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Open Source Idiom
Jan 4, 2013


Solice Kirsk posted:

Season 3 and 4 were mostly terrible, but the last two episodes tied it together pretty well. The first season is still fantastic. It was basically all downhill from there, but it started so high that my connection to the characters let me drag myself through the last couple seasons.

Yeah I didn't make it to season 4 after season 3. Pretty disappointing show overall, but I'm half to see someone else agrees with me lol.

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joepinetree
Apr 5, 2012


Watching the haunting of bly manor and i might not be able to sleep tonight. Mike Flanagan is great.

BigBallChunkyTime
Nov 25, 2011

Kyle Schwarber: World Series hero, Beefy Lad, better than you.



Illegal Hen

Solice Kirsk posted:

Season 3 and 4 were mostly terrible, but the last two episodes tied it together pretty well. The first season is still fantastic. It was basically all downhill from there, but it started so high that my connection to the characters let me drag myself through the last couple seasons.

I couldn't disagree more. I felt TGP got better as time went on. Season 3 has some of the best episodes in the series.

knox
Oct 28, 2004



Buffy the Vampire Slayer, I feel like I'm laughing at this show way more than I should be. Checking some of the 'best episode lists' it seems most of them are in the later seasons which I just got to with Season 4.

Sloth Life
Nov 15, 2014

Built for comfort and speed!

Fallen Rib

Bly Manor. Its not great, don't know why I'm bothering but i guess it's background noise

not a bot
Jan 9, 2019


Bly Manor and yikes what a letdown after Hill House.

Remy Marathe
Mar 15, 2007



knox posted:

Buffy the Vampire Slayer, I feel like I'm laughing at this show way more than I should be. Checking some of the 'best episode lists' it seems most of them are in the later seasons which I just got to with Season 4.

This is a series that benefits greatly from the binge format- small throwaway jokes reference past events all the time, and the characters actually develop and change enough that you aren't puking after 7 seasons of them. Also you should absolutely be laughing, even at it's sappiest I don't think there was a single moment of this series that wasn't done with tongue-in-cheek.

Solice Kirsk
Jun 1, 2004

.



BigBallChunkyTime posted:

I couldn't disagree more. I felt TGP got better as time went on. Season 3 has some of the best episodes in the series.

It did move at a steady clip, I'll give it that. Not a lot if spinning the wheels at all on that show.

NorgLyle
Sep 20, 2002

You think I posted on this forum because I value your companionship?


not a bot posted:

Bly Manor and yikes what a letdown after Hill House.
I think the writers felt like they were really clever for coming up with the way the ghosts work in Bly Manor and sort of forgot to bother to write an actual story that made use of that in any way. I did really enjoy Dani's ghost fiance who instantly reminded me of Harry Potter in his ghost form.

joepinetree
Apr 5, 2012


Ok, six episodes into bly manor and my opinion so far is:

Great atmosphere, meh story, bad acting.

Meatgrinder
Jul 11, 2003

Te Occidere Possunt Sed Te Edere Non Possunt Nefas Est


Watched the second season of The Boys. Pretty much the same overall quality of acting, story and production as the first season, which, for a superhero series and considering the source material, is a fairly high achievement. I was a bit disgruntled at the episodes not being released all at once, but I guess it wasn't too long a wait and it was a nice binge once the whole thing was out.
There were a few solid hooks into a possible third season which hopefully will get made and retain the same level of entertainment value as its predecessors.

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust


Grimey Drawer

They are doing season 3 and already announced some casting. I'm kind of more excited about the spinoff series which sounds like an X-Men spoof.

knox
Oct 28, 2004



Remy Marathe posted:

This is a series that benefits greatly from the binge format- small throwaway jokes reference past events all the time, and the characters actually develop and change enough that you aren't puking after 7 seasons of them. Also you should absolutely be laughing, even at it's sappiest I don't think there was a single moment of this series that wasn't done with tongue-in-cheek.

