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tater_salad posted:You could just what? How often are you rewiring a line? It's not like you can upsize a circuit either unless the conduit is oversized (which a builder wouldn't do). I mean I guess if you cut a wire too short you could pull a new one maybe depending on bends etc. You also can't run cable line Ethernet or other LV stuff in tht same conduit. As far as upsizing circuits, I have no need right now, but I've never lived in a house where the conduits were filled to capacity? Like the time my microwave kept blowing a breaker because everything in the kitchen was on a 15 amp breaker (that house was built in 1920), so I was easily able to run a new 20amp circuit to that outlet. I'm not sure if that's a product of Chicago electric code or just the age of my various houses, but there's always plenty of pipe available.
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Nov 29, 2021 04:25
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Wiring Thread: There's always plenty of pipe available
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Nov 29, 2021 18:39
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GEMorris posted:Wiring Thread: There's always plenty of pipe available Luckily for me, this was both false and true. I had to pull some new wire through an existing 1/2" conduit to be able to feed a subpanel, but in the process of doing so the conduit got so loving jammed up that nothing would pull from either side. Nothing like pulling as hard as I can on three solid 12ga strands and just snapping them all. Tried compressed air, tried pulling either direction, tried forcing the issue with a fish tape, no dice. The lucky part is that there was also a 2" conduit that was way underfilled. It didn't get me all the way to where I needed the new wiring, but it did get me from the main panel on the house and under the concrete slab. So while there did need to be 50' of new conduit, it was at least all run in dirt and no concrete cutting / horizontal digging needed. Now I have a lifetime supply of leftover THHN.
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Nov 29, 2021 21:50
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Hoping to get a sanity check. I'm re-installing a direct-vent gas fireplace. The manual states it needs to be grounded. OK. The only connection is a green screw on the back of the unit. There is nothing else (i.e. no blower/fan). I'm not actually sure if/how the previous installer had it grounded. I see two options: 1) Bare wire from the screw to the face plate screw of the nearby receptacle with a ring connector or similar, or 2) Wire to pipe clamp on the gas line, which should go to ground at the meter. Even if it doesn't, it looks like the gas line is bonded to my water line. Am I looking at this right?
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Dec 1, 2021 19:21
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When filling conduit keep in mind that conductors should be derated after enough of them are in the conduit. Also conduit fill is calculated and there are tables available for it. It's not just how many ever you can jam in there.Jenkl posted:Hoping to get a sanity check. I would bond it to the gas line and verify that the gas line is bonded to your electrical panel. My old house has steel gas line and had steel water lines. The water lines were bonded to the gas lines and the electrical panel. When I replaced the water lines I had to move the bonding wire from the old steel water pipes to the gas pipes to maintain their bond as my new water piping is PEX. If you have a gas appliance with grounded electrical components, there's also a good chance that's acting as a bond for your gas system, but you should still get a properly sized bonding wire installed if you don't have one. SpartanIvy fucked around with this message at 19:38 on Dec 1, 2021 |
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Dec 1, 2021 19:33
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Wiring Thread: Now I have a lifetime supply of leftover THHN.
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Dec 1, 2021 19:39
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Seriously though the pricing on THHN spools below 500ft is absurd.
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Dec 1, 2021 19:40
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SpartanIvy posted:When filling conduit keep in mind that conductors should be derated after enough of them are in the conduit. Also conduit fill is calculated and there are tables available for it. It's not just how many ever you can jam in there. Thanks. I had everything open, so all the gas runs are black steel, except a couple copper spots, so no problems there. The gas is for heat only (furnace, two direct vent fireplaces). I can trace the bonding on the water lines back to the panel and to ground, and I can see at least one spot where the gas and water lines are bonded to each other, so I think I'm good to tackle it that way.
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Dec 1, 2021 19:53
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GEMorris posted:Seriously though the pricing on THHN spools below 500ft is absurd. I'm about to have to buy a 25ft spool of black to finish a project, I'm not too happy about it.
