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Cojawfee
May 31, 2006
I think the US is dumb for not using Celsius
1 count of driving too fast
1 count of wearing driving gloves
1 count of possession of driveway protractor
1 count of intent to measure driveway angle
1 count of intent to discuss own M2

I hereby sentence you to 20 years in Federal Pound Me In The rear end Prison

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Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

So trying to figure out why one 5 series "feels" better than the other when you walk up to it. "Curb appeal"

The "good" one is a 2017 5 series sports line with 18" wheels, leather interior etc, regular cruise control, 14,000 miles

The "bad" one is a 2019 5 series, door sill says "sports line", 18" wheels, star-tex fake leather interior, active cruise control and assisted lane keeping, 4,500 miles

For whatever reason the 2017 feels bigger, taller, larger... More luxury. When you walk up to it you're like, "wow this thing rocks, I want one of these some day"

The 2019 supposedly has the same trim level, ride height, rims, tires etc... But it feels like a jelly bean rental car when you walk up to it

Am I crazy or what am I missing? Both are 7th gen so body style ought to be the same. We visited both cars today, but they're at different lots in different cities.

edit: Looks like there are no less than three versions of "black": jet black, black sapphire metalic, azurite black metallic II.... I think the "bad" 2019 is just jet black, while the 2017 might be the black sapphire metallic? black sapphire metallic has a bit more depth to it, i think the jet black is really flat in comparison?

Hadlock fucked around with this message at 03:03 on Aug 13, 2020

Ultimate Mango
Jan 18, 2005

He’s probably just waiting for the court Zoom meeting to connect. Virtual court is apparently a pain in the rear bumper.

That or his lawyer was so good the police showed up and took him to jail during the trial.

KOTEX GOD OF BLOOD
Jul 7, 2012

he's probably just off celebrating by driving his M2 at 100+mph again.

Hadlock posted:

edit: Looks like there are no less than three versions of "black": jet black, black sapphire metalic, azurite black metallic II.... I think the "bad" 2019 is just jet black, while the 2017 might be the black sapphire metallic? black sapphire metallic has a bit more depth to it, i think the jet black is really flat in comparison?
black cars get dirty quickly; black sapphire seems to "look" cleaner for a longer period of time. if you're garaging in the city, it's different than owning it a rural area, of course.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

My old 5 series (97?) and my wife's '13 bmw are/were both black so we're familiar with needing to be cleaned regularly

But yeah the "bad" new model had been sitting on the lot for 192 days or something, and they're in a particularly windy/dusty area. It looks like they brush them off regularly, but the end result is that all the cars outside not in the showroom look pretty hellblasted with tons of fine paint swirls etc etc. Kind of suprising as we scheduled the appointment/test drive the day before and it was pretty clear nobody had been within 10 feet of the car in at least a week. We haven't washed my wife's car in probably two months and it looked loads better than the 6 year newer yet hell blasted one. Every car on their lot looked like their detailing guy was just grinding the dust into the paint with a polishing wheel

The other car is smooth polished glossy black, presents amazing and almost has a regal presence

Mentally, it's hard to spend an extra 5,000 clams on a newer but hell blasted version

We keep our car in a garage 360+ days a year

fknlo
Jul 6, 2009


Fun Shoe
Negotiate the cost of paint correction off the other car if you want it more.

BlackMK4
Aug 23, 2006

wat.
Megamarm
Who is going to find his mugshot?

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

by Athanatos
God drat people are lovely.

Happened on premise of a members-and-guests-only club and I was only away from the car for 6 hours, AND, obstensibly, everyone that was there, ~150 people, were also out on the water for most of that time so there's only so many people it could have been...



When I narrow it down, jokes on them, vice grips are cheap and schrader valves are awfully delicate for the job they do. Suffice it to say I won't be driving the M2 back there anytime soon.

