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xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

wakey wakey to
this bowl of tasty


Yams Fan

If you can get an xterm just fine, your window manager is crashing. gently caress if I can troubleshoot gnome though, have fun with that one (or use fvwm ).

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evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

KVM will use virt-viewer/remote-viewer, or you can specify if you're using qemu-kvm by hand (SDL, etc)

Try: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=896648

Or:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...EeyX2Na0jAuJkiQ

Eletriarnation
Apr 6, 2005

People don't appreciate the substance of things...
objects in space.



Oven Wrangler

evol262 posted:

KVM will use virt-viewer/remote-viewer, or you can specify if you're using qemu-kvm by hand (SDL, etc)

Try: https://bugzilla.redhat.com/show_bug.cgi?id=896648

Or:

https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&sou...EeyX2Na0jAuJkiQ

Can you explain a bit more on the first line? I know KVM only as a virtual machine tool and this is a bare-metal installation.

With the first link there, I read the whole thread and the only really detailed solution, in comment 15, sadly doesn't work. It says to (1) add a line to /etc/pam.d/runuser-l, but that line is already there in CentOS 7; (2) change the Type in the service file to be 'simple' instead of 'forking'; (3) add '-fg' to the vncserver invocation in ExecStart in the service file; (4) comment out the ExecStop line. I did 2, 3, and 4 and now the service fails to start at all so I'm guessing some of that isn't valid.

With the second link, I'm not seeing the guy do anything in the tutorial that I didn't - am I missing something?

I'm getting the impression that I should just install XFCE and try having the VNC sessions use that instead.

Eletriarnation fucked around with this message at Dec 10, 2016 around 06:53

Hypnobeard
Sep 15, 2004

Obey the Beard


Slippery Tilde

evol262 posted:

akmods --force? Along with akmod-wl.

You can check whether or not "kmod-wl" matches "uname -r", though. RPMFusion's kmods aren't always up to date.

So this and the other reference to the arch forum eventually led me to figure out my problem: I hadn't disabled secure boot and OS optimizations in the laptop's BIOS. Disabling this let the wl driver load just fine and all was fixed.

Thanks for the help!

evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

You mean virt-viewer, or something else?

I linked to the bug (and the DO doc) because they'll go through every possible troubleshooting step.

XFCE may just be easier

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

How is the Linux ecosystem currently funded, aside from explicitly commercial enterprises like RHEL etc.?

Where does all the money come from, and are there possible corruptible influences at play when Google are making fat stacks of cheddar by adopting stuff from open source software and donating large sums back. Is it wrong to have Microsoft pumping enough wedge into the Linux Foundation to become one of its biggest donors?

Or has Stallman got our backs?

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

wakey wakey to
this bowl of tasty


Yams Fan

Why do you care? If you like linux, use it. If you don't, use something else.

evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

apropos man posted:

How is the Linux ecosystem currently funded, aside from explicitly commercial enterprises like RHEL etc.?

Where does all the money come from, and are there possible corruptible influences at play when Google are making fat stacks of cheddar by adopting stuff from open source software and donating large sums back. Is it wrong to have Microsoft pumping enough wedge into the Linux Foundation to become one of its biggest donors?

Or has Stallman got our backs?

This varies. Some are foundation projects (Apache, gnu, whatever) which solicit donations in order to run infrastructure and keep staff.

Some funding comes from training and conferences (Linux foundation, etc)

Some are funded almost 100% by companies which freeze and productize (distros, mostly).

Some are collaborative enterprises which rely on independent actors or corporate involvement to run (kubernetes, openstack, etc).

In general, though, "adopting open source software and donating back" is a flawed way to look at it. Almost every company which is donating is also contributing code. Some projects (Linux, gcc, and glibc are good examples) have gatekeepers who pass source in. Most use a source review system (patches to mailing lists, GitHub, gerrit, whatever) which requires multiple acks to get something merged.

Certainly large companies with a lot of resources can push a feature almost by themselves, but getting that feature accepted requires at least some cooperation with the community.

