The Windows and Windows Software Megathread

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teethgrinder: Oct 9, 2002

Even just loading.

Anyway, sorry I should have been clearer that obviously SSDs are ideal for certain types of games. I just meant to suggest that some types of, even big AAA games, load just fine from modern mechanical drives. And you can budget a bit if you know where to install what.

But all that said, I had no idea 2 TB SSDs are actually kind of approaching reasonable now. It's still a lot more, but worth it if you can afford it.

Unfortunately I should be updating my ~8 year old computer, with a slightly more modern video card, but lol my partner hasn't worked since December and there's a mortgage to pay.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 04:45

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# ? Apr 26, 2024 16:00

tuyop: Sep 15, 2006; Every second that we're not growing BASIL is a second wasted; Fun Shoe

Kind of a weird question but what's my best option for virtualizing another Windows 10 machine from within Win10? On my MBP I just use Parallels but that's MacOS only, of course.

I'll be teaching fairly graphics-intensive stuff so virtualbox straight up doesn't work.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 15:44

GigaFuzz: Aug 10, 2009

tuyop posted:

Kind of a weird question but what's my best option for virtualizing another Windows 10 machine from within Win10? On my MBP I just use Parallels but that's MacOS only, of course.

I'll be teaching fairly graphics-intensive stuff so virtualbox straight up doesn't work.

Do you have Windows 10 Pro (or higher)? If so, you can turn on Hyper-V.

Edit: There's VMware Workstation Player, but that's only free for non-commercial stuff.

GigaFuzz fucked around with this message at 16:00 on Aug 6, 2020

# ? Aug 6, 2020 15:57

HalloKitty: Sep 30, 2005; Adjust the bass and let the Alpine blast

Lambert posted:

Absolutely not, HDDs are extremely slow.

Eh, if you're writing a large file, they'll beat a QLC SSD :v:

# ? Aug 6, 2020 16:56

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

tuyop posted:

Kind of a weird question but what's my best option for virtualizing another Windows 10 machine from within Win10? On my MBP I just use Parallels but that's MacOS only, of course.

I'll be teaching fairly graphics-intensive stuff so virtualbox straight up doesn't work.

Kinda curious what you would do that for. Why not just run two VMs of same system right from your host? You can do that.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 18:07

CatHorse: Jan 5, 2008

Fruits of the sea posted:

A blank installation of Windows takes up around 50 gb but it can vary depending on updates and what MS apps are installed. I've seen them bloat up to over 100 GB.

A blank Windows installation is about 15 Gb and can grow up to 30 gb

# ? Aug 6, 2020 18:13

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

That might have been true for Windows 7, but it certainly isn't true for Windows 10. I paid attention last time I reinstalled and my blank installations very definitely started at 30 to 45-ish GBs.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 18:20

tuyop: Sep 15, 2006; Every second that we're not growing BASIL is a second wasted; Fun Shoe

Cardiovorax posted:

Kinda curious what you would do that for. Why not just run two VMs of same system right from your host? You can do that.

I�m thinking of selling the MBP. Might replace it with a Mini but I thought I�d give the windows desktop workflow a go for awhile first. I have the desktop for games.

I use a VM to teach productivity software and general computer skills. The VM lets me show a stock system with the useless task view button and cortana button and search box and whatever other endless bullshit UI elements Microsoft tacks on to new installs this month. If we have identical systems it�s less confusing for my students and when I cycle a new class I just restore a snapshot and start again. It�s also the only way I�ve found to get Teams to screenshare ALL the UI elements. Like if I want to teach troubleshooting an installation that won�t boot, I can just share the VM window and it displays absolutely everything as a user actually encounters it.

It also keeps any personal notifications and stuff totally separate.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 19:49

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Oh, so you want to practice inside a Windows VM because you are planning to switch to a Windows system for your teaching hardware? Okay, I see what the point is, in that case. I think you don't particularly need to bother, though. I have extensively used most modern virtualization software under a number of different operating systems and except for some specific issues based on the host system, what you get on one is basically what you get on all of them. Running a VM inside of a VM is more likely to give you unusual and unexpected behaviours, if anything.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 19:58

Toast Museum: Dec 3, 2005; 30% Iron Chef

Cardiovorax posted:

Oh, so you want to practice inside a Windows VM because you are planning to switch to a Windows system for your teaching hardware?

