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Spanish Manlove posted:which gym teaches how to do a wake up shoryuken? really that gym should teach new players to NOT do a wake up shoryuken
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Nov 10, 2019 02:26
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Brother Entropy posted:really that gym should teach new players to NOT do a wake up shoryuken The trick is you dp on their wakeup instead.
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Nov 10, 2019 02:31
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ImpAtom posted:"Pokemon is very difficult if I intentionally handicap myself" doesn't prevent it also from being for kids. Intentional handicaps are a way people try to make games they've mastered more interesting. The Pokemon franchise is and always has been absurdly easy barring a few optional challenge areas. This is because it is designed with the core idea being "the story is just for fun and to collect stuff so that you can compete with other people." Pokemon has issues with being competitive but that's more because GF isn't the best as designing for competitive and also had almost a thousand Pokemon so any attempt at balancing is a fool's errand. (For the record I doubt 400 will be any better balanced but we'll see.) But I found the earlier Pokémon games to still be fairly difficult and I played them recently; I used Empoleon, Roserade, Togekiss, Houndoom, Magnezone, and Chimecho in that Platinum run I mentioned and despite that and only really using repels in caves while battling every single trainer, I hit the Pokémon League with Pokémon in the mid 40s, when the weakest E4 member has them in the high 40s, and had quite a few individual fights like Wake where I had to retry a few times. "Pokemon is very difficult if I intentionally handicap myself" just isn't really true since to me it only holds water in XY and on, most of the previous games had enough places that actually are difficult. I didn't need to handicap myself in those playthroughs I did last year for them to still have a fair bit of difficulty  XY and on are only really that eays because of the Exp. Share which they pretty obviously aren't designed around aside from being a "just skate through the game" mode.
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Nov 10, 2019 02:34
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iospace posted:So, what would hard mode entail, beyond no exp share? Reducing exp gain makes it more grindy, so I'm eh on that, but am interested in other ideas. For starters, if enemy trainer has a grass pokemon out and a water pokemon in his party and you throw out a fire pokemon on the field, enemy trainer will switch to water pokemon for the incoming fire attack. Trainers already do this but very very infrequently and generally their pokes have terrible stats so that even if they switch into a type advantage move 80% of their hp is gone anyways and they are slow af so they won't be revenge killing you.
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Nov 10, 2019 02:54
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iospace posted:So, what would hard mode entail, beyond no exp share? Reducing exp gain makes it more grindy, so I'm eh on that, but am interested in other ideas. I almost feel like there should be two different hard modes that take the game in essentially opposite directions. One hard mode should limit grinding by capping your Pokemon's levels based on badges (instead of just making traded Pokemon above a certain level disobey based on badges). Also no items in battle, just like in battle facilities (this would apply to opposing Trainers too, and would mean that X items would no longer exist in this mode, I guess). Opposing Trainers would all have decent AI, and many would have full teams of 6 Pokemon. The other hard mode would be something more like the Battle Pyramid, where the focus would be on managing limited resources. You'd still have access to in-battle healing if you found potions lying around, but free out-of-battle healing would be limited because you wouldn't be able to just leave a route/building/forest to return to a Pokemon Center until you'd "cleared" the area for the first time by reaching the other side or beating the "boss." There would be no "whiting out"; losing a battle would mean returning to the last save point. Grinding would be limited because there would be limited amounts of XP and money available in the game (maybe there would be no XP gain from wild Pokemon more than a few levels lower than you, no XP gain or money from rematching a Trainer you've defeated before). I think there are people who have essentially done this as a self-imposed challenge, though, so making it an actual game mode is maybe unnecessary.
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Nov 10, 2019 02:58
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ah so Grind Hard and Sadomasochist Hard e: the exp cap thing of scenario 2 wouldn't really work well because after you clear the game you want to rise pokes for competitive but suddenly wild encounters don't give you exp lezard_valeth fucked around with this message at 03:13 on Nov 10, 2019 |
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Nov 10, 2019 03:09
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galagazombie posted:I don't think I saw a single entry hazard in ORAS until the literal champion fight where Steven used Spikes. Actually that would be a cool way to freshen up Gyms. Instead of the types have each teach you about a gameplay aspect. This Gym uses entry hazards, this Gym uses Switch-Out moves, etc. That would be unbearably annoying in places and nowhere near as iconic as just using types.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:10
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ImpAtom posted:I mean to be fair Pokemon is about the only RPG I've ever heard where people complain about the entire party getting EXP. Even in games where combat determines stat growth and such people prefer to have it on. Only the lead getting experience is archaic as hell and I genuinely don't know why people want it so bad. Being able to turn off experience share didn't stop the complaints about X/Y or Sun/Moon.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:10
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I WANT THE BALL CREATURE THAT SINGS AND GETS ANGRY AT SLEEPING THINGS
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Nov 10, 2019 03:10
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Only the lead getting experience is archaic as hell and I genuinely don't know why people want it so bad. Being able to turn off experience share didn't stop the complaints about X/Y or Sun/Moon. That’s because both of those games have other problems unrelated to an optional toggle
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Nov 10, 2019 03:15
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TheKingofSprings posted:That’s because both of those games have other problems unrelated to an optional toggle Then those are probably the problems that need to be fixed.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:17
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Then those are probably the problems that need to be fixed. you could do both of those things
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Nov 10, 2019 03:19
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it takes a lot more effort to fix fundamental design issues or to implement an entire new suite of modes when "let people toggle a thing" is relatively simple and inexpensive, so maybe start with that one
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Nov 10, 2019 03:20
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So is experience share the problem or not? I'm getting mixed messages here.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:21
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:So is experience share the problem or not? I'm getting mixed messages here. you're talking to multiple people, wild how they might have different thoughts on a topic.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:24
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:So is experience share the problem or not? I'm getting mixed messages here. You could always use that big brain of yours and do some critical thinking about how it might affect the game and come to your own conclusions instead of requiring someone to tell how to feel about a thing.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:25
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Only the lead getting experience is archaic as hell and I genuinely don't know why people want it so bad. Being able to turn off experience share didn't stop the complaints about X/Y or Sun/Moon. it stopped my complaints about XY and sun/moon. with it off they're more or less in line with previous game difficulties, with it on you start outleveling stuff fast
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Nov 10, 2019 03:26
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:So is experience share the problem or not? I'm getting mixed messages here. It's part of the problem. Exp. Share in a fairly challenging game is a good thing, it cuts the grinding down so you can spend more time on the fun parts Exp. Share on an easy game is just overkill
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Nov 10, 2019 03:26
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The game provides a way to limit the amount of experience you gain by making most trainer battles optional.Borsche69 posted:You could always use that big brain of yours and do some critical thinking about how it might affect the game and come to your own conclusions instead of requiring someone to tell how to feel about a thing. Can't see why people find the Pokemon community toxic.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:34
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:The game provides a way to limit the amount of experience you gain by making most trainer battles optional. battling trainers is the whole game though, minimizing the amount of gameplay you engage in is way dumber than just having a toggle quote:Can't see why people find the Pokemon community toxic. lol, that's some thin-rear end skin
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Nov 10, 2019 03:39
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It’s not even about the challenge for me, I just like the numbers to be the same. I’m like that in every game that lets me control exp to a similar degree. It’s aesthetically pleasing
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Nov 10, 2019 03:40
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SpaceDrake posted:See though, this still doesn't track with my own experiences with kids, including my own childhood; my experience with kids and games is that, more often than not, if the game gets hard, they'll just buckle down and try to beat it. It's possible that isn't true today (or at least is seen as not being true) due to the absurd cornucopia of distractions, amusements and time wasters available to human beings in the year of our Arceus 2019, but I'd still have my own doubts about that being the case. If the games are being designed to be "easy for kids", then I think that design is itself wrong-headed. A major thing was that when we were kids we didn't really have a choice. Games were still a new thing and a lot of them were genuinely crappily designed so a lot of us beat our heads against stuff that was just kinda crappy. However that's a design philosophy that is 20 years old at this point. Most games trend towards being accessible over being difficult because scaring people away isn't something you want to do now. That isn't to say there aren't Super Duper Hard Games but most of those are not marketed towards kids and specifically sell themselves on being something you beat your head against and which kills you a lot. This isn't even exclusive to kids. A vast majority of people who play games nowdays will give up if they reach a particularly hard or unfun part because there are seven dozen other games to play. Console players have all the myriad free games they've given ever month and I don't know a PC gamer who doesn't have a steam profile a mile long. There's not a lot of reasons for people to keep struggling at something they don't enjoy when they can just move on to something else. There's not really any solution because "I'm not having fun, I'll play something else" is something a lot of us would have done as kids if we had near-instant access to massive libraries of games instead of the one copy of Metal Warriors we borrowed from Blockbuster.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:42
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LIVE AMMO COSPLAY posted:Can't see why people find the Pokemon community toxic. The majority of your posts in this thread have been crying that anyone makes even the mildest criticism of the game like "Man I wish I could at least toggle this option off." and basically sea lioning your way around going "OH WOULD THAT SOLVE ALL YOUR PROBLEMS? NO? THEN IT"S NOT AN ISSUE!" Toxicity thy name is Live Ammo Cosplay
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Nov 10, 2019 03:48
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A longer term solution would be buffing the trainers with larger teams, and maybe better ai (but then there would be idiots who slog their way through everything.)Scrap Dragon posted:It’s not even about the challenge for me, I just like the numbers to be the same. I’m like that in every game that lets me control exp to a similar degree.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:49
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lezard_valeth posted:ah so Grind Hard and Sadomasochist Hard The idea is that neither option would be Grind Hard because both modes would actually stop you from grinding. The difficulty would be finding ways to win without grinding. As for raising Pokemon for competitive, my implicit assumption was that people who were trying to raise Pokemon for competitive play would play either the normal mode or the first hard mode. But it just occurred to me that there's an alternate solution of having postgame areas where you could grind XP and money, as well. Plus they could just make it possible to fix IVs with bottle caps at level 50 instead of level 100, so you wouldn't need to raise Pokemon that much anyway. But my proposal isn't entirely serious anyway, at least as a proposal directed at Game Freak. Think of it as two different directions "hard" fan games could go (instead of just being grindy, as they often are), I guess.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:49
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Can we not sling endless insults over a game?
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Nov 10, 2019 03:50
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Aw yeah motherfucker we're at the 11th hour random slapfighting stage of pre-release threads. Choo-choo let's loving go
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Nov 10, 2019 03:52
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https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/du52ka/swordshield_director_ohmori_maintains_that_the/ Interview out from the Netherlands says the reduced dex isn’t getting reversed and will be the standard going forward, among other things.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:54
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iospace posted:Can we not sling endless insults over a game? the hell I won't, assfrump
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Nov 10, 2019 03:54
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The Lets Go games improved the general flow of individual battles (though didn't have to deal with stuff like weather) so hopefully it's a bit better. Not having to run on a 3DS probably helps. More double battles please.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:54
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Bleck posted:the hell I won't, assfrump t  t
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Nov 10, 2019 03:55
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iospace posted:Can we not sling endless insults over a game? nah dude, not happening, sorry.
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Nov 10, 2019 03:57
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hatterene says trans rights
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Nov 10, 2019 03:58
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iospace posted:Can we not sling endless insults over a game? but also no
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Nov 10, 2019 04:00
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The main problem with "better trainer ai" is that at a certain point the game just cheats and reacts to whatever choice you made, so you can't really outplay it. For example, say you had a fire type out against their grass type and you knew they had a water type to switch in. Against a human, you could predict the switch and use say, thunderbolt expecting the switch. The ai would read that move and leave the grass type in to use a status or coverage move of their own because they know they're safe. It all just becomes a matter of either having the bigger numbers or learning new ways to exploit the ai. And honestly, while I do think boss fights and the like should definitely be more challenging than they had been in the last few games, making every trainer fight hard and giving them full or almost full teams just makes getting through new areas a slog. Victory Road in nearly every game has always been my least favorite area for that reason. Just my opinions though.
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Nov 10, 2019 04:00
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Johnny Joestar posted:hatterene says trans rights Still hoping her shiny says lesbian rights so we can make her the most powerful pokemon.
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Nov 10, 2019 04:01
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Plasbad posted:The main problem with "better trainer ai" is that at a certain point the game just cheats and reacts to whatever choice you made, so you can't really outplay it. For example, say you had a fire type out against their grass type and you knew they had a water type to switch in. Against a human, you could predict the switch and use say, thunderbolt expecting the switch. The ai would read that move and leave the grass type in to use a status or coverage move of their own because they know they're safe. It all just becomes a matter of either having the bigger numbers or learning new ways to exploit the ai. And honestly, while I do think boss fights and the like should definitely be more challenging than they had been in the last few games, making every trainer fight hard and giving them full or almost full teams just makes getting through new areas a slog. Victory Road in nearly every game has always been my least favorite area for that reason. Just my opinions though. Make every gym boss like the old monk fight from demons souls
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Nov 10, 2019 04:02
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Plasbad posted:The main problem with "better trainer ai" is that at a certain point the game just cheats and reacts to whatever choice you made, so you can't really outplay it. For example, say you had a fire type out against their grass type and you knew they had a water type to switch in. Against a human, you could predict the switch and use say, thunderbolt expecting the switch. The ai would read that move and leave the grass type in to use a status or coverage move of their own because they know they're safe. It all just becomes a matter of either having the bigger numbers or learning new ways to exploit the ai. And honestly, while I do think boss fights and the like should definitely be more challenging than they had been in the last few games, making every trainer fight hard and giving them full or almost full teams just makes getting through new areas a slog. Victory Road in nearly every game has always been my least favorite area for that reason. Just my opinions though. That doesn’t have to be the case if you have the AI commit to it’s move before the player selects theirs.
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Nov 10, 2019 04:03
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TheKingofSprings posted:That doesn’t have to be the case if you have the AI commit to it’s move before the player selects theirs. That's a fair point, I'll give you that. I guess I've just been playing too many romhacks that definitely got it wrong and it's just frustrating when it happens.
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Nov 10, 2019 04:04
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Plasbad posted:The main problem with "better trainer ai" is that at a certain point the game just cheats and reacts to whatever choice you made, so you can't really outplay it. For example, say you had a fire type out against their grass type and you knew they had a water type to switch in. Against a human, you could predict the switch and use say, thunderbolt expecting the switch. The ai would read that move and leave the grass type in to use a status or coverage move of their own because they know they're safe. It all just becomes a matter of either having the bigger numbers or learning new ways to exploit the ai. And honestly, while I do think boss fights and the like should definitely be more challenging than they had been in the last few games, making every trainer fight hard and giving them full or almost full teams just makes getting through new areas a slog. Victory Road in nearly every game has always been my least favorite area for that reason. Just my opinions though.
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Nov 10, 2019 04:04
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