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ROMAn Reigns
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Apr 24, 2017 19:28
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Halloween Jack posted:This might surprise you, but even though he was only active in the early part of the decade, Backlund was one of the top draws of the 80s and supposedly one of the top all-time draws in the WWE. Savage, Hart, Michaels, and Piper were also big draws in their heyday. Foley was a draw, but he hit his peak working with guys who were draws on their own. Edge, despite his nickname and his zillion title reigns, was a guy more analogous to like, Paul Orndorff: a meaningful draw for a period of several years but not a massive star. if you think about it correctly, there has only been one real draw in history and it is kevin nash
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Apr 24, 2017 19:31
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Everyone in the WWE is a superstar, it's not really supposed to sell Edge as a bigger deal.
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Apr 24, 2017 19:33
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Halloween Jack posted:This might surprise you, but even though he was only active in the early part of the decade, Backlund was one of the top draws of the 80s and supposedly one of the top all-time draws in the WWE. Savage, Hart, Michaels, and Piper were also big draws in their heyday. Foley was a draw, but he hit his peak working with guys who were draws on their own. Edge, despite his nickname and his zillion title reigns, was a guy more analogous to like, Paul Orndorff: a meaningful draw for a period of several years but not a massive star. In the 90s HBK wasn't really a draw except at house shows in 96. Hart was a draw in Europe and Canada but not really in the US. Neither was close to the heyday of Savage. Backlund wasn't really a top draw of the 80s, he started tailing off badly in 82 and 83 even though business was still hot. Snuka was the one really keeping it hot as he declined. Historically the real "draws" for WWE over a significant period of time were Rogers, Sammartino, Morales, Backlund (but he tailed off) Hogan, Piper (but only for a few years) Savage, Austin, Foley, Rock, HHH and Cena. Snuka and Batista were huge for shorter periods of time, along with other guys but everyone who had lasting drawing power is really on that list. MassRafTer fucked around with this message at 20:01 on Apr 24, 2017 |
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Apr 24, 2017 19:59
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Pope Corky the IX posted:ECIII's back acne is to the point that the WWE would have to give everyone at ringside plastic sheets as though they were at a Gallagher show. Odd, I've never seen anything like that during 205 live 
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Apr 24, 2017 20:02
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MassRafTer posted:Historically the real "draws" for WWE over a significant period of time were Rogers, Sammartino, Morales, Backlund (but he tailed off) Hogan, Piper (but only for a few years) Savage, Austin, Foley, Rock, HHH and Cena. The knock I've always heard on Morales is that he couldn't draw outside of New York and didn't connect with audiences who weren't also Puerto Rican. I take it that's bullshit?
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Apr 24, 2017 21:09
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Surely Brock Lesnar would have to be in the conversation of major draws throughout history, no?
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Apr 25, 2017 00:11
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Sandman McMahon posted:Surely Brock Lesnar would have to be in the conversation of major draws throughout history, no? Not in WWE.
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Apr 25, 2017 00:17
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Jerry lawler was always a great drawer
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Apr 25, 2017 00:21
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Jerry drawler
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Apr 25, 2017 00:22
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MassRafTer posted:Not in WWE. Not even a little bit? Just trying to think of some other names for the conversation, where does Randy Orton fit into this whole "draw" business? Edit: Just thought of one more, how about Flair in his original run with WWE?
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Apr 25, 2017 00:27
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Sandman McMahon posted:Not even a little bit? Flair didn't do so hot, they thought Flair would draw vs Hogan and tested it out in some Bay Area house shows and were super disappointed IIRC.