I may be mistaken, but I think they're actually saying that they use a VM during instruction because it lets them show the students a standard, un-personalized system, because there absolutely are students who would be completely thrown off by something minor like icon placement changing between classes. Presenting a VM also avoids accidentally showing students personal stuff from the host computer. Their question doesn't involve nested VMs.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:00

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Ooh, yeah, I think I may have completely misread that, now that I look at that post again. I thought they were asking about the best way to virtualize a Windows 10 virtual machine from within a Windows 10 virtual machine, which just seemed really pointless to me. Sorry everyone!

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:02

tuyop: Sep 15, 2006; Every second that we're not growing BASIL is a second wasted; Fun Shoe

Toast Museum posted:

I may be mistaken, but I think they're actually saying that they use a VM during instruction because it lets them show the students a standard, un-personalized system, because there absolutely are students who would be completely thrown off by something minor like icon placement changing between classes. Presenting a VM also avoids accidentally showing students personal stuff from the host computer. Their question doesn't involve nested VMs.

Yeah it's this, and this is a clear way to explain it as well!

Cardiovorax posted:

Running a VM inside of a VM is more likely to give you unusual and unexpected behaviours, if anything.

I've had some fun times attempting this too, though! Turns out you're right that it definitely makes more sense to just spin up two separate machines on the host.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:19

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Yeah, I've done it before, there are actually some interesting benefits you can get from it. I set up a system once where multiple VMs existed and one had the sole and exclusive purpose of being a highly tuned and customized firewall exit node to the VM ecosystem that I had created on the host machine. Everything was routed through that VM. Through some virtualization and bridging trickery, I managed to even route host machine traffic through it. You can get a very clean and controlled environment that way, if your computer is powerful enough to pull it off.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:30

Weedle: May 31, 2006

the VM nerd vs. the VN nerd

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:31

LODGE NORTH: Jul 30, 2007

tuyop posted:

I�m thinking of selling the MBP. Might replace it with a Mini but I thought I�d give the windows desktop workflow a go for awhile first. I have the desktop for games.

I use a VM to teach productivity software and general computer skills. The VM lets me show a stock system with the useless task view button and cortana button and search box and whatever other endless bullshit UI elements Microsoft tacks on to new installs this month. If we have identical systems it�s less confusing for my students and when I cycle a new class I just restore a snapshot and start again. It�s also the only way I�ve found to get Teams to screenshare ALL the UI elements. Like if I want to teach troubleshooting an installation that won�t boot, I can just share the VM window and it displays absolutely everything as a user actually encounters it.

It also keeps any personal notifications and stuff totally separate.

Gonna swing a probably basic question out there, but why not just set up a barebones account in Windows and then switch back to your other one for notifications, games etc?

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:32

tuyop: Sep 15, 2006; Every second that we're not growing BASIL is a second wasted; Fun Shoe

LODGE NORTH posted:

Gonna swing a probably basic question out there, but why not just set up a barebones account in Windows and then switch back to your other one for notifications, games etc?

It's faster, in my experience so far, to just restore a snapshot than it is to completely restore a user account or to start a new one. I think this is mostly because there are a couple of things that are done to student computers that I'd have to do each time. Stuff like logging into 365, grabbing some exercise files, stuff like that. This is also portable so in the event that my work decides to modify my contract to make me use a work laptop for work, I can just get the VM going on that laptop and the student experience will be seamless beyond my endless complaining.

Oh, I forgot that I also usually use a dummy student account to demonstrate file access and stuff in the more "advanced" courses. So I'd have to juggle those 365 and sharepoint accounts and ew, you know?

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:37

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Weedle posted:

the VM nerd vs. the VN nerd

Just a bit of a miscommunication, is all. I would actually recommend trying that "router VM" thing to anyone who has reason to be highly security-conscious, because it allows you to do some things you can normally only pull off by actually having a separate physical device running to gate your local network from the outside world, the way corporate networks tend to do. It's like having your own personal VPN that all devices communicate through. Very, very hard for anyone to mess with without you being able to notice.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 21:37

Fame Douglas: Nov 20, 2013; by Fluffdaddy

tuyop posted:

Kind of a weird question but what's my best option for virtualizing another Windows 10 machine from within Win10? On my MBP I just use Parallels but that's MacOS only, of course.

I'll be teaching fairly graphics-intensive stuff so virtualbox straight up doesn't work.

Hyper-V that's built into Windows 10 Pro or Virtualbox if you want something similar to Parallels (you probably want the Virtualbox Extension Pack as well)

There's also Windows Sandbox if you just need ad-hoc virtualization that isn't permanent.

# ? Aug 6, 2020 22:46

mystes: May 31, 2006

Weedle posted:

the VM nerd vs. the VN nerd

I don't think you have the meme format quite right.

# ? Aug 7, 2020 00:51

CatHorse: Jan 5, 2008

Cardiovorax posted:

That might have been true for Windows 7, but it certainly isn't true for Windows 10. I paid attention last time I reinstalled and my blank installations very definitely started at 30 to 45-ish GBs.

Fresh Windows 10 2004

that was May iso.
EDIT: after updating to latest build and updating store apps. It grew to 22 gb.
EDIT2: after running all the stub store apps and so forcing them to fully install. It grew to 23 gb.
EDIT3: apparently clean installs now come with reserved storage enabled by default. On this install it shows as 7GB and surprise! the .vdi file is only 16GB.

notes:
1) those numbers include about 2gb of page/fast startup file.
2) Hidden City: Hidden object adventure is apparently a Pro app.

CatHorse fucked around with this message at 13:47 on Aug 7, 2020

# ? Aug 7, 2020 01:18

Ghostlight: Sep 25, 2009; maybe for one second you can pause; try to step into another person's perspective, and understand that a watermelon is cursing me

Hyper-V is really easy to use and built in so there's no reason not to.

# ? Aug 7, 2020 02:32

LRADIKAL: Jun 10, 2001; Fun Shoe

I run Windows on a 32GB EMMC on a tiny lovely little mini PC I bought years ago. Sometimes it will even let me put a USB stick in it to give it enough space to update.

# ? Aug 7, 2020 03:00

Fame Douglas: Nov 20, 2013; by Fluffdaddy

On very small drives, Windows 10 will also compress some system files to save space (at the expense of performance)

# ? Aug 7, 2020 09:37

CatHorse: Jan 5, 2008

Fame Douglas posted:

On very small drives, Windows 10 will also compress some system files to save space (at the expense of performance)

The performance impact is mostly during updates when it has to recompress files. Funny thing is that on emmc drives (they are slow) compressing executable files with the "new" xpress or lzx can be either neutral or even improve launch times.

# ? Aug 7, 2020 11:45

BastardAus: Jun 3, 2003; Chunder from Down Under

Have had to upgrade from 7 to 10, and it seems like it�s still free. Any watchouts for this process?

# ? Aug 7, 2020 14:20

Ynglaur: Oct 9, 2013; The Malta Conference, anyone?

I have a couple older games from GOG that only work in full screen and don't like virtual mice (screen flickers if Mouse Without Borders is used). Can such apps be installed in Hyper-V? Is there any disadvantage on the host OS to having Hyper-V installed/enabled?

# ? Aug 7, 2020 16:54

Fame Douglas: Nov 20, 2013; by Fluffdaddy

Enabling Hyper-V (or other virtualization-based features) means Windows will run under a Hypervisor. This does reduce overall performance a bit compared to something like VirtualBox.

# ? Aug 7, 2020 22:19

Ynglaur: Oct 9, 2013; The Malta Conference, anyone?

Fame Douglas posted:

Enabling Hyper-V (or other virtualization-based features) means Windows will run under a Hypervisor. This does reduce overall performance a bit compared to something like VirtualBox.

Thanks. I play games sometimes so I'll use VMware or something. I guess I'll need to buy another Win19 license, though maybe I can run WINE?

So old game on WINE on Linux VM on VMWare/VirtualBox on Windows 10. This will probably go well.

# ? Aug 8, 2020 01:05

The Lord Bude: May 23, 2007; ASK ME ABOUT MY SHITTY, BOUGIE INTERIOR DECORATING ADVICE

How old is the game exactly?

