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Cool, cool. I mean, you have all rights not to believe I can follow up seeing as my PbP game died, but.. yeah. There's just something about PbP that kills both my creative impulse and bogs the whole thing down, whereas all IRC games I've had with goons have been awesome and worked out a charm. As I said, it's not really feasible before the start of winter, but I think we can do it. I'm in GMT+1, so weekends are probably the best bet, because I'm insomniac and don't mind being up and writing my rear end off whenever we can gather the rest of you.
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Aug 14, 2011 01:06
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Having ran a PbP shadowrun game you'll figure out that it is very doable as you have all the time in the world to write out what is going to happen when you sit down and respond because of the insane rules at times. Also, I ran three games/sessions. They took a year and a half moving at the complexity that I wanted and the pace that I didn't and I was new so I did something very, very stupid at the end of one of them and robbed the fun from most of them because it was the first game I ever GM'd.  PbP takes forever. Campaigns take forever. Unless you have staying power I wouldn't suggest joining one or starting one.
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Aug 14, 2011 01:29
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Ok.. created a game in the PBP Forum: http://forums.somethingawful.com/showthread.php?threadid=3431102 I'll take any questions there
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Aug 14, 2011 05:23
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Does anyone know the name of the trid show the chick on the cover from Shadowrun: Attitudes was from? And if it's based out of Los Angeles.
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Aug 14, 2011 13:05
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Opinions on Street Legends? Dumpshock seems to think that (unsurprisingly) it is full of errors and mostly useless.
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Aug 16, 2011 17:00
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Meh. Since some of the artifact books got bumped in the schedule, it has the fall out from a few events that "haven't happened yet"
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Aug 16, 2011 17:55
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Bigass Moth posted:Opinions on Street Legends? Dumpshock seems to think that (unsurprisingly) it is full of errors and mostly useless. All the mundanes aren't super well equipped, don't have SotA implants, occasionally have Alphaware, and mostly get by on base cunning and a scary reputation. Occasional skill group of 5 or 6. All the magicians have initiated several times and can kill you by looking at you.
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Aug 16, 2011 18:21
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Well, I have a creed for these situations: "No matter how drekhot the mage, 45 bullets between the shoulderblades will seriously cramp his style." And yes, I am aware that mages are broken in comparison to everyone else, particularly new runners, but that's why you plyy a sneaky git, eh? And even if the power level is too hosed, just have the chars start out against minions or friends of the big, bad prime boogieman?
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Aug 17, 2011 03:28
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Oh, I'm not exactly screeding against balance here. I'm just a little annoyed that the legends of the shadows who have awakened are great and powerful mages, while the legends of the shadows who haven't awakened aren't up to their nipples in the best toys money can buy.
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Aug 17, 2011 03:31
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Just wanted to post a recent experience here. The group was tasked with finding a chip containing something secret fot a local mob boss. Last intel said it was in the possession of a biker gang called the Soy Sloppers, due to the Mafioso boss' girl sleeping with their leader, and she'd been holding the package. The team found out that the Soy Sloppers were planning a big party at one of their safehouses, an abandoned Krill Krisps factory. So it was one players big idea to get ahold of some nausea gas to flush the place and give the group time to search. So in searching for the nausea gas, the team hit up their contacts looking for someone to provide it, and were directed to an arms dealer named Mikhail, who worked out of a junkyard and spend his time making scrap metal sculpture. This jovial, burly guy informed the team, sure, he had some gas. He didn't think it was nausea, but something like stun gas. His linguasofts (and theirs) read the 20 year old military Chinese as "bad gas". The group merrily purchased the canisters and went on their way. The crew placed the canisters at several points in the building's ventilation via drones, and sat back to watch the show on their commlinks. What they got was the worst snuff film ever. It turned out that the "bad gas" was a nerve toxin, and they sat two blocks away, watching abuelas and kids and yes, gangers, breaking their own backs over the enchiladas and taquitos (this was in Pueblo). They ended up fleeing the scene and not getting the chip, which was later revealed to have been in a ganger's rear end for safe-keeping. It's in the hands of Lone Star now, in the ME's office. The description of the event literally had most of the players in tears. As they watched a whole building full of people, even gangers, bang against the doors (blocked!) and succumb. And that's what Shadowrun should be about: consequences. When you shoot a security guard, he had a family. Maybe his brother was a Lone Star detective. Maybe he's a scrub instead, and just goes looking for vengeance. Shadowrunners are fundamentally hosed up people doing fundamentally hosed up things, and at the end of the day, they have a bullet to look forward to. Edit: oh, and we never found that loving chip.
