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Zurai posted:780% (elemental drive) * 1.3 (Hawkeye, which only works on elemental attacks) * 1.37 (Runic Gleam) * 1.3 (Elemental weakness, guesstimated) * 1.33 (Runic Precision) * 2.6 (Charge Edge, which doesn't stack with Charge) = 6,244%. 900% (Accel Drive) * 1.55 (Rage) * 2.6 (Charge Edge) = 3,627%. Even if you add maximum subclass Rage Mastery at maximum effectiveness, that's 4,932%, and requires you to be completely out of TP, which isn't a good situation to be in. And you have to set all that up again each time you get ready for a big hit. Blood Surge stays in effect for the entire battle. I have a 30% chance that I'm making my big hit on round 2 else round 3. And from then on there is no more setup its just how fast can I get to ignition (round 8-9 I believe).
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Mar 5, 2013 07:04
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The setup for Charge Edge is only significant on the first go around, where I usually skip it (at which point my setup of Hawkeye->Gleam is no more onerous than yours of Rage->Charge). Anyway, like I said, I tested it both ways and did way more damage overall in the 10 rounds before Blizzard King murdered me with Absolute Zero with Runemaster than I did with Bushi.
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Mar 5, 2013 07:23
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I'm not sure, but I think the crit hammer is on the third floor of the lush woodlands, in the secret area just south of the stairs.
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Mar 5, 2013 07:24
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Zurai what kind of builds are you running (or plan to run) on your NS and Sniper?
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Mar 5, 2013 07:30
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Zurai posted:The setup for Charge Edge is only significant on the first go around, where I usually skip it (at which point my setup of Hawkeye->Gleam is no more onerous than yours of Rage->Charge).
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Mar 5, 2013 07:39
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MotU posted:Zurai what kind of builds are you running (or plan to run) on your NS and Sniper? The sniper is PURE binds. I don't have any points in the other attack skills at all, currently, although eventually I'll work my way up to Squall Shot and max that. I find that I'm generally spending the first 10 or so turns of a boss fight spamming binds anyway because damage control is more critical than slightly higher damage (he still crits for 600 and then chases for 100-200 if he lands the bind). Currently he's subbed to Nightseeker for Blade Flurry, Speed Boost, and Follow Trace, but I'll be switching him to Arcanist for slightly better minion control, a tiny bit of backup healing, and the third tier abilities (reset status/bind resists, gain TP when you land a bind, and bind% up). The Nightseeker is a primary damage dealer along with my Imperial, although I havn't raised her actual attack skills beyond the minimum to reach Foul Mastery yet. Eventually I'll max out Biding Slice for its good damage-to-cost ratio. She's got Nerve and Venom throws maxed out (Venom for damage on bosses and for clearing out normal encounters with Spread Throw, Nerve for crowd control). On the Landshark end, she has Vanguard and the damage passives maxed out, and I'm eventually going to give her the Links, Iron Wall, Swordbreaker, and Weapon Parry, although Iron Wall and Weapon Parry aren't very high priority (only helps if my Fortress is disabled or dead or absolutely has to refresh a buff on a turn where I don't have other defensive measures in place). slayn posted:If we're talking the elemental dragons I can buy that easily. I think their weaknesses are extreme. My landsknechts links were doing 4 digit numbers which I have *never* seen before. Honestly it's not a big deal. Imperials deal such huge damage that I'm quite positive both methods are perfectly viable (I did beat the final boss with Imperial/Bushi, I only switched in the postgame). I didn't like losing 100 hp and 7 tp a round, personally, even with Endure to back me up. It's really just personal preference, I guess. I'm more cautious/defensively minded than others (I would never have dreamed of attempting a 5 Nightseeker party like Roguelike, for example, it wouldn't even have occurred to me although I can see how it works and he did beat the game with it), so not losing HP and having the extra defensive options really helps, and the damage is good enough to one-shot normal FOEs. Zurai fucked around with this message at 07:54 on Mar 5, 2013 |
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Mar 5, 2013 07:50
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I must just be awful at directions, but for the escort the blacksmith to get small flowers quest... are the Dense Bushlands the first dungeon in Scarlet Pillars or what? Google and GameFaqs weren't helping much.
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Mar 5, 2013 08:56
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Aerofallosov posted:I must just be awful at directions, but for the escort the blacksmith to get small flowers quest... are the Dense Bushlands the first dungeon in Scarlet Pillars or what? Google and GameFaqs weren't helping much.
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Mar 5, 2013 08:58
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Any tips for the 4th boss? He is resistant to all the status effects I throw at him and his area attack wrecks everybody's poo poo even with party guard.
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Mar 5, 2013 14:24
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Just got to the fourth area. Boy was I surprised when the battle theme was totally different! I can't tell if it's better then the original though
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Mar 5, 2013 14:25
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Well it's an EO tradition that the 4th stratum/area battle theme is a new one. Now, does the 6th Maze have it's own battle theme like 1 and 2, or does it not like 3?
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Mar 5, 2013 14:45
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I'm a bit confused with the "preserved by ice" quest. I found the bones when the cave was frozen but when I go back to it after lighting the place up they're gone. I even marked it on the map so I know it's there but it's not showing up.
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Mar 5, 2013 15:10
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slayn posted:That is a shitload of setup. hawkeye, runic gleam, sharp edge -> charge edge? You're not making your attack until the 5th round. Since Zurai is talking from a postgame perspective, it pretty much doesn't matter if it takes a lot of setup if it gets the job done. I'm currently running two Imperials in my main party. I've found Runemaster simply easier to run for normal dungeon crawling - Free Energy coupled with Finisher and Absorber means you actually net positive on TP as long as you're targeting weaknesses, and the way runes work means you can *create* weaknesses in literally anything you want. Bushi Deep Breath spamming or Impulse Edge spamming takes more turns to achieve independence. I didn't notice a significant damage difference between them for anything besides autoattacks, though this is just from clearing floors in the fifth labyrinth while experimenting. For big boss fighting they're basically a wash as well; Bushi takes less setup to get going, but I think that Rune has higher damage potential given a ton of setup time. Neither is a bad pick.
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Mar 5, 2013 15:21
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Well once I got to the bottom of the second Labyrinth and had Wufan join as a guest I instantly fell in love with Arcanists because holy poo poo. I walked into the boss fight sort of battered with only 2/3 TP on everyone but somehow managed to pull off a win on my first go, thanks to two things: 1. Runic Gleam + Fire Wall + Runic Guidance would very nearly one-shot the adds 2. Circles are goddamn amazing Seriously. Paralysis on everything, binds on everything, full party heal for 8 tp I practically won the fight on the virtue of that class. Also, is it just me or does that boss not build resistance to binds like other bosses? Because I landed arm/head binds at least 3-4 times that fight without any issue and they would always last awhile.
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Mar 5, 2013 16:25
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It is indeed cripplingly vulnerable to binds of all stripes because one of that boss's main gimmicks evasion would be ridiculously annoying for level-appropriate players if not. That and each of the labyrinth guest characters are intended to be hyper-effective against their specific boss to showcase their class to you. vvv This one actually has a pretty easy first stratum, a much, much harder second one, and then downhill from there. vvv Kanos fucked around with this message at 16:37 on Mar 5, 2013 |
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Mar 5, 2013 16:34
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Missed the EO4 launch, but played all of the previous EOs. Is difficulty still a downward slope like EO3's? EO3 for me was pretty much a difficult first dungeon, and then it was all downhill from there until the very final post-game bosses.
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Mar 5, 2013 16:35
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Kanos posted:It is indeed cripplingly vulnerable to binds of all stripes because one of that boss's main gimmicks evasion would be ridiculously annoying for level-appropriate players if not. Neat. Having turned in the mission now I guess having the guest character join your guild afterwards also happens every time? Because that's a pretty clever way to sidestep the problem of handing you a cool new class but then forcing you to grind them up to an appropriate level before using them.
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Mar 5, 2013 16:37
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Rascyc posted:Missed the EO4 launch, but played all of the previous EOs. Is difficulty still a downward slope like EO3's? EO3 for me was pretty much a difficult first dungeon, and then it was all downhill from there until the very final post-game bosses. It's really easy to overlevel yourself in this one and using an arcanist, sniper and nightseeker to shutdown and obliterate everything made half the game a joke so far. The game is still loving great though.
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Mar 5, 2013 17:09
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Speaking of difficulty is it possible to get away with a no-medic dancer healer party without overleveling? I want to try something a little newer for EO4. For reference my party is Dancer/Protector/Nightseeker/Sniper/Runemaster
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Mar 5, 2013 17:13
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Marogareh posted:It's really easy to overlevel yourself in this one and using an arcanist, sniper and nightseeker to shutdown and obliterate everything made half the game a joke so far. The game is still loving great though. It's also really easy to keep yourself underleveled if you're using a sniper and nightseeker, because you never really run into anything super difficult, and then you hit a boss and all of a sudden the boss fight is super tense because you're 8 levels below the guest character and your medic gets one shot if he gets hit.
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Mar 5, 2013 17:30
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Kanos posted:It is indeed cripplingly vulnerable to binds of all stripes because one of that boss's main gimmicks evasion would be ridiculously annoying for level-appropriate players if not. Curious how the second guest in dungeon 3 was supposed to sell me on the Bushi. he was a cool ox dude granted but he wasn't doing anything my other guys couldn't do to the boss.
