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You Are A Elf posted:Man, talk about absolute garbage that made it on TV. Adult Party Cartoon was a half hour of “how trashy can this get this without actually telling a joke or having a plot or meaning?” The answer was always never enough, apparently. Him making GBS threads out his KickStarter cartoon years late and it being a joke-free collection of grimacing faces and bouncing asses that ends with a commercial for a food truck is such a perfect capstone to his career. It's even full of terrible CGI just so you get to see JohnK sacrifice whatever twisted version of scruples he has. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xSZqX5Io6AY bartok posted:I think Ren and Stimpy got better when Bob Camp took over for the pedophile John K. Speaking of John K. how mad do you think that pedophile was at the Animaniacs reboot and the news that Tiny Toon Adventures is getting a reboot? The good news is it feels like it's been a decade since the kind of GenX animation neckbeards that signal boosted John K's thoughts have been relevant or had an audience at all so I literally have no idea. Every now and then you'll see someone like KC Green grumbling about how adult-oriented animation sucks because it's people standing around telling jokes without actually taking advantage of the medium and the general malaise about everything being rebooted is inescapable but for the most part it feels like those people all got chewed up by their assorted gamergate/comicsgate culture wars or just aged into irrelevance like the Penny Arcade guy.
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Feb 4, 2021 16:46
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la la laaa laa la
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Feb 4, 2021 16:50
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...of SCIENCE! posted:Him making GBS threads out his KickStarter cartoon years late and it being a joke-free collection of grimacing faces and bouncing asses that ends with a commercial for a food truck is such a perfect capstone to his career. It's even full of terrible CGI just so you get to see JohnK sacrifice whatever twisted version of scruples he has. I mean, I wouldn't equate someone like KC Green to the trash can that's JohnK, though.
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Feb 4, 2021 16:54
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You Are A Elf posted:Who even remembers Gary the Rat or Stripperella? Who brings up Ren & Stimpy Adult Party Cartoon with nostalgic fondness? The answer is no one. I remember Stripperella, I remember Spike advertising for it pretty aggressively on its channel before it came out. They really pushed the name recognition of Pam Anderson and Stan Lee, and shoved in the four or five  good gags in the commercials.
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Feb 4, 2021 16:55
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...of SCIENCE! posted:Him making GBS threads out his KickStarter cartoon years late and it being a joke-free collection of grimacing faces and bouncing asses that ends with a commercial for a food truck is such a perfect capstone to his career. It's even full of terrible CGI just so you get to see JohnK sacrifice whatever twisted version of scruples he has. You can tell John k is old as gently caress because his animation looks like a lifeless flash video from the 2000s (complete with pasted-in low-res photos and 3D renders). He’s also trying to hawk these “digital toys” which I guess might have found a niche audience back when the dancing baby was popular https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QxckTqrxLW0
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Feb 4, 2021 16:58
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Shinjobi posted:I mean, I wouldn't equate someone like KC Green to the trash can that's JohnK, though. Like look at Doug-- bland, underwhelming animation with flat designs have always been around.
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Feb 4, 2021 17:13
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The Moon Monster posted:I watched the first episode of adult party cartoon and it was basically just nothing but daring the viewer to stop watching. The funniest thing to come out of it is the phrase "adult party cartoon". IIRC That episode was twenty minutes of Ren and Stimpy talking about loving each other. That was the one "joke" told over and over for twenty loving minutes.
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Feb 4, 2021 17:14
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mind the walrus posted:I've never quite understood animation snobbery stuff about how things don't move enough or have varied enough facial expressions. Like I can see where they're coming from in terms of the stuff that drips down to non-hobbyists like me, but I've yet to read a reasoned critique. There always seems to be this desire to denigrate what is popular and fail to offer alternatives, which just looks petty and entitled. It's especially asinine because almost all television animation is outsourced so the only real difference is how much money you were able to convince the company paying for your cartoon to throw at the koreans actually making your animation.
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Feb 4, 2021 17:17
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Mega64 posted:IIRC That episode was twenty minutes of Ren and Stimpy talking about loving each other. That was the one "joke" told over and over for twenty loving minutes. I have now remembered "you're the pitcher... and I'm the catcher!" in a not-Billy West Stimpy voice, and my life is the worse for it. apparently the pitch meetings for the original cartoon would get wild, and one of the plots was "Ren has gotten Stimpy pregnant," which is funny if you're trying to be edgy in the writers' room for a kids' show but it turns out is not funny if you treat it as a good idea for an episode
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Feb 4, 2021 17:24
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...of SCIENCE! posted:It's especially asinine because almost all television animation is outsourced so the only real difference is how much money you were able to convince the company paying for your cartoon to throw at the koreans actually making your animation. It's always been budgets. Like, the real golden age of animation was when you got the equivalent of Pixar movie budgets for 5 to 15 minute shorts, and it showed.
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Feb 4, 2021 17:27
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You would think if they were such serious fans of the medium they'd find an appreciation for doing more with less. Even the lower bounds like Family Guy and South Park clearly employ their dirt-simple designs for a purpose-- it allows them to produce more new assets quickly. Sure the lack of fine motion is disappointing but like Ghost Leviathan said the issue there is always going to be budgets.
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Feb 4, 2021 17:38
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I'm reminded of an issue with CG cartoons, which I've come to call 'The CG Trap'; CG has its own ups and downs compared to drawn animation, with the animation itself in some ways presumably being much cheaper, allowing more action-oriented sequences, but the downside is that assets are so much more expensive to make- if you do a one-and-done monster of the week that's destroyed at the end, that's something you can't use again unless you contrive it. Probably the OG for high profile CG cartoons, Beast Wars, made the most of this by having a much smaller cast than most shows but focusing more on characterisation and ongoing story as a result, as did Transformers Prime years later. War Planets/Shadow Raiders comes to mind as being similar. (and probably a competitor in the selling toys sector, but it was at least pretty good for its time and had a helluva dark story for a 90s kids cartoon. I think it was British, so maybe some Warhammer influence) Reboot on the other hand got around the limits of 90s CGI by having the characters be actual video game characters, so looking like obvious CG just made sense, because they are. Sonic Boom strikes me as a more prominent victim, as the deliberately blandly designed and one-note background characters ended up being prominent in episodes simply because the protagonists have to interact with somebody besides each other, and it becomes clear there's like, three locales they made for the show. Early season CG TMNT also kinda shows it, with how conspicuously empty NYC is, but I think they must have gotten a serious budget boost later on for all the crazy poo poo you only see for one episode.
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Feb 4, 2021 17:49
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What adult watches a cartoon at a party? Or was this an attempt at doing a “holy roman empire” thing where it’s actually none of those things
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Feb 4, 2021 17:53
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crazy eyes mustafa posted:What adult watches a cartoon at a party? Or was this an attempt at doing a “holy roman empire” thing where it’s actually none of those things in another clip, he says something like "people always want cartoons to be funny, but why shouldn't cartoons be sexy?" so adult is in the porn sense, party is a euphemism for sex/coke orgies, and cartoon refers to how John K is a bad imitation of a human being
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Feb 4, 2021 18:08
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A lot also makes sense realising when whiny old fucks long John K refuse to pay any meaningful attention to the progress of the medium they miss that all the poo poo they think is groundbreaking has already been done, for better or worse.
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Feb 4, 2021 18:14
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Stephen Universe is horrible because of its fans, not because of the content. I've never seen an episode of it, but I know enough about it because of its fans. Any rebuttal to this just proves the rule. Doug, on the other hand, has no fans. Thus it is ur-bad.
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Feb 4, 2021 18:19
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wee-yow
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Feb 4, 2021 18:21
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Doug was always that show I thought I liked as a kid because it was between shows I wanted to watch and was tolerable enough that I didn't bother to change the channel. A cartoon palette cleanser if you will.
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Feb 4, 2021 18:40
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I remember Ren and Stimpy being more deranged and disturbing than funny. Except the one where they move to Canada to become sausage tycoons, that one was funny.
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Feb 4, 2021 18:49
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Backweb posted:Stephen Universe is horrible because of its fans, not because of the content. like Rick and Morty (but with a very different demographic), it's a really good cartoon ruined by people being insufferable about it
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Feb 4, 2021 18:49
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Ralph Hurley posted:The best thing about original She-Ra was the background paintings She Ra was boss! The art owned, her accent owned, and Hordak was a meanie! That's the Christmas spirit of Eternia!
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Feb 4, 2021 18:50
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Extra Large Marge posted:I remember Ren and Stimpy being more deranged and disturbing than funny. Except the one where they move to Canada to become sausage tycoons, that one was funny. yeah pretty much, but deranged and disturbing is still cool I'd go with space madness as the best R&S episode
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Feb 4, 2021 18:52
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doug has two things going for it: the animation isn't like, great or even good, but it was decent enough and didn't use the klasky-csupo art style billy west has two great roles
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Feb 4, 2021 18:53
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hawowanlawow posted:I'd go with space madness as the best R&S episode
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Feb 4, 2021 18:58
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Empty Sandwich posted:like Rick and Morty (but with a very different demographic), it's a really good cartoon ruined by people being insufferable about it Word. R&M is incredibly clever and has a great writing team, but its fans mistake the "clever" things as a sign from the cosmos that they themselves are a super genius for getting pop culture references. One thing that turned me away from R&M is that a guy I know (from before the show aired, and still have to interact with regularly) is a super self-absorbed egocentric rear end in a top hat who has similar mannerisms to Rick, including his dismissiveness. I couldn't enjoy the show. Fake edit: like another poster said many pages back, that this thread keeps veering away from Doug is an indictment about Doug.
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Feb 4, 2021 19:07
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Empty Sandwich posted:so adult is in the porn sense, party is a euphemism for sex/coke orgies, and cartoon refers to how John K is a bad imitation of a human being 
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Feb 4, 2021 20:04
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Animation thoughts! It's great when animation moves well and it can be done on a small budget. See: Japan. There's a huge bias against anime techniques in the US because Disney's been held as the gold standard for so long, and sensibly so because it was such a pioneer of the field. However, like with the early days of Japanese animation, we benefit from a cultural exchange. You get warned to cut the anime poo poo in school, but my generation has been so inspired by it that they're just going out and doing it anyway with some excellent results. Rise of the TMNT, Glitch Techs, Owl House, Steven Universe, etc., all have sakuga shots that are really breath-taking. People hire Spencer because he can make things look good on 3 or even 4 frames. Despite his Boss Who Hired Him For This Explicit Purpose on Owl House, he ended up getting a lot of push back from Cal Arts-trained superiors because it's a rule of Disney you animate on 1's or 2's and never more. So it's really frustrating for an animator to be told you can't make something dynamic when you're a kid who grew up watching anime. You know you loving can. I'd also love to see more adult animation come out of this country that's not "boob, boob, sex, swear" stuff. Primal was good move and I'm currently working on a sci-fi drama, so we're finaaaaaally scratching the surface of the other things animation is capable of. Rant over! For now.
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Feb 4, 2021 20:06
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You guys know what cartoon held up pretty drat well Samurai fuckin' Jack https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lqkr5vnYO48 It's a goddamned miracle Genndy Tartakovsky got the chance to finish it too.
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Feb 4, 2021 20:14
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God, I loving LOVE the first three episodes of that last season. The rest... God, I love those first 3 episodes.
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Feb 4, 2021 20:16
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Backweb posted:Stephen Universe is horrible because of its fans, not because of the content. It sucks as an action show because it builds up threats and problems and then has them be easily dismissed almost as an afterthought and it sucks as a vehicle for teaching kids about real-life issue because every time it's defanged by having Steven give some quavering-voiced speech about friendship and then it turns out the villain was just a depressed teen who needed to be told it's OK to have feelings. It actually has a fair bit in common with Doug in that sense, where Doug never actually learns anything or grows as a person because the things he worries about are always resolved on their own without him having to do anything or face the consequences of his actions.
