Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Endorph
Jul 22, 2009


graces' writing is extremely dumb but its a very breezy kind of dumb that never gets in the way of the cast dynamics or gameplay, which is vastly preferable to vesperia imo

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

A Sometimes Food
Dec 8, 2010

I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING



We have to go through the butt Cheria.

Edit:Tales usually has good VA but they went so hard with Graces. Sophie, Malik and Richard's in particular kill it.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

REAL TOP DOG SHIT
We Have Unlocked Woke Junpei Mode
Fuck Up Cops 2020
Beloved Forums Poster
Evolved Heightened Level Junpei
Junpei Is Not Ironic And That Is Why He Is Good

How do you see the dynamic going between the Arise PCs so far?

Alphen/Shionne obviously gonna have a romance arc

but I can't predict anything beyond that

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012






Who dies to give the main character a power up in this game?

ApplesandOranges
Jun 22, 2012

He will know I am near when he hears the screams of my enemies.

RareAcumen posted:

Who dies to give the main character a power up in this game?

The main character.

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


Junpei posted:

How do you see the dynamic going between the Arise PCs so far?

Alphen/Shionne obviously gonna have a romance arc

but I can't predict anything beyond that

The thing that sticks out to me is that as far as we know, everyone has a strong stake in the setting and plot problems - Shionne is a Renan defector, Rinwell is a rebel fighter, Law is an actual cop who I guess turns coat for :reasons:. By comparison, Alphen... he has maybe the strongest personal stake in fighting Rena, but as far as what he actually brings to the table, he's essentially Shionne's muscle and bodyguard.

It reminds me of Rebirth in a good way, where Eugene is practically the main character and half the party has ties to the villains, and Veigue gets dragged into it by way of Claire just so he can be an uncultured viewpoint character that everyone else explains racism and politics to. The wildcard here is Alphen's amnesia, which means they'll probably reveal what his deal is later but only after they've got all the exposition in motion.

Really curious about the last two characters - I still feel like we're going to get another Renan, maybe someone who previously defected and joins bringing intel or resources.

Ethiser
Dec 31, 2011



ApplesandOranges posted:

The main character.

Finally, a character with ghost powers.

Sab Sabbington
Sep 18, 2016

In my restless dreams I see that town...

Flagstaff, Arizona


I'm playing through Berseria for the first time, my first Tales game since Abyss back on the Ps2, and I'm completely blown away by pretty much everything about it. I fell off on my first attempt to play it after a few hours, but I'm very glad I decided to give it another shot--getting access to more artes and playing on the highest difficulty available (Intense/Evil, atm, though I'll swap to Chaos when I can) definitely improved the overall experience, too, and made it feel less like a mindless button-masher.

The story and presentation is doing it for me the most, though. I love revenge stories, and it feels super rare for something to commit this hard to it. They don't hold back on the reality of it--people die, often, and the characters aren't painted as good people nor their actions always For Justice, Actually. I feel like a lesser story could have easily gone the route of having people just be 'knock out' or somehow incapacitated, leaving some ambiguity or possibility to reason it away (though there is ambiguity elsewhere, from what I can tell after my current 15 hours or so).

Did this installment land well with other people when it released, and is there a general consensus on the quality of the other modern Tales games?

Also: The cinematography is excellent, even with the in-engine cutscenes. Does anyone know if there's someone in particular who made that a reality? Or is it just broadly an aspect of the series?

Sab Sabbington fucked around with this message at 17:15 on May 27, 2021

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


The ambiguity is that Velvet is digging a hole for herself. Keep going, the story is no more evil and edgy than it is good and heroic.

Actual cinematography in Tales goes back to the PS2 but it had a sharp uptick in the PS3 era, which in Tales terms is still fairly recent. From what we've seen of the upcoming one it should be good on that count.

As for the last few:
Vesperia: Not very good. Goes for ambiguity but chokes incredibly hard.
Zestiria: A complete mess in every sense.
Xillia 2: Extremely experimental, controversial.
Xillia: Solid.
Graces: Dumb fun.

If you're willing to go further back with recommendations I'd put Xillia, Abyss, and Eternia at the top of the pile. Destiny is also good and a decent patch is forthcoming (no, not the one that's currently in "beta".)

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009


Berseria didn't sell amazingly but most Tales fans thought it was pretty good. The game before it, Zestiria, was very controversial and got a lot of criticism even from people who like it, and a lot of the staff was shuffled around after it, so Berseria was seen as a sort of 'make good' after a very uneven entry.