For sure, I even started watching Firefly (long overdue) 'cuz Joss. Don't know why I never watched that either, I even saw Serenity and thought it was good even knowing nothing about the show. I'm not sure why I was never into his stuff before.
Buffy never appealed to me before until recently I saw some people referencing it on twitter 'academically' and it made me want to watch it.

I've seen more "Buffy is one of most influential TV show last x years" since I started watching.

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."


Remy Marathe posted:

This is a series that benefits greatly from the binge format- small throwaway jokes reference past events all the time, and the characters actually develop and change enough that you aren't puking after 7 seasons of them. Also you should absolutely be laughing, even at it's sappiest I don't think there was a single moment of this series that wasn't done with tongue-in-cheek.

The Body being an obvious exception.

clown shoes
Jul 17, 2004

Nothing but clowns down here.

Doctor Spaceman posted:

The Body being an obvious exception.

Still one of the funniest hours of television.

"Mom? Mom? Mommy?"

Torquemada
Oct 21, 2010

Drei Gläser


clown shoes posted:

Still one of the funniest hours of television.

"Mom? Mom? Mommy?"

One must have a heart of stone to read the death of Little Nell without laughing.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006


knox posted:

For sure, I even started watching Firefly (long overdue) 'cuz Joss. Don't know why I never watched that either, I even saw Serenity and thought it was good even knowing nothing about the show. I'm not sure why I was never into his stuff before.
Buffy never appealed to me before until recently I saw some people referencing it on twitter 'academically' and it made me want to watch it.

I've seen more "Buffy is one of most influential TV show last x years" since I started watching.

Buffy Season 6 has one of my favorite hours of television of all time, but for the most part, I didn't love Seasons 6 and 7 as much the earlier ones (especially 2, 3, and 5).

Since you like Buffy, I strongly recommend following it with Angel. Just like Buffy, I think Season 1 is the weakest, but it does an amazing job redeeming some of the more one-note, bland, and unlikable characters from Buffy. After that, Seasons 2-4 are one gigantic epic story arc, and Season 5 is one of my favorite seasons of any show, ever, with one of the best series finales ever.

It's a different tone -- darker, more mature-feeling. Buffy has so many obvious allegories about the horrors of growing up, but Angel is about how to be a good (or at least better) person once you're an adult, how to change the world around you for the better and fight against being corrupted and ground down by its institutions.

I have the complete series set on DVD for sale in case you're interested (along with Buffy, Firefly, Serenity, and Dr. Horrible's Sing-Along Blog), but I'm sure it's streaming somewhere.

TMMadman
Sep 9, 2003

Bat 'em up!




Man, I forgot how much I hated the Juliette becomes a hexenbeist/heel storyline in Grimm. Like becoming a hexenbeist was fine, but the massive personality change is just so jarring since they keep telling you throughout the show that a person is essentially the same whether they are woged or not. And while maybe it's right to expect some change from someone who becomes a wesen due to magic, the extreme nature of her heel change is just so wrong and offputting.

VagueRant
May 24, 2012


Am I blind or is there no thread for Haunting of Bly Manor? Seems like everything I saw in that show, and everything I heard about Hill House would make it a goon cult hit with a fervent fanbase!

Sloth Life
Nov 15, 2014

Built for comfort and speed!

Fallen Rib

TMMadman posted:

Man, I forgot how much I hated the Juliette becomes a hexenbeist/heel storyline in Grimm. Like becoming a hexenbeist was fine, but the massive personality change is just so jarring since they keep telling you throughout the show that a person is essentially the same whether they are woged or not. And while maybe it's right to expect some change from someone who becomes a wesen due to magic, the extreme nature of her heel change is just so wrong and offputting.

It felt like they were clearing the way for Adalind. The fact that newly Hexenbiest Juliette was able to gently caress Ads up was a ) hilarious and b) character assassination to indicate Juliette was evil deep down.

They were going all in on how an assertive and independent girlfriend is bad, pick the pretty dumb blonde who can't beat a two day old hexen.