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Apr 25, 2017 00:31
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Sandman McMahon posted:Not even a little bit? Brock drew above average buyrates for his first two PPVs back, they were good numbers for the time but didn't equal the added expense of having him on the shows. If you want to credit his match with HHH on WM as the big draw for the show you could do that I guess. The only real other show you could say he drew on was WM XX since Goldberg vs Lesnar had a lot of hype behind it, as weird as that is to think in retrospect. He helps house shows and stuff but we're not talking major shifts. He moves number about as much as Punk did during his title run. His first run was seen as disappointing at the time. Didn't mean anything in Japan either. Randy Orton drew well during his big run from 07-08 and for a year or so after. Nothing giant but he made a noticeable impact. Getting back to Morales, everything I've seen lately points to him having been really big for his big run in WWE. If it was just Puerto Ricans, well god bless the guy (it wasn't.) Even Carlos Colon couldn't draw like that with Puerto Ricans in the Northeast. El Gallinero Gros posted:Flair didn't do so hot, they thought Flair would draw vs Hogan and tested it out in some Bay Area house shows and were super disappointed IIRC. The first run of Hogan vs Flair did really well, the second run did middling numbers.
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Apr 25, 2017 00:33
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MassRafTer posted:Historically the real "draws" for WWE over a significant period of time were Rogers, Sammartino, Morales, Backlund (but he tailed off) Hogan, Piper (but only for a few years) Savage, Austin, Foley, Rock, HHH and Cena.
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Apr 25, 2017 01:14
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Halloween Jack posted:Mostly I was just going off of Meltzer's lists of top draws by decade and all-time draws for WWE. I was surprised at the high placement he gave to guys like Backlund and Orndorff. Backlund was only active until like '83 and his best-remembered WWF gimmick wasn't representative of his work, and since Dave pretty much despised his work at the time, I figured the numbers must be solid for him to come around on Backlund. Orndorff I know did tons of house shows with Hogan, but I figured, y'know, Hogan. Orndorff definitely drew really, really well with Hogan, way better than the baseline.
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Apr 25, 2017 01:18
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MassRafTer posted:Orndorff definitely drew really, really well with Hogan, way better than the baseline. Sold out a stadium! https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Big_Event
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Apr 25, 2017 01:36
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Nobody talks about this anymore but Orndorff was one of Hulk's best opponents when it comes to drawing power.
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Apr 25, 2017 02:30
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How about Rey Mysterio? Was he ever a draw or was he more of a merch machine?
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Apr 25, 2017 02:42
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Another Person posted:How about Rey Mysterio? Was he ever a draw or was he more of a merch machine? Yeah I should have included him too, he single handedly made WWE hot in Mexico for a 5 year period and was a significant attraction in the US.
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Apr 25, 2017 02:46
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MassRafTer posted:Yeah I should have included him too, he single handedly made WWE hot in Mexico for a 5 year period and was a significant attraction in the US. Wasn't this also during a pretty meh time for AAA as well? I assume that probably helped a lot. I personally do not miss the like ~4 year "Cibernetico and his lovely friends" era of AAA. Speaking of draws, no one has ever given me a straight answer on if Cibernetic/Secta/Los Hell Brothers/etc were actually big draws in Mexico. That's basically the only Lucha merch I've ever seen in the wild being worn by actual Latino kids in my neck of the woods, but I'm not sure if this goes hand in hand with those kids also usually being juggalos or goths.
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Apr 25, 2017 09:02
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I'm looking for a short wrestling match that was on YouTube I can't remember the participants of, but I know it's been posted here a lot (probably even in this thread). The wrestlers are a fat slob bearded white dude and a more in shape Japanese guy. IIRC for some reason the huge dude decides to not sell or work at all, just sort of showboats around for a minute, and then tries to actually attack his opponent for real, so the Japanese dude just knocks him down and out in like five seconds flat. Anyone have the link or know what I'm talking about? Was this scripted? What was the deal?
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Apr 25, 2017 22:41
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Neo Rasa posted:I'm looking for a short wrestling match that was on YouTube I can't remember the participants of, but I know it's been posted here a lot (probably even in this thread). Sounds like you're referring to the Great Antonio (the bearded dude) vs Antonio Inoki (the Japanese guy). Inoki really worked him over, IIRC. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9lXAGZtMxU8 El Gallinero Gros fucked around with this message at 22:44 on Apr 25, 2017 |
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Apr 25, 2017 22:42
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El Gallinero Gros posted:Sounds like you're referring to the Great Antonio (the bearded dude) vs Antonio Inoki (the Japanese guy). Inoki really worked him over, IIRC. Thank you!!!