No other tales game really has the exact same tone as Berseria, it was most influenced by Abyss but you said you played that one, so. Of the other recent tales games, Xillia is solid but very much a typical JRPG in terms of morality, there's a bit of ambiguity with the villains but the finale is fairly rushed so it doesn't have much time to explore it. Graces is a very fun game but the writing is extremely straightforward and stupid, though it's also funny and manages to have the tone of a fun adventure story so it's not all bad writing-wise.

Chaotic Flame
May 31, 2009

So...

Caphi posted:

The ambiguity is that Velvet is digging a hole for herself. Keep going, the story is no more evil and edgy than it is good and heroic.

Actual cinematography in Tales goes back to the PS2 but it had a sharp uptick in the PS3 era, which in Tales terms is still fairly recent. From what we've seen of the upcoming one it should be good on that count.

As for the last few:
Vesperia: Not very good. Goes for ambiguity but chokes incredibly hard.
Zestiria: A complete mess in every sense.
Xillia 2: Extremely experimental, controversial.
Xillia: Solid.
Graces: Dumb fun.

If you're willing to go further back with recommendations I'd put Xillia, Abyss, and Eternia at the top of the pile. Destiny is also good and a decent patch is forthcoming (no, not the one that's currently in "beta".)

Care to expound?

The Colonel
Jun 8, 2013


I commute by bike!

Chaotic Flame posted:

Care to expound?

there's two teams working on destiny. one of them has been doing an "open source" approach with public releases anyone can contribute to which... i can sort of understand how you'd come to that approach after the weird history destiny tl patches have had but. it's kind of a weird way to approach translating any piece of art so i dunno how that's gonna work out in terms of keeping the script consistent in quality

there's another patch coming out that i think is taking a more standard approach to things and it seems pretty far along itself

Goodguy3
Aug 11, 2016

"What?! I'm not tangled up like this for fun, you know!"

Chaotic Flame posted:

Care to expound?

They mean this patch.

As of now all of Stahn and Leon's side in Tales of Destiny Director's cut have been translated. Most of Stahns was mostly machine translated, however, and is currently going through a proofreading phase. Leon's side I translated by playing through it start to finish so I'd always have context. While I did open a proofreading channel on the discord for that story, it hasn't seen as much activity.

The other team, Lumina Tales, is focusing on Tales of Destiny 2, with DC also being in the pipe.

Sharkitten
Jan 14, 2010



Poor loving rebirth

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


Big Arise articles dropped.

I guess the most visceral thing to lead with is the current four MAs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vly4BcO5VwE

Also, another arte screen.



There are a couple of tidbits buried in here. The first one is it tells you what usage count you're going towards, a little bit of quality of life. The second is where it says "Flamme Edge: Rising Phoenix." So Alphen has some sort of mechanic that changes his artes when the fire sword is active, a bit like Alvin's charge maybe.

Also, it is confirmed that in addition to three ground and three air arte slots, there is also an input to double each of them for a total of 12. The wording on this is a bit weird as usual but it sounds like the usual L1+whatever for a different slot.

Character details don't confirm that much new, though it turns out Rinwell's magic is a thing passed down in her family and not unique to her.

A good pack of setting details this month. The Renans have divided Dahna up with walls, each of which is its own territory, so the early game (at least) has a straightforward hook of taking down the ruler ("Surd(?)") of each territory.

It also gives us a clearer picture of what the exploitation of Dahna looks like. It seems like Rena is using Dahnan slaves to mine a different type of Astral Energy out of each territory, which is causing different environmental effects. In Calaglia, they're extracting fire elements, so the region is cold and inhospitable. In Cyslodia, it's light magic, making the territory lifeless and barren.

Oh yeah, and there are fantasy slurs now. Renans in Calaglia cruelly call Dahnans stone-arms because of the control gems(?) embedded in their arms to keep them under control. Dahnans call Renans bright-eyes because their eyes glow when they use magic.




This is a new ally, Zephyr, the leader of the Calaglia resistance who the party cooperates with to take down Balseph. (The article points out that some Dahnans oppose the resistance because it just brings the Renan boot down harder.)

e: it also say she "joins combat as a support member" which I'm guessing means he's an NPC like Seres at a point where you only have three playable characters anyway, seems neat and I kind of hope you get to fight with a pal in each segment

That's about all the stuff that jumped out at me, but here's the article if it's of interest to anyone. (There are multiple articles but these people and Famitsu look like the most comprehensive.)

Caphi fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Jun 1, 2021

Chaotic Flame
May 31, 2009

So...

Caphi posted:

Big Arise articles dropped.

I guess the most visceral thing to lead with is the current four MAs.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vly4BcO5VwE

Also, another arte screen.