Crunchy Black fucked around with this message at 06:21 on Aug 13, 2020

Cojawfee
May 31, 2006
I think the US is dumb for not using Celsius
Someone put a Trump sticker on your car?

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

by Athanatos

Cojawfee posted:

Someone put a Donald "I promise not to talk about your massive plastic surgeries" Trump sticker on your car?

Correct

Ether Frenzy
Dec 22, 2006




Nap Ghost

Crunchy Black posted:

God drat people are lovely.

Happened on premise of a members-and-guests-only club and I was only away from the car for 6 hours, AND, obstensibly, everyone that was there, ~150 people, were also out on the water for most of that time so there's only so many people it could have been...



When I narrow it down, jokes on them, vice grips are cheap and schrader valves are awfully delicate for the job they do. Suffice it to say I won't be driving the M2 back there anytime soon.

That's extremely lame. Sorry for your shithole locality, OP.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VO48Vr4KIc8

Is it on the window at least?

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

by Athanatos
Yeah, on the window, at least.

I had forgotten about that scene, thanks, I feel slightly better.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
Well, it wasn't a total victory, but it was Good. They agreed to drop my clocked speed from 104 to 98, which means it's no longer 30+ over the limit and no longer a 100+ speed. That drops it from the Big Bad Type of Ticket to the normal kind where you just pay the man.

Could've been worse!

Cojawfee
May 31, 2006
I think the US is dumb for not using Celsius
If you're being forced to post that from inside prison, blink twice.

OBAMNA PHONE
Aug 7, 2002
I thought you can't hire lawyers for speeding tickets in Oregon? are you allowed to when it's reckless driving?

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog

BraveUlysses posted:

I thought you can't hire lawyers for speeding tickets in Oregon? are you allowed to when it's reckless driving?

Hiring lawyers for speeding tickets in Oreogn is totally fine. Also we almost NEVER get Reckless Driving tacked on to offenses here, because it's an actual misdemeanor and requires endangerment of other persons. I guess it's hard to stick someone with it so they only bust it out for the real exciting, 140+ stuff

Ether Frenzy
Dec 22, 2006




Nap Ghost
Congrats on your continued freedom. I'm not a prison expert but "I wore gloves while driving" is a pretty dumb story to tell in the cellblock

BlackMK4
Aug 23, 2006

wat.
Megamarm
I bet he'd get a cool prison name

Bape Culture
Sep 13, 2006

The giMp

moosemanmoo
Jan 6, 2007
R the Reply that his life was in danger
I picked up a pretty well maintained ‘99 323i last week with most of the options and it’s been a lot of fun. My only recent point of comparison is my B8.5 Allroad, which has a more amusing torque curve but otherwise can’t compare in steering feel or engine smoothness, and rowing my own gears again is a refreshing change.

Naturally, I have inherited some small issues with my new 22 year old German car. The automatic climate control has some strange ideas about what temperature to keep my legs, and the dash computer claims it’s -40 outside. I gather that knocking the thermistor off on some ice or a parking block is common, and sure enough behind the front left (driver’s) wheel well liner I found two wires coming out of the harness that look like they were ripped out of a socket. So I cut and crimped a new socket to the wires, plugged in a new sensor very firmly as recommended by others, and nothing has changed.

Is there some obvious thing that I don’t have the experience to check here? Climate control is working fine, just taking more adjustments than I’m used to and I figure this sensor is the cause.

Big Taint
Oct 19, 2003


RE: temp sensor, if it was torn out it may have damaged the wires farther up and you don’t have continuity? Also I want to say there is a sensor on each side in that car, one is for the dash and the other for the ECU. You may have fixed the wrong one.

Woolwich Bagnet
Apr 27, 2003



Yeah, reading -40 means there isn't continuity somewhere.

