Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us money per month for bills, and since we don't believe in showing ads to our users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
 
  • Post
  • Reply
Palladium
May 8, 2012


Nerds incessantly arguing that the $40 Hyper 212+ is (rightfully) an outdated and overpriced CPU cooler on Techpowerup forums seems incredibly sane versus audio woo

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



Palladium posted:

Nerds incessantly arguing that the $40 Hyper 212+ is (rightfully) an outdated and overpriced CPU cooler on Techpowerup forums seems incredibly sane versus audio woo

at least it isn’t pseudoscience

Dirt Road Junglist
Oct 8, 2010

There's a ghost in me
Who wants to say I'm sorry
Doesn't mean I'm sorry






BonHair posted:

A signal through a USB connection is 100% quantifiable. It's not like the overtones or whatever can be lost in transmission. Either the signal is good or it is corrupt. Digital audiophile stuff is really an amazing market. With any luck, it makes a slight high pitched noise while operating, effectively making the sound technically worse.

One of my favorite "gotcha" moments was going to the hifi shop with my parents when they were buying their first HDTV, and listening to the sales guy pitch them a hundred plus dollar HDMI cable to go with it with the usual, "The colors and sound and blah blah are better." I broke down the whole, "digital is just on or off signals, no gradation," and my dad galaxy brained right in the store.

Don't grift my family, assholes.

Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



Dirt Road Junglist posted:

One of my favorite "gotcha" moments was going to the hifi shop with my parents when they were buying their first HDTV, and listening to the sales guy pitch them a hundred plus dollar HDMI cable to go with it with the usual, "The colors and sound and blah blah are better." I broke down the whole, "digital is just on or off signals, no gradation," and my dad galaxy brained right in the store.

Don't grift my family, assholes.

that guy’s life was ruined because of you. he failed to make that bonus on your parents and then everything just spiraled from there......

Dirt Road Junglist
Oct 8, 2010

There's a ghost in me
Who wants to say I'm sorry
Doesn't mean I'm sorry






Ok Comboomer posted:

that guy’s life was ruined because of you. he failed to make that bonus on your parents and then everything just spiraled from there......

You make it sound like I did something bad.

Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



Dirt Road Junglist posted:

You make it sound like I did something bad.

hey man, that guy didn’t want to upsell HDMI cables. Just a working man who loved audio equipment...just wanted to sell people sensibly priced, well-performing Japanese HiFis back in the 80s and play smooth jazz on the side...then the whole industry changed out from under him. The CD came. The Japanese Miracle ended. The band broke up. Then the internet, and Napster. Now everybody wants an i-Pod.

Boss man riding him to make his quota...wife calling him a loser and threatening to run off to Cabo with the mailman as a cruel joke...and now here comes some snot nosed goon-faced little kid “from the internet” to ruin his loving pitch, in front of the boss no less! Also George W Bush is president. Oy Vey!

shortspecialbus
Feb 16, 2006

WOULD YOU ACCOMPANY ME ON A BRISK WALK? I WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK WITH YOU!!




Cable markup is insane. I worked at an ISP that had a small retail store, and we'd order LPR cables for about $1.00 each and sell them for $35.99

I maintain that's where electronics stores made most of their profit.

Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



You're not wrong. I knew somebody who worked at microcenter and they make all their money on cables and extended warranties. The employee discount lets you get anything at 5% over cost, which on actual hardware generally amounted to $0 discount.

Neurophonic
May 2, 2009


Fantastic Foreskin posted:

You're not wrong. I knew somebody who worked at microcenter and they make all their money on cables and extended warranties. The employee discount lets you get anything at 5% over cost, which on actual hardware generally amounted to $0 discount.

Yup. See printers, paper and ink for more of the same. If you’re selling a PC and you can’t get the customer to take tons of peripherals, you’re probably not making a dime.

Palladium
May 8, 2012


shortspecialbus posted:

Cable markup is insane. I worked at an ISP that had a small retail store, and we'd order LPR cables for about $1.00 each and sell them for $35.99

I maintain that's where electronics stores made most of their profit.

I bought 2.5" to 3.5" SSD brackets at retail that still had at least a 300% markup after a -33% haggling.

Only bought them since they are an expense claim under my employer.