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Dec 4, 2021 03:11
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I finished up some rewiring work today by removing some old breakers from my panel that I had cut the wires for up in the attic last week and moved everything to new circuits. Well after getting everything back together and powered on I discovered that two of the four remaining original circuits no longer were providing power but showed as hot when I hit them with the non-contact voltage tester. Went up to the attic to look into the big junction box that contains all the remaining original wires of my house and discovered that when connecting the extension wires from the panel to the original wiring in my house, my electrician mixed up two of the neutrals, and I'd disconnected the swapped neutrals in the panel. It ended up being a quick fix where I just had to rewire the neutrals properly but I had that momentary panic of "This 30 minute project just turned into a whole weekend long project" when not all the lights turned back on in the house.
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Dec 4, 2021 23:43
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What does code say about doorbell wire (max 24 volts)? Can it be run on the exterior of a house? Does it need to be run through conduit? It turns out the previous owners of my house cut the doorbell wire not just at the doorbell, which would make sense, but at the porch level, which means it would have to be refished in a very un-fish-friendly house.
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Dec 5, 2021 05:23
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Arsenic Lupin posted:What does code say about doorbell wire (max 24 volts)? Can it be run on the exterior of a house? Does it need to be run through conduit? It turns out the previous owners of my house cut the doorbell wire not just at the doorbell, which would make sense, but at the porch level, which means it would have to be refished in a very un-fish-friendly house. as long as the cable's outdoor rated, it's fine. hard to find specifics about doorbells in the NEC, when it comes to low voltage, they're more concerned with fire alarms and signalling circuits. it'd be nice to protect that wire, obviously, but considering that the transformer secondary side usually is just sitting there on the panel with its terminals all exposed, i don't think it's an issue. looking at your predicament, i think you're being given the 'i don't want to do this' price by your electrician. honestly i would do the same!
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Dec 5, 2021 05:57
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GEMorris posted:Seriously though the pricing on THHN spools below 500ft is absurd. It really is. I could/"should" have wired one of the legs of a circuit in red but then I'd have spent more on two 100' spools and a possibility that I might run short versus one 500' spool in black and zero concerns about overusing it.
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Dec 5, 2021 06:07
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I'm going to be replacing the two outdoor light fixtures on each side of my garage door, as well as the one next to the front door. The front door fixture is covered completely, while the two garage fixtures can see inclement weather. I live in Phoenix FWIW, so typically we're talking occasional monsoon storm, but otherwise heat and dust. I'd like to use my Wago connectors because of how easy they have made my life, but I read that I'd need to put them in the Wago Gel box to make them damp/weather safe. It doesn't seem like I can get them easily though, so are there any other options for using the Wago's in this instance, or do I have to go back to standard wire nuts? Edit: I'd be putting them within the light junction box on each, and then silicon caulking around the fixture base plate. Just debating on whether what I have now could work, or if I should go pick up some DryConn's. Canned Sunshine fucked around with this message at 07:49 on Dec 5, 2021 |
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Dec 5, 2021 07:37
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Fellow Arizonan here and the only place I've ever seen waterproof connectors used is inside sprinkler valve boxes. I've never seen anything but standard wire connectors on outdoor wall fixtures at any house I've worked on.