# ? Aug 8, 2020 02:00

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Ynglaur posted:

Thanks. I play games sometimes so I'll use VMware or something. I guess I'll need to buy another Win19 license, though maybe I can run WINE?

So old game on WINE on Linux VM on VMWare/VirtualBox on Windows 10. This will probably go well.

Wine is not really a virtualization, it's a sort of translation system from Windows system calls into Unix system calls. It's highly unstable and unrealiable even when using many common and older utility softwares. Games are already much more fickle even when you run them on the kind of OS they were made for. I would honestly not recommend this.

I would say to just use VirtualBox, but it has all of poo poo for 3D compability, which is why I switched to VMware to begin with. You can't really use it to play games all that well to begin with.

# ? Aug 8, 2020 09:38

Icept: Jul 11, 2001

Hi guys, I have a one year old girl who loves walking up and start hammering on the keyboard. I was thinking it would be fun if there was a program or an app that just sort of popped some random colors and maybe played some sounds.

My first thought was something like the old school Winamp plugin Milkdrop but I think that needed some music to be playing. Ideally it would just be launch -> ready to take input.

Anyone know of software like this? Web, local app, paid, unpaid it's all fine.

# ? Aug 8, 2020 12:20

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

I could recommend you a few things for Android tablets, if that is also an option? There are a few apps that do nothing but make pretty particles flash and swirl around your fingertips as you touch the screen. It's kind of relaxing.

# ? Aug 8, 2020 12:28

Icept: Jul 11, 2001

Yeah that would be awesome and come in handy down the road. I hope there is something for computers as well! The thought was more "look how good you are at open palm slamming the keys" rather than "take this and let me work" 😀

# ? Aug 8, 2020 13:10

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

Check out this developer page on Google Play, then: https://play.google.com/store/apps/dev?id=7421375278843971457&hl=en

I own Atomus HD and Triple A, they're both very simple apps in concept but it's strangely fun to play around with. Different combinations of touches and distances can make special patterns, so you can fumble around on the screen and suddenly you have a ~magical glowing butterfly~ which I'm sure is just grade-A entertainment for any little girl. It's very nice and flashy and requires nothing more complicated than patting the screen and watching what happens.

# ? Aug 8, 2020 13:41

Icept: Jul 11, 2001

That sounds really great! Thanks for that, I'll probably have to pick up a tablet for her sooner or later 🙂

# ? Aug 8, 2020 14:14

Cardiovorax: Jun 5, 2011; I mean, if you're a successful actress and you go out of the house in a skirt and without underwear, knowing that paparazzi are just waiting for opportunities like this and that it has happened many times before, then there's really nobody you can blame for it but yourself.

I hope she has fun with it!

# ? Aug 8, 2020 14:52

Ynglaur: Oct 9, 2013; The Malta Conference, anyone?

The Lord Bude posted:

How old is the game exactly?

Late 90s. Warlords 3: Darklords Rising (the TBS, not the RTS).

# ? Aug 8, 2020 17:32

The Lord Bude: May 23, 2007; ASK ME ABOUT MY SHITTY, BOUGIE INTERIOR DECORATING ADVICE

Ynglaur posted:

Late 90s. Warlords 3: Darklords Rising (the TBS, not the RTS).

That's old enough that it would run very easily in a VM.

# ? Aug 8, 2020 18:43

Uthor: Jul 9, 2006; Gummy Bear Heaven ... It's where I go when the world is too mean.

EDIT: Nevermind. Seem to have figured it out.

Uthor fucked around with this message at 20:21 on Aug 8, 2020

# ? Aug 8, 2020 20:16

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# ? Apr 26, 2024 16:00

Factor Mystic: Mar 20, 2006; Baby's First Post-Apocalyptic Fiction

Icept posted:

Hi guys, I have a one year old girl who loves walking up and start hammering on the keyboard. I was thinking it would be fun if there was a program or an app that just sort of popped some random colors and maybe played some sounds.

My first thought was something like the old school Winamp plugin Milkdrop but I think that needed some music to be playing. Ideally it would just be launch -> ready to take input.

Anyone know of software like this? Web, local app, paid, unpaid it's all fine.

https://www.hanselman.com/babysmash/

# ? Aug 8, 2020 23:28

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