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Hemp Knight
Sep 26, 2004


Zimadori Zinger posted:

It wasn't so much that the middle was necessarily bad, but for fucks sake it was after the cliffhanger with Blaine. They get off, settle down, and Roland tells a story that takes up pretty much 7/8ths of the book with little to no progression towards the Tower until the end? Ugh.

If it didn't rip you completely away from the quest for the Tower, and was maybe told in interspersed flashbacks while they kept moving (like how he did it in Gunslinger, and kind of LOST style), I wouldn't have felt so bored and ultimately annoyed with it. He definitely could have trimmed off more than half of Roland's flashback.

IMHO, the Blaine resolution was a bit of an anticlimax, and the coda part with Roland and co was certainly a waste (King must have run out of inspiration for this part). The Tick-Tock Man, who was set up to be an awesome foil for Roland, got killed as an afterthought, and Flagg was a bit of a pussy. (Though I suppose it was a warning for what was to come in DT 5-7).

As for the flashback, perhaps it would have been better in chunks rather than two near-consecutive sections, but I thought it was one of Kings better works nevertheless. We get a much needed look at Alain and Cuthbert, that bit with Roland's journey in the glass after the showdown with Jonas and co is pure awesomeness and sets up his obession in DT1-3 perfectly, and the Susan storyline is handled perfectly.

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The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Fun Shoe

I actually liked the Dreamcatcher novel but didn't really care for the movie. I think King's main problem is that it's hard for him to vary up his quirky dialogue/characterization roles that's become so accustomed to. You either really like this style or get bored of it after awhile. I didn't care for Rose Madder and Songs of Suzannah, I think they were easily his worst books.

lamb SAUCE
Nov 1, 2005

Ooh, racist.

The Gunslinger posted:

I didn't care for Rose Madder and Songs of Suzannah, I think they were easily his worst books.

I blew through Susannah, and honestly the only part I enjoyed was the shootout Roland and Eddie had after they went through the door.

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Fun Shoe

Zimadori Zinger posted:

I blew through Susannah, and honestly the only part I enjoyed was the shootout Roland and Eddie had after they went through the door.

People poo poo on Wolves of the Calla quite a bit, I think mainly for the whole Roland dancing thing but I thought it was worlds better than the last two books. In general King has always been really hit or miss and I don't care for the magical retard plot devices that been in far too many of his books. To be fair though, when you've put out as much work as this guy has, some of it is going to be bad or at least not resonate with the reader like previous works did.

Ballsworthy
Apr 30, 2008

yup

The Gunslinger posted:

People poo poo on Wolves of the Calla quite a bit, I think mainly for the whole Roland dancing thing but I thought it was worlds better than the last two books. In general King has always been really hit or miss and I don't care for the magical retard plot devices that been in far too many of his books. To be fair though, when you've put out as much work as this guy has, some of it is going to be bad or at least not resonate with the reader like previous works did.

I don't care about Roland dancing, I poo poo on it for Dr Doom and Lightsabers and the loving Golden Snitch. I didn't read any of his stuff that was published after that and I'm not going to. gently caress you right back, Mr King.

On a side note, I think he's got pretty excellent taste in fiction and when I pick up a book that he has praised I'm virtually certain to enjoy the hell out of that book.

Kal Torak
Jul 17, 2003

When Giles sends me on a mission, he says "please". And afterwards I get a cookie.

Song of Susannah is the absolute worst thing King has ever written.

Wizard and Glass is the absolute best thing King has ever written.

Mister Kingdom
Dec 14, 2005

And the tears that fall
On the city wall
Will fade away
With the rays of morning light

Ballsworthy posted:

I don't care about Roland dancing, I poo poo on it for Dr Doom and Lightsabers and the loving Golden Snitch. I didn't read any of his stuff that was published after that and I'm not going to. gently caress you right back, Mr King.