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Dec 5, 2021 09:04
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Extant Artiodactyl posted:as long as the cable's outdoor rated, it's fine. hard to find specifics about doorbells in the NEC, when it comes to low voltage, they're more concerned with fire alarms and signalling circuits. it'd be nice to protect that wire, obviously, but considering that the transformer secondary side usually is just sitting there on the panel with its terminals all exposed, i don't think it's an issue. That's cool; if it's safe for me to do it, I'm good with that. e: It interests me that the electrician specifically called it "Belden wire" when talking about it to me and to his apprentice. I grew up in a town with a Belden factory, now closed. It was an auto-parts town, and all those factories are long closed. I grew up just calling it "doorbell wire"; it was what you used in My First Electric Project, as for 4-H. Arsenic Lupin fucked around with this message at 17:59 on Dec 5, 2021 |
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Dec 5, 2021 17:56
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Sous Videodrome posted:Each closet has a fixture that's already wired to switches that activate when the doors open. I just want to swap the old busted fluorescent fixtures out for an LED hard wired fixture but finding an 18-24" long fixture that isn't a massively bright shop light has been hard. Update on this project: I bought some 18" ge direct wire fixtures when I was at Home Depot https://www.homedepot.com/p/GE-18-in-Premium-LED-Direct-Wire-Under-Cabinet-Fixture-26764/206496239 They are UL Listed and grounded and light up instantly
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Dec 10, 2021 00:14
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I've got a single 15amp breaker that both my home office (with a NAS) and the garage are connected to. On occasion, I've overloaded that circuit when working in the garage - which really sucks because of the NAS in the office. Ideally I'd separate the two onto their own breakers, but that'd take a bunch of rewiring that I'm not ready to call someone in to do. Would upgrading the 15 amp breaker to a 30 amp breaker be another pathway to a more resilient circuit? Or is that just something that will burn my house down?
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Dec 10, 2021 05:32
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El Mero Mero posted:I've got a single 15amp breaker that both my home office (with a NAS) and the garage are connected to. On occasion, I've overloaded that circuit when working in the garage - which really sucks because of the NAS in the office.  that breaker protects the wire, which is not rated for 30 amps. You're stuck with 15A until you rewire.
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Dec 10, 2021 05:39
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El Mero Mero posted:I've got a single 15amp breaker that both my home office (with a NAS) and the garage are connected to. On occasion, I've overloaded that circuit when working in the garage - which really sucks because of the NAS in the office. That will burn your house down. Arsenic Lupin posted:What does code say about doorbell wire (max 24 volts)? Can it be run on the exterior of a house? Does it need to be run through conduit? It turns out the previous owners of my house cut the doorbell wire not just at the doorbell, which would make sense, but at the porch level, which means it would have to be refished in a very un-fish-friendly house. If it's less than 48 volts between conductors and isn't powering fire alarms, the NEC doesn't apply to it at all. Go hog-wild. I think there's something in there about "workmanlike installation" or something, maybe. Probably also something about maximum current? I'm pretty sure anything under 500VA just flat-out isn't electrical to the NEC.
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Dec 10, 2021 06:53
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Dumb new homeowner question: How do people safely connect their Christmas lights outdoors? My neighborhood is full of older homes with no outdoor plugs, so I see a lot of extension cords run under garage doors out to the lawn for lights on bushes. My wife says her dad did the same and just wrapped the connections in electrical tape, but I can't imagine that protects it from the elements that well.
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Dec 10, 2021 06:55
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Insurrectum posted:Dumb new homeowner question: How do people safely connect their Christmas lights outdoors? My neighborhood is full of older homes with no outdoor plugs, so I see a lot of extension cords run under garage doors out to the lawn for lights on bushes. My wife says her dad did the same and just wrapped the connections in electrical tape, but I can't imagine that protects it from the elements that well. Real answer: shopping bags over the connectors with packing tape sealing them to the cords on either side. Is it pretty? No. Is it safe? Not entirely. But it demonstrably is what people do. You can and should put GFCI inline. You can get ones that work like power strips, with a plug on one and one or more receptacles on the other, or you could replace the outlet you’re running from.
