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Still waiting to see you modify enemies and bosses for not living up to their in-story prowess. 
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Jul 9, 2015 16:40
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TravelLog posted:Still waiting to see you modify enemies and bosses for not living up to their in-story prowess.
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Jul 9, 2015 16:51
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vilkacis posted:
Man it's been forever since I remembered those games. I still remember finding the story to Sword of Mana oddly compelling. I thought it a beautiful game. 'Course I was like 12 when I played it, but the point remains.
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Jul 9, 2015 17:13
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Cat Army 
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So uh to change the subject entirely how high can characters' stats go in this game before something breaks messily and hilariously, anyway? I've been capping everything at 30 for now, but...The Iron Rose posted:Man it's been forever since I remembered those games. I still remember finding the story to Sword of Mana oddly compelling. I thought it a beautiful game. 'Course I was like 12 when I played it, but the point remains. I'm not familiar with Sword, but all the ones I have played were very nice looking games for the consoles they were on, so you're probably remembering it right. Great soundtracks, too.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:14
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I think after 30 everything breaks horrifically without major rewrites to the stats code. That's why you might see glitched stats in bad romhacks, or stats that wrap around when they go negative. Don't go above 30 and you'll be safe.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:30
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vilkacis posted:So uh to change the subject entirely how high can characters' stats go in this game before something breaks messily and hilariously, anyway? I've been capping everything at 30 for now, but... 31 specifically is the limit. If I'm not mistaken in 7 you can use some of FEditor's patches to increase that to 31+base in a state if I remember how it works right (check the documentation), but I'm not sure if you can do the same for six.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:32
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vilkacis posted:So uh to change the subject entirely how high can characters' stats go in this game before something breaks messily and hilariously, anyway? I've been capping everything at 30 for now, but... I think FEDDOP taught us that anything above 31 leads to ~magic~. Fakeedit: Dammit.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:33
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~Magic~, you say...?  ...But equipment boosts don't count, right? Just looking at Fae, she could easily pass 30 Res with that stone equipped.
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Jul 9, 2015 18:41
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vilkacis posted:...But equipment boosts don't count, right? Just looking at Fae, she could easily pass 30 Res with that stone equipped. Well, yeah. A few of the legendary weapons give +5s to classes that could already hit 30 or close to it, like Nomad Troopers with Murgleis or Generals with Armads. Hell, everyone's luck caps at 30 and Forblaze gives 5. If stats break past 31 then base stats are stored as a binary and a hex. So 16 to 17 would be going from 0F to 10 internally. The +5 from equipment or dragonstone boosts must be added in formulas rather than directly applied to those stats. E: Wait, the games understand having 0s in stats, so 15 would be 0F, 16 would be 10, and then 17 would be 11, all the way up to 31 at 1F. The games cap at 30 because, well, it looks nicer better than 31. The Gamecube FEs let stats go up to 40, though PoR only shows it with extreme Luck blessing or Ashnard's huge arms. Shadow Dragon went back to 30 caps but True Mystery is on the same engine and Medeus has 40s on Lunatic. Then Awakening happened and character stats get up to 66 between limit breaker and eugenics and enemies in Apotheosis show up rockin' 99s. Orange Fluffy Sheep fucked around with this message at 19:17 on Jul 9, 2015 |
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Jul 9, 2015 19:05
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Orange Fluffy Sheep posted:If stats break past 31 then base stats are stored as a binary and a hex. So 16 to 17 would be going from 0F to 10 internally. The +5 from equipment or dragonstone boosts must be added in formulas rather than directly applied to those stats. I wouldn't be surprised if the stat boosts graphically displayed +5 STR or whatever but actually added to the derived Attack, Defense, Avoid, etc. stats that are actually used after counting in supports, terrain, etc. Also, a bit of tooling around with numbers, and I think stats are stored internally as five bits. 31 is 11111 which fits in five bits, but 32 is 100000 which is six, so it just takes the five it's supposed to be and you get zero. Maybe. Logically, this means that the sixth bit gets toggled somewhere, which means that a >31 stat actually starts affecting other stats. I've never done any tinkering or delving into how FE does its stats to find out, but given Ostian Princess in general and one of the odd bugs that was encountered