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

xzzy posted:

Why do you care? If you like linux, use it. If you don't, use something else.

I would care if I was using something I liked and then a while later it went all crap.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


evol262 posted:

This varies. Some are foundation projects (Apache, gnu, whatever) which solicit donations in order to run infrastructure and keep staff.

Some funding comes from training and conferences (Linux foundation, etc)

Some are funded almost 100% by companies which freeze and productize (distros, mostly).

Some are collaborative enterprises which rely on independent actors or corporate involvement to run (kubernetes, openstack, etc).

In general, though, "adopting open source software and donating back" is a flawed way to look at it. Almost every company which is donating is also contributing code. Some projects (Linux, gcc, and glibc are good examples) have gatekeepers who pass source in. Most use a source review system (patches to mailing lists, GitHub, gerrit, whatever) which requires multiple acks to get something merged.

Certainly large companies with a lot of resources can push a feature almost by themselves, but getting that feature accepted requires at least some cooperation with the community.

What annoys me is companies taking it making proprietary awesomeness. See: ksplice, that poo poo needs to be OSS yo.

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

evol262 posted:

....
Some are funded almost 100% by companies which freeze and productize (distros, mostly).
.....

How does, say, Canonical make their money though? (it can't be from the sale of the Ubuntu phone!)

And its parent (not in terms of business, I mean in terms of engineering), Debian?

I know that there was that deal with Amazon a couple of years ago, which people went apeshit about and then the Amazon search in Unity was removed. But there must be more than that?

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

RFC2324 posted:

What annoys me is companies taking it making proprietary awesomeness. See: ksplice, that poo poo needs to be OSS yo.

Is ksplice what Ubuntu used in order to patch the recent dirty COW vulnerability? The patch that was applied whilst the kernel was still running? I thought that was pretty cool.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


apropos man posted:

Is ksplice what Ubuntu used in order to patch the recent dirty COW vulnerability? The patch that was applied whilst the kernel was still running? I thought that was pretty cool.

Maybe, but I know Oracle owns it and requires you be running their kernel to use it.

I did just discover kpatch in RHEL, so I guess there are alternatives now.

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

wakey wakey to
this bowl of tasty


Yams Fan

apropos man posted:

I would care if I was using something I liked and then a while later it went all crap.

Well do a U-turn and get out then because linux has been crap for one reason or another since 1991.

First it really didn't work at all, then it mostly worked but you'd spend all night compiling poo poo, then we got package managers and it was crap because everyone was yelling about which was the best and you ended up compiling constantly anyways. Then there was an argument about standardizing on paths and then it was crap because the only loving thing people ever talked about was SCO and then no one really cared about linux anymore, it was all KDE vs Gnome. Now it's crap again because of all the bickering about systemd.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


xzzy posted:

Well do a U-turn and get out then because linux has been crap for one reason or another since 1991.

First it really didn't work at all, then it mostly worked but you'd spend all night compiling poo poo, then we got package managers and it was crap because everyone was yelling about which was the best and you ended up compiling constantly anyways. Then there was an argument about standardizing on paths and then it was crap because the only loving thing people ever talked about was SCO and then no one really cared about linux anymore, it was all KDE vs Gnome. Now it's crap again because of all the bickering about systemd.

Just FYI, KDE supremacy forever.

Forgall
Oct 16, 2012

What're you lookin' at?


xzzy posted:

Well do a U-turn and get out then because linux has been crap for one reason or another since 1991.

First it really didn't work at all, then it mostly worked but you'd spend all night compiling poo poo, then we got package managers and it was crap because everyone was yelling about which was the best and you ended up compiling constantly anyways. Then there was an argument about standardizing on paths and then it was crap because the only loving thing people ever talked about was SCO and then no one really cared about linux anymore, it was all KDE vs Gnome. Now it's crap again because of all the bickering about systemd.
Also, http://www.washingtonpost.com/sf/bu...f-the-argument/

Suspicious Dish
Sep 24, 2011



Fun Shoe

apropos man posted:

How does, say, Canonical make their money though? (it can't be from the sale of the Ubuntu phone!)

