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Invalido
Dec 28, 2005

BICHAELING



Maybe my prejudice is because I only ever see the exported stuff here which tends to be pretty niche, expensive and good. From your reaction I'm guessing the domestic market is full of cheap lovely tools where "proudly made in the USA" is a selling point but I never see those. I think that segment is flooded by even cheaper chinese tools where I live.

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Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

Invalido posted:

Maybe my prejudice is because I only ever see the exported stuff here which tends to be pretty niche, expensive and good. From your reaction I'm guessing the domestic market is full of cheap lovely tools where "proudly made in the USA" is a selling point but I never see those. I think that segment is flooded by even cheaper chinese tools where I live.
Ah, that makes sense. Yeah, there's just as much cheap poo poo that comes out of here as anywhere else. There are certainly good brands here - if you check my prior posts here, you'll see me tout Snap-On quite a bit - but there are also cheeeeeeaaaaaaaappp poo poo with a flag (probably with the wrong number of stars) and "MADE IN THE U.S.A.!" stamped on the package. I wouldn't take a US made tool over anything else just because it's from the US.

Invalido
Dec 28, 2005

BICHAELING


Krakkles posted:

Ah, that makes sense. Yeah, there's just as much cheap poo poo that comes out of here as anywhere else. There are certainly good brands here - if you check my prior posts here, you'll see me tout Snap-On quite a bit - but there are also cheeeeeeaaaaaaaappp poo poo with a flag (probably with the wrong number of stars) and "MADE IN THE U.S.A.!" stamped on the package. I wouldn't take a US made tool over anything else just because it's from the US.

Some sense at least. Sweden where I live has a long history of tool making and a steel industry in general, but AFAIK it's all at least attempted high quality - due to wage costs it'd be hard to compete in any other way and I guess the domestic market is simply too small to keep objectively uncompetitive things afloat for patriotic reasons. I don't know if it's the same in say Germany or Japan, I just always assumed it was. Sure, you'll see Husqvarna churn out cheap chain saws but they're all from China. In my mind they're making a mistake using the same color scheme and name on those, but it's probably for a quick buck. Much like Bahco did in the 00's, at least that's my impression. I still haven't forgiven them for a lovely Spanish made Bahco pipe cutter I bought ten years ago instead of the Ridgid I really should have gotten.

therobit
Aug 19, 2008


I'd say that in general the same applies for US made goods, or at least ones simple enough not to skate by saying "Made in the USA" when it should be "Assembled in the USA from Chinese parts." Not always HIGH quality, but at least decent quality if they are actually made in the us.

StormDrain
May 22, 2003

Thirteen Letter


therobit posted:

I'd say that in general the same applies for US made goods, or at least ones simple enough not to skate by saying "Made in the USA" when it should be "Assembled in the USA from Chinese parts." Not always HIGH quality, but at least decent quality if they are actually made in the us.

Agreed on that. Labor in USA is too expensive to compete with cheap imported manufacturing, so you either get moderately priced stuff of mediocre quality or high quality goods at a higher price, in my experience.

So it's not a blanket statement unless the company has a good reputation, and even then, any product at any time can nosedive. Which to me is tough in a world where people idolize manufacturers. Mfrs can get by making garbage for too long.

MrOnBicycle
Jan 18, 2008
Wait wat?

Well it broke off trying to get a seat bolt out. Sheared right off when using an impact gun after trying to free it with a breaker bar (not even a long one) where it started to twist. At least the guy in the store told me to come back if it broke. Better get those $27 back.

bolind
Jun 19, 2005



Pillbug

StormDrain posted:

Agreed on that. Labor in USA is too expensive to compete with cheap imported manufacturing, so you either get moderately priced stuff of mediocre quality or high quality goods at a higher price, in my experience.

So it's not a blanket statement unless the company has a good reputation, and even then, any product at any time can nosedive. Which to me is tough in a world where people idolize manufacturers. Mfrs can get by making garbage for too long.

I firmly believe that everyone should do a stint in manufacturing, to realize the amount of badge engineering that goes on in every industry. I spent three months in a spring roll factory, turned out they made the brand everyone knew about, some mexican stuff (for a completely different brand) which their machinery was well suited for, plus a bunch of white-label catering products. Probably more I never saw.

TLDR; brand idolization is dumb in the majority of cases.

meatpimp
May 15, 2004

Psst -- Wanna buy

EVERYWHERE
some high-quality thread's DESTROYED!



Side note on good tools -- I got a set of Wiha micro bits with handle and ratchet handle and stuff a few years ago: https://www.wihatools.com/master-te...tal-storage-box

I love this set. Every time I have something small to work on, I know I have the bits for it, and the handle and ratchet are really top-notch in feel and use. Plenty of leverage and not bulky at all.

therobit
Aug 19, 2008


bolind posted:

I firmly believe that everyone should do a stint in manufacturing, to realize the amount of badge engineering that goes on in every industry. I spent three months in a spring roll factory, turned out they made the brand everyone knew about, some mexican stuff (for a completely different brand) which their machinery was well suited for, plus a bunch of white-label catering products. Probably more I never saw.

TLDR; brand idolization is dumb in the majority of cases.

Oh man. I spent a summer working the wet prep area in a packaged food manufacturing plant when I was in my 20s. They made a couple of name brand things and some other stuff. The things I saw happening there disgusted me and put me off of prepackaged foods for a few years. The main products were soups and let's just say that the Tales from the Bear Cave Soup Company series on the front page was closer to the truth than I want to think about.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

StormDrain posted:

Labor in USA is too expensive to compete with cheap imported manufacturing, so you either get moderately priced stuff of mediocre quality or high quality goods at a higher price, in my experience.
This is basically what's known as a "race to the bottom".

You can buy a premium tool for a premium price that will be well made and work well, and some people will do this.

You can buy an ok tool for a normal price that will probably do the job and basically be ok, but definitely not as good (long-lasting or effective) as the premium tool. Almost no one will do this, though, because ...

You can buy a tool for 99c that you'll probably be able to use once, and when am I ever going to need a leather hole punch again?

This is complicated by the fact that wealth inequality has made people value price over quality for almost everything for, like, ever.

meatpimp posted:

Side note on good tools -- I got a set of Wiha micro bits with handle and ratchet handle and stuff a few years ago: https://www.wihatools.com/master-te...tal-storage-box

I love this set. Every time I have something small to work on, I know I have the bits for it, and the handle and ratchet are really top-notch in feel and use. Plenty of leverage and not bulky at all.
I have this same set and I'm sitting here wondering if I paid that much for it.

It is pretty great - especially for things in cramped spaces. That little ratchet is so compact.

meatpimp
May 15, 2004

Psst -- Wanna buy

EVERYWHERE
some high-quality thread's DESTROYED!



Krakkles posted:

This is complicated by the fact that wealth inequality has made people value price over quality for almost everything for, like, ever.
I have this same set and I'm sitting here wondering if I paid that much for it.

It is pretty great - especially for things in cramped spaces. That little ratchet is so compact.

Amazon has it for $93 right now, I picked it up in the $70-ish range. It's worth every bit of both.

El Jebus
Jun 18, 2008

This avatar is paid for by "Avatars for improving Lowtax's spine by any means that doesn't result in him becoming brain dead by putting his brain into a cyborg body and/or putting him in a exosuit due to fears of the suit being hacked and crushing him during a cyberpunk future timeline" Foundation

I have that same Wiha mini set. It's fantastic. I also paid around $70 and I'd pay $100 if I had to replace it.

Big Taint
Oct 19, 2003



Wiha did a 50% off sale several months ago, hopefully they do it again some time. Iím very happy with their tools.

MomJeans420
Mar 19, 2007

Most of the gear, most of the time


I don't see a lot of Kobalt posts in here but FYI

https://twitter.com/USCPSC/status/1...9416491009?s=20

Cat Hatter
Oct 24, 2006

Hatters gonna hat.


"The switch on the recalled pole saws can fail while under a heavy load, and cause the unit to continue running after the user releases the trigger, posing a laceration hazard to consumers."

Does that mean a heavy electrical load is causing the contacts to fuse or that the switch is physically breaking because Lenny thought of rabbits while trimming a tree?

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

Cat Hatter posted:

"The switch on the recalled pole saws can fail while under a heavy load, and cause the unit to continue running after the user releases the trigger, posing a laceration hazard to consumers."

Does that mean a heavy electrical load is causing the contacts to fuse or that the switch is physically breaking because Lenny thought of rabbits while trimming a tree?
I don't know, but this is basically why I have a professional reputation for proofreading. I hate bad sentence structure.

MomJeans420
Mar 19, 2007

Most of the gear, most of the time


I took the tweet to mean fail as in the saw portion falls off and hits you, but yeah it looks like it just keeps running under "heavy load" which I guess is problematic but not nearly as bad

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003

Psst! It's me!
The Sinister with the mutant gene.


MomJeans420 posted:

I took the tweet to mean fail as in the saw portion falls off and hits you,

this is way more metal though

Poisonlizard
Apr 1, 2007


MomJeans420 posted:

I don't see a lot of Kobalt posts in here but FYI

https://twitter.com/USCPSC/status/1...9416491009?s=20

Aw crap, I have one of those and just loaned it to my brother in law.

tangy yet delightful
Sep 13, 2005





Poisonlizard posted:

Aw crap, I have one of those and just loaned it to my brother in law.

How much does your sibling love your BIL?

Uthor
Jul 9, 2006

Gummy Bear Heaven ... It's where I go when the world is too mean.

tangy yet delightful posted:

How much does your sibling love your BIL?

DON'T ANSWER THAT. Plausible deniability and all.

Elviscat
Jan 1, 2008

High Energy, Good Feeling!




Cat Hatter posted:

"The switch on the recalled pole saws can fail while under a heavy load, and cause the unit to continue running after the user releases the trigger, posing a laceration hazard to consumers."

Does that mean a heavy electrical load is causing the contacts to fuse or that the switch is physically breaking because Lenny thought of rabbits while trimming a tree?

I doubt it, almost everything these days has a switch that sends a signal to the ECM that changes speed, maybe an SSR or something in the ECM is the issue? Or the wiper on the switch just sticks at the full-on position?

MrOnBicycle
Jan 18, 2008
Wait wat?

So I'm in need of a drill bit that can cut through hardened steel (probably 10.8 grade) that is the remnants of a seat bolt. I've probably gotten halfway through it with the bits that I had. I used cutting oil, but it seems like I won't get any further. Probably had the speed too high and killed the bits. The bolt itself is so drat seized that I'll have to drill i out fully and re-tap the hole later. My hope was to drill it and then collapse the sides. Doesn't seem to want to happen.

Should I get extraction tools that are designed to murder bolts, or should I go for normal drill bits that have the hardness and cut to get through this annoying bastard of a bolt? I've tried heating, hammering, air hammering etc with no movement what so ever, which makes me draw the conclusion that it's as stuck as can be.

Invalido
Dec 28, 2005

BICHAELING


Recently I drilled a bunch of 7mm holes through M12 bolts for a project. I did it on a lathe so I had control over the speed. Feed was hand cranking on the tail stock which wasn't perfectly uniform though, and some bolts were really hard compared to others - they came from different sources I think. I bought a fancy brand name cobalt drill bit that did a lot better than regular cheap HSS bits. It managed a few holes before becoming unusable but several of those bits would have gotten expensive fast so I ended up annealing the hard bolts with an oxy torch which worked great for my application since soft steel is fine and the zink was coming off anyways.

MrOnBicycle
Jan 18, 2008
Wait wat?

Ok so maybe something like Bosch Cobolt drill bits should do the trick. What's the correct way of drilling these sorts of things. Low speed and plenty of lubrication?

Poisonlizard
Apr 1, 2007


Uthor posted:

DON'T ANSWER THAT. Plausible deniability and all.

I know the drill.
Turns out mine has a 2015 date code, so I guess it's not recalled.

Invalido
Dec 28, 2005

BICHAELING


MrOnBicycle posted:

Ok so maybe something like Bosch Cobolt drill bits should do the trick. What's the correct way of drilling these sorts of things. Low speed and plenty of lubrication?

Pretty much, in my limited experience.

Elviscat
Jan 1, 2008

High Energy, Good Feeling!




MrOnBicycle posted:

Ok so maybe something like Bosch Cobolt drill bits should do the trick. What's the correct way of drilling these sorts of things. Low speed and plenty of lubrication?

Buy the appropriate bit from McMaster, Bosch is junk just like everything at the big boxes (except Cleveland)

kastein
Aug 31, 2011

Moderator at http://www.ridgelineownersclub.com/forums/and soon to be mod of AI. MAKE AI GREAT AGAIN. Motronic for VP.


I've had good luck with Milwaukee and Vermont American black oxide HSS but I don't think they'll do well on hardened bolts in an uncontrolled, sloppy application like leaning on a hand drill inside a car, which always sucks. My best luck has been slow, just enough pressure to keep it biting, and drown it in cutting oil.

Safety Dance
Sep 10, 2007

Five degrees to starboard!


low speed, lubrication, and tool pressure as high as you're willing to go

Uthor
Jul 9, 2006

Gummy Bear Heaven ... It's where I go when the world is too mean.

Safety Dance posted:

low speed, lubrication, and tool pressure as high as you're willing to go

Rhyno
Mar 22, 2003

Psst! It's me!
The Sinister with the mutant gene.


Any Ryobi guys have one of the 18v vacuums?

MrOnBicycle
Jan 18, 2008
Wait wat?

Elviscat posted:

Buy the appropriate bit from McMaster, Bosch is junk just like everything at the big boxes (except Cleveland)

drat ok. Sure are expensive though at $ a pop. I'll see what else is available as McMaster isn't available in Europe. I'd rather go overkill and get the fucker out. Maybe I'll attempt sharpening the bits I have first.

Elviscat
Jan 1, 2008

High Energy, Good Feeling!




If you're in Europe, look for bits made in Germany, England, Finland, or Sweden, one of them will have excellent bits, made of good quality metal, with excellent grinds, which is what you need. Hopefully for a decent price, I recommended McMaster because I assumed you were in the US, your local industrial supply chain should be able to have a good product for you.

powderific
May 13, 2004



Grimey Drawer

Every time I have to drill out a bolt Iím shocked at how much better nicer
Norseman/whatever bits work than cheap box store bits.

Rectal Placenta
Feb 25, 2011


I've slowly been upgrading/filling out my tool chest and just got a set of Wera laser tips, and holy poo poo, what a night and day difference.

cakesmith handyman
Jul 22, 2007

Pip-Pip old chap! Last one in is a rotten egg what what.



Rhyno posted:

Any Ryobi guys have one of the 18v vacuums?

I have an older vac, CHV182M, it's not great for anything other than little clean up jobs while/after DIY, and if I don't want to kill the good vacuum with plaster dust. Also the filters are impossible to get so I've been washing/blowing out the original one and it's starting to show. Get one if its cheap, not for a main vacuum.

MomJeans420
Mar 19, 2007

Most of the gear, most of the time


Rectal Placenta posted:

I've slowly been upgrading/filling out my tool chest and just got a set of Wera laser tips, and holy poo poo, what a night and day difference.

I've been buying Wera screwdriver sets for people as gifts (especially when I'm out of other ideas), and I always have to explain when they open it that no really, trust me on this you actually needed new screwdrivers you just didn't know it. Then I'll talk to them months later and they've seen the light.

Krakkles
May 5, 2003

like and subscribe for more passive-aggressive roadway bullshit adventure in Chigcao

cakesmith handyman posted:

I have an older vac, CHV182M, it's not great for anything other than little clean up jobs while/after DIY, and if I don't want to kill the good vacuum with plaster dust. Also the filters are impossible to get so I've been washing/blowing out the original one and it's starting to show. Get one if its cheap, not for a main vacuum.
For what it's worth, I've got the Milwaukee M18 Wet/Dry and while it's certainly not the 5HP craftsman (I think?) that runs on 120v, it's more than adequate for anything day to day. The filters are relatively inexpensive and easily available.

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StormDrain
May 22, 2003

Thirteen Letter


MomJeans420 posted:

I've been buying Wera screwdriver sets for people as gifts (especially when I'm out of other ideas), and I always have to explain when they open it that no really, trust me on this you actually needed new screwdrivers you just didn't know it. Then I'll talk to them months later and they've seen the light.

I thought people were crazy for liking fancy screwdrivers and now if I have to use a regular one I'm upset. And everyone thinks I'm nuts now.

Recently I got out a screw that was threatening to strip out completely, and for any regular driver it was already stripped. Laser tips always.

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