There are a couple of tidbits buried in here. The first one is it tells you what usage count you're going towards, a little bit of quality of life. The second is where it says "Flamme Edge: Rising Phoenix." So Alphen has some sort of mechanic that changes his artes when the fire sword is active, a bit like Alvin's charge maybe.

Also, it is confirmed that in addition to three ground and three air arte slots, there is also an input to double each of them for a total of 12. The wording on this is a bit weird as usual but it sounds like the usual L1+whatever for a different slot.

Character details don't confirm that much new, though it turns out Rinwell's magic is a thing passed down in her family and not unique to her.

A good pack of setting details this month. The Renans have divided Dahna up with walls, each of which is its own territory, so the early game (at least) has a straightforward hook of taking down the ruler ("Surd(?)") of each territory.

It also gives us a clearer picture of what the exploitation of Dahna looks like. It seems like Rena is using Dahnan slaves to mine a different type of Astral Energy out of each territory, which is causing different environmental effects. In Calaglia, they're extracting fire elements, so the region is cold and inhospitable. In Cyslodia, it's light magic, making the territory lifeless and barren.

Oh yeah, and there are fantasy slurs now. Renans in Calaglia cruelly call Dahnans stone-arms because of the control gems(?) embedded in their arms to keep them under control. Dahnans call Renans bright-eyes because their eyes glow when they use magic.




This is a new ally, Zilfa, the leader of the Calaglia resistance who the party cooperates with to take down its Surd, named Piezo. (The article points out that some Dahnans oppose the resistance because it just brings the Renan boot down harder.)

That's about all the stuff that jumped out at me, but here's the article if it's of interest to anyone. (There are multiple articles but these people and Famitsu look like the most comprehensive.)

Those seem short and sweet so hoping we're getting multiple levels of MA like some previous titles

A Sometimes Food
Dec 8, 2010

I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING



There been any shots showing a bestiary screen? Preferably with lore or character comments? Tales is really inconsistent on these.

ApplesandOranges
Jun 22, 2012

He will know I am near when he hears the screams of my enemies.

New guy looks like first broad dude in a Tales party since... what, Malik?

A Sometimes Food
Dec 8, 2010

I AM THE STORM THAT IS APPROACHING



ApplesandOranges posted:

New guy looks like first broad dude in a Tales party since... what, Malik?

Gaius?

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


ApplesandOranges posted:

New guy looks like first broad dude in a Tales party since... what, Malik?

He's not actually a party member, I think he joins your party as a guest and fights with you though (edited that in later).

Tired Moritz
Mar 25, 2012

wish Lowtax would get tired of YOUR POSTS

(n o i c e)


is he the token old man

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

REAL TOP DOG SHIT
We Have Unlocked Woke Junpei Mode
Fuck Up Cops 2020
Beloved Forums Poster
Evolved Heightened Level Junpei
Junpei Is Not Ironic And That Is Why He Is Good

Hmmmm... both Efreet and Rem were on the starting worlds of both Eternia and Symphonia. Maybe it's a throwback to that? And there are gonna be two other regions we visit with them draining the wind and water energy, and then Rena has an abundance of Earth, Lightning, Ice and Dark energy.

RevolverDivider
Nov 12, 2016



Vesperia kinda sucks. Just at the end of Act 2 having never played it before and man does everything feel just slapped together with no real rhyme or reason. Even the combat is a mess with bosses not telegraphing combo breakers or how long the game locks every single interesting ability and basic quality of life feature behind skills. The game easily feels way worse then Graces or Xillia by a long shot.

At least Judith is kind of fun to play in a way that stands out.

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


Junpei posted:

Hmmmm... both Efreet and Rem were on the starting worlds of both Eternia and Symphonia. Maybe it's a throwback to that? And there are gonna be two other regions we visit with them draining the wind and water energy, and then Rena has an abundance of Earth, Lightning, Ice and Dark energy.

Surely they wouldn't do Eternia a third time.

RevolverDivider posted:

Vesperia kinda sucks. Just at the end of Act 2 having never played it before and man does everything feel just slapped together with no real rhyme or reason. Even the combat is a mess with bosses not telegraphing combo breakers or how long the game locks every single interesting ability and basic quality of life feature behind skills. The game easily feels way worse then Graces or Xillia by a long shot.

At least Judith is kind of fun to play in a way that stands out.

Yeah Vesperia just completely falls apart going into act 2 and barely puts itself back together for act 3.