TMMadman
Sep 9, 2003

Bat 'em up!




Sloth Life posted:

It felt like they were clearing the way for Adalind. The fact that newly Hexenbiest Juliette was able to gently caress Ads up was a ) hilarious and b) character assassination to indicate Juliette was evil deep down.

They were going all in on how an assertive and independent girlfriend is bad, pick the pretty dumb blonde who can't beat a two day old hexen.

But again, it just doesn't make sense for the themes of the show which is that it's the person inside, not the wesen, that makes someone good/bad. So the extreme 180 from Juliette being nice and helpful to just being not only bad, but downright evil, doesn't track with everything else in the show. And you can't blame being it on being a hexenbiest because we've seen that they can certainly act and do things are 'good', like with Reynard's mother. I guess I could see the whole 'juliette is really evil deep down', but we aren't even given a taste of that in the previous few seasons, so it's just really jarring and I have a lot of trouble believing it.

Or maybe there is just some sort of under the radar misogyny from the writers that I'm not fully picking up on.

mllaneza
Apr 28, 2007


Veteran, Bermuda Triangle Expeditionary Force, 1993-1952





Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:

Since you like Buffy, I strongly recommend following it with Angel. Just like Buffy, I think Season 1 is the weakest, but it does an amazing job redeeming some of the more one-note, bland, and unlikable characters from Buffy. After that, Seasons 2-4 are one gigantic epic story arc, and Season 5 is one of my favorite seasons of any show, ever, with one of the best series finales ever.

Of Buffy and Angel I've only seen S5 of Angel. It's incredible, easily Whedon's best work. Buffy had already made his rep, but Angel S5 cemented it.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006


mllaneza posted:

Of Buffy and Angel I've only seen S5 of Angel. It's incredible, easily Whedon's best work. Buffy had already made his rep, but Angel S5 cemented it.

I recommend watching the rest, but you've already seen the best part and realize it for what it is.

sad question
May 30, 2020


I've been re-watching Buffy and was surprised how much I enjoyed season 1. I guess my appreciation of camp has increased over the years. Episodes with demon possessing the internet or lady teacher who is is secretly a praying mantis are not like... good but they are enjoyable to watch.

Some things in show aged poorly. Like Buffy/Angel romance is actually creepy and Xander is loving awful at the beginning of the show. Fact that the Joss turned out be a creepazoid also tarnishes it somewhat, but given that tv shows are massive collaborative endeavors it would be unfair to write it off because of some rear end in a top hat.

Hope amazon adds Angel next, I'll be on that poo poo in a second. I remember liking it more than Buffy.

WeedlordGoku69
Feb 11, 2015

A DAILY DOSE
OF OLD SHOOTERS


PLAY NOW MY LORD



sad question posted:

Fact that the Joss turned out be a creepazoid also tarnishes it somewhat, but given that tv shows are massive collaborative endeavors it would be unfair to write it off because of some rear end in a top hat.

Thing is, Buffy/Angel basically wasn't. That poo poo was Whedon's baby 100% and the wide bulk of the people who worked on it were just following what Whedon wanted.

sad question
May 30, 2020


I was going by writing and directing credits. Which are other people usually. But you are right, as a showrunner he was big driving force behind everything. I don't remember which show he concentrated more on when Angel started. I think Marti Noxton took charge on Buffy side then?

Dude should have stayed on TV.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou
Jan 1, 2006


sad question posted:

Hope amazon adds Angel next, I'll be on that poo poo in a second. I remember liking it more than Buffy.

If you want the complete series DVD box set, I'm selling it.

showbiz_liz
Jun 2, 2008


sad question posted:

I was going by writing and directing credits. Which are other people usually. But you are right, as a showrunner he was big driving force behind everything. I don't remember which show he concentrated more on when Angel started. I think Marti Noxton took charge on Buffy side then?