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Feb 4, 2021 20:47
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I remember an episode of Doug where he and Skeeter have to go door-to-door selling candy bars and nobody wants them because the chocolate is all gross and rock hard and tastes like concrete. Then the last house they go to is the Willy Wonka knockoff who makes the candy bars and Doug and Skeeter feel all awkward and guilty about being there. Then fake Wonka takes a bite and only then realizes that his candy is terrible. Apparently for who knows how long, there had been concrete pouring into the mix at the factory and nobody noticed. This was treated as Doug saving the chocolate factory, but I always thought that incident would have destroyed the factory due to all the negligence and scandal.
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Feb 4, 2021 21:05
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I vaguely recall that episode but I think it mentally merged with another show because I can't remember Doug in it
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Feb 4, 2021 21:12
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Heath posted:I vaguely recall that episode but I think it mentally merged with another show because I can't remember Doug in it LOL, Doug becoming invisible in the memories people have of his own show is peak Doug
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Feb 4, 2021 21:59
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Sardonik posted:You guys know what cartoon held up pretty drat well Samurai Jack kicked rear end. I know it's not everyone's cup of tea but I still really enjoy it. That reminds me, I have to watch the second season of primal.
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Feb 4, 2021 22:11
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Linux Pirate posted:Samurai Jack kicked rear end. I know it's not everyone's cup of tea but I still really enjoy it. Would you believe the second half of Primal is even better than the first?
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Feb 4, 2021 22:45
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Samurai Jack is one of those things I just straight up do not understand the appeal of. It seems tonally all over the place and I find the art style really unappealing. But I acknowledge that that is aesthetic preference.
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Feb 4, 2021 23:29
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...of SCIENCE! posted:It sucks as an action show because it builds up threats and problems and then has them be easily dismissed almost as an afterthought and it sucks as a vehicle for teaching kids about real-life issue because every time it's defanged by having Steven give some quavering-voiced speech about friendship and then it turns out the villain was just a depressed teen who needed to be told it's OK to have feelings. It actually has a fair bit in common with Doug in that sense, where Doug never actually learns anything or grows as a person because the things he worries about are always resolved on their own without him having to do anything or face the consequences of his actions. I hate to say it but there's some hard truth in here. Steven Universe does so much excellently that it's hard to not notice when it still has to default to the serial franchise problem of wrapping things off a little too neatly. That's not a knock, I love Marvel/DC stuff and they're the Kings of punting emotional growth downfield to stay adolescent and melodramatic forever, but it is an observation worth taking into consideration. Part of emotional honesty that the show champions is admitting that sometimes we really aren't going the full distance, and own that choice. I also never did notice how Doug never really had to learn from within. Dude really is the most passive protagonist I've ever seen. Even in his own thread it's so impossible to use him as a driving force. Heath posted:Samurai Jack is one of those things I just straight up do not understand the appeal of. It seems tonally all over the place and I find the art style really unappealing. But I acknowledge that that is aesthetic preference. Primal has its faults, but I felt it was Mr. Geddy and his team using lessons they learned on Jack to tell a similar story with much greater focus.
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Feb 5, 2021 00:42
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Samurai Jack was one of the first cartoons to purposefully try to break away from a lot of the industry established modes of cartoon making for the sake of the medium. Tartakovsky had built up enough good will from Dexter's Lab and PPG that he was given the freedom as an artist to create something completely different in terms of storytelling and aesthetics. It was the first show to remove outlines from its characters, which is now fairly common. His team created something from the heart, heavily influenced by a lot of Japanese movies and animation, and allowed each episode to revel in this fact. Some episodes were narratively minimal, but if you approach it as "a creator was given the freedom to create," it's a delight.
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Feb 5, 2021 01:37
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Feb 5, 2021 02:15
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This better not awaken anything in me
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