I would be willing to bet big money that if King had not been in that accident and continued writing the DT saga, he wouldn't have put all those modern references in the story. The other stuff, like "Hey Jude" and the "ancient" gas station stuff was fine because it was just bits and pieces. Tying his own works together was one thing, tying other people's works together was something else entirely.

Slackerish
Jan 1, 2007

Hail Boognish


Women's Rights? posted:

Okay I was thinking on this, and I got it: The Girl Who Loved Tom Gordon. It is the only Stephen King book that I've only read once because it was so fuckin' dull I put it on the shelf the second I was finished with it and never looked back. I don't remember any details of the book (Girl gets lost, girl hallucinates Tom Gordon walking with her, girl kills a bear? I think?) all I remember is that I hated it when I was reading it.

Seconding this. I've only read a small portion of King's stuff, but this book was seriously some of the dullest poo poo I've ever read. I think I was like 12 when I read it and still found it to be completely trite and silly.

muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005



Ballsworthy posted:

I don't care about Roland dancing, I poo poo on it for Dr Doom and Lightsabers and the loving Golden Snitch. I didn't read any of his stuff that was published after that and I'm not going to. gently caress you right back, Mr King.

When I got to the Dr Doom and Harry Potter talk I literally said "what the gently caress?" out loud. The last books really suffered because he felt like he was forced to write them instead of just writing when he had the story in his head.

Ballsworthy
Apr 30, 2008

yup

muscles like this? posted:

When I got to the Dr Doom and Harry Potter talk I literally said "what the gently caress?" out loud. The last books really suffered because he felt like he was forced to write them instead of just writing when he had the story in his head.

The worst part is that it's just a ripoff of Heinlein's World-As-Myth bullshit, which sucked the first time around.

Actually, that's kind of interesting, because I finally decided Heinlein had gone completely off the deep end when Laz started rubbing shoulders (and god knows what else) with John Carter of Mars.

egon_beeblebrox
Feb 29, 2008

WILL AMOUNT TO NOTHING IN LIFE.



cheerfullydrab posted:

Insomnia is awesome. The answer to the question posed in this thread is always going to be Cell. Cell is absolutely horrible. If I read a Stephen King book or story that I don't think is that good, I can at least say "Hey, this is still better than Cell!"

That's exactly how I feel. I refuse to read anything of his published after Cell, but still have a few of his older books to read.

Also, The Dark Tower is pretty gently caress-awful. The first four books were great, the fifth was okay, and the last two were just terrible.

Insomnia really was awesome.

ConfusedUs
Feb 24, 2004

Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!


egon_beeblebrox posted:

That's exactly how I feel. I refuse to read anything of his published after Cell, but still have a few of his older books to read.

Duma Key is rad. You're missing out.

muscles like this!
Jan 17, 2005



ConfusedUs posted:

Duma Key is rad. You're missing out.

ehhhhhhhhh

I didn't like the main character who was a rich older gentleman who was recovering from a traumatic accident. Gee, I wonder where you got the inspiration for that Steve?

I know the car accident was pretty horrible for him but he just keeps on writing about it and I'm getting tired of it overshadowing his stories.

Wrojin
Nov 10, 2008

Quixoticist

I've been "missing out" on King for the past twenty years, since I threw The Tommyknockers against the wall. I liked him at first---I read him when he first started with Carrie, then he turned into a drunk and no one edited his books anymore. This is a sad comment on the people around him who allowed him to be a drunk, lovely writer as long as the money kept rolling in.

I don't think I've missed much. I saw Dreamcatchers and it was awful: that whole story was a monster that crawled out of his rear end. I saw The Mist---utter garbage. I don't hate the guy; I even feel a bit sorry for him because he works so hard and mostly fails to write anything good.

Zeff Clancy
Nov 25, 2007


Are we counting his Richard Bachman work? Thinner was interesting for the first fifty pages, then got tiresome, then got a little interesting again, and then had such a bad ending that I dropped the book on the floor and yelled at it. I had just previously finished The Dead Zone, and the sudden drop in quality really threw me.