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Dec 10, 2021 07:18
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Insurrectum posted:Dumb new homeowner question: How do people safely connect their Christmas lights outdoors? My neighborhood is full of older homes with no outdoor plugs, so I see a lot of extension cords run under garage doors out to the lawn for lights on bushes. My wife says her dad did the same and just wrapped the connections in electrical tape, but I can't imagine that protects it from the elements that well. I have mine going to a GFCI with an extension cord and a smart timer laying on the ground, no tape.. just plug in and leave it. I'm in an area that gets snow in the winter.. have yet to have a connection ground out. (Yes I"ve tested the GFCI)
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Dec 10, 2021 13:11
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El Mero Mero posted:I've got a single 15amp breaker that both my home office (with a NAS) and the garage are connected to. On occasion, I've overloaded that circuit when working in the garage - which really sucks because of the NAS in the office. As others have stated that is how most house fires start and how my PO almost burned my house down. Splitting the two rooms onto separate 15 amp breakers is definitely the most cost effective and also safe solution, but it sounds like that would be best left up to a professional for you.
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Dec 10, 2021 15:59
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Yeah, I just.. have them all run back to a GFCI. With standard Christmas light plugs you'll never get them all sealed, and unless they are underwater, drips from rain or other moisture probably won't complete a circuit to ground. I can recall maybe one year there was enough rain to trip it.
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Dec 10, 2021 16:01
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El Mero Mero posted:I've got a single 15amp breaker that both my home office (with a NAS) and the garage are connected to. On occasion, I've overloaded that circuit when working in the garage - which really sucks because of the NAS in the office. Why not get a UPS?
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Dec 10, 2021 16:02
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Guy Axlerod posted:Why not get a UPS? This seems way less likely to burn your house down. For extension cords outside, I've seen some little things at Menards that are a little plastic container you put the plug ends into where they meet and it supposedly protects them from the elements.
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Dec 10, 2021 16:30
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SpartanIvy posted:As others have stated that is how most house fires start and how my PO almost burned my house down. babyeatingpsychopath posted:That will burn your house down. Well fine, i never even wanted to really do it anyway sheeeeesh  Guy Axlerod posted:Why not get a UPS? Yeah. I'm gonna do this also, but that doesn't necessarily do anything about the overloading. I think the long term plan will be to just put this one on the "when i next remodel" list
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Dec 11, 2021 05:13
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So I bought this GFCI adaptor to be used in my garage for my Christmas lights, but it turns out my garage outlet is 2-prong and thus it doesn't work without a 2-to-3 prong adaptor. Am I correct that a GFCI outlet doesn't actually need the outlet to be grounded to provide ground fault protection? It seems like the standard advice to update 2-prong outlets without rewiring is to install a GFCI outlet in its place. My thinking now is outlet -> 2 to 3 prong adaptor -> plug-in GFCI adaptor -> extension cord -> outdoor lights. On a scale of 1-10 for bad ideas, how bad is this?
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Dec 11, 2021 06:05
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Insurrectum posted:So I bought this GFCI adaptor to be used in my garage for my Christmas lights, but it turns out my garage outlet is 2-prong and thus it doesn't work without a 2-to-3 prong adaptor. Am I correct that a GFCI outlet doesn't actually need the outlet to be grounded to provide ground fault protection? It seems like the standard advice to update 2-prong outlets without rewiring is to install a GFCI outlet in its place. My thinking now is outlet -> 2 to 3 prong adaptor -> plug-in GFCI adaptor -> extension cord -> outdoor lights. On a scale of 1-10 for bad ideas, how bad is this? It doesn’t need a ground wire to do its job. It’s looking for a mismatch in current between hot and neutral. This residual current could flow through the ground wire, or it could pass through the mud & rocks ground, or anything else that completes a circuit other than the way it’s supposed to be completed, through the neutral wire. For equipment designed to be grounded, it is somewhat safer to have the ground wire there than not, even with GFCI, but Christmas lights don’t use a ground wire anyway, so you’re not losing anything there. This is a solid one out of ten, not a bad idea at all.