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Aug 17, 2011 08:08
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Mystic Mongol posted:Oh, I'm not exactly screeding against balance here. I'm just a little annoyed that the legends of the shadows who have awakened are great and powerful mages, while the legends of the shadows who haven't awakened aren't up to their nipples in the best toys money can buy. I guess the explanation could be that once you learn how to use the tools you are comfortable with you don't have a lot of incentive to switch. However, it's more likely that it was sloppy and quickly thrown together garbage like the rest of Catalyst's releases. What are the stats for Ehran and Lofwry (and any other IE or "can't kill" NPC?) Martin de Vries is in it correct? Is his character in line with how he was presented in Prime Runners?
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Aug 17, 2011 14:04
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I always thought Shadowrunners who could not adapt (including switching methods and tools) were dead shadowrunners. Of course, if the tools in question are either powerful magical artifacts or nanocybernetic insta-kill murderweapons, I guess such considerations are moot 
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Aug 17, 2011 15:09
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I'm poking through it now, and on a fresh readthrough I'm spotting the word 'Betaware' a little more often than I did the first time, so it's not as bad as I was saying. Still, the dangerous ones are absolutely the mages--and there's no real USE for some of these runners. Sure, Wild Bull's wacky adventures and associated spin off video games are interesting, but what use is he? He doesn't hire runners, he doesn't have an agenda, he's not a player on any level--he's just a skilled shadowrunner. Martin de Vries is indeed in there, he's got high end but humanly achievable stats if you ignore his magic of 13. He also has a unique item that boosts his maximum essence to 16. Ehran the sage isn't, but they do have high prince Lugh Surehand, who's a garden variety magic 20 has all the spells kinda guy. Lowfyr has a magic of 27, an initiative of 43, a sorcery skill group of 12, and other stats besides. Why is his skill focus in magic casting and not social manipulation, which is what he does all day? But I guess with a charisma of 23, you don't need much in the way of skills.
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Aug 17, 2011 15:09
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Did I just read that right. Magic 27? Admittedly, he is the boss among dragons and all, but why even bother putting stats on someone like him like that. Lowfyr isn't waiting in Saeder-Krupp's Are there any amusing quirks in the book. End boss characters not knowing how to read, for instance?
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Aug 17, 2011 15:31
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Chicken Slayer posted:Did I just read that right. Magic 27? Lugh Surehand isn't some random mage--he's the immortal elf former ruler of Tir Tairngire. He showed up in 2030, mysteriously, and founds what for a time is the most dangerous nation on the planet. No one knows where they get their military, but it's outfitted with SotA tech and the average soldier is packing hundreds of thousands of nuyen worth of implants. Also when Harlequin needs help (Harlequin being Shadowrun's Elminster AND Shadorun's Drizzt) it's Lugh he turns to. Then there was a revolution and Lugh was out on his rear end. Now he's wandering the world looking for the, "Sextant of Worlds," an item which will supposedly allow him to single-handedly conquer Tir Tairngire, despite the aforementioned astounding magical military. Highest magic in the book isn't Lofwyr, it's great dragon Hestaby with magic 36. This post made my spellchecker go apeshit.