The Saddest Robot
Apr 17, 2007


Easily Dreamcatcher. The novel was poo poo through and through. The Dark Tower books after The Wizard and Glass vary from disappointing to bad but I didn't think they were awful on the level that Dreamcatcher was.

ConfusedUs
Feb 24, 2004

Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!


Wrojin posted:

I saw The Mist---

The short story is wonderful.

racecardriver
Apr 27, 2009


ConfusedUs posted:

The short story is wonderful.

Seconded. I liked the movie, though, as well. Thought it was extremely entertaining.

pile of brown
Dec 31, 2004


Ballsworthy posted:

The worst part is that it's just a ripoff of Heinlein's World-As-Myth bullshit, which sucked the first time around.

I agree with this except for the scene in whichever book where three Jubal Harshaws are sitting around a table and ordering around servant girls

Julia Trillard
Apr 19, 2009

YOLO CARBON PRINCESS

racecardriver posted:

Seconded. I liked the movie, though, as well. Thought it was extremely entertaining.

Definitely. Short story was great, and the movie was good, certainly one of the best King adaptations - though for the most part that's not saying much.

Adar
Jul 27, 2001

by R. Guyovich


The movie got ruined by Darabont's ending but was otherwise exactly the way I've always envisioned the short story in my head. The short story itself is tied for my favorite King book with the Long Walk, which Darabont is doing next/I'm kinda looking forward to because TLW can only be shot as a B movie.

Dreamcatcher/DT V-VII are by far the worst of his books - nothing he wrote before the accident is in the same league.

spixxor
Feb 4, 2009


Lisey's Story without a doubt. I had to rally struggle to finish that book and felt amazingly relieved when it was over. Just an awful, boring book. Most of his other work is either awesome (Pet Sematary, The Stand, The Green Mile, all his short story books) or mediocre (Cell, Dreamcatcher, Bag of Bones) but poo poo, that book was awful.

Christabel
Apr 18, 2003

The Edge... there is no honest way to explain it because the only people who really know where it is are the ones who have gone over.

From a Buick 8. It was the very first time I had been completely let down by a Stephen King book, so maybe that's why I think of it as the worst. Sure, Gerald's Game and Dolores Claiborne were a bit crap, but I was trapped on a plane with an eagerly anticipated book that the more I read, the more I felt a bit ill. There were no redeeming features in this story at all.

In the meantime, I quite happily read Cell and even Lisey's Story. I have not finished Duma Key. I just can't. It's so bad. Haunted arm paintings. Jesus.

Ballsworthy
Apr 30, 2008

yup

Hennergy posted:

Short story was great, and the movie was good, certainly one of the best King adaptations - though for the most part that's not saying much.

Well, it's no Maximum Overdrive...

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Fun Shoe

Adar posted:

The movie got ruined by Darabont's ending but was otherwise exactly the way I've always envisioned the short story in my head. The short story itself is tied for my favorite King book with the Long Walk, which Darabont is doing next/I'm kinda looking forward to because TLW can only be shot as a B movie.

Dreamcatcher/DT V-VII are by far the worst of his books - nothing he wrote before the accident is in the same league.

Darabont's ending wasn't horribly far off the mark. They were sitting around in a hotel room running out of supplies without any hope, their car had run out of gas and they could still hear the massive things walking around outside. The character is even contemplating suicide or something if I recall correctly.

Stephen King writes amazing short stories, anyone who hates his novels should check out the collections he does. The Jaunt and Dolan's Cadillac are pretty awesome.

Alaan
May 24, 2005



The Gunslinger posted:

Darabont's ending wasn't horribly far off the mark. They were sitting around in a hotel room running out of supplies without any hope, their car had run out of gas and they could still hear the massive things walking around outside. The character is even contemplating suicide or something if I recall correctly.

Stephen King writes amazing short stories, anyone who hates his novels should check out the collections he does. The Jaunt and Dolan's Cadillac are pretty awesome.