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Dec 11, 2021 06:17
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 The antivax congressman from KY is proud of this abomination e: the biggest problem here is that he appears to be using a 3-phase AC breaker to switch high current DC loads, which is a huge no-no because you need entirely different arc chute designs to quench DC. It's eventually going to blow up in his face when he tries to turn it off, and never mind the total lack of enclosure. shame on an IGA fucked around with this message at 14:50 on Dec 12, 2021 |
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Dec 12, 2021 14:45
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Don’t most larger molded case circuit breakers have both AC and DC ratings/curves? I can’t see the specific model on that 3 pole but that’s been my experience.
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Dec 12, 2021 15:40
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shame on an IGA posted:
it definitely looks like one bad break could kill the thing and possibly everyone near it. for solar-integrated home batteries, the most capacity right now is generac with 18kwh capacity and 9kwh continuous in a full (enclosed!) cabinet which you can get a couple of to up the capacity to 36kwh. i'm thinking theres a reason that even though we have these 70kwh+ batteries, we dont use them as permanent installations to power houses. there already aren't a ton of code requirements for these (some counties want you to build a fire-rated enclosure around the battery system though) and i'm not sure there will be until Something Bad happens.
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Dec 12, 2021 15:53
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Extant Artiodactyl posted:it definitely looks like one bad break could kill the thing and possibly everyone near it. for solar-integrated home batteries, the most capacity right now is generac with 18kwh capacity and 9kwh continuous in a full (enclosed!) cabinet which you can get a couple of to up the capacity to 36kwh. i'm thinking theres a reason that even though we have these 70kwh+ batteries, we dont use them as permanent installations to power houses. there already aren't a ton of code requirements for these (some counties want you to build a fire-rated enclosure around the battery system though) and i'm not sure there will be until Something Bad happens. With the temperatures those batteries burn at as well as what it takes to extinguish them I'd want a detached precast concrete shed. Preferably with enough water to fill it twice over using nothing other than gravity.
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Dec 12, 2021 16:19
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Motronic posted:With the temperatures those batteries burn at as well as what it takes to extinguish them I'd want a detached precast concrete shed. Preferably with enough water to fill it twice over using nothing other than gravity. For lithium batteries you really want sand. Once the reaction is going you really can't do anything other than let it burn out.
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Dec 12, 2021 16:39
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Danhenge posted:For lithium batteries you really want sand. Once the reaction is going you really can't do anything other than let it burn out. What you really want is class D fire retardant, not sand which will pick up water and cause its own issues. This is not economically feasible, requires annual maintenance, etc. Which is why the standard way to put these fires out is, in the fire department lingo, "copious amount of water".
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Dec 12, 2021 16:55
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Hed posted:Don’t most larger molded case circuit breakers have both AC and DC ratings/curves? That's my experience as well. Usually you need to route it through multiple poles in series to get more air gap (which looks like that's being done here), but you'd need to do that anyway if the breaker monitors phase imbalance. IMO I'd be concerned about the apparent lack of cooling, particularly with them sandwiched together like that. I thought Tesla cars had active cooling plates that went over the batteries...
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Dec 12, 2021 17:20
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As was gently suggested upthread, I've realized my electrician's proposal for replacing the doorbell wire was a hint at "I don't think this job is worth my time." (2 men, one day) This seems like a thing I can fix myself, with a tolerance for crawlspaces, spiders in my hair, and drilling poo poo. I have one major question: How do I figure out which breaker the transformer is on? It's not like there's a socket I can plug a multitester into.
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Dec 12, 2021 20:29
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I'm no electrician, but can you have someone ring the doorbell (or tape a pebble over it or something) and flip breakers until it stops ringing?
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Dec 12, 2021 21:02
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i like nice words
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Anne Whateley posted:I'm no electrician, but can you have someone ring the doorbell (or tape a pebble over it or something) and flip breakers until it stops ringing? No, the whole problem is that the previous owner removed the doorbell and cut the wire at porch level; I need to run a new wire so I can mount a new doorbell.
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Dec 12, 2021 21:42
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