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009


RevolverDivider posted:

Vesperia kinda sucks. Just at the end of Act 2 having never played it before and man does everything feel just slapped together with no real rhyme or reason. Even the combat is a mess with bosses not telegraphing combo breakers or how long the game locks every single interesting ability and basic quality of life feature behind skills. The game easily feels way worse then Graces or Xillia by a long shot.

At least Judith is kind of fun to play in a way that stands out.
all of these points are correct, yeah. once you do get every single qol thing the combat does feel pretty good, but boy is it a slog to get there for no real reason. id honestly wonder if the best method might not be downloading a save and doing ng+ with the skills unlocked.

edit: also if you havent played as her yet, patty is also one of the better playing characters.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

REAL TOP DOG SHIT
We Have Unlocked Woke Junpei Mode
Fuck Up Cops 2020
Beloved Forums Poster
Evolved Heightened Level Junpei
Junpei Is Not Ironic And That Is Why He Is Good

Caphi posted:

Surely they wouldn't do Eternia a third time.

I mean to be fair it has been literally 18 years since Symphonia, I wouldn't mind a new version of that, and it's clearly doing it's own thing, it's not a total rip-off of it or Eternia

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009


Actually, speaking of Eternia, it'd be interesting if 'joins combat as a support member' was closer to say, Ras/Chat/Max, where they're full party members that you can play as, just with somewhat limited artes.

If the combat's based around the assist system, at the very least I'd expect to get those filler party members before you have a full 4 person party? So Zilfa probably has assists at the very least.

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


Junpei posted:

I mean to be fair it has been literally 18 years since Symphonia, I wouldn't mind a new version of that, and it's clearly doing it's own thing, it's not a total rip-off of it or Eternia

The two-worlds spirits arrangement is a thing Symphonia copied from Eternia, and it didn't put a twist on it, it just removed all the actual interesting parts from the worldbuilding and forgot to account for there being two light-elemental spirits in Phantasia instead of one.

There's no reason to assume Arise will do that weirdly specific thing again, either, or that they'll pass up the chance to do territories drained of Celestian elements just to homage it. Especially since there's kind of an emphasis on Arise having standalone lore.

Endorph posted:

all of these points are correct, yeah. once you do get every single qol thing the combat does feel pretty good, but boy is it a slog to get there for no real reason. id honestly wonder if the best method might not be downloading a save and doing ng+ with the skills unlocked.

edit: also if you havent played as her yet, patty is also one of the better playing characters.

Flynn is actually a lot of fun. His artes are interesting and have good utility and variety. It's just too bad I'm kind of insulted by the way he joins you.

Caphi fucked around with this message at 22:53 on May 31, 2021

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009


Flynn and Patty both playing well makes it clear they were aware of some of the issues with Vesperia's combat, so its a shame the ps3 port couldnt make you get some of the qol skills way earlier.

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


Just Manual Cancel, they added it to the Battle Book so people can claim it's a basic technique now.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

REAL TOP DOG SHIT
We Have Unlocked Woke Junpei Mode
Fuck Up Cops 2020
Beloved Forums Poster
Evolved Heightened Level Junpei
Junpei Is Not Ironic And That Is Why He Is Good

I still think that Efreet might either have blessed, created, or is Alphen's sword

Vorik
Mar 27, 2014



Any boss fight footage for this new tales game? I played berseria years ago and the bosses were so disappointing.

Caphi
Jan 6, 2012

INCREDIBLE


Update: the friendly commander's English name is officially Zephyr. I'm updating my post.

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

REAL TOP DOG SHIT
We Have Unlocked Woke Junpei Mode
Fuck Up Cops 2020
Beloved Forums Poster
Evolved Heightened Level Junpei
Junpei Is Not Ironic And That Is Why He Is Good

100 days until Arise drops in English!

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009





two new party members

OneDeadman
Oct 16, 2010

[SUPERBIA]


I appreciate Tales putting in Katarina from Granblu into Tales as a guest char.

Phantasium
Dec 27, 2012



they both fuckin' rule

Endorph
Jul 22, 2009


this might actually be a tales party where the the oldest party member is female too, for the first time since destiny 2

RareAcumen
Dec 28, 2012






Finally, a handsome man in the party.

It's been so long since Graces.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Junpei
Oct 4, 2015

REAL TOP DOG SHIT
We Have Unlocked Woke Junpei Mode
Fuck Up Cops 2020
Beloved Forums Poster
Evolved Heightened Level Junpei
Junpei Is Not Ironic And That Is Why He Is Good

Redhead (something like "Doheleen Il Caris"? Can't be sure on the spelling...) is a staff user, but like a martial arts staff user, all Wukong-y

Captain ("Kisara") is shield and mace

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply