literally piss myself on the spot and beg for mercy at their feet if I met one" is yet another indication that he's way more powerful than he lets on.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
Interesting that Roland also knows Prayer For Loving Sorrow, given that he recognizes what Binah's quoting and supplies the next line.

MiiNiPaa
Jan 19, 2020

Deep Dish Fuckfest posted:

Roland going "I always wanted to ask an Arbiter questions if I met one" instead of "I would literally piss myself on the spot and beg for mercy at their feet if I met one" is yet another indication that he's way more powerful than he lets on.

He literally told he was Grade 1 before. He did play it down, claiming that he mostly took care of intel, but still, Grade 1.


Junpei posted:

Interesting that Roland also knows Prayer For Loving Sorrow, given that he recognizes what Binah's quoting and supplies the next line.

Roland seems to be well-educated person. It is strange that he lived in Backstreets and not Nest. Though it fits his claims of being demoted to Grade 9 from Grade 1. Probably got thrown out of the Nest when he was demoted.

A jargogle
Feb 22, 2011
Trust Binah to make brewing tea sound like a war crime.

Ariamaki
Jun 30, 2011

"I'm the most powerful
search engine in the world!"
-- The GoogleProg

MiiNiPaa posted:

Roland seems to be well-educated person.

Does he? He seems really well-connected and like, versed in the knowledge you'd need to have out in the world, but I don't know if I'd call him well-educated.

Kith
Sep 17, 2009

You never learn anything
by doing it right.


Roland is extremely suspicious in a ton of different ways, and the best evidence of that is the very first thing we ever saw him say:

TeeQueue posted:

Music: Entrance


It seems the Library has a visitor. Unlike in Lobotomy Corporation, there's no cognition filter to make everything look cartoonish.

Can’t believe this is how she handled it…

What the hell happened? What’s with all this smoke?

Sigh… Guess I’ll have to trust her…


It's pretty obvious that the Purple Tear is a Color Fixer, and the Color Fixers that we've seen are not people you get involved with by mistake. Also, Roland mentioned "trusting" "her" (probably the Purple Tear but because I know gently caress-all I'm being cautious) and how "she" "handled it", which likely means his story of winding up here on accident is total bullshit.

Roland is a chill fella and I love him for that but he's also shady as gently caress and every detail we learn about him makes him seem even shadier.

Lunatic 0verlord
Apr 9, 2022
Wait everyone!

The path to a Realization is...

Wait, is it a spoiler to say which path leads to a Realization?

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015
Probation
Can't post for 11 years!
I mean, TQ did say that Tiph's last Abno was on this route/column in a previous vote's options.

But, look, it's just one more fight, two counting Chesed's next Abno (also said in a previous vote's options). We can knock out Cane Office before going full boar on more Realizations.

Quackles
Aug 11, 2018

Pixels of Light.


Lunatic 0verlord posted:

Wait everyone!

The path to a Realization is...

Wait, is it a spoiler to say which path leads to a Realization?


It's "All of them", isn't it. :lobcorp:

BisbyWorl
Jan 12, 2019

Knowledge is pain plus observation.


Quackles posted:

It's "All of them", isn't it. :lobcorp:

Maybe the true Realization was the friends we made along the way...

Lunatic 0verlord
Apr 9, 2022

Junpei posted:

I mean, TQ did say that Tiph's last Abno was on this route/column in a previous vote's options.

But, look, it's just one more fight, two counting Chesed's next Abno (also said in a previous vote's options). We can knock out Cane Office before going full boar on more Realizations.

Well I guess the Library can have a small breather before the next Realization.

TeeQueue
Oct 9, 2012

The time has come. Soon, the bell shall ring. A new world will come. Rise, my servants. Rise and serve me. I am death and life. Darkness and light.
Ya'll are probably going to make me do at least two of them in a row. I'm fine with putting that off, realizations are beefy.

TeeQueue
Oct 9, 2012

The time has come. Soon, the bell shall ring. A new world will come. Rise, my servants. Rise and serve me. I am death and life. Darkness and light.


The thread has spoken, and we're doing the far-right node next. Let's see what the Cane Office is all about!

PS, I updated the fanart post again. It was time.

MiiNiPaa
Jan 19, 2020

TeeQueue posted:

Ya'll are probably going to make me do at least two of them in a row.
Don't worry, we will only make you do two realizations in a row, if we would not be able to unlock third one in time.

Boksi
Jan 11, 2016
You all voted wrong :mad:

Deep Dish Fuckfest
Sep 6, 2006

Advanced
Computer Touching


Toilet Rascal

MiiNiPaa posted:

He literally told he was Grade 1 before. He did play it down, claiming that he mostly took care of intel, but still, Grade 1.

True, but there seems to be a significant gap between Colors and the "average" Grade 1 Fixer, as evidenced by Gebura and Blue Batshit. And we know Arbiters are roughly on par with Colors. Well, Binah is in any case. But maybe other Arbiters aren't quite as psycho as Binah and might actually be able to have a reasonably normal conversation with other people. I kinda doubt it though; I feel like working directly for the Head requires a... certain mindset.

KobunFan
Aug 13, 2022

Boksi posted:

You all voted wrong :mad:

When has "TV-face" ever been a wrong option?

MiiNiPaa
Jan 19, 2020

KobunFan posted:

When has "TV-face" ever been a wrong option?

When it doesn't have Netflix.

IMJack
Apr 16, 2003

Royalty is a continuous ripping and tearing motion.


Fun Shoe

KobunFan posted:

When has "TV-face" ever been a wrong option?

Tombot
Oct 21, 2008
To be honest it was what I voted for, but usually people just vote for whatever is at the top so I wasn't expecting it to win.

SL the Pyro
Jun 16, 2013

My soul cries out
with the desire to
FRACTURE
your puny spine.


what do you mean that hotkey disappeared

MiiNiPaa posted:

When it doesn't have Netflix.

He was asking for a wrong option, not an improvement.

Andyzero
May 22, 2009

I used to spoil, I'm sorry.
“O sorrow, I have ended, you see, by respecting you,
because I am certain you will never leave me.”
“Ah, I realize it: your beauty lies in the force of your being.”

https://lparchive.org/Lobotomy-Corporation/Update%2082/

Mentioned back during the Lobotomy Corp playthrough, this is a French poem called "Prière pour aimer la douleur" (Prayer to Love Sorrow/Prayer for Loving Sorrow, depending on translation) by Francis Jammes.

(Be careful googling it, it comes up in the franchise a lot and you might get spoilers)

Leoshiki
Jul 19, 2022
So pretty much if Binah told Angela who Roland really is alot of problems that going to happen would be resolve very easily but of course Binah as to make it harder than it needs to be, Binah I like you but the common sense in me is just "Why..Just Why?" Also I think Arbiters are about Grade 1 in terms of skill but have the tools to cripple a color if need be because remember even thought Gebura, and Binah first fight ended in a mutal kill Gebura was also fighting Abos, claws as well with one arm. So Arbiters are more akin to assassins than outright warriors but the tools they have are way more advance than anyone else has.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

MiiNiPaa
Jan 19, 2020

Leoshiki posted:

So pretty much if Binah told Angela who Roland really is alot of problems that going to happen would be resolve very easily but of course Binah as to make it harder than it needs to be, Binah I like you but the common sense in me is just "Why..Just Why?" Also I think Arbiters are about Grade 1 in terms of skill but have the tools to cripple a color if need be because remember even thought Gebura, and Binah first fight ended in a mutal kill Gebura was also fighting Abos, claws as well with one arm. So Arbiters are more akin to assassins than outright warriors but the tools they have are way more advance than anyone else has.

Don't forget that Kali wielded EGO in that fight (both her own and extracted proto-mimicry). Binah commented on it several times, both admitting that it took her by surprise and telling Gebura that now she knows about EGO and its capabilities, so she wouldn't be able to beat her this time. And then she ripped her arm again.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply