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bewilderment posted:
I'll add that phys skills are so broken that, until very late game, you're probably better off using your other 'guy with phys skills' member instead of 'girl with gun skills', just because she needs late game passives to do real damage and having better magic usually does not actually matter (a light sneeze of the right element will still knock enemies over). Basically every boss battle that is not specifically resistant to physical ends up as three dudes bashing a giant monster repeatedly while a cat/girl uses a heal spell sometimes. Another little thing dragging P5 down - they set up a character as being a versatile jack-of-all-trades, but then she flat out stops learning phys skills like midway through the game. This means that her magic stat isn't really good enough to do fantastic magic damage (as its balanced with her strength stat), so by endgame she's just a buff/heal/support character with disappointing magic offense and a sizable strength stat that does nothing. Her support moveset is good enough that she's worth using (especially since high-level heals fully restore all health regardless of the user's magic stat), but it's still disappointing considering how they introduce the character - especially with her visual design.
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Apr 28, 2017 04:37
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You know how goons described Lords of the Fallen as "the best bad game"? Well I'm calling Nier the worst good game. Because it's great fun, the combat is awesome, it's all the platinum goodness I could hope for. But the Chip-Recovery system is the single worst game mechanic I have ever encountered. It has a Dark Souls rip-off corpse recovery system - but you don't drop souls/currency when you die, you drop your equipment. And if you die before you get back to it, that equipment is gone forever. On this one boss, I have lost all my useful gear. My damage resistance, my auto heals, all gone. I was also loaded up with Max Hp + gear, so now we have that wonderful DS2 thing where I'm now at half the health I was before. And your consumables dont reset when you die, so I have no healing. This one mechanic is game ruiningly terrible. gently caress it so much.
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Apr 28, 2017 07:27
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Considering it literally just puts you back at the last save-point you should probably just reload your save if you die in a bad place. Assuming you're saving obsessively, like you should be.
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Apr 28, 2017 07:48
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Veotax posted:Considering it literally just puts you back at the last save-point you should probably just reload your save if you die in a bad place. That works for items, but does it restore your chips?
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Apr 28, 2017 08:18
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Strom Cuzewon posted:That works for items, but does it restore your chips? The game has no auto save, if you reload your save then you never died. So yes, you keep your chips.
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Apr 28, 2017 09:10
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Strom Cuzewon posted:That works for items, but does it restore your chips?
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Apr 28, 2017 09:11
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Lunchmeat Larry posted:yes. Remember, there really isn't an autosave - you get put back at (usually) the last save point when you die but it doesn't actually save at any point until you do. That's really weird. Checkpoints that aren't really checkpoints. On the brightside when I reloaded after ragequitting all my chips are still there. Still feels like an exploit. Can't help thinking of all the beautiful chips I lost previously that I could have still had.
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Apr 28, 2017 10:55
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Strom Cuzewon posted:That's really weird. Checkpoints that aren't really checkpoints. And yeah the logic falls apart sometimes with things like repeating cutscenes/dialogue after respawning and respawning at the start of major boss fights but whatever. Lunchmeat Larry has a new favorite as of 11:01 on Apr 28, 2017 |
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Apr 28, 2017 10:58
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It's a neat idea but really half-asses the ~art~ behind itself, which is a shame.
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Apr 28, 2017 11:03
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poptart_fairy posted:It's a neat idea but really half-asses the ~art~ behind itself, which is a shame. the game checkpoints you during the Eve fight; i was glad i didn't have to start all over but you could tell that was one of those concessions the devs made for QoL over a design statement. regarding the chip recovery, i think that stops being a thing once the bunker is gone. i don't remember having to pick up my chips after that point in route c
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Apr 28, 2017 15:47
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If procedural generation is a way of covering for being bad at level design then being artsy commentary is a way of covering for being bad at game design.