OBAMNA PHONE
Aug 7, 2002
that's an e36 right? pretty common issue for the temp sensor, it's by the front left bumper inlet/duct.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Hadlock posted:

Found a two year newer car (2019) with 12,000 fewer miles for about $4000 more. I guess it's been the dealerships "loaner car"

Basically brand-new, way less than 10,000 miles. The last BMW I bought was 13 years old and had closer to 135,000 miles and ran like a top so not sure if this matters

Looking at this one vs the 2017 5 series because it has "active cruise control" as well as active lane keeping (poor man's autopilot?) and collision avoidance etc

We live in the crowded part of the San Francisco bay area, and my mother in law lives about an hour's drive away in far north bay... How good is active cruise control, and the lane keeping, really? Looks like it works all the way down to 18mph.

We rented a Toyota last year and drove from Seattle to the California border and back with a similar system, I guess they include these features for free as standard. I was really surprised at how well it worked, and SIGNIFICANT decrease in mental load while driving. I was able to drive 5 hours on I-5, then get out of the car and felt refreshed and ready to go, zero fatigue at all, even though I hadn't ever driven on that stretch of road ever before in my life, and it had been raining on and off the whole time

TL;DR how good is active cruise control with stop & go, and is it worth $4000 on a car we plan on keeping for 6-10 years

Did a test drive this week

The radar-based cruise control was pretty good in a straight, flat line, but in an older downtown area where there's a bunch of at an angle parking and the lanes are really non-standard wider than normal wide it would panic stop for parked service vehicles etc. In the bay area where the roads can be pretty windy, even on the highways, it wasn't able to keep up with traffic conditions, nearly crashed the car several times. It would successfully stop but either took too long to start again, or wasn't working. This is probably best for long distance road trips, I dunno if it would be useful at all during rush hour commute, and at that point, why bother?

Active lane keeping seems to only work when the paint stripes are pretty fresh. Worn white stripes on concrete road surface, the car wasn't able to really keep track of things very well. I was expecting something closer to Tesla autopilot, for some reason. This is not that. This seems to work about 80% better than the toyota lane keeping, which primarily seems to exist only to keep you from drifting into another lane when you're half asleep.

When active cruise control was working, it was really nice, but currently I don't think it's worth the money as an option except as a gimmick. Lane keeping is probably more dangerous than it is a safely feature.

jink
May 8, 2002

Drop it like it's Hot.
Taco Defender

Hadlock posted:

Did a test drive this week

The radar-based cruise control was pretty good in a straight, flat line, but in an older downtown area where there's a bunch of at an angle parking and the lanes are really non-standard wider than normal wide it would panic stop for parked service vehicles etc. In the bay area where the roads can be pretty windy, even on the highways, it wasn't able to keep up with traffic conditions, nearly crashed the car several times. It would successfully stop but either took too long to start again, or wasn't working. This is probably best for long distance road trips, I dunno if it would be useful at all during rush hour commute, and at that point, why bother?

Active lane keeping seems to only work when the paint stripes are pretty fresh. Worn white stripes on concrete road surface, the car wasn't able to really keep track of things very well. I was expecting something closer to Tesla autopilot, for some reason. This is not that. This seems to work about 80% better than the toyota lane keeping, which primarily seems to exist only to keep you from drifting into another lane when you're half asleep.

When active cruise control was working, it was really nice, but currently I don't think it's worth the money as an option except as a gimmick. Lane keeping is probably more dangerous than it is a safely feature.

Is that actual radar ACC or MobilEye ACC? My i3s has MobilEye ACC which uses a camera under the rear view mirror and it is not great at all; box trucks confuse it, motorcycles, etc. I use it > 30MPH on highways to reduce mental load but nothing more...

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

jink posted:

Is that actual radar ACC or MobilEye ACC? My i3s has MobilEye ACC which uses a camera under the rear view mirror and it is not great at all; box trucks confuse it, motorcycles, etc. I use it > 30MPH on highways to reduce mental load but nothing more...

I think it's actual radar? On the 5 series below the license plate and kidneys there's a 5" diameter flat circle in the dead center. It's called "Active Cruise Control with Stop & Go", previous generation was merely "adaptive" and not active, but both condense down to the same ACC acronym

The marketing website calls it radar, and it's good to 650 ft/200m

Car was a 2019 model and that's the first year they offered it so I don't think it's camera based

We're thinking about adding solid state radar to our boat, I think it's the same technology, it's pretty impressive how cheap it is, marine grade radar 20 years ago was $10,000 and needed it's own dedicated base station/CRT monitor. Now they are $1,100 and connect via PoE (power over Ethernet) to an existing networked nav computer/display, similar to what every iDrive BMW has now.

Anyways yeah it sounds about as good as your camera based system when it comes to getting confused, the big difference is probably that it works up to 650 feet away, which allows the car to slow down further away at highway speed and you don't rear end a parked car on the highway. BMW has some example videos of how the car will brake, then swerve to avoid parked cars at near-highway speeds

We're probably going to buy the 2017 model with regular cruise control. The ACC is awesome when it works, but it's not quite there yet IMO

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010

i powder a
granite monument
in a soundless flash

showering the grass
with molten drops of
its gold inlay

sending smoking
chips of stone
skipping into the fog
ACC just isn't there yet. The minimum safe distance between cars is like 2-3x what Normal Drivers do, so someone will scootch into the spot in front of you, causing you to slow down, causing another person to scootch in front of you, and suddenly you're going 18 on the freeway

jink
May 8, 2002

Drop it like it's Hot.
Taco Defender

Hadlock posted:

I think it's actual radar? On the 5 series below the license plate and kidneys there's a 5" diameter flat circle in the dead center. It's called "Active Cruise Control with Stop & Go", previous generation was merely "adaptive" and not active, but both condense down to the same ACC acronym

The marketing website calls it radar, and it's good to 650 ft/200m

Car was a 2019 model and that's the first year they offered it so I don't think it's camera based

We're thinking about adding solid state radar to our boat, I think it's the same technology, it's pretty impressive how cheap it is, marine grade radar 20 years ago was $10,000 and needed it's own dedicated base station/CRT monitor. Now they are $1,100 and connect via PoE (power over Ethernet) to an existing networked nav computer/display, similar to what every iDrive BMW has now.

Anyways yeah it sounds about as good as your camera based system when it comes to getting confused, the big difference is probably that it works up to 650 feet away, which allows the car to slow down further away at highway speed and you don't rear end a parked car on the highway. BMW has some example videos of how the car will brake, then swerve to avoid parked cars at near-highway speeds

We're probably going to buy the 2017 model with regular cruise control. The ACC is awesome when it works, but it's not quite there yet IMO

Interesting, yeah that sounds like the actual radar system. Bummer that it doesn't work as well as I envisioned. The 'up to 650ft away' is intriguing though, the i3s gets spooked quite easily. Thankfully with an EV it recovers instantly and doesn't impose a hit on comfort due to shifting/rpms/etc.

I wanted to add comma.ai to my i3s but the Flexray system has proven incredibly difficult to MiTM attack due to the low latency of the packets compared to CAN systems. They have an incredible driving ability with other vehicles like the Accord, RAV-4, etc etc etc: https://comma.ai/

Boat auto pilot sounds freaking cool! :D

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Boat auto pilot is pretty neat, it's very usable and does end to end routing etc like a Tesla would. The big difference is that boats don't have stop and go traffic, and distance between boats is generally measure in fractions of a mile, not inches, so accuracy isn't super critical. We will turn on the autopilot and go make dinner down below, or take a nap, and come up to check on the situation top side every 15 minutes or so.

Solid state radar is pretty great too, it will clearly/distinctly pick up seagulls and ducks on flat water at 300 feet, in addition to boats, rocks, walls etc. You can actually click on what you think is a boat on the radar output, and then set the autopilot to track that thing and follow it, or if you're not following it, alert you if your paths will cross within X feet/miles. Marine radar is good from about 20 feet up to 12-27 miles typically. Commercial boats are required to carry a radio beacon now, called AIS, which includes their GPS position, name of boat, size/depth of boat, as well as a "private phone number" where you can call them from.

All this technology comes in a $599 package these days, it's pretty impressive boats have all these systems, but you pay thousands of dollars for automotive versions. You can't call the guy in front of you in traffic from their traffic radio beacon from your BMW yet.

heated game moment
Oct 30, 2003

Lipstick Apathy

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

ACC just isn't there yet. The minimum safe distance between cars is like 2-3x what Normal Drivers do, so someone will scootch into the spot in front of you, causing you to slow down, causing another person to scootch in front of you, and suddenly you're going 18 on the freeway

This is my experience using it for 700 highway miles in my E63. The second I would get over to the left lane to pass a truck or whatever, some rear end in a top hat would come divebombing in from the right lane to merge last second and try to cut off everyone who already got into the left lane to pass. When you see that happening you can just hit the accelerator to not leave a big gap though. For the most part it is extremely helpful to have though, I was pretty impressed overall especially once I hit LA traffic.

Ultimate Mango
Jan 18, 2005

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

ACC just isn't there yet. The minimum safe distance between cars is like 2-3x what Normal Drivers do, so someone will scootch into the spot in front of you, causing you to slow down, causing another person to scootch in front of you, and suddenly you're going 18 on the freeway

Genesis seems to have the implementation of this exact ACC down pat, best on the market. I’ve used BMW ACC in my 2019 from LA to Vegas twice and it’s been fine, but it’s not great in mixed traffic. Stop and go can be okay, the real pea soup fog of traffic. In between it sucks.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

Yeah we drove a toyota with a laser based(?? i think?) ACC system from Seattle to the southern border of Oregon, probably 300 miles, once we got out of Seattle it was great. In downtown seattle/portland trying to use it was suicide though.

Wife did the math on a used tesla with unlimited supercharging, total cost of ownership is about the same and has "real autopilot" (??) that was designed/tested within a 30 mile radius of where we live, gonna go look at one tomorrow hopefully

My guess is in another 5-10 years ACC will be standard on most cars that aren't entry level. I think Toyota already has it across their entire range including the 2019 and newer Corolla, which is what we drove.

SlapActionJackson
Jul 27, 2006

My buddy just bought a '19 740i with 5k miles on it from Hertz.

Stickered for $86K all his for $48K

I will will regale you with any tales of triumph/regret.

Hadlock
Nov 9, 2004

We very nearly pulled the trigger on a '19 530i off the dealer lot

Stickered for $51,000 but they have it on their website for $35 and change

Rental companies are hemorrhaging money right now, a lot of interesting deals to be had. Every '17 530i we've seen has been marked down "$8000 below kbb" which I think just tells me that KBB hasn't caught up with the car sales apocalypse

Keyser_Soze
May 5, 2009

Pillbug
....meanwhile Carvana recently offered me $1500 less than what I paid for my Silverado 4x4 brand new nearly 3 years ago. :newlol:

Guinness
Sep 15, 2004

Hadlock posted:

KBB hasn't caught up with the car sales apocalypse

KBB has always been trash, more now than ever

Ether Frenzy
Dec 22, 2006




Nap Ghost

Crunchy Black
Oct 24, 2017

by Athanatos

Mods!? Probate this heresy.

MrOnBicycle
Jan 18, 2008
Wait wat?

GoGoGadgetChris posted:

But the gloves keep my pomade from getting on the wheel!

Surely though, the cop was about to let you off with a warning but then saw your gloves.

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Popete
Oct 6, 2009

This will make sure you don't suggest to the KDz
That he should grow greens instead of crushing on MCs

Grimey Drawer
Rural Oregon lawyer: "If the gloves don't fit you must acquit!"

*gloves fit perfectly*

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