And its parent (not in terms of business, I mean in terms of engineering), Debian?

I know that there was that deal with Amazon a couple of years ago, which people went apeshit about and then the Amazon search in Unity was removed. But there must be more than that?

They used to try to squeeze dollars out of desktop installs. They failed at that. Then they tried to enter the phone market because handset makers hate Android. They failed at that.

Now they're trying to be the cloud OS, so that every OS you install in Docker or AWS has royalties going to Canonical. It's working out pretty well in theory, but when they go to collect royalties companies tend to just switch to Debian. Hint: the Amazon search deal was related to the AWS deal to let part of the EC2 money go to Canonical.

Also, reminder that Mark Shuttleworth is a loving rich man, and Canonical can be funded basically with the interest made on his fortune.

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

...the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. —Bertrand Russell


Doesn't Canonical have paid support contracts or something like that for Ubuntu?

Suspicious Dish
Sep 24, 2011



Fun Shoe

there are a lot of ways you can give Canonical money, yes.

Morter
Jul 1, 2006


Time after time,
I tried to walk your way yeah


uhn, uhn uhn

And you don't break my heart!





evol262 posted:

When applications are built, there's no need to reinvent the wheel. So you use something you can expect to find on the system. Wanna do hostname resolution? Use libc.

Ok, so Windows shoves shared libraries in \Windows\System[32]

When you install stuff (like a game or whatever), it often repeatedly reinstalls the C++ runtime, so you have a zillion versions.

MacOS shoves everything under the package root (.app files are directories trees)

Linux assumes libraries will be under /lib[64], /usr/lib[64], /usr/local/lib[64], etc. When applications (like DF) ship their own libraries (like their version of libstdc++ or whatever), your system doesn't know to look under "/path/to/df_linux". LD_LIBRARY_PATH says "hey, look here for libraries" first. Libraries are versioned. "libstdc++.so.6" is not always the same as "libstdc++.so.6" (they could be different versions). The linker path (from ldconfig) assumes that something looking for "libstdc++.so.6" will be happy with any version that it finds. Major versions (libstdc++.so.5) are broadly incompatible, but any "so.6" should behave basically the same. That's not always true, though. Sometimes you need newer versions. I don't know what DF needs.

I don't know if DF's startup script sets this or not. It may, but they're calling a function which should be found in libgioproxy (or libproxy), which you may or may not have. Or it may not set it at all. If it's set, and they don't ship libproxy (or libgioproxy), but do ship libstdc++, then they're doing it wrong. You may need to install that library yourself. Or maybe they don't set it at all. I don't know. Can you provide "tree df_linux"?

Sorry for the delay, but here is the output of tree for the directory in full (tree.txt is the same thing I could easily C&P onto pastebin)

evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

Thermopyle posted:

Doesn't Canonical have paid support contracts or something like that for Ubuntu?

And Landscape. And their weird "Openstack in a physical box thing" (if that still exists). But Canonical is notoriously understaffed and underfunded, so they don't need to make much.

evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

Morter posted:

Sorry for the delay, but here is the output of tree for the directory in full (tree.txt is the same thing I could easily C&P onto pastebin)

LD_LIBRARY_PATH=$HOME/df_linux/lib

You can also ldd the binaries (including libs) and install whatever is missing (libgioproxy? libproxy?)

Morter
Jul 1, 2006


Time after time,
I tried to walk your way yeah


uhn, uhn uhn

And you don't break my heart!





evol262 posted:

LD_LIBRARY_PATH=$HOME/df_linux/lib

You can also ldd the binaries (including libs) and install whatever is missing (libgioproxy? libproxy?)

Tried this on its own and with seemingly proper variations to point to the correct folder, but I still get the same error. Trying to figure out what's getting me this libgiolibproxy.so error, and how to fetch it

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


Morter posted:

Tried this on its own and with seemingly proper variations to point to the correct folder, but I still get the same error. Trying to figure out what's getting me this libgiolibproxy.so error, and how to fetch it

I'm still confused why you are running 32-bit linux in TYOOL 2016.

I get why you would be running the 32-bit version of DF, but not the 32 bit OS, given its significant drawbacks on any remotely recent hardware.

Morter
Jul 1, 2006


Time after time,
I tried to walk your way yeah


uhn, uhn uhn

And you don't break my heart!





RFC2324 posted:

I'm still confused why you are running 32-bit linux in TYOOL 2016.

I get why you would be running the 32-bit version of DF, but not the 32 bit OS, given its significant drawbacks on any remotely recent hardware.

As I mentioned earlier, this is an old netbook. That said, if it just arbitrarily can't work, then that's fine, I can live with it. I'm just trying to learn from it, and it would suck of this dead end ended up being '32-bit OS! '

anthonypants
May 6, 2007

by Nyc_Tattoo


Dinosaur Gum

Morter posted:

As I mentioned earlier, this is an old netbook. That said, if it just arbitrarily can't work, then that's fine, I can live with it. I'm just trying to learn from it, and it would suck of this dead end ended up being '32-bit OS! '
Why do you have a >20-year-old netbook

Morter
Jul 1, 2006


Time after time,
I tried to walk your way yeah


uhn, uhn uhn

And you don't break my heart!





anthonypants posted:

Why do you have a >20-year-old netbook

It's an EeePC from 2010 but I don't think I can give a satisfactory answer. All I can say is: "I'm poor and this was sitting around doing nothing", but otherwise I'll shut up

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


Morter posted:

It's an EeePC from 2010 but I don't think I can give a satisfactory answer. All I can say is: "I'm poor and this was sitting around doing nothing", but otherwise I'll shut up

Pretty sure it can still run a 64bit OS, but I could be wrong.

That said, I'm just derailing your issue, it shouldn't be as a result of running a 32bit OS(since its a 32bit application).

I would suggest trying to explicitly install the libraries with the :i386 flag anyway, just to rule out a stupid packaging issue.

E: You can run 64 bit according to this: http://www.tomsguide.com/forum/6781...4bit-processing

As said before, use ldd to see what libraries you are actually missing, and then use apt-file search to find out what package to install.

Oh, and check to see if you are already running 64 bit... uname -a will tell you the architecture, if you see i386 its running 32 bit, otherwise its probably 64 bit.

RFC2324 fucked around with this message at Dec 11, 2016 around 22:17

evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

Morter posted:

Tried this on its own and with seemingly proper variations to point to the correct folder, but I still get the same error. Trying to figure out what's getting me this libgiolibproxy.so error, and how to fetch it

Dwarf Fortress doesn't ship those (or they're not in /lib), which is either lazy or stupid, if they actually link against them.

Find out what's requiring those (ldd is your friend here)

LD_LIBRARY_PATH just sets the order. I'd figure out what packages normally provide those libraries and install them.

Morter
Jul 1, 2006


Time after time,
I tried to walk your way yeah


uhn, uhn uhn

And you don't break my heart!





RFC2324 posted:

Oh, and check to see if you are already running 64 bit... uname -a will tell you the architecture, if you see i386 its running 32 bit, otherwise its probably 64 bit.

I won't have time to check out other stuff until later but I can say for right now I've already confirmed, from past trials (and errors) trying to get this poo poo to run, that it's 32 bit. That's covered.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


SELinux is killing me right now. Trying to write a webpage so I can turn my server off from my phone(I know, its a bad idea and SELinux is correct in trying to stop me).

The thing is, I have it working, but because SELinux is throwing an informative error, it is making the page throw a 500 error even tho the script issues the power off command.

Twerk from Home
Jan 17, 2009

This avatar brought to you by the 'save our dead gay forums' foundation.


RFC2324 posted:

Pretty sure it can still run a 64bit OS, but I could be wrong.

That said, I'm just derailing your issue, it shouldn't be as a result of running a 32bit OS(since its a 32bit application).

I had a first gen eeePC, before they were available with Windows. Dothan based 700mhz pentium m, hoo boy that thing was slow.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


Twerk from Home posted:

I had a first gen eeePC, before they were available with Windows. Dothan based 700mhz pentium m, hoo boy that thing was slow.

Yeah, I'm betting hes gonna be pissed once he gets DF running, since it runs slow on a high end gaming rig due to the extremely detailed simulation it does.

But its a fun challenge to get running!

Morter
Jul 1, 2006


Time after time,
I tried to walk your way yeah


uhn, uhn uhn

And you don't break my heart!





This isn't fun at all! The past week has been "Hey try this" "It doesn't work!" "Oh well"

I haven't gotten any smartererer

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

wakey wakey to
this bowl of tasty


Yams Fan

No that makes you an expert because that's what every other linux admin on the planet is doing.

The final lesson is to learn to identify the point where it's working "well enough" and stop loving with it.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


Morter posted:

This isn't fun at all! The past week has been "Hey try this" "It doesn't work!" "Oh well"

I haven't gotten any smartererer

I get paid for going though that.

hifi
Jul 25, 2012



Morter posted:

This isn't fun at all! The past week has been "Hey try this" "It doesn't work!" "Oh well"

I haven't gotten any smartererer

http://www.bay12games.com/dwarves/m...iew.php?id=9893

This is a sort of similar bug and the workaround is to delete the library file in the dwarf fortress folder. Have you tried it? I'd imagine any of the ppa solutions are just going to be ignored by the loader using the packaged library and then failing because the versions aren't lining up right.

evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

RFC2324 posted:

SELinux is killing me right now. Trying to write a webpage so I can turn my server off from my phone(I know, its a bad idea and SELinux is correct in trying to stop me).

The thing is, I have it working, but because SELinux is throwing an informative error, it is making the page throw a 500 error even tho the script issues the power off command.



audit2allow will generate a handy rule for you.

Or write a small helper which context switches.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012

Http 418


evol262 posted:

audit2allow will generate a handy rule for you.

Or write a small helper which context switches.

Audit2allow is how i got it working at all.

I just can't make the error msg go away. It's complaining that it can't audit the sudo action, but it allows it to succeed anyway.

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Harik
Sep 9, 2001

From the hard streets of Moscow
First dog to touch the stars



Plaster Town Cop

ToxicFrog posted:

Are you sure btrfs isn't the problem? When I used it I was plagued with random slowdowns and things blocking on IO that really shouldn't be, although if it's only ~2 seconds for you it's been much improved. Switched to XFS and ZFS on the same disks and the problems went away.


Try iotop or atop to see what's chewing on the disk? With atop you can also change the collect interval, so you could, e.g., tell it to collect stats over a five second window for real-time, iotop/htop style stats, or over a 24 hour window to see stats for the previous day.

Well, I can't be certain it's not BTRFS, but I'm running a basically identical setup on other machines (btrfs on SSD) and not seeing the same stalls. It still could be BTRFS, it's sensitive to free-space fragmentation so differing load patterns lead to accumulating performance differences. I just don't want to give up filesystem-level snapshots or maintain off-tree ZFS to keep them.

My backup system is "take a snapshot then backup the snapshot to NAS" so everything is 100% consistent. Then I keep today, yesterday, 1 week and nuke the rest. Having "oh gently caress" recovery from 1hr, yesterday, last week without having to do a full restore from the NAS is nice.

I'm not even positive that it's process-originated IO either. It could be writeback getting lumpy or some other bit of stupidity. I'll run blktrace for a while and examine the logs by hand for the timestamp in question.

iotop doesn't work because it's polling and refreshes the burst away before I can tab to the window. There really isn't a tool to do what I want, which would be graph IO load and let you click on any point to get the process breakdown.

Maybe I'll write it as a viewer for blktrace logs.

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