Neurophonic posted:

Yup. See printers, paper and ink for more of the same. If you’re selling a PC and you can’t get the customer to take tons of peripherals, you’re probably not making a dime.

Casio/Brother label cartridges must be insane too, one cartridge alone is priced higher than the handheld printer

Palladium fucked around with this message at 04:08 on Jun 19, 2021

Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



Fantastic Foreskin posted:

You're not wrong. I knew somebody who worked at microcenter and they make all their money on cables and extended warranties. The employee discount lets you get anything at 5% over cost, which on actual hardware generally amounted to $0 discount.

yeah my hunch was always that the bulk of their profit came from stuff like cables and accessories and those $10 keyboards that probably cost them like $0.25 a unit.

Sort of like how your average casual restaurant makes all of their money in drinks.

Wasabi the J
Jan 23, 2008


Increasingly I think I would spend thousands on building my own speakers for the hell of it as my halo system.

I love experimental poo poo and the science behind it, but after a few hundred bucks, it's just paying for the marketing -- and I'm not interested in being some kind of golden ear, so why not take a shot at making something that's going to at least be "good enough" and fully custom?

There's a cutout above my TV/fireplace wall that I daydream about turning into a huge speaker array.

qirex
Feb 15, 2001



Big fan of the blind pulls lining up in a way that it looks like your TV is held up by string.

Josh Lyman
May 24, 2009



Palladium posted:

Nerds incessantly arguing that the $40 Hyper 212+ is (rightfully) an outdated and overpriced CPU cooler on Techpowerup forums seems incredibly sane versus audio woo
As someone who owns a Hyper 212+, I thought it was "good enough" for years, though I got mine for $30 in 2012. It took me a long time to come around to the idea an $80 or $100 Noctua, but the benchmarks are pretty convincing.

Jeherrin
Jun 7, 2012


Has this nonsense been posted before?

https://www.theaudioworks.co.uk/all-bits-are-not-created-equal/

My favourite bit (pun intended):

quote:

Well, we have known that CDs were not always equal. CDs burnt on a laptop didn’t sound as good as pressed CDs. CDs stamped on Sony presses tended to sound better than those on Polygram presses.

Endless Mike
Aug 13, 2003





"I burned some 128 cbr mp3s I downloaded from Napster in 1998 and they sounded like poo poo so obviously burned CDs sound worse!"

cruft
Oct 25, 2007



Jeherrin posted:

Has this nonsense been posted before?

https://www.theaudioworks.co.uk/all-bits-are-not-created-equal/

My favourite bit (pun intended):

Once, on a mail list for Volkswagen Vanagons, I asked for speaker recommendations, and the longest reply opened with an assertion that they could tell the difference between an original CD and a copy on their system.

In a VW bus.

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004


:911:
:wookie: :thermidor: :wookie:
:dehumanize:

:pirate::hf::tinfoil:


...thus i recommend these kicker 6x9s for your bus

strtj
Feb 1, 2010


Jeherrin posted:

Has this nonsense been posted before?

https://www.theaudioworks.co.uk/all-bits-are-not-created-equal/

My favourite bit (pun intended):

Oh ffs. This is the same discussion we were having about digital sources - either everything is 100% or it's very obviously not. CDs have huge amounts of error correction built into them and as a result there are people who would stare at raw error rates on equipment that could present those numbers, but you know what? As long as it's all being corrected, every frame could have errors and it wouldn't matter. CDs were designed that way.

Neurophonic
May 2, 2009


Jeherrin posted:

Has this nonsense been posted before?

https://www.theaudioworks.co.uk/all-bits-are-not-created-equal/

My favourite bit (pun intended):

I’m the link to a page to explain what ‘Blu-spec’ is that doesn’t exist on Wikipedia.

Palladium
May 8, 2012


We can transmit packets 10GBps flawlessly over 40 kilometers of fiber, but you see this level of technology clearly isn't enough to transmit audio at 0.014% the bandwidth over 0.00025% of the length.

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004


:911:
:wookie: :thermidor: :wookie:
:dehumanize:

:pirate::hf::tinfoil:


Fiber transceivers don't have ears :eng101:

DancingShade
Jul 26, 2007

MAYBE IF MY WEAK NONSENSICAL "BURNS" ARE CONVOLUTED ENOUGH, NOBODY WILL NOTICE THAT IN SPITE OF BEING A CONDESCENDING TAINTSMEAR IN EVERY THREAD I POST IN, I HAVE LITERALLY NEVER HAD ANYTHING EVEN REMOTELY INSIGHTFUL OR FUNNY TO SAy. :thumbsup:

If you aren't listening to your recordings off a Voyager probe class solid gold record you're just not doing it right.

BobHoward
Feb 13, 2012

The only thing white people deserve is a bullet to their empty skull


Neurophonic posted:

I’m the link to a page to explain what ‘Blu-spec’ is that doesn’t exist on Wikipedia.

My guess on the real story: Sony tooled up to mass produce Blu-ray discs and figured out they could use the same equipment to make Redbook-compliant audio discs, enabling them to scrap old Redbook-only equipment and standardize their whole production line. The marketing department then came up with some bullshit to try to sell this as a quality advantage.

GWBBQ
Jan 2, 2005




Ok Comboomer posted:

what do you goons consider “cruising altitude” in terms of high-end audio? Like, what’s the most money you’d ever spend on a complete system without getting to the point where you felt like you were just needlessly pissing away cash (assume that you don’t have other financial concerns, etc. this is money purely for audio).
If I were obscenely rich, I could see myself spending maybe in the 2-5k (US) range for a music setup, maybe 10k if I found stuff that looks cool. I'd probably still piece things together from thrift store finds because that's all I really need to enjoy music.

KillHour posted:

It could theoretically be a copper -> fiber -> copper transceiver, which would help justify the cost to SOME degree (although it would still be stupid)
There are very legitimate uses for opto-isolators but I can 100% guarantee that nobody who buys audiophile poo poo has any legitimate need for one.

KillHour posted:

If the intent is to slow down brute force attempts, you could just shuffle between 16 or so random layouts. Randomly picking each button is ridiculous overkill.

In fact, randomly ordering the buttons is dumb because it would be much better to use a failure lockout to achieve the same thing. The only possible benefit is maybe so the fingerprints don't give it away?
Logic stops applying when the customer requests it and pays for it, especially when they have top secret clearance and you don't.

Ok Comboomer posted:

yeah my hunch was always that the bulk of their profit came from stuff like cables and accessories and those $10 keyboards that probably cost them like $0.25 a unit.

Sort of like how your average casual restaurant makes all of their money in drinks.
And here come the flashbacks of the "commission" structure at Radio Shack. Parts, Batteries, and Accessories were the highest margin and highest commission at something like 5% of retail price. The only deal there was that you got rebranded Duracell batteries cheaper than brand name before it was so easy to order stuff online.

Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



GWBBQ posted:

If I were obscenely rich, I could see myself spending maybe in the 2-5k (US) range for a music setup, maybe 10k if I found stuff that looks cool. I'd probably still piece things together from thrift store finds because that's all I really need to enjoy musicit’s my hobby and I love it

FTFY

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






GWBBQ posted:

Logic stops applying when the customer requests it and pays for it, especially when they have top secret clearance and you don't.

I deal with so many "experts" with top secret clearance who don't know dick squat about physical security that I can totally imagine this happening. Military people love to jack off to their own bullshit ideas. It's kind of like audiophiles in that way....

Yuns
Aug 19, 2000

There is an idea of a Yuns, some kind of abstraction, but there is no real me, only an entity, something illusory, and though I can hide my cold gaze and you can shake my hand and feel flesh gripping yours and maybe you can even sense our lifestyles are probably comparable: I simply am not there.


I got a promotional email for what I thought were pricey flagship headphones for $3,999 but turned out to be just a set of IEM cables. I understand cables as pure audio jewelry but even as that. whew.

https://shop.musicteck.com/collections/effect-audio/products/ea-flagship-centurion

edit: lmao, you can't even buy the black and gold version unless you've already bought a set of their $1,699 cables or their $7,000 King Arthur iems.

Yuns fucked around with this message at 15:57 on Jul 20, 2021

Fantastic Foreskin
Jan 6, 2013

A golden helix streaked skyward from the Helvault. A thunderous explosion shattered the silver monolith and Avacyn emerged, free from her prison at last.



"Gold Plated Silver Gold Alloy"

Blue Footed Booby
Oct 4, 2006

got those happy feet




Slippery Tilde

KillHour posted:

I deal with so many "experts" with top secret clearance who don't know dick squat about physical security that I can totally imagine this happening. Military people love to jack off to their own bullshit ideas. It's kind of like audiophiles in that way....

I might be reading you wrong, but top secret clearance is about access to secrets and has nothing to do with expertise in security, besides theoretically sitting through some powerpoint slides once a year. I'd expect them to know nothing useful about physical security because their training and responsibilities begin and end at "don't talk about poo poo in public, don't hold the door of a secure area for people, and don't show anything marked as classified to anyone who isn't cleared or doesn't need to know." The main point of clearance is the background check.

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






Blue Footed Booby posted:

I might be reading you wrong, but top secret clearance is about access to secrets and has nothing to do with expertise in security, besides theoretically sitting through some powerpoint slides once a year. I'd expect them to know nothing useful about physical security because their training and responsibilities begin and end at "don't talk about poo poo in public, don't hold the door of a secure area for people, and don't show anything marked as classified to anyone who isn't cleared or doesn't need to know." The main point of clearance is the background check.

I agree with you. The problem is with people who think "4 years in the Marines and a Secret clearance" equates to a set of qualifications beyond the ability to murder people.

Ok Comboomer
Oct 20, 2007



KillHour posted:

I agree with you. The problem is with people who think "4 years in the Marines and a Secret clearance" equates to a set of qualifications beyond the ability to murder people.

you ever meet anybody with an MBA?

cruft
Oct 25, 2007



KillHour posted:

I agree with you. The problem is with people who think "4 years in the Marines and a Secret clearance" equates to a set of qualifications beyond the ability to murder people.

Qualifications like gorilla warfare?

DancingShade
Jul 26, 2007

MAYBE IF MY WEAK NONSENSICAL "BURNS" ARE CONVOLUTED ENOUGH, NOBODY WILL NOTICE THAT IN SPITE OF BEING A CONDESCENDING TAINTSMEAR IN EVERY THREAD I POST IN, I HAVE LITERALLY NEVER HAD ANYTHING EVEN REMOTELY INSIGHTFUL OR FUNNY TO SAy. :thumbsup:

KillHour posted:

I deal with so many "experts" with top secret clearance who don't know dick squat about physical security that I can totally imagine this happening. Military people love to jack off to their own bullshit ideas. It's kind of like audiophiles in that way....

Physical security isn't on the curriculum. That's what bodies are for. No bodies, no physical security.

A fancy lock only means someone is going directly through a wall or getting an oxy cutter. Or if it's biometric maybe cutting someone else's bits off.

MrOnBicycle
Jan 18, 2008
Wait wat?

Edit:
VVV Thanks

MrOnBicycle fucked around with this message at 10:40 on Aug 1, 2021

njsykora
Jan 23, 2012

Robots confuse squirrels.



Definitely not the right thread, try the home audio thread.

GnarlyCharlie4u
Sep 23, 2007

I have an unhealthy obsession with motorcycles.

Proof


It's me. I'm the audiofool.

I am so tempted by these


Courtesy of slickdeals https://slickdeals.net/f/15153181-focal-elegia-closed-headphones-399-free-s-h-adorama?src=SiteSearchV2Algo1

qirex
Feb 15, 2001



Oh god that’s tempting. I tried some of their open ones and they were super nice. That said I have no interest in going full headphone grognard, I’m trying to spend less time at my desk.

Take the plunge! Okay!
Feb 24, 2007





Focals are known to be well-made and sweet sounding headphones. And $400 is not that ludicrous for a decent pair of cans, plus a couple of hundred for a good amplification solution. Many people in the headphone thread have spent more on their setups, and I'm not even thinking about the collectors with multiple sets.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

KillHour
Oct 28, 2007






I just spent two whole-rear end hours of my limited sleep time having a dream in which I was trying to figure out what in an overcomplicated signal chain was causing noise on only the left speaker. Thanks, brain, you dumb audiophile. You owe me a dream with boobs next time.

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply