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Laphroaig posted:You end up with Attributes E, but hey you'll be the best Decker out there; you'll have like... 24 dice before edge 7. The the -10 Penalty you can still roll 21 dice, plus whatever your Agent gives you on a teamwork test. Makes hacking in combat reasonable. I think I will simply say that this is unappealing to me and let it lie there rather then get into another big arguement over this  Although that does bring another question - Agents. How good are they? I feel like I don't quite have enough of a grasp to judge them. I did notice that, while you can only run one type of a program, you can have multiples. This means a Decker could by the program that rearranges your deck twice, and have two setups, one for Attack, and the other for Sleaze, and simply swap between them with ease as a free action when needed, since those are the two you'll most likely be using in combat or tense situations.
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Nov 4, 2013 16:50
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ProfessorCirno posted:I think I will simply say that this is unappealing to me and let it lie there rather then get into another big arguement over this Agents are autonomous actors that take up a program slot. Generally, they roll rating x2 for their dice. At character creation, I believe you can start with a rating 4 agent. You generally want to buy a Rating 6 ASAP. Since agents are autonomous, they roll their own initiative (which is 4d6, since they are a program they count as being hot-simmed) plus rating x2 I think. I don't remember the exact way it works out for their initiative, but suffice to say they have good initiative. They have dog-brains, much like a Drone's programs. But they are an extra set of actions, which in this system is invaluable. There is, however, no clear limit on the number of instructions you can give them. Your GM will have to decide what type of command is a free action, what is a simple, etc. Right now they are like spirits - they do what you tell them to do. Even simply having the agent roll initiative and then spend its actions making teamwork tests to help you is useful, since every hit they get on the teamwork tests raises your limit by 1 and gives you a bonus die to roll. A rating 6 agent is giving you 3 to 4 more dice. Agents have no limit to how many you can run on your deck. They use up a program slot. I think you want to have as many as your GM will allow to help you on teamwork tests. Even outside of teamworks tests, they can do things during combat, like make Matrix Perception tests.
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Nov 4, 2013 17:02
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Am I reading cyberlimbs right? Each limb can support up to Rating 3 armor, and it all stacks? Ultimately, if you had the money for upgraded cyberware, you could get two Full Arms and two Full Legs with Rating 3 armor in each and have 12 armor that stacks with anything else you wore? "Armor enhancements prove an Armor bonus equal to their rating, cumulative with other armor, without adding encumbrance."
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Nov 4, 2013 20:52
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Mortanis posted:Am I reading cyberlimbs right? Each limb can support up to Rating 3 armor, and it all stacks? Ultimately, if you had the money for upgraded cyberware, you could get two Full Arms and two Full Legs with Rating 3 armor in each and have 12 armor that stacks with anything else you wore? "Armor enhancements prove an Armor bonus equal to their rating, cumulative with other armor, without adding encumbrance." That's correct, but you can only start with +2 armor on a limb unless you buy the limb as used ware (which you also have to buy used accessories for). This is the current cheese for most sam builds I've seen and it's pretty much dumb as hell to expect every sam to be a full-body conversion.
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Nov 4, 2013 22:27
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The real cheese is to buy 1 cyberarm with 2 cyber feet and 1 cyberhand to get to 12 armor, to save essence and money.
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Nov 4, 2013 22:36
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Bigass Moth posted:That's correct, but you can only start with +2 armor on a limb unless you buy the limb as used ware (which you also have to buy used accessories for). This is the current cheese for most sam builds I've seen and it's pretty much dumb as hell to expect every sam to be a full-body conversion. So wait... :looks again: There's no rule that you have to average the armor of all limbs, or any rule that the armor only applies to the specified location or anything like that? Huh.
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Nov 4, 2013 23:21
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That is 100% correct, and one of the ways that Shadowrun's attempts to abstract combat winds up being kind of dumb if you think too hard about it. There's no such thing as "hit location" in Shadowrun which means that armor coverage isn't a factor, only armor value. This means that if you have a pair of armored cyberfeet giving you +3 armor each that anyone who shoots you will find you to be just as protected as if you were wearing a full suit of armored clothing unless they make a "Called Shot" to bypass your magnetic foot-armor. By the same token there's no reason to buy a suit of armored clothing when you can buy an armored vest instead since the vest is only $50 more, concealable under normal clothing, 3 points higher, and it doesn't matter that it only covers your chest rather than most of your body because in the grim cyberfuture all bullets are armor-seeking by default.
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Nov 5, 2013 01:23
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Kai Tave posted:That is 100% correct, and one of the ways that Shadowrun's attempts to abstract combat winds up being kind of dumb if you think too hard about it. There's no such thing as "hit location" in Shadowrun which means that armor coverage isn't a factor, only armor value. This means that if you have a pair of armored cyberfeet giving you +3 armor each that anyone who shoots you will find you to be just as protected as if you were wearing a full suit of armored clothing unless they make a "Called Shot" to bypass your magnetic foot-armor. Well yeah and I'm fine with all that. I just feel like having two cyber fists shouldn't make you 100% more difficult to harm than having one. Taking the highest armor value or something seems a lot more sane.
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Nov 5, 2013 01:37
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I feel like this issue is less with armor on 'ware and more with armor on stuff like cyberhands and cyberfeet. Like I can see a big fat bulky arm giving you more armor overall, and it definately fits with stuff like a cybertorso.
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Nov 5, 2013 02:09
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Honestly I would support giving all cyberhands/feet armor +1, lower arms/lower legs armor +2, and full cyber limbs armor +3 at no cost, as well at maybe +4 armor to torsos and skulls, but in return you can't upgrade any of those values. Then there'd be an advantage to cybering up bodyparts.
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Nov 5, 2013 05:31
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Actually, I've been working on a hacker over the weekend. I would appreciate some feedback. The concept I started with is "Neo-anarchist Viking Elf Hacker"--decidedly pink-mohawk in a group that's started out trying to be Operators Operating Operationally and quickly went fuckways while earning an appropriate reputation. My top priority as the only hacker in the group is to be able to hack like a motherfucker. No half-measures on that front. The character doesn't particularly care about subtlety, preferring to get in, make a splash, and get out before anyone rubs the dust off their goggles. I have been listening to a lot of death metal lately, so he has an axe. The axe is not negotiable. Since this is an ongoing game, I've also got 72 additional karma to spend "after" chargen. The tin foil is there for the construction of booster bags as portable, makeshift faraday cages. While I can turn the wireless off on things I own, I may not be able to do so on things I acquire along the way. I'd like him to hack, be scary enough that folks are hesitant to physically approach him in combat (and smart enough to take cover), and have lots and lots of Batman tricks to pull out. Right now, all I've got left to do is give him 12 points of contacts. And, of course, a proper name. code:Diaghilev fucked around with this message at 07:06 on Nov 5, 2013 |
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Nov 5, 2013 07:04
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There's something I've been wondering about, regarding implanted commlinks. Do you need to buy a subvocal mic with them, or can you Ghost In The Shell it by default, rules-as-written?
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Nov 5, 2013 14:56
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I've always assumed that implanted commlinks or those connected to you via a datajack just let you do the whole "telephone call with your mind" thing, because otherwise what's the point?
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Nov 5, 2013 15:05
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What about programs? Do I need to buy programs to be able to do a Future Google search or to use Future Word/Photoshop, or do these programs just make it easier to do so with the Computer skill?
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Nov 6, 2013 00:39
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Diaghilev posted:Actually, I've been working on a hacker over the weekend. I would appreciate some feedback. Edge is a very useful attribute. All things being equal, you want more of it. Drop a lot of the stuff you are spending karma on like raising the Firearms group to 2 and spending karma to take specializations after character creation (why are you doing this by the way, drop the skills you took at 1 rank and instead buy specializations, then buy those same skills back with karma. You'll save 10 karma. (2 each to buy the skills at 1 or 4 karma v. 2 specializations at 14 karma). Also it takes a literal day to learn a new skill at rank 1, and you can learn a number equal to your logic divided by 2 a day. Whereas it takes a solid month of hard training to learn a specialization. Oh you did it to raise the skill group. The issue is the group discount from 5->6 is 6 karma, which is still less than the 10 you'd save by breaking it up during character generation. So buy Edge up. I'd say since you have so much karma, but it up to as close to 6 as possible, Doc Dee posted:What about programs? Do I need to buy programs to be able to do a Future Google search or to use Future Word/Photoshop, or do these programs just make it easier to do so with the Computer skill? Commlinks don't have program slots. Doing a search would be Logic + Computer. OR you call up one of your contacts and have them do it for you (hint: if you do not have a high logic + computer, call up one of your contacts and have them do it for you). Laphroaig fucked around with this message at 00:54 on Nov 6, 2013 |
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Nov 6, 2013 00:46
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Doc Dee posted:What about programs? Do I need to buy programs to be able to do a Future Google search or to use Future Word/Photoshop, or do these programs just make it easier to do so with the Computer skill? The latter. Programs are basically small boosts. You can keep a number of them "active" at a time based on your deck and switch them out as needed (though it costs an action to do so). I'm not sure if commlinks can even use the programs.
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Nov 6, 2013 00:49
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So I finished a decker myself the other night for a PBP 'round here. It's quite a bit too late to make most changes, but I thought I'd share it anyways. Here! I tried to give some character with stuff like Perform (Guitar) to fit the whole psuedo-punk rocker thing, gave him an addiction I tend not to see (it's always alcohol or drugs that actually help you!), and of course knowledge skills is where you tend to see a lot of the "characterization" or fluff stuff. Overall I noted that you probably don't need the best deck you can get right from the start. Deck matters when you start butting against the Limits or if your firewall is getting it's poo poo rocked. The limit thing can be handled to some degree by just going for more marks to lower your dice pool if you're really that confident, too, so in the end the deck could basically be how many programs you can run (and always run Virtual Machine for one extra), your highest limit, and your Firewall. I also noticed that, while you can only RUN one of each sort of program, nothing stops you from having more then one, so you can stock up on Configurators and leave a program slot empty to switch all your stuff immediately. In my case I'm going to stick with just two - one with high Attack, and one with high Sleaze, since I don't forsee myself needing to suddenly switch all in to Data Processing in the heat of battle. Also, decking takes loving a lot of skills!
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Nov 6, 2013 01:46
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ProfessorCirno posted:So I finished a decker myself the other night for a PBP 'round here. It's quite a bit too late to make most changes, but I thought I'd share it anyways. Yeah, you can have as many programs installed as you like, just like a modern computer. I believe there is something in the rules about switching out programs, but it may have just meant switching which programs are active. In any case, I'm going with unlimited programs installed, because storage space is supposed to be loving gigantic in SR, so why the hell not? But also just like a modern computer, you don't want to try running them all at the same time.
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Nov 6, 2013 02:19
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You can switch programs as a free action, same as changing stats in your deck, if I recall. So it'd take four actions to swap out all four programs...or one free action to bring in one Configurator program. The offside, of course, is that the Configurator has one set configuration. If you don't want that, well, start using those actions.
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Nov 6, 2013 02:26
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If I can't use programs on commlinks, why does the book say programs can be used on commlinks, decks, and terminals??? Actually, I just read, and common programs fall under "cyberprograms" which can only be used on decks, so no Google Boosters for me. 7 dice should be good enough starting out to do a Matrix search, right? I have no idea, I need to actually get a game under my belt to get a feel for it.
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Nov 6, 2013 02:51
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Dude, I'm not with my book right now. I'm making my best guess. Thus "I'm not sure..." 
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Nov 6, 2013 03:34
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ProfessorCirno posted:Dude, I'm not with my book right now. I'm making my best guess. Thus "I'm not sure..." I know, I said I found that programs can only be USED on decks, but can also be stored on commlinks and dataterminals. But I also said I have no idea what kind of dice pools are necessary for any kind of action, especially for the start of a campaign. I'll figure out soon enough.
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Nov 6, 2013 04:01
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Doc Dee posted:If I can't use programs on commlinks, why does the book say programs can be used on commlinks, decks, and terminals??? Depends on what you're looking for.
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Nov 6, 2013 05:10
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Laphroaig posted:useful things Thanks! I swapped some stuff around to make better use of my existing karma, and what karma I earn in play will quickly go toward boosting Edge even higher. My GM will be disappointed that I am able to avoid blowing myself up.
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Nov 6, 2013 10:10
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The biggest issue with that decker is that you have too few dice playing guitar, what were you thinking?
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Nov 6, 2013 10:42
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Poil posted:The biggest issue with that decker is that you have too few dice playing guitar, what were you thinking? That he's in a lovely punk band 
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Nov 6, 2013 12:24
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ProfessorCirno posted:That he's in a lovely punk band He should have zero die then, and the Incompetent flaw.
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Nov 6, 2013 14:08
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Bigass Moth posted:He should have zero die then, and the Incompetent flaw. He is just bad enough to never be any good, not bad that it would be character defining. A key difference.
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Nov 6, 2013 14:54
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Bigass Moth posted:He should have zero die then, and the Incompetent flaw. He said a lovely punk band, not a great one.
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Nov 6, 2013 15:02
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Mr. Maltose posted:He said a lovely punk band, not a great one. This is beautiful.
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Nov 6, 2013 15:41
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Can't play, can't sing, can't dance, but he CAN set his genitals on fire and scream.
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Nov 6, 2013 15:56
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Would Shadowrun be a good system to roleplay the world of pre-Reaper War Mass Effect, or should I be casting my eyes more at Eclipse Phase?
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Nov 6, 2013 20:46
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TwoQuestions posted:Would Shadowrun be a good system to roleplay the world of pre-Reaper War Mass Effect, or should I be casting my eyes more at Eclipse Phase? There's really no reason to take Shadowrun's system. The good thing here is the setting, not the system.
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Nov 7, 2013 01:15
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I have finished creating my Shadowrun Missions Season 5 character. After much deliberation I went with making the zero augmentation, zero magic character that can walk in anywhere. Once an Aztechnology agent of espionage, this cannibal got stuck in Chicago's CZ when poo poo went down. He survived the containment but is now a deniable asset as he was supposed to have died in the CZ. Now he runs the shadows to keep up his James Bond lifestyle and taste for metahuman flesh. His weapons of choice are injection darts disguised as an anachronistic fondness for pens.code:dirtycajun fucked around with this message at 19:44 on Nov 8, 2013 |
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Nov 8, 2013 19:21
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I'm really not sure if this belongs more here or in the Notable Gaming Experiences thread. Last night's run involved gaining both physical and matrix control of a specific Hyper-Rail train headed from Portland to Vancouver, picking up “The Package” from another team waiting at the Aztechnology HQ stop in Olympia (Salish-Shidhe territory), making it past the security checkpoint at the Everett Marina (in Seattle proper), and then delivering “The Package” to Vancouver at the end of the line. We were given access to a powerful Jammer that would shut off communications to the train during the first leg of the journey. Unknown to us, there were a group of Triads escorting a secure locker of high-grade bioware to Everett. Four of the five runners, with rank 4 SINs, went down to Portland, stayed the night, then got on the train first thing in the morning. The fifth runner was an adrenaline junkie with (I think) an addiction to doing insanely dangerous and stupid things (physical adept with vehicle-based skills, distinctive style, adept centering that consists of yelling "WOOO!!!" incredibly loud). The adrenaline junkie arranged for a ramp and motorcycle to be placed at a convenient place near the tracks, so he could jump onto the train, then get inside and bring his extra firepower to bear. At the rendevous point, he landed on the roof of the last car of the train just as we triggered the jammer. The hacker and infiltration specialist went to work accessing a security panel to get to a hardline for the train's systems, while the street samurai and the magic detective (my character) stayed incognito and followed the Triads back towards the cargo cars (where they suspected their bioware crate was in trouble). Which was when everything went wrong. The adrenaline junkie was on the roof of the caboose, next to an access hatch. Rather than trying to lockpick in, or wait for the hacker to do his thing and unlock it, or crawl forward to the plastic tubing between cars and cut his way in that way, he decided to blow the access hatch with a high explosive grenade. I'm not sure if the character or the player didn't realize how much damage the HE grenade would do, or overestimated the physical strength of the train, or what. But the explosion peeled off the entire back half of the caboose like a sardine can, flinging giant hunks of flaming metal out onto the rails behind us, along with two guards sucked out at 200 mph. At which point the mission was guaranteed to fail, because there's no way the train would've gotten past ANY security checkpoints after that. In the chaos that followed, all of the Triads and all but one of the guards died, and the thirty or so civilian passengers were terrified out of their minds. The adrenaline junkie parachuted off the back of the train before the first checkpoint, and the hacker disabled the braking systems, keeping the train going at cruising speed. "The Package", a two-meter square heavy duty metal crate, was delivered not by stealth, but by brute force. As the other team of runners held off Aztech security with a truck-mounted machine gun, they hacked the automated cargo loader to jam the crate into the middle cargo car (which also further demolished the top halves of the train's rear three cars). The street samurai had gotten in touch with this team when everything went down, and the package delivery team's attitude was "Your problems aren't mine, I'm going to deliver this package and get paid for the job". The street samurai cashed in a major favor, and after we blew through the Aztech checkpoint, a DocWagon VTOL flew in and extracted us, the sole surviving guard, and a DocWagon client. Everyone else was left to their fate, and the VTOL dropped us off in a field in Puyallup. As we walked back to civilization, we watched the aftermath via news feed. The train proceeded to tear through downtown Seattle, the Everett Marina station, and all of the associated security checkpoints on the way north. Due to the speed in which it changed security jurisdictions, no single force was able to respond in time, and it tore straight off the end of the line into the Univeral Omnitech HQ in Vancouver to deliver “The Package”. Less than a half hour after the we were dropped off in the field, there was a bright flash of light off the horizon to the North, followed by a massive cloud and a tremendous wave of stale hot air. "The Package" was a tactical nuclear weapon, which completely destroyed Universal Omnitech HQ and much of the surrounding area. Lone Star captured the rogue DocWagon agent (the street sam's contact), charged him with aiding in an international terrorist event, and he's now on death row. At some point during all of this, the GM said "I fully expected that train to get trashed. I just didn't expect it to happen in the first ten minutes of the run." Even though the session was so horribly derailed so quickly, he ran with it, and all of us were just laughing throughout at all the crazy poo poo that was going down. (This group has been playing together off and on for something like 15 years; the AJ's player has a habit of doing this sort of thing, derailing adventures in ways that turn out to be hilarious in hindsight, even if you want to strangle him while you're at the table). There was serious debate about whether or not any of the other characters would ever work with the adrenaline junkie again (the player was more than willing to make up a new character if that was the case), but it looks like we will for at least one more mission. The group as a whole has decided that they're going to try and break the street sam's contact out of prison... Seeing as he did save our lives, and this would allow the junkie to do the one thing he is good at: Providing a distraction. tl;dr A package-delivery / train mission goes FUBAR when a high-explosive grenade destroys the caboose in the first ten minutes of the run. Beef Hardcheese fucked around with this message at 23:20 on Nov 9, 2013 |
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Nov 9, 2013 23:17
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Simon Draskovic posted:tl;dr A package-delivery / train mission goes FUBAR when a high-explosive grenade destroys the caboose in the first ten minutes of the run. I would watch this film. Awesome stuff.
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Nov 10, 2013 02:39
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http://www.pcpro.co.uk/news/385294/motorola-patent-uses-neck-tattoo-as-microphone Every time I see an article like this, I find it useful for justifying technological advancements past similar points in 207X.
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Nov 10, 2013 07:01
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Spirit Clarification Question Time! The book says that "You can only summon one spirit at a time". Is this use of the verb summon meant to indicate that you can only summon a single spirit at one time (i.e. one action), or that you may only HAVE one summoned spirit at a time, and you must bind them to have more than one floating around? Compiled sprites are more clear that you can only have one, but spirits seem vague to me. Have I missed something in the rules? It seems like limiting magi to a single summoned spirit at a time makes sense in terms of preserving the action economy, since bound spirits require at least an investment of nuyen in the form of reagents, but I was curious what people here thought.
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Nov 11, 2013 07:53
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Are straight medics any fun to play? I am doodling around making an on-deck character and was thinking of doing a dedicated street doc/disgraced surgeon. The shtick being he is a little to fond of his own medicine. Going to max first aid, chemistry, biotech and stuff like that, his thing being the manufacture of new and exciting drugs, both as weapons and a little after run treat. For a mirrorshades game he would be played more as a tragic, scheming figure, the pink mohawk version would be more like The Dude with a medical degree. Going to name him "Dr Benway" in either case. I think some house rules for custom drugs would be needed to really make him work as the bonuses and penalties for the book drugs are too great for someone to really be a constant user. To give him some combat skills I would focus on making gas "grenades", dart gun ammo, and sprays. Does this sound reasonable?
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Nov 11, 2013 18:44
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Spell caster to boot, for extra healing umpf. On the other hand I enjoyed playing with our cyberdoc "Dr. Strangeglove" the mad man with an injection dart throwing cyber arm.
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Nov 11, 2013 19:24
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