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So just to get this straight, your new President is going to constantly, brazenly lie to the American people about what he's said, what he's done, etc, and that's just going to be mostly considered "whatevs", for the next 4-8 years? Lol.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:31
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Paradoxish posted:Oh no, the DNC on the whole was great. I'm talking about what amounted to about half a night of speeches here. Well, no, I think that, that's actually important in retrospect. People keep saying "America is Already Great" is a bad message but that wasn't the message. The message was "America is Already Great, but We Can Make it Better!" And the DNC is proof positive that, that message actually did resonate and reach a lot of people. I think that the Khan feud was actually a total disaster because the Hillary campaign zeroed in on that and thought that was what tanked Trump. But Trump didn't actually fall that far. Hillary went up like ten points. It was the positive message that worked, but they abandoned it because they learned the wrong lesson.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:31
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Nixon killed the country in 1974 and the autopsy has lasted 42 years. The report finally came in and we've decided to bury the country. The cause of death was difficult to determine ,but seems that the rich convinced the poor to some sort of suicide pact.
Hollismason fucked around with this message at 06:43 on Nov 18, 2016 |
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Nov 18, 2016 06:41
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Lightning Knight posted:Well, no, I think that, that's actually important in retrospect. People keep saying "America is Already Great" is a bad message but that wasn't the message. The message was "America is Already Great, but We Can Make it Better!" And the DNC is proof positive that, that message actually did resonate and reach a lot of people. Maybe, but remember that Clinton's post-convention bounce wasn't anything special. It was about twice Trump's if you take the higher end of polling or more or less the same if you take the aggregate. That's not bad, but it wasn't historically large. That said, I'm one of the people saying that "America is Already Great" was terrible messaging. It's the kind of message that's not going to read as optimistic to anyone who isn't happy with the status quo, no matter how many times you add "but we can do better" to the end.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:42
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Cigar Aficionado posted:So just to get this straight, your new President is going to constantly, brazenly lie to the American people about what he's said, what he's done, etc, and that's just going to be mostly considered "whatevs", for the next 4-8 years? Nothing matters
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Nov 18, 2016 06:42
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Cigar Aficionado posted:So just to get this straight, your new President is going to constantly, brazenly lie to the American people about what he's said, what he's done, etc, and that's just going to be mostly considered "whatevs", for the next 4-8 years? Do you not remember the Bush years, like, at all?
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Nov 18, 2016 06:45
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Cigar Aficionado posted:So just to get this straight, your new President is going to constantly, brazenly lie to the American people about what he's said, what he's done, etc, and that's just going to be mostly considered "whatevs", for the next 4-8 years? yep. Merica
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Nov 18, 2016 06:48
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Party Plane Jones posted:Do you not remember the Bush years, like, at all? People are used to administrations lying by surrogate. Having it come straight from the horse's mouth, and so blatantly at that, is weird and scary.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:52
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Party Plane Jones posted:Do you not remember the Bush years, like, at all? Bush didn't lie constantly in real time.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:54
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People who are already in the conservative alternate-reality bubble aren't people who would ever vote Democrat anyway.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:55
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Cigar Aficionado posted:Bush didn't lie constantly in real time. lol remember how it was almost treated like a problem that he might have been lying about things? What a rosy world that was.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:55
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I'm pretty sure Bush literally lied to the country and dragged us into a war. I dunno though maybe I am misremembering events.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:57
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There's plausible deniability that Bush & Co. honestly thought Saddam was up to something and they could prove it if they just got in there. That would make their case for invasion mere bullshit.
