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VOTE YES ON 69
Oct 16, 2008

time is a flat circle


Fun Shoe

I'd disagree, updating Ubuntu has been pretty painless for years. Ubuntu is good, you should use it for your desktop. Install LTS, upgrade to next LTS if you don't have a new computer by then. Rinse, repeat.

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Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Polygynous posted:

mycmd | tee TMPFILE | gzip >whatever & tail -f TMPFILE

I think? vv

At least I don't think tee really does anything other than what it says.

Oh, I figured it out. Anonymous FIFO to the rescue.


mycmd | tee >(gzip -c > "mycmd-$(date +'%Y.%m.%d-%H.%M.%S').gz")


then


zcat mycmd-2017.06.16-21.34.50.gz

Xik
Mar 10, 2011



Can you explain that use of tee? I understand Polygynous's example, as that is pretty much my standard use case for the command but I don't understand yours at all...


e: VVVVV Ah right thanks, feel like an idiot now.

Xik fucked around with this message at Jun 17, 2017 around 04:07

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012



Xik posted:

Can you explain that use of tee? I understand Polygynous's example, as that is pretty much my standard use case for the command but I don't understand yours at all...

He's just piping it into the command in the parentheses. Nothing special happening as far as tee is concerned.

Paul MaudDib
May 2, 2006

"Tell me of your home world, Usul"


Xik posted:

Can you explain that use of tee? I understand Polygynous's example, as that is pretty much my standard use case for the command but I don't understand yours at all...


e: VVVVV Ah right thanks, feel like an idiot now.

this is what's called an "anonymous FIFO" or "process substitution", basically when the shell parses through the command instead of giving tee a particular file descriptor it gives it a pipe to another application that I've set up. So like a pipe that doesn't take over the whole thing.

> (mycmd) redirects stdout to a new 'mycmd' process instance. <(mycmd) passes the output of mycmd as a file on stdin.

Xik
Mar 10, 2011



That's some cool poo poo, I have no idea how I am only learning about this now. Thanks.

Xeom
Mar 16, 2007


I've never used git or anything like that. I'm far from a power user. I just want to use an OS that isn't literally spyware.
I have a second hard-drive so backups shouldn't be an issue.

Is there a downside in using 16 over 17? I was led to believe that using old versions wouldn't allow me to use the latest drivers and such.
If there is no downside to slower distros, should I consider using Debian which is even slower and stabler?

HPL
Aug 28, 2002

Worst case scenario.

Or use Opensuse Tumbleweed if you really don't want to worry about upgrading. I've only had one time where things went awry, but I used Snapper to roll back to the previous state, waited a few days and then updated again and it was fine.

Boris Galerkin
Dec 17, 2011


Thermopyle posted:

For the heck of it I got 256 colors working in my bash console in Windows 10.

Now the question is...whats some useful/interesting things I can use to take advantage of all these colors?

How did you manage that? Got a link?

Boris Galerkin fucked around with this message at Jun 17, 2017 around 21:10

anthonypants
May 6, 2007



Dinosaur Gum

Boris Galerkin posted:

How did you manage that? Got a link?
Step 1: Install bash on Windows 10

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

...the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. —Bertrand Russell


Boris Galerkin posted:

How did you manage that? Got a link?

I use ConEmu to manage terminal windows. Then you do this stuff: http://conemu.github.io/en/BashOnWindows.html

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

Xeom posted:

I've never used git or anything like that. I'm far from a power user. I just want to use an OS that isn't literally spyware.
I have a second hard-drive so backups shouldn't be an issue.

Is there a downside in using 16 over 17? I was led to believe that using old versions wouldn't allow me to use the latest drivers and such.
If there is no downside to slower distros, should I consider using Debian which is even slower and stabler?