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Mar 5, 2013 17:36
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:Curious how the second guest in dungeon 3 was supposed to sell me on the Bushi. he was a cool ox dude granted but he wasn't doing anything my other guys couldn't do to the boss. I want to know why they sub him as a medic since his healing was super weak.
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Mar 5, 2013 17:40
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Dragongem posted:Speaking of difficulty is it possible to get away with a no-medic dancer healer party without overleveling? I want to try something a little newer for EO4. It might, but the lack of on-demand reviving is going to be really really rough. I've done pretty well with a no-Fortress run up through the 3rd land, if you want to break the mold that way. DrManiac posted:I want to know why they sub him as a medic since his healing was super weak. For me it was how you could fire off Full Heals if you wanted to spend the time normal attacking / using Deep Breath since he has access to mana regeneration. Maybe to offset how you spend a ton of time gathering Ice Stakes on that level. Has anyone tried a frontline dancer? I'm trying to figure out the pros and cons of specializing in Trick Samba versus Rush Dance. I was thinking of maxing out the Sword Dance and Mist Dance, while subbing into Bushi to get Rage and Ferocity, but the damage output seems really unreliable versus Rush Dance with a link going, which reliably triggers all 6 chases from my Dancer. I haven't hit level 40 yet, so is there something I'm not getting? Does Trick Samba allow a Charge-boosted Bushi attack without expending the charge or something, or is the proc rate of Mist Dance high enough to make auto attacks worthwhile? Is the difference solely "use Trick Samba for mobs when you don't want to spend a lot of TP, and Rush Dance for bosses"
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Mar 5, 2013 17:47
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ThisIsACoolGuy posted:Curious how the second guest in dungeon 3 was supposed to sell me on the Bushi. he was a cool ox dude granted but he wasn't doing anything my other guys couldn't do to the boss. Roar strips the boss's flame wall and self-healing buffs, something no class you have access to up to that point can do. It's the easiest boss in the game if you break the big scale but I guess if you don't Roar would be super helpful/vitally important.
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Mar 5, 2013 17:55
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Unstoppable blade Meet unmoveable shield Now, Logre must die http://www.twitch.tv/roguelike
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Mar 5, 2013 18:05
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DrManiac posted:Any tips for the 4th boss? He is resistant to all the status effects I throw at him and his area attack wrecks everybody's poo poo even with party guard. He usually doesn't use * Mixer (his nasty all-party attack) immediately after changing faces. He always changes faces after using * Mixer. Each of his four faces are vulnerable to a different type of damage -- IIRC it's fire is vulnerable to ice, ice is vulnerable to physical, physical is vulnerable to volt, and volt is vulnerable to fire, but experiment for yourself. Logre can do absurd damage to him if you hit the vulnerability with a Drive. Aegis Guard will prevent the damage from Arm Mixer (the physical version), but not the other three versions, but Guard Order will lower the damage against all of them. Marogareh posted:I'm a bit confused with the "preserved by ice" quest. I found the bones when the cave was frozen but when I go back to it after lighting the place up they're gone. I even marked it on the map so I know it's there but it's not showing up. I'm pretty sure I remember gathering the bones when the cave is frozen. Meiteron posted:Also, is it just me or does that boss not build resistance to binds like other bosses? Because I landed arm/head binds at least 3-4 times that fight without any issue and they would always last awhile. She has negative resistance to binds. The resistance still builds, but it takes a while. Dragongem posted:Speaking of difficulty is it possible to get away with a no-medic dancer healer party without overleveling? I want to try something a little newer for EO4. It might be a bit rough if you do it from the start, but I switched to dancer/medic as my primary healer after the 4th labyrinth and beat the game and two of the postgame bosses so far that way. The main issue, as mentioned, is going to be reliance on nectars for reviving.
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Mar 5, 2013 18:19
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Rascyc posted:Missed the EO4 launch, but played all of the previous EOs. Is difficulty still a downward slope like EO3's? EO3 for me was pretty much a difficult first dungeon, and then it was all downhill from there until the very final post-game bosses. I'd say EO4 is a downward slope until postgame, but with a much easier first dungeon compared to EO3. I feel like the 2nd labyrinth boss was the most difficult part of the main storyline to me, and was also the only time I was actually underlevelled during the story. The skill trees are all much better this time around. You get access to good, useful skills early on, with a lot fewer bullshit filler prerequisites that do nothing. It's also quite easy to get overlevelled just through thorough exploring, completing all the quests, and using a burst skill that gives an EXP bonus. There's also rare breeds of monsters (foes included) that give another big bonus to exp if you can kill them before they run away.
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Mar 5, 2013 18:31
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The White Dragon posted:You can't get to them until you get the flight altitude upgrade from the first cave in the second area. Once you have it, it's back in the first area, on the cliff above the cave being guarded by Kangaroos; this one's guarded by a bird man. Oooh, thanks.