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Nov 18, 2016 06:59
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Hollismason posted:I'm pretty sure Bush literally lied to the country and dragged us into a war. No that was neoliberals forcing are troops into a war no one wanted.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:00
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Mustached Demon posted:No that was neoliberals forcing are troops into a war no one wanted. Let's compromise and say 50/50
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Nov 18, 2016 07:01
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Um Obama started the war in Iraq guys. Bush lost the election.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:02
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Mustached Demon posted:No that was neoliberals forcing are troops into a war no one wanted. And Bernie Sanders single handedly stood against Bush to try to stop going to the Iraq War. Same as when he tried to stop the dastardly Clintons from sending minorities to prison.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:03
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Stereotype posted:Um Obama started the war in Iraq guys. Bush lost the election. I think it's a fair compromise to say that it was Obama that started half the war and Bush lost half of the election.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:05
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Republicans posted:People are used to administrations lying by surrogate. Having it come straight from the horse's mouth, and so blatantly at that, is weird and scary. We did not, repeat, did not, trade arms or anything else for hostages
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Nov 18, 2016 07:08
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crazy cloud posted:We did not, repeat, did not, trade arms or anything else for hostages Hey as long as you know that in your heart.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:13
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Republicans posted:People are used to administrations lying by surrogate. Having it come straight from the horse's mouth, and so blatantly at that, is weird and scary. Also the Bush lies tended to be big, constructed things. This kind of random bullshit is more Reagan-esque.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:13
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Ok, I haven't logged in for a long time. I am one of the few conservative people that used to be on here a while back, but left voluntarily years ago. I have come to tell you what many people on here don't seem to get, so open your ears. Remember that Toxx in 2012 where people were banned if they picked Romney for the election? I never participated in that nonsense, but here is what that effectively did. IT PURGED THIS FORUM OF DISSENTING VIEWPOINTS AND TURNED IT INTO AN ECHO-CHAMBER. There probably weren't a lot of people on here this election to say things like Hillary was a corrupt candidate who knee-capped Bernie with Super-delegates, or questioned the poll numbers despite the massive differences in the crowd sizes that candidates were drawing (Trump's were far larger all over the place), or pointed out that Democrats just assumed that the people who showed up for Obama would show up for Clinton (they didn't). Earlier in the thread some people were tossing out thought-terminating cliches like it was racism, sexism, misogyny and all of the other words that are so overused now that they have lost their original meaning and effectiveness in a pathetic attempt to explain why their side lost. This is not the case at all. You were all punked by a hyperbolic main-stream media narrative that portrayed Trump as literally Hitler, and at the same time could not ever provide any good case to vote for Hillary. Strange, the MSM never had an issue with him before he ran for president, but I digress. I could give several reasons why someone would choose to vote for Trump this time around, but I'll limit it to a few for the sake of time. 1) Globalization has hollowed out working-class communities. At election time Hillary stood by this practice, while Trump pledged to reverse it. This point is pure self-interest. The working-class made up the core of the Democrat party for years, and in 2016 the party forgot about them. 2) Border laws were not being enforced. Having lived abroad as a legal foreign national for many years, I know firsthand how byzantine and arbitrary immigration laws can be. However, the one thing that makes even the most obtuse process bearable is the idea that everybody has to go through it. If you're shocked that a naturalized citizen could choose to vote for enforcement of immigration laws as written, then you have rather missed the point. Everybody hates cheaters and line-cutters. And furthermore, it sets a bad precedent, because if certain laws are only selectively enforced then what is the impetus to follow any law in the first place? Trump ran on a campain to secure the border and enforce the immigration laws on the books. 3) Holding power to account. When James Comey flat-out said that Hillary wouldn't be prosecuted after the initial investigation into her e-mails, but went onto say that "if someone else had done similar they probably wouldn't have escaped prosecution" the message was clear: THERE WAS ONE SET OF RULES FOR THE RICH AND POWERFUL, AND ANOTHER FOR EVERYBODY ELSE. There was a greater principle at stake. I don't know if Trump really will appoint a special prosecutor, but if he does it won't be because Clinton opposed him, it will be due to her decades of shady activities. I hold no illusions that Trump is any sort of shining angel, but Clinton's scandals make even Richard Nixon look like a choir-boy by comparison. My choice to vote for Trump instead of Hillary had nothing to do with her being a woman, and everything to do with her being a crook and endemic of everything wrong with Washington D.C. A Clinton presidency would've signaled to every special interest on the planet that the US was officially on sale to the highest bidder, and that those same interests could go buck wild because accountability would be officially dead. Do I know what a Trump presidency will mean? No. He has made promises, but won't assume the office until the 20th of January. However, I could estimate exactly what a Clinton presidency would mean. More of the same lobbyism and crony capitalism that enriches only the wealthy few at the expense of everybody else. Her presidency would've likely been another Gilded Age, like the one before Theodore Roosevelt took office. Thanks, but no thanks.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:20