If you use the latest Ubuntu LTS (which is 16.04) then there's a small chance that you won't get all the latest and funkiest poo poo that's available to Ubuntu 17.04 users but it's almost a moot point. The chances are that you'll barely notice a difference and Ubuntu is iteratively supported back to 16.04, with 14.04 as a special inclusion because it's an LTS (Long Term Support) release. This means that you'll get exactly the same important security updates as every other Ubuntu user and updates for the the packages you installed. The only things missing will most likely be fancy user interface stuff that they are trying out in the latest version and maybe some background stuff that's being tried out but isn't currently a mainstay of the Linux ecosystem (yet).

I'd go with Ubuntu 16.04 as a noob. The advantage you'll get over trying other good distros like SuSE or Fedora or whatever is that Ubuntu has a huge Q&A and documentation presence on the internet that pretty much dwarfs other distros. If you have a problem just get yourself over to https://askubuntu.com/ and the chances are someone will have the same experience as you.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012



apropos man posted:

If you use the latest Ubuntu LTS (which is 16.04) then there's a small chance that you won't get all the latest and funkiest poo poo that's available to Ubuntu 17.04 users but it's almost a moot point. The chances are that you'll barely notice a difference and Ubuntu is iteratively supported back to 16.04, with 14.04 as a special inclusion because it's an LTS (Long Term Support) release. This means that you'll get exactly the same important security updates as every other Ubuntu user and updates for the the packages you installed. The only things missing will most likely be fancy user interface stuff that they are trying out in the latest version and maybe some background stuff that's being tried out but isn't currently a mainstay of the Linux ecosystem (yet).

I'd go with Ubuntu 16.04 as a noob. The advantage you'll get over trying other good distros like SuSE or Fedora or whatever is that Ubuntu has a huge Q&A and documentation presence on the internet that pretty much dwarfs other distros. If you have a problem just get yourself over to https://askubuntu.com/ and the chances are someone will have the same experience as you.

I've found centos or rhel have support as good, with much less cargo cult fixes and just completely bad advice. They community is slightly smaller, but all around better.

The practice sifting the wheat from the chaff in Google isn't bad tho

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

Yeah. I'm in the process of setting up a CentOS server. I used it to study for my RHCSA which I passed a couple of weeks ago. It's a good distro and the worst thing I could say about it is perhaps it's visually a little boring. Maybe the new guy wants something with a few graphical tweaks.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012



apropos man posted:

Yeah. I'm in the process of setting up a CentOS server. I used it to study for my RHCSA which I passed a couple of weeks ago. It's a good distro and the worst thing I could say about it is perhaps it's visually a little boring. Maybe the new guy wants something with a few graphical tweaks.

I've never used it with a gui, tbh. I assume it's pretty much just stock whatever de you install?

Go kde and pretty is easy enough.

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

wakey wakey to
this bowl of tasty


Yams Fan

CentOS is pretty solid, but has the same issue as any RHEL derivative: it's years behind the latest and greatest.

I would never want to use it on a desktop. In a server room though? Nothing out there I'd prefer more.

(though if you're going headfirst into docker, I'm really digging CoreOS)

An Enormous Boner
Jul 12, 2009



Am I wrong to suspect that a big part of the reason people care about their desktop distribution choice is because they use the default WM/DE? I guess I use a pretty limited set of software locally so I don't feel like I'm missing anything running Debian stable with xmonad (I wear a fedora and cargo shorts and socks with sandals).

Maybe I'm asking what kinds of things people are annoyed by running slower-moving distributions.

VOTE YES ON 69
Oct 16, 2008

time is a flat circle


Fun Shoe

An Enormous Boner posted:

Am I wrong to suspect that a big part of the reason people care about their desktop distribution choice is because they use the default WM/DE? I guess I use a pretty limited set of software locally so I don't feel like I'm missing anything running Debian stable with xmonad (I wear a fedora and cargo shorts and socks with sandals).

Maybe I'm asking what kinds of things people are annoyed by running slower-moving distributions.

Gamers, computer ricers, and people who conflate window managers with an OS.

Bob Morales
Aug 18, 2006

HYPER-THREADING


An Enormous Boner posted:

Am I wrong to suspect that a big part of the reason people care about their desktop distribution choice is because they use the default WM/DE? I guess I use a pretty limited set of software locally so I don't feel like I'm missing anything running Debian stable with xmonad (I wear a fedora and cargo shorts and socks with sandals).

Maybe I'm asking what kinds of things people are annoyed by running slower-moving distributions.

It's nice to have it out of the box because with the bigger DE's you can't really (cleanly) remove the default if you don't want to use it (at least in Ubuntu)

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012



Bob Morales posted:

It's nice to have it out of the box because with the bigger DE's you can't really (cleanly) remove the default if you don't want to use it (at least in Ubuntu)

Most distros will let you pick a de on install.

Or just install without a de then install one with the package manager.

ToxicFrog
Apr 26, 2008


An Enormous Boner posted:

Maybe I'm asking what kinds of things people are annoyed by running slower-moving distributions.

Sometimes drivers, but mostly the endless cycle of "hmm, it would be nice if this program I'm using (had feature X/didn't have bug Y), I wonder if there's an alternative -- oh look, it was (added/fixed) three years ago, but since nothing on this system has gotten anything but security patches since 2012 I guess I get to build it from source".

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

...the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. —Bertrand Russell


ToxicFrog posted:

Sometimes drivers, but mostly the endless cycle of "hmm, it would be nice if this program I'm using (had feature X/didn't have bug Y), I wonder if there's an alternative -- oh look, it was (added/fixed) three years ago, but since nothing on this system has gotten anything but security patches since 2012 I guess I get to build it from source".

This is exactly it.

xzzy
Mar 5, 2009

wakey wakey to
this bowl of tasty


Yams Fan

Where I'm at, version updates are generally limited by compatibility. Physicists write code for an experiment or one off chunk of hardware that has a 15+ year lifecycle, you try to tell them they need to upgrade their gcc they gonna flip out on you. And since they bring in the grant money, they always win.

Virtualization has helped a lot, if they truly are incapable of updating their code to work on a new OS that at least gives us a way to give them a sandbox. But we've done chroot jails in the past as well.

Our final RHEL4 based system was removed from duty just last year.

LochNessMonster
Feb 3, 2005

I need about three fitty



xzzy posted:


Our final RHEL4 based system was removed from duty just last year.

Varkk
Apr 17, 2004


RFC2324 posted:

I've found centos or rhel have support as good, with much less cargo cult fixes and just completely bad advice. They community is slightly smaller, but all around better.

The practice sifting the wheat from the chaff in Google isn't bad tho

You can usually tell if a HOWTO guide for CentOS/RHEL or Fedora is worth the time by the first line. If it starts by telling you to disable SELinux or set it to permissive give it a miss.

Potato Salad
Oct 23, 2014




Tortured By Flan

I STILL HAVE E7500s in production. Lab bought them and doesn't want them turned off.

loving power hogs. As long as I can bill, though, who cares.

evol262
Nov 30, 2010
#!/usr/bin/perl

ToxicFrog posted:

Sometimes drivers, but mostly the endless cycle of "hmm, it would be nice if this program I'm using (had feature X/didn't have bug Y), I wonder if there's an alternative -- oh look, it was (added/fixed) three years ago, but since nothing on this system has gotten anything but security patches since 2012 I guess I get to build it from source".

Note that this only applies to streams in extended support. CentOS 6.9 is still receiving normal bug fixes. CentOS 7.2 and 7.3 both had substantial rebases against upstream and got a lot of new features

feedmegin
Jul 30, 2008




xzzy posted:

Where I'm at, version updates are generally limited by compatibility. Physicists write code for an experiment or one off chunk of hardware that has a 15+ year lifecycle, you try to tell them they need to upgrade their gcc they gonna flip out on you. And since they bring in the grant money, they always win.

Virtualization has helped a lot, if they truly are incapable of updating their code to work on a new OS that at least gives us a way to give them a sandbox. But we've done chroot jails in the past as well.

Our final RHEL4 based system was removed from duty just last year.

You think that's bad, we only chucked out the MicroVAXes and PA-RISC kit a couple of years ago. I think we still build the older version of our product on RHEL 4. (Also, Solaris 9)

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012



Job i was at 2 years ago still had boxes running SunOS 5.6, and RedHat 4 (not RHEL, Red Hat)

Thermopyle
Jul 1, 2003

...the stupid are cocksure while the intelligent are full of doubt. —Bertrand Russell


I'm not really sure there's a good thread for this question, so I'll just ask here:

Is there a way with Grafana or InfluxDB to discard measurements above/below a certain value? I'm measuring something from a device that sometimes gives spurious readings which just throws my graphs out of whack.

edit: That was a stupid question, I just have to edit my query...durr. Now to figure out if its possible in the query...

Thermopyle fucked around with this message at Jun 19, 2017 around 19:14

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

I'm migrating my home server to CentOS (from Ubuntu). I've now got more powerful hardware and I want to share the mechanical drives between some guest VM's.

Is setting up a basic NFS share on the host, to be used by two or three guest VM's a decent way of doing this?

I'm running the main host OS from an SSD and have two spinny drives I want to export for use by two or three guests.

EDIT: I've just noticed that VirtFS exists for this very purpose. Is learning how to implement VirtFS a better idea?

apropos man fucked around with this message at Jun 19, 2017 around 19:27

other people
Jun 27, 2004
Associate Christ

you can create and pass lvm logical volumes to a vm for them to use as a block device, too. virsh and virt-manager have support built in to make doing this painless.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012



other people posted:

you can create and pass lvm logical volumes to a vm for them to use as a block device, too. virsh and virt-manager have support built in to make doing this painless.

I think he wants them all to be able to access the same filesystem live.

And i use NFS for this just because it was easy to set up and easy to add more vms to. I just use a second nic attached to a virtual network to minimize latency.

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

Yeah, that's what I meant. I've got one drive running on an nfs share and it's mounting with autofs on my first VM.

I'll add the other drive and more mounts tomorrow. I might also employ that second nic trick if I find that it slows things down. I'm not doing particularly heavy io so it may be alright.

RFC2324
Jun 7, 2012



I don't know if it actually minimizes latency, tbh. I have an issue where the way I bridged the adapters prevents the VM and host from talking, so when I first set up the system I did the second adapters to get around that.

Now I claim its for latency because I don't want to rebuild everything with my network set up correctly

apropos man
Sep 5, 2016

You get a hundred and forty one thousand years and you're out in eight!

I know what you mean. It took me around 5 hours of trying various guides to finally get network bridging to work. And find out it was a two minute job. And I should have went straight to the guide on the actual kvm site!

Vulture Culture
Jul 14, 2003

I was never enjoying it. I only eat it for the nutrients.


Are there any Linux LiveCDs preconfigured to start an SSH server at boot? I'm messing with a multi-stage Packer workflow and I'd rather not have to bake my own and add yet another weird dependency into this pipeline.

anthonypants
May 6, 2007



Dinosaur Gum

Vulture Culture posted:

Are there any Linux LiveCDs preconfigured to start an SSH server at boot? I'm messing with a multi-stage Packer workflow and I'd rather not have to bake my own and add yet another weird dependency into this pipeline.
I don't think there are any LiveCDs that have a static default user/password configured, no.

Vulture Culture
Jul 14, 2003

I was never enjoying it. I only eat it for the nutrients.


anthonypants posted:

I don't think there are any LiveCDs that have a static default user/password configured, no.
Anything I can toss command-line arguments or preseed/cloud-config/etc. files at is cool too, I'm just trying to avoid having to do weird send-keystrokes-at-running-system business (which is where I'll probably end up on Alpine or something).

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ToxicFrog
Apr 26, 2008


The OpenSUSE install disks let you start an sshd via additional kernel arguments (which also specify the password and whatnot); the liveCD probably supports the same arguments.

E: you could also prepare a NixOS liveUSB configured to start sshd on boot with password hashes defined in configuration.nix fairly easily, I think.

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