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Mar 5, 2013 18:47
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J posted:I'd say EO4 is a downward slope until postgame, but with a much easier first dungeon compared to EO3. I feel like the 2nd labyrinth boss was the most difficult part of the main storyline to me, and was also the only time I was actually underlevelled during the story. The skill trees are all much better this time around. You get access to good, useful skills early on, with a lot fewer bullshit filler prerequisites that do nothing. It's also quite easy to get overlevelled just through thorough exploring, completing all the quests, and using a burst skill that gives an EXP bonus. There's also rare breeds of monsters (foes included) that give another big bonus to exp if you can kill them before they run away. I kind of get the feeling EO4 is more or less the same thing, which is fine to me. I think anyway.
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Mar 5, 2013 18:52
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DrManiac posted:Any tips for the 4th boss? He is resistant to all the status effects I throw at him and his area attack wrecks everybody's poo poo even with party guard.
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Mar 5, 2013 19:13
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Does anyone remember the solution to the Book Spines Trap in the 2nd floor of the 4th Labyrinth? Southern dead end in E6. Edit: Haha, literally as a posted this I accidentally clicked it and solved it on accident. Right, Bottom, Top, Left Spoiled in case people want to guess a bunch and lose 50 HP. Double Edit: Oh, there's the solution like 10 steps away anyways. MotU fucked around with this message at 19:26 on Mar 5, 2013 |
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Mar 5, 2013 19:22
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MotU posted:Edit: Haha, literally as a posted this I accidentally clicked it and solved it on accident. Right, Bottom, Top, Left Spoiled in case people want to guess a bunch and lose 50 HP. It's kinda dick, you only get three tries before the thing explodes permanently.
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Mar 5, 2013 19:35
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How does retiring work? I never played an EO game up to the point where I considered retiring a character before. Does it give you a level 1 character with extra skillpoints (level of the retiree/10)?
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Mar 5, 2013 20:40
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Metrohunter posted:How does retiring work? I never played an EO game up to the point where I considered retiring a character before. Does it give you a level 1 character with extra skillpoints (level of the retiree/10)? Pretty much. I think it's 1 SP per 10 levels until level 70 (for a total of 7 SP), then nothing until level 99, in which case retiring gives you 10 skillpoints.
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Mar 5, 2013 21:25
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Retiring gives you a character at half the level you retired at (max 30 for retiring a character of level 60+) with 1 skill point plus 1 skill point per 10 levels pre-retirement up to level 70. If you retire a level 99 character, you get 2 bonus skill points, but you get the same amount (8) for retiring between 71 and 98 as you do at 70. Stat bonuses from books are carried over to the new character.
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Mar 5, 2013 21:36
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RoboCicero posted:Has anyone tried a frontline dancer? I'm trying to figure out the pros and cons of specializing in Trick Samba versus Rush Dance. I was thinking of maxing out the Sword Dance and Mist Dance, while subbing into Bushi to get Rage and Ferocity, but the damage output seems really unreliable versus Rush Dance with a link going, which reliably triggers all 6 chases from my Dancer. Unfortunately dancer chases do use up Charge. IIRC Rush Dance always goes at the end of the turn, while your dancer will probably attack before your bushi. I could be misremembering that last bit though.
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Mar 5, 2013 22:55
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So I finally thawed the underground lake, where is the clear ice in it? I can't seem to find it...
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Mar 5, 2013 23:35
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Ibram Gaunt posted:So I finally thawed the underground lake, where is the clear ice in it? I can't seem to find it... Is that the stuff you take to the vessel village? I got that before I thawed the lake and wouldn't be surprised if you had to do it that way. it's in the room with the torch
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Mar 5, 2013 23:37
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Rascyc posted:Yeah, it didn't help that if you were an EO vet then it was pretty clear what class combinations went well together in EO3. The main game was very easy to break and it always seemed like the difficulty in the game had to account for the player who had no clue how to subclass and built really terrible characters. So in a sense, your reward for being a good player was simply stomping the poo poo out of the game with your free meteors and multi-attack gun slingers. The game is great and I haven't been able to put it down. If you're a fan of the series I don't think you can go wrong.
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Mar 5, 2013 23:42
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I just beat the 4th labyrinth and I'm reshuffling my team around a bit. My team right now is: F/D, I/R, R/I, A/M and I'm currently in a tossup between keeping my dancer or trying out a nightseeker. My only concern is lack of healing as I enter the 5th stratum and I'm not sure whether just the arcanist will be enough. I mean, it has been enough since I unlocked them and I've used regen waltz about 4 times since stratum 2 so it's gone mostly unheeded as opposed to attack/chase samba. I can't really decide between having a dancer for front line defensive buffs or having a nightseeker for even more damage. Metrohunter fucked around with this message at 01:30 on Mar 6, 2013 |
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Mar 6, 2013 01:28
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