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lol I'm pretty sure that the opposite of what Comey said, but maybe that's another MSM lie
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Nov 18, 2016 07:24
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Again, Bush didn't lie, like, daily, about things that are totally irrelevant. His administration did lie, but the lies were only found out later, like typical lies are discovered. Trump is going to lie daily, constantly, about everything. What he ate that morning, where he travelled to that day, etc. Stuff that is incredibly easy to prove as lies that same day, usually immediately. It's going to be amazing to watch the media and his supporters gaslight the country for the next 4-8 years, as if he was not a pathological liar.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:24
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https://twitter.com/Gil_Hoffman/status/799340779609227264 lol
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Nov 18, 2016 07:28
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don't worry captain crunch i'm sure the hereditary billionaire conman will remove special interests from us politics and restore 'accountability' lol
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Nov 18, 2016 07:30
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Crypt N. Crunch posted:Ok, I haven't logged in for a long time. I am one of the few conservative people that used to be on here a while back, but left voluntarily years ago. I have come to tell you what many people on here don't seem to get, so open your ears. Remember that Toxx in 2012 where people were banned if they picked Romney for the election? I never participated in that nonsense, but here is what that effectively did. IT PURGED THIS FORUM OF DISSENTING VIEWPOINTS AND TURNED IT INTO AN ECHO-CHAMBER. There probably weren't a lot of people on here this election to say things like Hillary was a corrupt candidate who knee-capped Bernie with Super-delegates, or questioned the poll numbers despite the massive differences in the crowd sizes that candidates were drawing (Trump's were far larger all over the place), or pointed out that Democrats just assumed that the people who showed up for Obama would show up for Clinton (they didn't). That's nice dear.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:32
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Crypt N. Crunch posted:Ok, I haven't logged in for a long time. I am one of the few conservative people that used to be on here a while back, but left voluntarily years ago. I have come to tell you what many people on here don't seem to get, so open your ears. Remember that Toxx in 2012 where people were banned if they picked Romney for the election? I never participated in that nonsense, but here is what that effectively did. IT PURGED THIS FORUM OF DISSENTING VIEWPOINTS AND TURNED IT INTO AN ECHO-CHAMBER. There probably weren't a lot of people on here this election to say things like Hillary was a corrupt candidate who knee-capped Bernie with Super-delegates, or questioned the poll numbers despite the massive differences in the crowd sizes that candidates were drawing (Trump's were far larger all over the place), or pointed out that Democrats just assumed that the people who showed up for Obama would show up for Clinton (they didn't). Sir this is a Wendy's (USER WAS PUT ON PROBATION FOR THIS POST)
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Nov 18, 2016 07:32
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We're gonna drain the swamp!!! *Hires Ebell*
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Nov 18, 2016 07:33
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Crypt N. Crunch posted:Do I know what a Trump presidency will mean? No. He has made promises, but won't assume the office until the 20th of January. However, I could estimate exactly what a Clinton presidency would mean. More of the same lobbyism and crony capitalism that enriches only the wealthy few at the expense of everybody else. Her presidency would've likely been another Gilded Age, like the one before Theodore Roosevelt took office. Thanks, but no thanks. You supported Trump without knowing what he plans to do, or even willing to speculate, but you know what Clinton will do down to the cellular motion. Haha, don't post again for another four years please.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:33
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Crain posted:https://twitter.com/jessesingal/status/799455529756139521 Josh Marshall was talking about this. https://twitter.com/joshtpm/status/799470178668941312 https://twitter.com/joshtpm/status/799470638826143744 People have watched this campaign closely and know Trump's biggest weakness is his ego. They're going to play him like he played the American people. BTW. there's rumors floating around the Twitter that private military contractor Blackwater i mean Xe i mean Academi founder Erik Prince has been picked for Secretary of Defense. This is despite his ties to providing contracted services to China and Libya.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:33
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Superdelegates are dumb, but they weren't why Bernie lost. Wasn't he even trying to court them to overcome Clinton's lead in regular delegates near the end?
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Nov 18, 2016 07:35
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Trump's already paying dividends!quote:To mitigate the impact of a potentially less committed alliance partner, South Korea could enhance its security capabilities in two ways. Firstly, the transfer of military operational control to South Korean forces should take place as soon as possible. This would help lessen some of the operational confusion that may arise if conflict with North Korea occurs. e: more analysis: https://twitter.com/DavidFeith/status/796778997195489280
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Nov 18, 2016 07:36
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Lovely, welcome to the prospect of regional nuclear war. I should say "another" since we already have India and Pakistan.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:39
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Paradoxish posted:Maybe, but remember that Clinton's post-convention bounce wasn't anything special. It was about twice Trump's if you take the higher end of polling or more or less the same if you take the aggregate. That's not bad, but it wasn't historically large. My argument is that the DNC messaging was A Message. They literally abandoned that message post convention. It might not have been A Great Message, but they instead attempted to sell "Trump bad, look how bad he is." I think that message would've worked on enough people to probably make a difference, especially since it was a message that included patriotism and religion, things that appeal to the Rust Belt. Instead they didn't even bother to try and aggressively control the narrative or push their own narrative other than "look at that crazy thing Trump said!" Hell, I bet absent Pussygate he would've taken Minnesota and Virginia and swept the board, given how close they were. Re: lovely conservative poster, if you're going to log in to share the latest Reddit r/altright garbage you can gently caress off right back to Reddit.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:47
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Motto posted:Superdelegates are dumb, but they weren't why Bernie lost. Wasn't he even trying to court them to overcome Clinton's lead in regular delegates near the end? Nah he lost because he had way less votes.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:47
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Okay I'll talk to you. (Also everyone else should read this guys post because it is both insane and probably what a good 40% of the country thinks for real)Crypt N. Crunch posted:Ok, I haven't logged in for a long time. I am one of the few conservative people that used to be on here a while back, but left voluntarily years ago. I have come to tell you what many people on here don't seem to get, so open your ears. Remember that Toxx in 2012 where people were banned if they picked Romney for the election? I never participated in that nonsense, but here is what that effectively did. IT PURGED THIS FORUM OF DISSENTING VIEWPOINTS AND TURNED IT INTO AN ECHO-CHAMBER. I would be so happy if all it took to make conservatives shut the gently caress up about their stupid backwards wrong ideas was for them to lose a $10 bet but it doesn't. Not getting huge support for parroting talking points you heard on the radio and instead having people suggesting that you might be *gasp* wrong apparently is plenty to get cowards and idiots to leave though. quote:There probably weren't a lot of people on here this election to say things like Hillary was a corrupt candidate who knee-capped Bernie with Super-delegates, or questioned the poll numbers despite the massive differences in the crowd sizes that candidates were drawing (Trump's were far larger all over the place), or pointed out that Democrats just assumed that the people who showed up for Obama would show up for Clinton (they didn't). Lol you clearly didn't read anything here and are just making up what you want because there were tons of people who hated Hillary and tons of people questioning poll numbers. We even came up with a FORUM SPECIFIC TERM FOR IT. quote:Earlier in the thread some people were tossing out thought-terminating cliches like it was racism, sexism, misogyny and all of the other words that are so overused now that they have lost their original meaning and effectiveness in a pathetic attempt to explain why their side lost. quote:This is not the case at all. You were all punked by a hyperbolic main-stream media narrative that portrayed Trump as literally Hitler, and at the same time could not ever provide any good case to vote for Hillary. He quite possibly could cause deaths on the scale of Hitler. He wants to START with deporting 2-3 Million people. Where do those people go? They have lives here, they have jobs and family and shelter, are they going to starve to death or die of exposure in Jails or in a poor foreign country that collapses under the weight of that many refugees? No one gave a poo poo about Trump as a person because he is just some loud rear end in a top hat quote:Strange, the MSM never had an issue with him before he ran for president, but I digress. I could give several reasons why someone would choose to vote for Trump this time around, but I'll limit it to a few for the sake of time. quote:1) Globalization has hollowed out working-class communities. At election time Hillary stood by this practice, while Trump pledged to reverse it. This point is pure self-interest. The working-class made up the core of the Democrat party for years, and in 2016 the party forgot about them. quote:2) Border laws were not being enforced. Having lived abroad as a legal foreign national for many years, I know firsthand how byzantine and arbitrary immigration laws can be. However, the one thing that makes even the most obtuse process bearable is the idea that everybody has to go through it. If you're shocked that a naturalized citizen could choose to vote for enforcement of immigration laws as written, then you have rather missed the point. Everybody hates cheaters and line-cutters. And furthermore, it sets a bad precedent, because if certain laws are only selectively enforced then what is the impetus to follow any law in the first place? Trump ran on a campain to secure the border and enforce the immigration laws on the books. quote:3) Holding power to account. When James Comey flat-out said that Hillary wouldn't be prosecuted after the initial investigation into her e-mails, but went onto say that "if someone else had done similar they probably wouldn't have escaped prosecution" the message was clear: THERE WAS ONE SET OF RULES FOR THE RICH AND POWERFUL, AND ANOTHER FOR EVERYBODY ELSE. There was a greater principle at stake. I don't know if Trump really will appoint a special prosecutor, but if he does it won't be because Clinton opposed him, it will be due to her decades of shady activities. quote:I hold no illusions that Trump is any sort of shining angel, but Clinton's scandals make even Richard Nixon look like a choir-boy by comparison. My choice to vote for Trump instead of Hillary had nothing to do with her being a woman, and everything to do with her being a crook and endemic of everything wrong with Washington D.C. A Clinton presidency would've signaled to every special interest on the planet that the US was officially on sale to the highest bidder, and that those same interests could go buck wild because accountability would be officially dead. quote:Do I know what a Trump presidency will mean? No. He has made promises, but won't assume the office until the 20th of January. However, I could estimate exactly what a Clinton presidency would mean. More of the same lobbyism and crony capitalism that enriches only the wealthy few at the expense of everybody else. Her presidency would've likely been another Gilded Age, like the one before Theodore Roosevelt took office. Thanks, but no thanks. Trump is going to be a catastrophe and you won't even notice as your life gets horrible worse and millions are killed in the streets because the big flashing lights in front of you held by Breitbart News and The Federal American Truth Report tell you that everything is going great.
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Nov 18, 2016 07:49
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ECHO CHAMBER almost always == "more then 1 person here disagrees with my essay of nonsense I made up and refuse to support with any sort of facts"
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Nov 18, 2016 07:52
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e;nm
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Nov 18, 2016 07:54
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I actually love the subtle partisan inferiority complex with "she was totally worse than Nixon guys, totally." Yeah the woman who at worst violated government IT protocol while carrying on the status quo of her Republican predecessor is worse than the guy who literally hired goons to break into his political opponents' homes and offices and steal their poo poo. Countdown to "Benghazi and Clinton Body Count/Cash" in 3, 2, 1...
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Nov 18, 2016 07:55
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