I never got into any novel length King, but I did enjoy most of the stories in Nightmares & Dreamscapes. Dolan's Cadilac was good. I loved Umney's Last Case.

Tuxedo Catfish
Mar 17, 2007

You've got guts! Come to my village, I'll buy you lunch.


Adar posted:

The movie got ruined by Darabont's ending but was otherwise exactly the way I've always envisioned the short story in my head.

You know, without saying that it necessarily matters one way or another, King loved the ending and was quoted somewhere saying that he wished he'd thought of it himself.

Julia Trillard
Apr 19, 2009

YOLO CARBON PRINCESS

I preferred the hopelessness of the originals ending. The changed ending has a little of that, but it's still like IT'S OKAY EVERYONE, THE UNSTOPPABLE MIGHT OF THE U.S. ARMY HAS DEFEATED THE MIST, IT'S OKAY (EXCEPT EVERYONE YOU LOVE IS DEAD, SORRY)

Adar
Jul 27, 2001

by R. Guyovich


The Gunslinger posted:

Darabont's ending wasn't horribly far off the mark. They were sitting around in a hotel room running out of supplies without any hope, their car had run out of gas and they could still hear the massive things walking around outside. The character is even contemplating suicide or something if I recall correctly.

Hennergy posted:

I preferred the hopelessness of the originals ending.
Have you guys reread The Mist recently?

One word is Hartford. The other is hope.

I mean, yeah, it's not a happy ending by any means, but it's not the total pit of despair that you're making it out to be. (Okay, pretty close. But the point was that we don't know what happened.)

I did read King's comments, and it's hard to disagree with the story's author, but let's just say I do and leave it at that

Adar fucked around with this message at 16:22 on May 8, 2009

Death Hamster
Aug 21, 2007
Is this a two-bagger I see before me?

Adar posted:

Have you guys reread The Mist recently?

One word is Hartford. The other is hope.

I mean, yeah, it's not a happy ending by any means, but it's not the total pit of despair that you're making it out to be. (Okay, pretty close. But the point was that we don't know what happened.)

I did read King's comments, and it's hard to disagree with the story's author, but let's just say I do and leave it at that

I agree, I didn't like the movie's ending because they were striving to survive all through the events of the film and then just gave up. I think it would have been a better ending for the monsters to have eaten them all as they strove to survive to the last man/woman. It would have been more "in-character" at least.

The Gunslinger
Jul 24, 2004

Do not forget the face of your father.

Fun Shoe

Adar posted:

Have you guys reread The Mist recently?

One word is Hartford. The other is hope.

I mean, yeah, it's not a happy ending by any means, but it's not the total pit of despair that you're making it out to be. (Okay, pretty close. But the point was that we don't know what happened.)

Yeah there was that but without any way of getting there well...

Uncle Boogeyman
Jul 22, 2007



Death Hamster posted:

I agree, I didn't like the movie's ending because they were striving to survive all through the events of the film and then just gave up. I think it would have been a better ending for the monsters to have eaten them all as they strove to survive to the last man/woman. It would have been more "in-character" at least.

That would be a loving terrible ending. Do you really think it would be more in character for the lead character to allow his son to be eaten alive?

Death Hamster
Aug 21, 2007
Is this a two-bagger I see before me?

LtKenFrankenstein posted:

That would be a loving terrible ending. Do you really think it would be more in character for the lead character to allow his son to be eaten alive?

Yes. Yes I do. I think it would be more in character for them to strive to the very end, because that's what the whole movie entails up to that point. To just give up at the end seemed incongruous to me. I didn't think the movie was terrible, the ending just didn't seem to jibe with the rest of the film. However, by no means do I think they should have ended it with everyone happy and safe.

General Ledger
Dec 23, 2007

COYI

Just finished Tommyknockers yesterday night. I though it was at least good, not as good as IT or the The Stand by any means, but certainly good. Best part was that i didnt feel it the lack-lustre ending that many of his works suffer from.

The gadget making throughout and final zap-gunning of some of the Tommyknockers was excellent, and i loved the IT references two thirds in.

Regarding plot specifics, I was wondering, was there a suggestion that The ship was influencing or channelling the dead as well as the living? Early on when the television bomb is planted and blows the house up, was Jesus's reference to Brillo cream, and eventually talking like the postman's housewife's dead father in fact her father plus Tommyknocker gadget knowledge? Similarly with Bobbie ghost helping Gard to aim the zap-gun at the smoke alarm.

Adar
Jul 27, 2001

by R. Guyovich


The Gunslinger posted:

Yeah there was that but without any way of getting there well...
They had another hundred miles' worth of gas

Dacap
Jul 8, 2008

ME BOSS
YOU NOT




So is it worth even starting the Dark Tower series? I had heard good things about The Gunslinger and a couple of the others, but I don't really want to read it if its just going to jerk me around in the end.

lamb SAUCE
Nov 1, 2005

Ooh, racist.

Dacap posted:

So is it worth even starting the Dark Tower series? I had heard good things about The Gunslinger and a couple of the others, but I don't really want to read it if its just going to jerk me around in the end.

Read up until book three or four, spoil the rest for yourself. Or make it up in your head, it will be better than what actually happens.

Romanshoes
Dec 15, 2007

Haha! They're Roman shoes! Aren't I witty?

Women's Rights? posted:

Okay I was thinking on this, and I got it: The Girl Who Loved Tom Gordon. It is the only Stephen King book that I've only read once because it was so fuckin' dull I put it on the shelf the second I was finished with it and never looked back. I don't remember any details of the book (Girl gets lost, girl hallucinates Tom Gordon walking with her, girl kills a bear? I think?) all I remember is that I hated it when I was reading it.

I fail to agree - I think it's one of his best. Although this opinion is slightly biased seeing as I first read it while camping in really deep woods and the day before a bear had spent almost an hour trying to get at our food supply. Goddamn bears.

Dreamcatcher was terrible, though.

ConfusedUs
Feb 24, 2004

Bees?
You want fucking bees?
Here you go!
ROLL INITIATIVE!!


Barrelfox posted:

Just finished Tommyknockers yesterday night. I though it was at least good, not as good as IT or the The Stand by any means, but certainly good. Best part was that i didnt feel it the lack-lustre ending that many of his works suffer from.

The gadget making throughout and final zap-gunning of some of the Tommyknockers was excellent, and i loved the IT references two thirds in.

Regarding plot specifics, I was wondering, was there a suggestion that The ship was influencing or channelling the dead as well as the living? Early on when the television bomb is planted and blows the house up, was Jesus's reference to Brillo cream, and eventually talking like the postman's housewife's dead father in fact her father plus Tommyknocker gadget knowledge? Similarly with Bobbie ghost helping Gard to aim the zap-gun at the smoke alarm.

I like the Tommyknockers. Quite a bit, actually. It drags pretty hard around the 1/3 mark, but it picks up steam pretty quickly after that. The gadgets are awesome, with the Coke machine being the best, and the exchange between the two cops is great. "Sir I have just discharged my weapon and killed a coke machine." "You didn't even fire a warning shot."

And it has one of King's best endings. It doesn't seem rushed or out of character for anyone. Yeah, it's somewhat ambiguous, but that's alright with me.

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Bloody Hedgehog
Dec 12, 2003

Gotta nuke something


I haven't read through the whole Dark Tower series yet, but I'm really disliking Wizard & Glass. Apart from the last quarter of the book when things start cooking, the majority of the book is some boring western bodice-ripper where nothing happens whatsoever. When I first started it I thought, "Alright, Roland will recount his past for a few chapters and then we'll be back in business.". And then it just keeps going and going and you slowly realize the whole book is about his past and some woman you don't really care about.

Such a shame too after The Wastelands. That book was kickass from the first page to the last. Blaine was awesome.

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