in the latest public Awful Emblem beta (a character, when loading the game, would end up with a negative/maxed stat and others would be affected), I strongly suspect this is how it's done. Which kind of makes sense, maybe? If we assume nine stats stored this way (level, strength, skill, speed, luck, defense, resistance, constitution, move, but not HP because that has to use at least seven bits), then you're saving 27 bits per character, or three and 3/8 bytes per character. Let's say HP's stored in seven bits because then we get a nice even 3.5 bytes per character. I don't know how many characters the RAM and SRAM support, but I'm going to just guess 80, since there's a 50 enemy cap. 80*3.5=280 bytes, or about a quarter of a kilobyte. Three save files means three quarters of a KB. Now, there's all sorts of different save formats for the GBA ranging from 512 bytes to 128 KB. I don't know for sure which one FE6/7/8 uses, but all of the save files on GameFAQs are 64 KB so I suspect that might be the one. When you have 64 KB to play with, saving .75 KB seems fairly pointless, so I doubt the save file influenced this decision. Maybe it was the internal RAM? Wikipedia posted:Memory: 32 kilobyte + 96 kilobyte VRAM (internal to the CPU), 256 kilobyte DRAM (outside the CPU). With those kinds of numbers, possibly? I suspect the actual answer is different. FE6 was first unveiled as being in development in January 2001, two months before the GBA's actual release and a year and change before the game's release. It's entirely possible that FE6 was developed while the hardware limitations were still being hammered out, so the team had no way of knowing for sure the limitations they'd be under, so they went conservative. Additionally, this was in 2000/2001, and Nintendo hadn't yet switched to CDs. I would guess that everyone there was still in the SNES era "save as much space as possible because we have a 2 MB cart" mindset even while expanding hardware made that less necessary. This is all speculation, of course, but it's fun to think of how the developers approached things just based on theorizing on how they stored some numbers.
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Jul 9, 2015 19:57
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Edward_Tohr posted:I think FEDDOP taught us that anything above 31 leads to ~magic~.    But yeah, stat boosts pushing you past 31 don't cause any problems, an easy example is Fomortiis:  Strength, Skill, Defense, and Resistance are all boosted beyond 31 no problem. I should note that Fomortiis's caps are weird (FE8's Draco Zombies are too), and if you start leveling either of them up their stats will go right past 31, and then end up looping back to 0.
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Jul 9, 2015 20:43
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fade5 posted:But yeah, stat boosts pushing you past 31 don't cause any problems, an easy example is Fomortiis: Wasn't there a romhack that made the tutorial unwinnable by placing Fomortiis with negative hp on the map?
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Jul 10, 2015 09:34
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Chapter 16x: The Glorious Ascension or,  AureolaSo before we do anything else I just want to say I went back to an earlier save and bought a Guiding Ring instead of one of the robes I got from the secret shop in case I actually want to use Hugh or something, but the only thing else that changed is that Dorothy didn't get HP for killing Narcian and maybe a couple of weapon uses saved/used but nothing really important.  The Saint's Tower was once a place of worship for Saint Elimine. In the tower lay numerous sacred relics relating to her. However, this sacred tower is now under the control of the revolutionaries. Sadly, the previous paragraph has very little to do with the actual map, because space is yet again very limited, so we won't be bringing Hugh. In retrospect, I probably should have though, since he'd benefit more from it than all these promoted units.  Bishop Windbag is such a bit character I can't even be arsed to come up with something to replace his face with. It's simply not worth the effort.  As said, reduced party size. Even then, it's more than we'll need to finish the map - it's honestly nothing really special.  Of course there's a throne in the tower, why wouldn't there be a throne in the tower?  What of me?! I betrayed the church and took over this tower for him! You're gonna die. That's all there's to it.  Lord Roartz's message said that he considers your work a failure. He says that because you couldn't bend the church, he has no use for you.Sadly, the pilot episode for Windham: The Last Churchbender did not sway the jaded hearts of the production company.  This is all Yoder's fault. If he hadn't meddled in my affairs... I agree... but there's nothing to be done about that now... ...Very well... Then this is our last mission. If we are to die, then the Lycian Army shall fall along with us! Prepare the Heavenly Arrows! But if we use those, we'll hit our own men as well!Mostly your own men, actually.   Annnnd nope.  Meanwhile, at the bottom of the tower, Douglas is here to remind us that we didn't kill him for EXP last chapter.  Saint Elimine's weapon, the Aureola spell tome, lies within."Stop giggling. It's a holy relic, drat it!"  Thank you, Sir Douglas. Although we were enemies earlier, I appreciate your help. I have no need for thanks. I do as the king orders. Do not concern yourself.Secretly, Douglas resents Roy for being able to grow such a rad 'stache at his tender age. Douglas was in his thirties by the time he managed to grow his, and it still isn't as good as Roy's. ...... You saved Eturia. It is an honor to fight alongside you. Sir Douglas...  And here's the map. Windbag is in the top middle, and a whole bunch of casters are hanging around with Physic staves and ranged tomes. Some of them have status staves as well.  A bishop of the St. Elimine Church who turned against his order. Most annoying of all,  Windbag has a Berserk staff,  ...and this is his effective range with it. Well, technically about three tiles less, since he won't move off his throne - but as I'm sure you can imagine, climbing the tower will be a huge hassle with him free to snipe at us from across the entire map. Even worse, my only decent staff user is Saul, who has a much lower magic score, so we can't even pull any dirty tricks on him in return. I am sad.  The Great General of Eturia. A respected veteran. Now that he's on our side, Douglas has both the growths and bases you'd expect of a prepromote (the former being HP 60, Str 30, Skl 30, Spd 30, Lck 20, Def 30, Red 5) and will be getting benched as soon I have a choice in the matter, beard or no beard. 19 Str and 20 Def isn't bad, as such, but on a level 20/8 character with single-digit speed it sure as hell isn't very impressive either.  I could mess around with the longbow, but two shots at 67% isn't worth it. We'll hit this guy with something less unique a few rounds from now instead.  Also at the end of every round these arrows randomly shoot down across the map. Anyone they hit takes 10 damage, I guess it counts as a gimmick or something?  Well, we can't sit around and wait all day, so let's get crackin'. Schwarth doesn't kill this guy, but that wasn't the point.  Candygram for Mongo!  gently caress you Saul  Pictured: Fir with a killing edge. That 68% crit rate   Everything to ash! You don't even have a fire tome, what the gently caress is wrong with you.  Oh, someone is really going to regret that decision.  Apparently being berserked turns off animations. Anyway, as you can probably imagine, Schwarth does to these guys what a berserked promoted unit with a killing lance usually does to unpromoted wastes of space. (And of course I gave Schwarth the delphi shield, you think I'm gonna waste it on loving Shanna or something?)  Most of the enemies on this map are not very threatening.  Even the ones who would actually deal damage if they could hit.  ...Well, okay, so the Bolting guys poo poo all over Douglas, but I don't know what you were expecting.  Go be useless someplace else.  This is even more obnoxious. Noah gets silenced.  This is worth two shots from the longbow.  Feeding Bartre those speedwings paid off, he doubles and kills this guy with the second swing   Let's fix that little problem. Oh yeah, that's what the Restore staff does, the Recover staff is a 1-range full heal.  ...Why did you fly all the way down here when there's a nice juicy mage right next to where you were standing?  ...This is somewhat problematic, though.  Wolt could probably murder my entire party if he really wanted to. Saul fixes this as soon as he's able.  Purge is back! Purge still can't hit worth poo poo!  Again?!  ... You know, I can't decide if that was the smartest or the dumbest thing you could have done. Sure, that's my one good staff user out of the picture. But he has no weapons because I've loaded him with five different utility staves, so now he'll run around glaring menacingly at my other units while they slaughter the rest of the opposition. That was the last use of the Berserk staff.  You guys are really bad at this.  Your levels are still high enough to let Fae get like 80 exp per kill though, so that's nice!    It's okay I guess. Schwarth status: Three levels under Douglas, better in six out of eight stats.  These guys are really not good at aiming.  Where are you, my daughter? To be honest, this is probably the most interesting thing that happens this level.  F-Father... There's no need to shout so loudly...  I've been hearing some troubling rumors, Fir. I hear that another man in the army is secretly seeing you. Oh... Is it true, my daughter? If so, fear not! I will crush anyone who would hurt you! N-no, it's nothing like that! He's helping me with my training. That's all. Oho, so you merely wanted a training partner. Have no worries, my daughter. Your father is here to train you! Um... I appreciate it, but I need someone who can use a sword... ...... I'm sorry, father... Take care of yourself, my daughter. Poor Bartre, he's trying so hard, but she's just at that age.  Douglas gets hit by an arrow. Serves him right.  Schwarth's berserk status runs out, so now it's business as usual. Hm, come to think of it, this guy actually stands a pretty good chance of being painful! Guess I've been lucky she survived this long all by herself.  'Course, she crits him before he can try anything.  The rest is just mopping up.  Some reinforcements show up after a while. They're high-level bishops, so very good experience for just about anyone on the team. Though, they also have Lightning tomes and Physic staves, and sometimes also Silence staves, so they can be obnoxious.  Well gently caress me, a Purge actually hit. Oh well, Schwarth has vulneraries.  Almost done.  Somewhere along the way, Noah masters anima magic. Eeeexcellent.  Having healed up, Schwarth takes on the boss. That's a pretty nifty looking spell. Hahaha! Haha... ha...Boring to the end.  Holy poo poo Fae.  That's actually a kinda bad level, as Fae levels go.  We've dealt with all the enemies, so -  Oh, come on!  God drat!  anyway it's just 10 HP per arrow, so it's just an annoyance. I don't even care to farm some exp by healing it up. Sir Douglas, is this it...? This is the Glorious Ascension, Aureola, Saint Elimine's weapon. May we make use of it? The king said to take anything in the tower that may be of use.With the tome in hand, we have literally taken everything in the tower that could be of use. drat stingy tower. The St. Elimine Church is on our side as well. If any oppose our use of it, then I will negotiate."By 'negotiate' I mean I will bludgeon the bastard over the head with this tome until they stop complaining." "That should solve the problem quite handily, yes." All right. Thank you, Sir Douglas.And scene change.   ...The attack on Bern will begin after we finish in Eturia. Did someone tell you already? No... I simply knew that it would come to this eventually. ...We cannot leave Bern unopposed any longer. I know it will be painful to see your homeland invaded, but..."...tough poo poo, everyone else on the team had to deal with it at some point so I'm sure you can too."   Bern's greatest treasure... the Fire Emblem. What?! Within it lies the sword of Hartmut, founder of Bern. Is it... a legendary weapon? Yes. The most powerful of them all, in fact. It was made to slay the leader of the dragons in the Scouring. Its power was so immense that it had to be sealed away after the war. The Fire Emblem is the key to accessing it once more. The key... My brother... is forcing the world into submission with military might. I cannot forgive him, no matter his reasons. ...... All we must do to stop him is defeat the dragons he commands. Princess Guinivere..."You do realize he's going to be a boss at some point, right? Parked on a throne on a map with a seize-the-throne-to-win objective...?"  No... The people will resent me for the rest of my days. Roy, promise me this one thing. When we invade Bern, do not harm any civilians... I will not. I promise you. ...Thank you. I'm not sure I'll ever get to use this; at first I was planning to make Noah my light-caster type, but then I decided to save the tomes for Saul once he got close to promotion, but he's still spending most of his time staffbotting, so he will probably never reach that S-rank. Oh well, I'm sure there are other legendary weapons for us to play around with. Fir was actually carrying the Durandal around on this map, but nothing we fought warranted using it. Either way, Roy's inventory isn't full, so we won't get to look at it until next map.  And that's it for this side mission. Next up... I hope for something a little more interesting, personally. vilkacis fucked around with this message at 14:42 on Jul 12, 2015 |
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Jul 10, 2015 22:58
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The recover staff actually fully heals a single target.
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Jul 10, 2015 23:13
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Well I'll be hosed, so it does.
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Jul 10, 2015 23:30
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This map is...not very fun. At least the staves makes it SLIGHTLY interesting I guess. But the map can't be salvaged with just that.
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Jul 10, 2015 23:54
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Yeah, it was just sort of underwhelming. I'm actually kind of fond of Windbag's colossal range berserk staff, it's mean but not too assholeish since you're probably equipped to handle it at this stage, but the rest of the map was really just there, the enemies were largely weaklings, and the "gimmick" didn't add much. I've sneaked a peek at the next map, though. It has ballistas in the middle of a lake! I'm going to have so much fun ignoring them completely with my arrow-proof fliers 
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Jul 11, 2015 00:10
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So it might just be me being stupid and dumb, but it feels like your gifs for attacks/crits are playing fast, Vilk. If so, fewer frames of Fae is absolutely criminal.  Please keep doing crazy stuff otherwise. Also just retcon Zeiss's portrait. You know you want to.
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Jul 11, 2015 00:28
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vilkacis posted:
Seriously just bump him up to like A-and-a half rank in Light Magic, this game is stupid with not giving you useful Light Magic users without hilariously cheesy levels of grinding. Like seriously Saul will probably hit level 20 before he hits S in Light Magic. Also there's something interesting you should know about S-ranks in this game: you can have multiple S-ranks on one unit.
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Jul 11, 2015 00:52
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Zwingley posted:So it might just be me being stupid and dumb, but it feels like your gifs for attacks/crits are playing fast, Vilk. If so, fewer frames of Fae is absolutely criminal. Enemy armies really hate it when their soldiers start standing out like some kind of special snowflake so they try to put a stop to it as soon as possible. Problem is that none of the armor fits them since they get it off the assembly line for the similarly armed hordes.
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Jul 11, 2015 01:29
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