I was deep in the fandom nonsense for Buffy back then and the Buffy fansites I went to were obsessive about following that stuff. From what I remember, when Angel started after season 3, it took some of the Buffy writer's room with it, which some people felt negatively affected the next couple of Buffy seasons. But Whedon was still the Buffy showrunner after Angel started. And then it looked like Buffy was going to end after five seasons, and Whedon started working on Firefly and it became his new baby, the thing he was going to do next... and then Buffy didn't end, it moved to a new network, which was almost unprecedented at the time, and seems to have been largely a power play by FOX against the WB.

Back then, showrunners didn't necessarily get to say "I want to tell a story in five seasons and then I'm wrapping it up" like they can now. That was a top-down decision. So the impression I get is, Joss Whedon thought Buffy was ending, made plans for that to happen, and then had sort of moved on from Buffy to Firefly mentally when it became clear the show was coming back after all. So he essentially handed it off to, yes, Marti Noxon, and he wrote the musical episode in season 6 as his swan song, although he stayed somewhat involved in the show until the end.

I remember it was Marti Noxon who became the showrunner because she ate a lot of poo poo for certain developments in season 6. She got blamed for what many people felt was a steep decline, although season 6's reputation has improved somewhat over time. The ire focused on her was probably undeserved, especially because I think even more of the writing staff had been bled off again before season 6, this time from Buffy to Firefly.

WeedlordGoku69
Feb 11, 2015

A DAILY DOSE
OF OLD SHOOTERS


PLAY NOW MY LORD



honestly the stuff from Noxon's tenure is probably the only Buffy that still holds up at all

the rest is just so aggressively Whedon and that writing style is just loving intolerable now that we know the dude's a poo poo

Doctor Spaceman
Jul 6, 2010

"Everyone's entitled to their point of view, but that's seriously a weird one."


Sloth Life posted:

It felt like they were clearing the way for Adalind. The fact that newly Hexenbiest Juliette was able to gently caress Ads up was a ) hilarious and b) character assassination to indicate Juliette was evil deep down.

They were going all in on how an assertive and independent girlfriend is bad, pick the pretty dumb blonde who can't beat a two day old hexen.

Adelind is a massive writer's pet and drags down the show.

cryptoclastic
Jul 3, 2003

The Jesus


I finished Ted Lasso, and it was definitely one of the best things I've seen this year. Does anyone who has watched it have any recommendations for other similar shows? The feel-good is just so wonderful.

newts
Oct 10, 2012


Doctor Spaceman posted:

Adelind is a massive writer's pet and drags down the show.

There's a lot to like about Grimm. But, man, that surprise sex-by-deception plot and subsequent... consequences just dragged the whole thing down.

Mu Zeta
Oct 17, 2002

Me crush ass to dust


Grimey Drawer

cryptoclastic posted:

I finished Ted Lasso, and it was definitely one of the best things I've seen this year. Does anyone who has watched it have any recommendations for other similar shows? The feel-good is just so wonderful.

Ted Lasso is basically the male version of Leslie Knope

Mrenda
Mar 14, 2012



I think what most impressed me about Ted Lasso was they had English/British, or at least people familiar with England/Britain doing at least some of the writing/consulting. It's not something I see in a lot of ostensibly US media.

However, I do feel the show is a reflection of what peoplethese daysactually want from comedy, in some circumstances, at least. Not necessarily a show that has them laughing out loud regularly, but a comfortable show, where the characters are people you can enjoy, and the story has its tensions, and releases, but it doesn't weigh on you. It doesn't even ask you to admire its writing, cinematography, or timing (to a degree.) It's not an "intellectual" engagement. Ted Lasso (the show) is immediately familiar as "goodness." It's not attempting to upset your relationship with expectation; either for an emotional reaction, or to make you seriously, and immediately, consider what's happening. Which I think is what a lot of comedies are facing up to more and more. They're not "challenging" they're "relief-from." I wouldn't say escapism, which is something that's talked about in other media (film and books, a lot, and something I think ostensibly involves imagination, or imagining "another") but Ted Lasso and these shows have a comfort-food friendliness. And not even true friendliness, because they don't ask you for anything.

wormil
Sep 12, 2002

Hulk will smoke you!

I randomly started watching The Booth at the End (Prime) and binged S1 and 3/5 of S2 this afternoon. It's only ten 20 minute episodes. What a unique and interesting show. It's about a guy who sits in a diner booth all day, every day, and makes deals with people. You want something, you do something, and it happens. Want to fall in love, save your sick child, be happy, marry your true love, whatever; you tell him what you want and if you complete the task he gives you, you get what you ask for. There is no selling your soul, no catch, just complete a task. The less said the better but the tasks can be quite extreme, like torture, abandonment, but sometimes uplifting or kind. Often, figuring out how to do the task is more important or more difficult than the task itself. Always front and center is free will. You can choose to complete the task or not, or stop at any time.

GoGoGadgetChris
Mar 18, 2010


Bad Dog

Bly Manor isn't much but it's definitely one of Greg Sestero's top 2 performances

sad question
May 30, 2020


showbiz_liz posted:

I was deep in the fandom nonsense for Buffy back then and the Buffy fansites I went to were obsessive about following that stuff. From what I remember, when Angel started after season 3, it took some of the Buffy writer's room with it, which some people felt negatively affected the next couple of Buffy seasons. But Whedon was still the Buffy showrunner after Angel started. And then it looked like Buffy was going to end after five seasons, and Whedon started working on Firefly and it became his new baby, the thing he was going to do next... and then Buffy didn't end, it moved to a new network, which was almost unprecedented at the time, and seems to have been largely a power play by FOX against the WB.

Back then, showrunners didn't necessarily get to say "I want to tell a story in five seasons and then I'm wrapping it up" like they can now. That was a top-down decision. So the impression I get is, Joss Whedon thought Buffy was ending, made plans for that to happen, and then had sort of moved on from Buffy to Firefly mentally when it became clear the show was coming back after all. So he essentially handed it off to, yes, Marti Noxon, and he wrote the musical episode in season 6 as his swan song, although he stayed somewhat involved in the show until the end.

I remember it was Marti Noxon who became the showrunner because she ate a lot of poo poo for certain developments in season 6. She got blamed for what many people felt was a steep decline, although season 6's reputation has improved somewhat over time. The ire focused on her was probably undeserved, especially because I think even more of the writing staff had been bled off again before season 6, this time from Buffy to Firefly.

Yeah, I remember some of that season 6 backlash. I'm currently watching said season and it's not bad (I remember liking it as an angsty teen too). It's got an interesting depiction of a person in deep depression and villains being proto incels seems oddly prescient now. Magic as crack metaphor still doesn't really work though and I'm dreading the dumb poo poo with the wedding. I think season 7 is where the decline gets noticeable. Shorter season with less chaff (potentials) would have helped.

Now that you mention it, I do remember the mess with the network hopping. It made them stop crossovers for a while since they required jumping through a lot of hoops.

Big Bad Voodoo Lou posted:

If you want the complete series DVD box set, I'm selling it.
Thank you, but I'm okay with waiting for it to hit streaming

showbiz_liz
Jun 2, 2008


sad question posted:

Magic as crack metaphor still doesn't really work though and I'm dreading the dumb poo poo with the wedding.

Yeah, for me these two developments are where it went from "a darker version of the show but in an interesting way" to "let's make sure we torture every single one of our characters as much as possible, this show is now a no-happiness zone"

Shlomo Palestein
Apr 16, 2003






cryptoclastic posted:

I finished Ted Lasso, and it was definitely one of the best things I've seen this year. Does anyone who has watched it have any recommendations for other similar shows? The feel-good is just so wonderful.

If you haven't seen it, Schitt's Creek has a very good sort of sweet comfort to it after the first bit of the first season (when it's harder on the fish out of water thing)

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Mercury Ballistic
Nov 14, 2005

not gun related

Anyone watching utopia? I am 3 eps in. It's okay I guess?

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