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Apr 28, 2017 16:09
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Guy Mann posted:If procedural generation is a way of covering for being bad at level design then being artsy commentary is a way of covering for being bad at game design. honestly, the game's not reinventing the wheel. sidequests are almost always fetch quests, weapon crafting is also fetch quest-y, and the shmup hacking is where i'd expect qte's from other games. the writing behind most of the quests are interesting enough to keep me playing, and the weapon stories are something to look forward when you upgrade a weapon. replaying the game and seeing characterization for enemies that player characters are probably not aware of - or more likely don't care about - is cool. i think the sea monster one is a little too much, but it's more effort than i'd expect to characterize a one-off enemy.
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Apr 28, 2017 16:21
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Guy Mann posted:If procedural generation is a way of covering for being bad at level design then being artsy commentary is a way of covering for being bad at game design. Speaking of procedural generation - it sucks. I don't think I've ever played a game where procedural generation has been a boon. What it typically means is a mess of nonsenical rooms/passages that don't really add anything to the game. Hell, my favourite Diablo-like game is Nox, a game with no procedural generation in it at all, if I remember right. And Persona 5, for example, ditches the randomly-generated levels for hand-made ones, which makes dungeons so much more interesting (except for Mementos, which of course is boring as a result). I watched my friend play Subnautica, and when they mentioned that the game map isn't procedurally generated, I got a lot more interested in the title.
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Apr 28, 2017 18:27
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Morpheus posted:Speaking of procedural generation - it sucks. I don't think I've ever played a game where procedural generation has been a boon. What it typically means is a mess of nonsenical rooms/passages that don't really add anything to the game. The problem is that game-developers started using procedural generation as a crutch. It was a novel gimmick in Diablo 1 & 2 and some developers understood why that worked there (hello Binding of Isaac) and others simply didn't. The worst examples of procedural generation aren't even found diablolikes and roguelikes, but open-world games. I think Ubisoft and Bethesda especially have permanently scorched the ground on procedural generation.
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Apr 28, 2017 18:39
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MiddleOne posted:The problem is that game-developers started using procedural generation as a crutch. It was a novel gimmick in Diablo 1 & 2 and some developers understood why that worked there (hello Binding of Isaac) and others simply didn't. The worst examples of procedural generation aren't even found diablolikes and roguelikes, but open-world games. I think Ubisoft and Bethesda especially have permanently scorched the ground on procedural generation. No way man. It's fantastic that Skyrim is giant and has a ridiculous amount of tiny random dungeons dotting the wide open fields of nothing.
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Apr 28, 2017 18:45
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I finished Persona 5! -I feel like the final party member was kind of phoned in and didn't get an opportunity to grow at all or really become a part of the group. -I definitely noticed the ~big detective plot reveal~ hint when it happened, and the game never gave you an opportunity to use that information, going out of it's way to pull the wool over your eyes. -The cruise ship dungeon mouse puzzle schtick suuuuuucked. It was just tedious and went on for way too long. -Spent all game unlocking these cool level 80-90 personas that you'll never ever need because you can clear the game at level 60!
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Apr 28, 2017 18:59
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Poulpe posted:-Spent all game unlocking these cool level 80-90 personas that you'll never ever need because you can clear the game at level 60! to be fair you could probably say this about 95% of non-scaling RPGs (the grind being even more pointless in scaling ones).
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Apr 28, 2017 20:17
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Poulpe posted:I finished Persona 5! I think it was a mistake to lock the Confidant links from party members until after their respective dungeon is over. You are encouraged to use Yusuke in his sensei's dungeon but simultaneously can't use his full potential because several of the best features, like Baton Pass, are locked in his confidant chain, which doesn't start until after that first dungeon with him is over. This is especially a problem for Haru, I think, because the game kicks into overdrive so it can be done by Christmas, and you only get to start hanging out with her on Halloween. quote:-I definitely noticed the ~big detective plot reveal~ hint when it happened, and the game never gave you an opportunity to use that information, going out of it's way to pull the wool over your eyes. I like him until the reveal and feel they kind of lost track of what to do with him after that. You have a boss fight where he completely changes character twice in a scene and then he's written out of the game. I kept hoping he'd come back to stick it to his "creator" one last time, only this time instead of trying to ruin his dad he fucks up God. quote:-The cruise ship dungeon mouse puzzle schtick suuuuuucked. It was just tedious and went on for way too long. Yes that was obnoxious. Two of those rooms at most would have been more than enough but they kept adding more and they kept getting bigger. So much obnoxious back tracking. I understand they're not the worst SMT dungeons but that doesn't make them good. quote:-Spent all game unlocking these cool level 80-90 personas that you'll never ever need because you can clear the game at level 60! There seems to be bonus boss fight in NG+ that you can also clear at level 60 or so (watched someone do just that yesterday) and beyond that I can't think of any reason you'd actually unlock all these super powerful Personas besides saying you did. marshmallow creep has a new favorite as of 20:47 on Apr 28, 2017 |
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Apr 28, 2017 20:44
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So far the biggest (Not actually very big) thing bugging me about Persona 5 is just the pronunciation of names often enough, apparently the japanese clients were the reason for it god knows why. Example "In the english dub, all VA's are pronouncing last names for Ryuji and Ann with a hard "ka" sound. Ex. "Suh-kah-moto" and "Ta-ka-maki" instead of "Saka-moto" and "Taka-maki". I already know a lot of people are going to be really upset with this, however Erica Harlacher, the VA for Ann Takamaki, stated on twitter that the japanese clients told them to use those pronunciations, so it isn't the VA's or the voice director's fault."
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Apr 28, 2017 20:50
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Morpheus posted:Speaking of procedural generation - it sucks. I don't think I've ever played a game where procedural generation has been a boon. What it typically means is a mess of nonsenical rooms/passages that don't really add anything to the game. Tons of games quietly use procedural generation to help with things like generating terrain or creating a forest without having to place thousands of trees by hand and it can work pretty well for that. The most popular recent one I can think of is Horizon Zero Dawn, I'm on my phone so I can't dig it up but I remember them building up a lot of the new procedural generation tech that went into making it.
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Apr 28, 2017 21:15
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Guy Mann posted:If procedural generation is a way of covering for being bad at level design then being artsy commentary is a way of covering for being bad at game design. And this attitude right here is why video games struggled for so long to be taken seriously as an art form.
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Apr 28, 2017 21:20
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Yardbomb posted:So far the biggest (Not actually very big) thing bugging me about Persona 5 is just the pronunciation of names often enough, apparently the japanese clients were the reason for it god knows why. Nope literally unplayable and censorship. Gonna download a giant patch so I can listen to then speak words I don't understand because "they sound a lot more enthusiastic about their jobs than an American actor" even though I can't tell where one word begins and another ends.
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Apr 28, 2017 21:59
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Len posted:Nope literally unplayable and censorship. Gonna download a giant patch so I can listen to then speak words I don't understand because "they sound a lot more enthusiastic about their jobs than an American actor" even though I can't tell where one word begins and another ends. At least it cuts down on some of the "MUH AUTHENTIC INTENDED EXPERIENCE" people I suppose. They can keep that and only understand (Maybe) every 10th word, while I enjoy the actually really good rear end dub.
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Apr 28, 2017 22:27
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Somfin posted:And this attitude right here is why video games struggled for so long to be taken seriously as an art form. Nobody's going to take away your BDSM lesbian robots, somfin. Games can be arty and that's fine, but it's also fine to criticize it when done in a sloppy way.
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Apr 28, 2017 22:38
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Somfin posted:And this attitude right here is why video games struggled for so long to be taken seriously as an art form. An entirely worthless goal, to be fair. (to clarify, the desire for validation part, not the being arty if you want part)
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Apr 28, 2017 22:45
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Like, one of the arguments I hear in favour of Spec Ops: The Line is how its combat is meant to be generic and dull, to highlight the futility of war. No, it's just generic loving combat. That doesn't take away from the rest of the game's qualities, but it's still a ridiculous argument to be had.
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Apr 28, 2017 22:48
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If I can enjoy Japanese VAs mispronounce English words and expressions I can enjoy English VAs mispronounce takoyaki or whatever the gently caresspoptart_fairy posted:Games can be arty and that's fine, but it's also fine to criticize it when done in a sloppy way. I really don't think Yoko Taro supposes himself as an auteur. I think he's taking the whole thing tongue in cheek and is just genuinely happy one of his games is getting love straight from release and not as a cult classic years later.
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Apr 28, 2017 22:55
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Oh yeah, nothing against the dude, it's just the fanbase. That's less a small thing and more something you gotta expect. e; I mean this is the same whose response to "there is robot butthole in your game??" was "find the robot butthole fan art and send it to me". 
poptart_fairy has a new favorite as of 23:18 on Apr 28, 2017 |
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Apr 28, 2017 22:57
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Blightown's framerate was absolutely intentional.
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Apr 28, 2017 22:58
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RareAcumen posted:Blightown's framerate was absolutely intentional.
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Apr 28, 2017 23:04
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Action Tortoise posted:If I can enjoy Japanese VAs mispronounce English words and expressions I can enjoy English VAs mispronounce takoyaki or whatever the gently caress Did he not call Something Awful's own Dark ID a cultural ambassador to the west? I seem to recall that being a thing. In all its insane glory.
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Apr 28, 2017 23:14
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poptart_fairy posted:Nobody's going to take away your BDSM lesbian robots, somfin. Believe me there are some fuckin' terrible artistic and design decisions in N:A that I think are indefensible. I'm not a blind fan of the thing. What I'm specifically reacting to is the idea that being artistic is a cover for being bad at making games. Speaking as someone who makes games in his spare time, this is an attitude usually expressed by people who vastly underestimate the effort and thought that goes into a big game project.
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Apr 28, 2017 23:36
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FactsAreUseless posted:Your character's perception of time is distorted by the poisonous fumes. Now explain the shortcut ladder in New Londo
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Apr 28, 2017 23:43
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Well he's not wrong though? "It's arty" is used as a cover for poorly designed or otherwise clunky game mechanics more often than it should. Being arty isn't contradicting the idea of something being well designed, but it isn't really a valid defense either.
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Apr 28, 2017 23:43
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Strom Cuzewon posted:You know how goons described Lords of the Fallen as "the best bad game"? Well I'm calling Nier the worst good game. Because it's great fun, the combat is awesome, it's all the platinum goodness I could hope for. You don't have to play on hard?
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Apr 28, 2017 23:57
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poptart_fairy posted:Well he's not wrong though? "It's arty" is used as a cover for poorly designed or otherwise clunky game mechanics more often than it should. Being arty isn't contradicting the idea of something being well designed, but it isn't really a valid defense either. "It's badly designed" is often used (by people who don't make stuff) as a way of saying "I don't like it." Appealing to it being made that way intentionally is usually an attempt to get people to see it as a decision rather than a failed attempt at something better. I hate turn-based combat, but I can understand it as a deliberate design decision rather than a failure to deliver a better combat experience. The point of this whole thing was a shitpost by Guy Mann that I took too seriously though, so who gives a gently caress we're not even arguing.
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Apr 29, 2017 00:04
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Somfin posted:The point of this whole thing was a shitpost by Guy Mann that I took too seriously though We've all made that mistake.
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Apr 29, 2017 00:14
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Olive Garden tonight! posted:Now explain the shortcut ladder in New Londo
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Apr 29, 2017 00:15
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FactsAreUseless posted:Ladders are used to descend when limited space is available. Actually this one is for ascending and this is what I'm talking about https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iLFXox_TTPg&t=74s Insane framerate drop when kicking/climbing that ladder
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Apr 29, 2017 00:29
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Strom Cuzewon posted:You know how goons described Lords of the Fallen as "the best bad game"? LotF is actually just a bad game. If there's a current winner of best bad game, it's probably For Honor.
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Apr 29, 2017 00:44
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