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HondaCivet
Oct 16, 2005

And then it falls
And then I fall
And then I know




My boyfriend is planning on building a cat tree for our two new cats (well, they are kittens right now but hopefully they will make it to cathood). We've been thinking about all these super-elaborate plans with places to hide and jump around and whatnot but I'm not sure if the cats even want anything more than some elevated platforms to hang out on. In your experiences, what cat tree styles do cats enjoy the most? Would they actually use tunnels and hideaway spots or would it be a waste of time? I know this sort of depends on the cat but I was just curious as to what you guys had seen.

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Yawgmoft
Nov 15, 2004


Blackishsheep just built a whole playground for her new kitten out of nothing but five cardboard boxes slapped together and what happens? My resident female moves on in and attacks anything that comes near it.

Short version: cat love anything and everything. Fill it with toys treats and catnip and they will play in it forever, no matter the design.

Lets face it, a lot of the super crazy designs we plan out are for our own enjoyment. And that's perfectly acceptable.

Fire In The Disco
Oct 4, 2007
I cannot change the gender of my unborn child and shouldn't waste my time or energy pretending he won't exist

HondaCivet posted:

My boyfriend is planning on building a cat tree for our two new cats (well, they are kittens right now but hopefully they will make it to cathood). We've been thinking about all these super-elaborate plans with places to hide and jump around and whatnot but I'm not sure if the cats even want anything more than some elevated platforms to hang out on. In your experiences, what cat tree styles do cats enjoy the most? Would they actually use tunnels and hideaway spots or would it be a waste of time? I know this sort of depends on the cat but I was just curious as to what you guys had seen.

I think it really depends on your cats. I have four, and a couple are loungers and a couple are hiders. The loungers lounge on everything loungeable, and the hiders hide in everything hideable. I'd suggest that you observe the babes for a while and figure out what they like best before building away. You'll be able to figure out pretty quickly if you need lounging spots, hiding spots or both.

Helanna
Feb 1, 2007



Fire In The Disco posted:

I think it really depends on your cats. I have four, and a couple are loungers and a couple are hiders.

Definitely depends on the cats. I have 5, and all of them ignored the hideaways in the cat tree, prefering to lounge around on the open parts.

HondaCivet
Oct 16, 2005

And then it falls
And then I fall
And then I know




Does it matter that they are still kittens? They mostly seem to just like climbing onto things, not into them, but is that likely to change once they age?

Fire In The Disco
Oct 4, 2007
I cannot change the gender of my unborn child and shouldn't waste my time or energy pretending he won't exist

In my experience kittens like both hiding and lounging places, because it gives them more places to play. I'd build a tree that has both if it were me; as far as my cat tree goes, I have this Armarkat one, which has both hiding and lounging places, and they all get used (except the hammock on the bottom).

Captain Foxy
Jun 13, 2007

I love Hitler and Hitler loves me! He's not all bad, Hitler just needs someone to believe in him! Can't you just give Hitler a chance?


Quality Pugamutes now available, APR/APRI/NKC approved breeder. PM for details.

Fire In The Disco posted:

they all get used (except the hammock on the bottom).

loving cats not appreciating awesomeness when they have it.

Civet, if I were you I would go nuts with it and build as many things into it as you can. It'll be fun for you and the cats will explore it all and be able to develop their own preferences, since they have a lot to chose from. Make a thread about it, why don't you? I'd be interested in seeing some in progress pics, since I plan on doing this myself at some point, and my DIY skills are nil.

HondaCivet
Oct 16, 2005

And then it falls
And then I fall
And then I know




Captain Foxy posted:

loving cats not appreciating awesomeness when they have it.

Civet, if I were you I would go nuts with it and build as many things into it as you can. It'll be fun for you and the cats will explore it all and be able to develop their own preferences, since they have a lot to chose from. Make a thread about it, why don't you? I'd be interested in seeing some in progress pics, since I plan on doing this myself at some point, and my DIY skills are nil.

Good idea, I'll see if I can do something like that. My boyfriend will be doing most of the work since he's the only one of us with any woodworking experience but hopefully I can get some pictures of the various stages and some info on materials and construction.

We're also going to make a scratching post out of an actual piece of tree with the bark intact and everything. Our cats' foster dad said that his cats have all loved this kind of scratcher.

LoreOfSerpents
Dec 29, 2001

No.



Xerin posted:

She said that declawing comes standard when they neuter them and they prefer not to neuter without doing a declawing too and they rarely don't declaw cats.

Whenever someone tells me that unnecessary declawing is the way to go, I like to inform them that declawing is illegal in one US city already and similar laws are being considered elsewhere.

Of course, it's very controversial as a city-based law and it doesn't affect much in the one city where it is illegal, but that's beside the point...

nonanone
Oct 25, 2007




LoreOfSerpents posted:

Whenever someone tells me that unnecessary declawing is the way to go, I like to inform them that declawing is illegal in one US city already and similar laws are being considered elsewhere.

Of course, it's very controversial as a city-based law and it doesn't affect much in the one city where it is illegal, but that's beside the point...

A pretty easy argument is that it's banned in pretty much every other first world country. Also, that it's an [unnecessary] amputation, and sometimes bringing up the fact that no one would ever think of declawing dogs. Alternatively, what sometimes works is just asking them if they've ever tried just training the cats to stop/give them something other than furniture to scratch. It's amazing how many people want to declaw even before their cats have actually scratched anything.

Unagi
Jan 27, 2007


PISSmaster




I would like to recommend something for the "Alternatives to Declawing" bit:

Similar to foil or saran wrap, there is a product called Sticky Paws. It's essentially the same as double sided tape but is softer, clear, and safer for fabrics like furniture. You can buy packages of it in strips, or larger rolls of it. I've recently seen an off brand of it at Target for much cheaper, too. It's pretty much invisible, cats hate touching it, it stays on easily, and comes off even easier without damaging your couch. Save your furniture or door frames without people thinking you're a for lining your doorframe with foil.

http://www.petsmart.com/product/ind...oductId=2755193

We used it with GREAT success in my house, and every person I've recommended it to has made an effort to get back to me to thank me for the suggestion. If your cat will tear your arm off before you get some Soft Paws on him, then this stuff is your best friend.

Fire In The Disco
Oct 4, 2007
I cannot change the gender of my unborn child and shouldn't waste my time or energy pretending he won't exist

Unagi posted:

awesomeness about Sticky Paws

Added to the OP. Thanks for this!

giZm
Jul 7, 2003

Only the insane equates pain with success



Ok, so I have a question of my own now, I have two male kittens, ~3 months old, Max & Moritz, not yet castrated (I usually do that when they're around 1 year old as they're always indoors), and a female cat, Ludmilla, 4 1/2 years old, spayed.

I got the kittens about 3 weeks ago, and Ludmilla has accepted them rather fast into her home. She grooms them both, plays with them and lets them cuddle up to her when she's sleeping somewhere.

But today I noticed that Moritz is actually treading and suckling on her teats, and that Ludmilla lets him do that. I mean, I know she's a female cat and all, but drat, I thought when cats are spayed/neutered they lose production of all the hormones that make them behave like their gender.

Is this something I have to be concerned about? Will she ween him off someday? She isn't really producing any milk, right? The kittens eat both wet and dry food, and have plenty of it to boot, so it's not like they're starving.

I'm proud as poo poo that she's acting like that, but really, I mean, it's unexpected.

giZm fucked around with this message at 21:43 on Jul 30, 2009

bamzilla
Jan 13, 2005

All butt since 2012.


It's likely just a comfort thing. Some kittens do it with fingers. They will likely ween off the behavior but not always. I wouldn't worry too much and I imagine if it starts to bother Ludmilla she'll let him know.

giZm
Jul 7, 2003

Only the insane equates pain with success



Yeah I realize it's a comfort thing, he does it to me when I pet him as well, but I just didn't think Ludmilla would let him do it. That's what I'm so astonished about.

bamzilla
Jan 13, 2005

All butt since 2012.


It could be a comfort/relaxation thing for her, too. Either that or you have a pedocat.

hobbesmaster
Jan 28, 2008


giZm posted:

Yeah I realize it's a comfort thing, he does it to me when I pet him as well, but I just didn't think Ludmilla would let him do it. That's what I'm so astonished about.

A friend of mine's parents had an 8 year old male and a month or so old rescue they got. The kitten would suckle on the older cat, and he would sit there and roll over and start purring loudly. Hes a very, very weird cat though...

Helanna
Feb 1, 2007



hobbesmaster posted:

A friend of mine's parents had an 8 year old male and a month or so old rescue they got. The kitten would suckle on the older cat, and he would sit there and roll over and start purring loudly. Hes a very, very weird cat though...

One of my adult male cats used to let one of my male kittens suckle all the time. He even groomed the kitten while he nursed, to encourage him.

It stopped after a few months though I thought it was adorable

BanjoFish
Nov 24, 2007


Question time:

This handsome fellow showed up at my parents house 3 days ago.




According to the vet he is a ragdoll, about 4 years old, and completely healthy, except for some dirty ears. He was found on the side of the road in the middle of nowhere two weeks ago by a friend, most likely abandoned (which is really weird, because he is obviously an expensive cat). He lived with her for about 10 days. After flyering all over the place, no one has claimed him, and he has come to live with us on a trial basis.

He is a very docile cat, and in many ways very sweet, but not terribly affectionate. I've never adopted an adult cat before, so I don't really know how bonding works, but so far, he has been sort of distant. He really likes being around people and sitting near us, but hasn't been cuddly, and hasn't come to sit on out laps or play with us or anything. He has a favorite chair that he sleeps on, and whenever I pick him up, he just walks back over to it and plops down.

Basically, my question is how long should I expect before this cat bonds with us and starts acting how he would under normal circumstances? Is there anything we can do to help him out? We really want this cat to love us, but so far he seems a little indifferent.

Helanna
Feb 1, 2007



BanjoFish posted:

He has a favorite chair that he sleeps on, and whenever I pick him up, he just walks back over to it and plops down.

Basically, my question is how long should I expect before this cat bonds with us and starts acting how he would under normal circumstances? Is there anything we can do to help him out? We really want this cat to love us, but so far he seems a little indifferent.

Some cats are just like this unfortunately. One of my 5 won't tolerate being picked up for more than a few seconds, and won't sit on peoples laps very often at all. The most you can usually hope for is that he'll come over for a stroke and purr a bit. Conversely one of my other cats will do anything to sit on anyone who sits down in my house, and one of the others will only sit on my lap, nobody elses.

On the other hand, if you've only had him a short time, give him a while to adjust. Give him nice treats so that he associates you with good things, and be sure to pet him when treating him. One thing I did with two of my nervous kittens was to hold them while feeding them something tasty (like pieces of roast chicken breast) so that they learned that being held was a good thing.

Also try him on some catnip and see how he mellows with that Feliway plugins are also an option if he's a bit edgy.

Montefarle
Apr 12, 2005


I'm planning getting a new kitten, but we already have a small dog in our house. He's very friendly and gets on well with all living things so I don't forsee a problem on his end. Is there any way to tell if a kitten will get on well with a grown dog? What would be the best way to introduce the two?

Cpt.Wacky
Apr 17, 2005


BanjoFish posted:

Question time:

This handsome fellow showed up at my parents house 3 days ago.




According to the vet he is a ragdoll, about 4 years old, and completely healthy, except for some dirty ears. He was found on the side of the road in the middle of nowhere two weeks ago by a friend, most likely abandoned (which is really weird, because he is obviously an expensive cat). He lived with her for about 10 days. After flyering all over the place, no one has claimed him, and he has come to live with us on a trial basis.

He is a very docile cat, and in many ways very sweet, but not terribly affectionate. I've never adopted an adult cat before, so I don't really know how bonding works, but so far, he has been sort of distant. He really likes being around people and sitting near us, but hasn't been cuddly, and hasn't come to sit on out laps or play with us or anything. He has a favorite chair that he sleeps on, and whenever I pick him up, he just walks back over to it and plops down.

Basically, my question is how long should I expect before this cat bonds with us and starts acting how he would under normal circumstances? Is there anything we can do to help him out? We really want this cat to love us, but so far he seems a little indifferent.

He looks almost the same as my cat, but mine has a white splotch on his face. The vet I talked to also said he was a Ragdoll, but I think he looks more like a Birman. It's a bit confusing since you can find pictures that look the same for both breeds on different websites.

I've had my cat for about 5 years now and his behavior has continued to change gradually throughout that time, becoming more affectionate. When I first got him, he refused to sit on my lap unless he was facing forward. Now he'll usually get right up in my face while kneading my stomach. I think you should definitely give him a chance because it's a great type of cat. Just brush at least once a day and you shouldn't have any trouble with matting and only an occasional hairball.


On to my questions... I have a single adult male cat. We get along great together but I think he's getting more bored and lonely staying at home alone while I'm working. He's kept indoors, but I do take him out on a leash to explore the yard every few days.

I've been thinking about adopting a kitten for a while now, but I'm not sure about it. My cat gets along with other cats well enough, as long as they aren't in his territory (my apartment/house). If they come inside then he'll start growling and hissing at them, but not attack.

So I'm not sure about adopting. Should I go for a kitten? How young/old? Male or female? What about 2 kittens to entertain themselves and not bother the adult as much? Would an older cat, say 2+ years, still be an option? My main concern is that they get along well enough.

ChairmanMeow
Mar 1, 2008

Fire up the grill everyone eats tonight!


Lipstick Apathy

BanjoFish posted:

I've never adopted an adult cat before, so I don't really know how bonding works
Every ragdoll I've come across has been a 1 person kind of cat and pretty slow to bond. But very loyal once bonded YMMV
It is a stunning cat.

Helanna
Feb 1, 2007



Cpt.Wacky posted:

So I'm not sure about adopting. Should I go for a kitten? How young/old? Male or female? What about 2 kittens to entertain themselves and not bother the adult as much? Would an older cat, say 2+ years, still be an option? My main concern is that they get along well enough.

Kitten will be easiest to introduce. Two kittens will be even better because they will try to play with your adult cat but also use some of the energy amongst themselves when your adult cat doesn't want to play. Male or female doesn't matter; females have a reputation for being slightly bitchy with other females but that doesn't always hold true. Maybe go with 2 male kittens, or 1 male and 1 female.

You could go for an older cat if you wanted, but the introduction tends to be much harder. For example, one of my adult cats takes about 48 hours to accept a new kitten (I foster for a local rescue), but he takes 1-2 weeks before he stops hissing at new adult cats. It certainly can work, but its harder to manage for the first couple of weeks, and some cats just won't get on when introduced as adult cats - my Bengal cat spent 2 weeks hissing and fighting with a friend's cat I was looking after, yet she tolerates foster kittens with minimal hissing.

Montefarle posted:

I'm planning getting a new kitten, but we already have a small dog in our house. He's very friendly and gets on well with all living things so I don't forsee a problem on his end. Is there any way to tell if a kitten will get on well with a grown dog? What would be the best way to introduce the two?

Kitten will probably hiss a bit and be upset at the dog, but I wouldn't say you need to worry about them not getting on if they're raised together. We had a couple of dogs when I was living at home, and I bought my first kitten back then; apart from some initial posturing, the kitten got on just fine with the dogs. As he got older the dogs would sit still and let the kitten groom their faces

You do need to be wary of the dog being overexcited though, and bear in mind that if he gets scratched (in the eye for example) it could be nasty. You also need to be confident he wont react to being scratched by biting/attacking when upset. I'm confident my Boxer puppy won't hurt a kitten if scratched, but I still won't let her be around my foster kittens unsupervised simply because her excitement means she can accidentally hurt the kittens (granted, my main concern is that she's already 12kg of bouncing energy). Introduce them slowly, make sure the dog is on a leash so that he can't snap/lunge at the kitten.

Helanna fucked around with this message at 08:39 on Aug 1, 2009

Bloodie
Nov 24, 2008

carbs.


Is it normal for a cat to shun all food and water after coming into your house? I brought my cat home yesterday, she is somewhere between 4-10 years old (bad estimation on the part of the shelter and the uncertainty of the vet without blood work), and somewhere between the time I met her and the time I got her two days later she had picked up an upper respiratory infection that makes her sneeze and sniffle a lot, and her right eyelid is kind of stuck (so, as a result, is her eye; the vet thinks this is a result of the infection). She used the litterbox fine when she got home, but she hasn't been eating or drinking anything and she's severely underweight and dehydrated. The vet gave her an IV and I mixed some lysine they gave me into her food - she ate about half a teaspoon when I fed her, but then didn't touch either the wet or the dry food. Is this normal for a cat who has just been brought home? I imagine being sick while being introduced to a new environment must be pretty traumatizing, but is there anything I can do to encourage her to chill out and at least eat a little bit of something and stop hiding in tiny nooks? I left her sleeping in the laundry room with water, litterbox, wet food and dry food (I don't know which one she prefers) for the night, so hopefully she will start to relax into being at home soon.

Helanna
Feb 1, 2007



Bloodie posted:

Is it normal for a cat to shun all food and water after coming into your house? ... she had picked up an upper respiratory infection that makes her sneeze and sniffle a lot

Sounds pretty normal in a new environment,and particularly when sick.

Try some nice stuff like a can of tuna, or warmed up wet cat food that's nice and stinky to tempt her to eat.

Failing that, syringe feed her (I think "pedialyte" is the stuff you want but someone else might have a better idea) to ensure she doesn't get hepatic lipidosis from not eating.

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003



Has anyone used a diaper genie for scooping out their litter boxes? Is there a better cat equivalent?

Buddyleet
Jun 5, 2004
The Walking Man


My cat peels this off the furniture and balls it up.

Fire In The Disco
Oct 4, 2007
I cannot change the gender of my unborn child and shouldn't waste my time or energy pretending he won't exist

Alterian posted:

Has anyone used a diaper genie for scooping out their litter boxes? Is there a better cat equivalent?

There is a cat equivalent that I see at Petco when I stop there, but honestly, I don't think it's worth the price of the refills. You're really just better off using grocery bags and taking the bag to the trash after scooping. If you must put it in something inside before taking a large load out, you can try a good, foot pedal metal trash can that seals well, and line that with trash bags. But honestly, I'd probably die from the smell of that after a few days, whereas taking the litter out every time I scoop is quick and less stinky.

Eggplant Wizard
Jul 8, 2005


i loev catte


Bloodie posted:

Is it normal for a cat to shun all food and water after coming into your house? I brought my cat home yesterday, she is somewhere between 4-10 years old (bad estimation on the part of the shelter and the uncertainty of the vet without blood work), and somewhere between the time I met her and the time I got her two days later she had picked up an upper respiratory infection that makes her sneeze and sniffle a lot, and her right eyelid is kind of stuck (so, as a result, is her eye; the vet thinks this is a result of the infection). She used the litterbox fine when she got home, but she hasn't been eating or drinking anything and she's severely underweight and dehydrated. The vet gave her an IV and I mixed some lysine they gave me into her food - she ate about half a teaspoon when I fed her, but then didn't touch either the wet or the dry food. Is this normal for a cat who has just been brought home? I imagine being sick while being introduced to a new environment must be pretty traumatizing, but is there anything I can do to encourage her to chill out and at least eat a little bit of something and stop hiding in tiny nooks? I left her sleeping in the laundry room with water, litterbox, wet food and dry food (I don't know which one she prefers) for the night, so hopefully she will start to relax into being at home soon.

Yes, it's normal for a cat to be a little picky for a while after moving into a new place, but since you have an illness in the case and already have had to treat her for dehydration, you'll want to do whatever you can to get her to eat (cats can get life-threatening liver problems if they don't eat for a few days, tons of fun).

There are some tips here, but I will quote as well for posterity:

exactduckwoman posted:

You need to get him to eat, so try stinky foods like tuna. You might also try heating up his wet food because it smells to high heaven. It will help with his congestion for him to be in a small space with a humidifier, or with the shower running. Getting him uncongested will help him want to eat, too.

And CatDoc adds:

CatDoc posted:

Antibiotics are only going to affect susceptible bacteria. Viruses are just to be waited out. Food and liquids are critical. Make sure other cat is up on RCP and wash hands. You DO have them quarantined from each other...

...

Warning when warming foods: Microwaves can have second-degree burn temps right next to ice-cold. Mix that poo poo up well, I do it with my finger, so I know it's warm. You're looking for 99'F or so.

Sub-cutaneous fluids might be a daily treatment here. Talk to your vet about having them show you how. Force feeding might be in order to avoid hepatic lipidosis.

Fluids. Eating.

Hepatic lipidosis is the aforementioned liver problem, and yes, keep your cat separate from your non-sick pets if you have any, and be really careful about hand washing.

Alterian
Jan 28, 2003



Fire In The Disco posted:

There is a cat equivalent that I see at Petco when I stop there, but honestly, I don't think it's worth the price of the refills. You're really just better off using grocery bags and taking the bag to the trash after scooping. If you must put it in something inside before taking a large load out, you can try a good, foot pedal metal trash can that seals well, and line that with trash bags. But honestly, I'd probably die from the smell of that after a few days, whereas taking the litter out every time I scoop is quick and less stinky.

We use resueable grocery bags so we don't actually have a good supply of small bags to use for scooping.

I tried using an old litter tub as a can next to the boxes since those seal well. That only lasted one week. By the end of the week I thought I was going to vomit when I opened the lid.

Hopefully I'll get knocked up soon so it won't be my problem anymore.

Fire In The Disco
Oct 4, 2007
I cannot change the gender of my unborn child and shouldn't waste my time or energy pretending he won't exist

^^^ Hahaha, you sound like me.

Booties
Apr 4, 2006

forever and ever

Will cat piss smell come off clothes in regular wash, or do I need something stronger like the oxy clean used for rug messes?

Fire In The Disco
Oct 4, 2007
I cannot change the gender of my unborn child and shouldn't waste my time or energy pretending he won't exist

I have found that it won't. If you test an inconspicuous area first for color-fastedness, you can use Nature's Miracle to help destroy the pissy enzymes.

Booties
Apr 4, 2006

forever and ever

Fire In The Disco posted:

I have found that it won't. If you test an inconspicuous area first for color-fastedness, you can use Nature's Miracle to help destroy the pissy enzymes.

I'll go look for some of that stuff this week. I've also heard of vinegar as a good neutralizing agent for the smell. The problem is that this is a messenger bag so I'm afraid to put it into the washer because of the velcro wearing out plastic clips melting a little. I can find out about the washing machine from a biking forum though.

Serella
Apr 24, 2008

Is that what you're posting?



Booties posted:

I'll go look for some of that stuff this week. I've also heard of vinegar as a good neutralizing agent for the smell. The problem is that this is a messenger bag so I'm afraid to put it into the washer because of the velcro wearing out plastic clips melting a little. I can find out about the washing machine from a biking forum though.

Definitely try the vinegar! I wash my ferrets' bedding with regular laundry soap and vinegar, and it almost completely eliminates the smell. Not completely, but they are very musky. And if you're worried about the heat melting the clips, wash the bag in cold water. I had an old messenger bags I used to wash all the time, and the velcro wasn't affected at all by it.

Ceridwen
Dec 11, 2004
Of course... If the Jell-O gets moldy, the whole thing should be set aflame.



Booties posted:

I'll go look for some of that stuff this week. I've also heard of vinegar as a good neutralizing agent for the smell. The problem is that this is a messenger bag so I'm afraid to put it into the washer because of the velcro wearing out plastic clips melting a little. I can find out about the washing machine from a biking forum though.

Wash it on cold with some Simple Solution or Nature's Miracle in addition to the detergent. To be extra sure it comes out I would soak it with some of the enzyme cleaner before you put it in the wash.

Velcro washes fine and the plastic clips will be fine on cold (really I'm quite certain they would be ok on hot but just to be safe). Don't put it in the dryer, just hang it up to dry.

I washed my Chrome bag and it came out fine.

machinegirl
Apr 16, 2002

*sigh*

Alterian posted:

Has anyone used a diaper genie for scooping out their litter boxes? Is there a better cat equivalent?

I used the cat equivalent and it sucked. The bag things kept ripping open, so we just threw it away. Maybe try using a flushable litter?

Booties
Apr 4, 2006

forever and ever

Yeah I guess I just forgot I would wash it on cold anyway. Thanks for all the tips. I'll go use vinegar if I have it lying around, but probably won't get the nature's miracle unless I really need to since I don't live with my cat now.

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HondaCivet
Oct 16, 2005

And then it falls
And then I fall
And then I know




I need litter box advice!

I live in a fairly small one-bedroom apartment with a smallish living room, big kitchen, bathroom and bedroom. My plan is to shut them up in the bathroom when we move to give them a little place of their own until they are comfortable and to help them finish taming down (they're feral kittens). Questions:

1) Should I get them a little night light or something for nighttime? The bathroom has no windows so I'm assuming that it'll be pitch black when the door is closed. I plan on leaving the lights on for them all day and just shutting them off at bedtime.

2) I was thinking of just sticking with one litter box since they happily share one right now and the apartment is rather small. Since it's what they'll be used to by the time we let them out of the bathroom, I was thinking of just leaving it in there. We're also going to have to shut them away once in awhile for their safety when we do weight-lifting exercises so just making the bathroom their room makes sense. Of course, the problem with that is that people are always in and out and opening and closing the door. It's just my boyfriend and I so we can get into the habit of leaving the door open a bit for them when we're just showering or something but the door will of course be closed for five or ten minutes at a time when the toilet's in use. Will they be willing to hold it in for five or ten minutes if the door is closed or will they likely refuse to wait?

3) If the answer to my second question is 'no', could we possibly just move the litter box in and out of the bathroom when we have to, or would that confuse them? Also, is the kitchen a bad place to keep the litter box? It's a decently-sized kitchen but the box would still probably be in a ten-foot radius of where they are fed. Would that be too icky for them?

Sorry for the longness, I have been wracking my brain about this and can't come up with a good answer.

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