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Aug 17, 2011 16:01
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Mystic Mongol posted:Martin de Vries is indeed in there, he's got high end but humanly achievable stats if you ignore his magic of 13. He also has a unique item that boosts his maximum essence to 16. de Vries had that essence focus in prime runners as well, nothing new there. His high magic stat would be a requirement for his profession. Lugh is an IE dating back to at least the 4th World so high magic isn't surprising. Giving stats to Lofwyr and Hestaby is stupid because great dragons have special powers anyway which make them essentially unkillable. Edit: In SR2 Harlequin was listed as having a magic of "high double digits" so I'd assume you can adjust him down to around Lofwyr levels if you wanted based on re-balancing. Bigass Moth fucked around with this message at 16:46 on Aug 17, 2011 |
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Aug 17, 2011 16:44
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poo poo like that makes me glad that I ignore Harlequin and write off Lugh Surehand and the Tir Princes as a bunch of scam artists who managed to convince everyone that elves were immortal and fooled a nation for forty years.
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Aug 19, 2011 04:27
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Mystic Mongol posted:
I read this as Lowfyr also being sort of an old-school dragon who just eats people who displease him, thus creating a culture of fear/respect among his subordinates. If he's not manipulating you behind the scenes, he may just ask you to come to his office/cave for a performance review. Also reading those dumb super mary sue types makes me wanna pay someone to write a Shadowrun novel where they all die and its canon so it's not "when will harlequin save us?" but rather "when will the drug addicted sociopath career criminals save us to protect their own retirement?" which places that control back in PC hands.
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Aug 19, 2011 14:35
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After my lover has presented me with a kukri she found in Nepal, I'm sorely tempted to create a mystic adept with an Indian Army Gurkha koncept, following the Dark Goddess in the guise of Maha Kali! This idea: retarded or balls-out awesome? I know a fair bit about the gurkhas, but it does seem a bit one-sided.
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Aug 19, 2011 18:50
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4 PCs in a room. They know there are seven people in the next room, six of which are Awakened, in the next room waiting in ambush. So they fired an assault cannon through the wall, intending to throw gas grenades in through the hole it created. Force 7 Spirit of Man beat 'guy throwing in grenade' to the punch and threw its one spell - Force 7 Ball Lightning - through the hole. As I was resolving it, I remembered that metal armor is supposed to provide no protection from electrical-type attacks, and the entire group was wearing military-grade armor. If anything is made of metal, it's military grade armor. None of them had the non-conductive upgrade. 3 out of 4 PCs went down for the count, the other suffered no damage.
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Aug 19, 2011 18:58
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While this may stand as a reminder to the players to remember to buy chemical protection, fire resistance, insulation, and nonconductivity on any expensive armor, I can't fault them on this. Not only was attacking first through a wall absolutely the right move, full body armor isn't metal--it's ceramic plates over liquid gel armor over thick cloth padding. Actual metal armor is fairly rare when you could have something lighter, less conductive, and cooler.
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Aug 19, 2011 19:12
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Mystic Mongol posted:While this may stand as a reminder to the players to remember to buy chemical protection, fire resistance, insulation, and nonconductivity on any expensive armor, I can't fault them on this. Not only was attacking first through a wall absolutely the right move, full body armor isn't metal--it's ceramic plates over liquid gel armor over thick cloth padding. Actual metal armor is fairly rare when you could have something lighter, less conductive, and cooler. I believe straight up military armor is more like Fallout power armor though, probably containing a lot of dense heavy metals with ceramics and kevlar linings underneath.
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Aug 19, 2011 19:19
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I have some house rules I wanted to get feedback on from this thread, since most of us seem to be in agreement on key issues within the rules.. -Ban/Remove Form Fitting Body Armor from gear you or any NPC can use. -Emotitoys give a flat +1 bonus to Judge Intention tests. That is all they do, and they do not have a rating. The maximum force of spirit a Mage can summon is equal to his Magic Rating +1.(Which can still inflict Physical Drain, but should be way lower because of the cap) There may be a few spells that will be modified following this line of thought, though they are subject to change if after time in play, they cause unforeseen issues. So bear that in mind. (Stunbolt, Stunball, Manabolt seem to be key offenders here) The Spirit Power: Influence does not do what you think it does. -Instead, suggestions that seem harmless or inconsequential, or do not violate the 'moral code'(if said character has one) are resisted with just Willpower. Actions that would endanger the target, or someone they feel strong emotional attachment to is resisted with twice their Willpower in the Opposed test. Yes, this means high willed mundanes will often be able to shrug off these machinations of a ill-intentioned spirit, but as written, the power is far too easily abused. If you are an Adept, but not a Mystic Adept, you can still purchase the Counterspelling Skill, up to a maximum of 4.(Mystic Adepts can still raise Counterspelling to 6) If you are a Technomancer, you gain the Advantage Magic Resistance 4 for free. -This is mostly in here because there is an in-game implant that provides dice of magic resistance to mundane characters on this team of government agents and making an Technomancer take that is just lovely. I think the the way they've become in tune to the Resonance or whatever has warped their Essence so that it resists mana as a matter of course. Dumb, broken, okay?
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Aug 26, 2011 03:09
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Wow I had never actually read the entry for Form Fitting Body Armor. I just thought it was very concealable armor. Now it's just broken. I guess I'll hold it back for NPCs I want to be extra tough or something.
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Aug 26, 2011 03:20
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I think one PBP on here actually had the GM state clearly that you were more likely to own a sword made out of Lofwyrs dick than have a set of Form Fitting Body Armor.
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Aug 26, 2011 03:33
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I can see why. I've been having an amazing time running my game locally. The next game involves trying to infiltrate a Koshari underground fighting ring to find a focus for an L.A. flood zone vampire lord. Of course the reason they are doing it is oodles of Nuyen. I've got plots written out in case they actually try to get in on the fighting themselves and the troll bruiser might even run into an old buddy who will spark his amnesia. Can't wait.
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Aug 26, 2011 03:39
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Yeah, rereading that entry as well. I think what I'll do is treat it as customized-fitted body armor by itself (Body x 3), but uses regular armor rules when combined. Really, form-fit is supposed to make you look unarmored.
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Aug 26, 2011 10:04
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I've got no problem with Form Fitting BA as written. If all your PCs have it, then so does every NPC goon they run against. A simple solution would be to not allow any additional armor to stack with it (except PPP and helmets). I am also firmly in the camp that even mundanes should be allowed to purchase Spell Resistance as a skill.
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Aug 26, 2011 14:33
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Random issue that's been nagging me: Am I off, or are nanocybernetic enhancements not worth the shitton of money they cost? Also, having a hive installed seems kind of invasive for bonuses that one could get with gear or cyber/bioware.
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Aug 29, 2011 18:53
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thought I'd use the thread to mine for some ideas here. I started a new game with two players (technomancer and magician) and in the first job they acted as couriers to get a commlink (ripped out of a victim of street crime) to a data broker. Long story short, the broker decrypted it and it was information on experiemts by Evo to create technomancers. this is hot info and evo has been sending cor sec to clean things up and kill anyone who has come in contact with the data. They ended the game by "donating" it to the Dunklezahn (sp?) foundation and hoping they'd deal with it. what's a good place to take the story? I was thinking I'd have evo find them, but I'm not too sure that the foundation would do with the info? If the data becomes public, evo can just blame it on an independent subsidy and deny all knowledge. My goal is to have the players get involved and actually do something to stop the experiments. any ideas? I'm kind of stuck right now.
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Aug 29, 2011 20:48
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I'm in the process of reading through the thread in anticipation of an upcoming shadowrun campaign. My group has never played 4th Ed, but most of us have experience with a house-ruled 3rd Ed. In 3rd we always ignored or NPC'd the Matrix aspect of the game, for reasons everyone here understands, I'm sure. Since we'll be playing SR4 this time around, I'm really looking forward to including that aspect of the universe. Unfortunately, none of us really understand the Matrix rules very well. As we are discussing our party builds, I had the idea for all of us to dedicate 40 BP or so to hacking. I think this could be much more fun than one person dedicating 400 BP to being a technomancer or dedicated hacker. The other benefit, is that we can all learn the rules together. Playing around with a character builder, it seems like it's reasonable to buy a nice commlink with a hot sim module and a few rating 4 programs for less than 10 BP. Add a rating 4 skill or 2 for 16 BP each and we're all throwing 8 dice plus Logic for our Matrix tests. I figured we would break up our specializations into something like this: Matrix Perception / Data Search Guy Stealth Cracker Matrix Warrior Any feedback would be appreciated. What skills/software are needed for each role? Is this idea stupid or impossible for some reason that this Matrix noob doesn't understand?
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Sep 1, 2011 01:55
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Off the top of my head, these programs would be useful Perception Guy needs analyze and browse. Sneaky hacker needs stealth, exploit, spoof, command, edit. And matrix warrior needs armor, biofeedback filter, blackout and black hammer as well as attack. One thing they can do is have the stealth Guy sneak in, create accounts with his admin access, and give the other two a way in. Now that I think about it, everyone should have analyze so they know what they're looking at
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Sep 2, 2011 04:13
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God drat but these matrix rules are confusing. First session of my brand new table top SR campaign coming up, and I'm really excited, but I still don't get what's going on on the wireless side of things. I want the following scene to introduce my people to the game: Simple protection job, a courier is visiting Johnson with an object a lot of people desire. Our heroes stand around guarding the perimeter when a Stormcloud blimp-drone slowly enters the area and dumps CS-gas on them so the bad guys can try to make a break for the Johnson and the courier. Thing is, I want to have the hacker notice something is off and give them a chance to hack/blow up the drone before it drops the payload, but the rules are just too hard for me to make sense of. Am I doing this correct? Let the hacker newbie know he can roll scan+system in order to see wireless nodes nearby. Then, when he notices a node entering the area, I let him roll Analyze+Computer in order to learn things about the node in question - will this be enough to know that it is a Stormcloud, that it is active and that it is currently loading a grenade launcher? Or would you need a subscription in order to learn things about the hardware host? And, if that is right, what would be needed in order to take control of the drone? I want to give the players a chance to hack it and drop the grenades on the bad guys so there's some humor in it. Please help, as I've read and re-read the rules, but I'm still stumped.
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Sep 7, 2011 18:28
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I wouldn't even require a roll to see new nodes within his signal area, as long as the hacker specifically states he's constantly scanning for new nodes. After all, you can't hide the fact that there's a new signal. Once the node is within the hacker's range, the hacker uses a Simple Action to Observe in Detail on the icon, and roll Computer + Analyze against whatever you set as the threshold. Each hit is one detail regarding the icon (that it's a Stormcloud drone, whether it's actively rigged or running on autopilot, who's listed as the registered owner, if it's loading its launcher, etc.). If the drone is trying to hide its icon, it's an Opposed roll vs. Hacking + Stealth (or Firewall + Stealth if it's running on autopilot). Once the hacker has identified the blimp, he can then hack that bitch. In order to issue any kind of command to the drone, he first has to log in with an account suitable for issuing commands (such as the registered owner mentioned earlier). Now, since he won't have time to probe the target (which takes hours in VR), he's gonna have to do it on the fly (pg 221 of the core). This is a Complex Action (if you're all rolling initiative right now) Extended Test of Hacking + Exploit vs. the drone's Firewall (probably +6 for admin) each Initiative Pass until he's exceeded the threshold. Every roll also gives the drone (or rigger) an Analyze + Firewall test against the hacker's Stealth program rating. If they succeed, all the fun on pg. 222 starts. Once the hacker has established an admin account, he can do whatever the Hell he pleases. The table on pg. 219 is useful as a reference. Unless a rigger is actively perceiving through the drone, I wouldn't even roll for detection after that, unless the hacker's doing something like trying to crash the OS or something else blatantly malicious to the blimp itself. Go hog wild! Vent the hydrogen! Eject the fuel cell! Launch CS grenades in random directions, bringing police attention to the owner! tl;dr: New node in the area allows a Matrix perc check that works just like a regular perc check except it's Computer + Analyze. Node requires a hack on the fly to create an admin account. After that, it's all gravy. Unless, of course, the rigger's paying attention. In which case, Matrix combat, pg. 230!
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Sep 7, 2011 19:04
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Geekkake posted:I wouldn't even require a roll to see new nodes within his signal area, as long as the hacker specifically states he's constantly scanning for new nodes. After all, you can't hide the fact that there's a new signal. Have you ever opened a wireless laptop in the city? You can get a couple of dozen hits, easy--and this is today, when each signal is a distinct local area network or router designed for accessing the internet. In the future, where signal technology is better and the half-digested soykaf bar in your stomach probably has a small node for the collection and dissemination of advertising information, your commlink is probably in range of thousands if not tens of thousands of networks at any given moment. That's why you specifically have to scan for nodes using specialized software--humans just can't keep up by pawing through a list.
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Sep 7, 2011 19:41
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Thanks a bunch, Geekakke, that was good and concise, I think I have the hang of it now. And yeah, in an age of ubiquitous RFID tags, dystopian population code systems and a cup of coffee that can host it's own server, I see the "scan" option as having to navigate that mass of traffic.
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Sep 7, 2011 19:49
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Mystic Mongol posted:Have you ever opened a wireless laptop in the city? You can get a couple of dozen hits, easy--and this is today, when each signal is a distinct local area network or router designed for accessing the internet. In the future, where signal technology is better and the half-digested soykaf bar in your stomach probably has a small node for the collection and dissemination of advertising information, your commlink is probably in range of thousands if not tens of thousands of networks at any given moment. That's why you specifically have to scan for nodes using specialized software--humans just can't keep up by pawing through a list. That's fair enough.
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Sep 8, 2011 17:28
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One of the beautiful things about Shadowrun is that you ALWAYS have to split the party. this makes for great opportunities as a GM. For instance, in one module I made it advantageous for the covert ops specialist to come into an EVO facility from the roof, while the others stayed with the in provided by the Johnson, a scheduled delivery of lab equipment. They were tasked to get some pay data and extract a scientist, unfortunately for them the facility was already aware of their plans to to their torture of the scientist to spill his guts. So they were walking into t trap and it was executed perfectly. The facility was in a faraday cage so the technomancer had to go in with the face and the street sammi so they could get the pay data. So they were delivering the package to the second floor when the guards moved in and tried to apprehend them. the face and street sammi engaged them outside the elevator and the technomancer enabled the emergency shutoff for the elevator and hacked the buildings security. Meanwhile the guards on the ground floor moved in on the rigger, but the rigger had back in the way of two dobermans. THEN the covert ops specialist practically ran into one of the security guards on the third floor and she needed back up bad because she was out numbered 5 to 1. So the face then locked herself into the other elevator and jumped into the roto drones she had flying over the facility. The roto drones crashed through the windows showing glass on the guards on the third floor and engaged them with the covert ops specialist. Because they split the party it made for an amazing fight sequence, they all managed to extract the scientist and get the pay data. The icing on the cake was that they never actually looked inside the packages they were to deliver...inside were enough explosives to blow the top off a mountain. As they fled the scene the explosives detonated and they entire building was gone. Then they learn that the Johnson is dead after they try to contact him and a EVO kill squad finds them due to a tracker chip inside the scientists shoulder. Made for a great session.
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Sep 12, 2011 20:01
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Quick question regarding the core books. I'm gearing up to learn the game so I can GM it with some friends, and I've got the 20th Anniversary Edition, and almost all the core supplement books save Augmentation (which is on its way), and I just got Arsenal the other day. And honestly, as goony as it sounds, I'm a little annoyed that Aresenal's cover doesn't follow the layout of the other core supplements. But I understand that it's a second printing, and there's actually a print of Arsenal that DOES follow that cover layout. So while I'm interested in returning the reprint and ordering the original print, I'm told the original print doesn't "sync" with the 20th Anniversary Edition core book. Is it true, or can I safely order the original Arsenal print and not be left confused?
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Sep 17, 2011 23:11
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Mansion Maniac posted:Quick question regarding the core books. Just stick with the one you have, if you base Shadowrun books on the cover art you will be extremely disappointed.
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Sep 18, 2011 14:49
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