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Apr 25, 2017 22:52
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There was a little story about this in one of the old observers I read recently. Basically the Great Antonio came in and was going to get a push (for some god forsaken reason) to the point where they filmed him pulling a bus or something of that nature and showing off his ~INCREDIBLE STRENGTH~. Of course, he immediately got cocky as hell about it, this happened, and he was fired.
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Apr 25, 2017 23:21
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Marquis de Pyro posted:There was a little story about this in one of the old observers I read recently. Basically the Great Antonio came in and was going to get a push (for some god forsaken reason) to the point where they filmed him pulling a bus or something of that nature and showing off his ~INCREDIBLE STRENGTH~. Of course, he immediately got cocky as hell about it, this happened, and he was fired. Forum favorite David Showmaker wrote about this match. http://grantland.com/the-triangle/wrestlings-greatest-shoots-volume-3-antonio-inoki-vs-the-great-antonio/
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Apr 25, 2017 23:52
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MassRafTer posted:ECIII is bad. Derrick Bateman is good tho
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Apr 27, 2017 06:03
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Since we just watched Souled Out 2000, a related question. How exactly did Benoit and company plan to actually get out of their contracts? They got lucky and Mike Graham accidentally gave them a golden ticket out of the dumpster fire that was WCW, but what if Graham accidentally behaved like a person with an ounce of decorum? What was plan B in that situation?
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Apr 27, 2017 11:39
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C. Everett Koop posted:Forum favorite David Showmaker wrote about this match. http://grantland.com/the-triangle/wrestlings-greatest-shoots-volume-3-antonio-inoki-vs-the-great-antonio/ websters dictionary defines shoot as,
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Apr 27, 2017 14:17
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ChrisBTY posted:Since we just watched Souled Out 2000, a related question. Bill Busch had told the lockerroom he would give a release to anyone who was unhappy when he took over. It was felt that if enough guys (about 15) asked en masse they could push Sullivan out. Worst case the ones who really wanted out could try to hold him to his word. Management then attempted to divide the group, and succeeded but those four plus Douglas remained adamant.
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Apr 27, 2017 14:31
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I like the article but it's hilarious that he describes the match as being between Antonio Inoki and a crazy person.
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Apr 27, 2017 14:35
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When's the best time to buy tickets to a house show if you wanna get a good seat?
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Apr 27, 2017 19:45
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MassRafTer posted:Bill Busch had told the lockerroom he would give a release to anyone who was unhappy when he took over. It was felt that if enough guys (about 15) asked en masse they could push Sullivan out. Worst case the ones who really wanted out could try to hold him to his word. Management then attempted to divide the group, and succeeded but those four plus Douglas remained adamant. Believe the initial group was: Eddie Benoit Malenko Saturn Shane Douglas Konnan Kidman Rey Juvi Rey and Juvi were injured at the time so they didn't take their request as legit (Konnan was the one who said they wanted out), Kidman they promised a big push and he decided to stay, Konnan they suspended for some other reason and then he decided to stay. The Observers for that time period were posted a few weeks ago with the full story leading up to and afterwards if you want exact details (including the sad story of Shane Douglas in the aftermath).
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Apr 27, 2017 20:42
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It was far from the first time WCW did a 'if you want out, you'll get your release', and also not the first time WCW went 'oh, but you can't leave Rey'.
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Apr 27, 2017 20:43
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VJeff posted:When's the best time to buy tickets to a house show if you wanna get a good seat? Depends where you are, but around here I usually buy rail seats on a balcony the day of the show. floor seats suck poo poo unless you're willing to shell out for the first couple rows.
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Apr 28, 2017 03:57
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I want to know if a move/finisher (or some variation of it) exists. This was my imaginary finisher as a child. Basically, the set-up would be that of a fisherman's suplex or God's Last Gift into a DDT, basically slamming the opponents knee and head down simultaneously after raising them with the leg hooked. Fisherman's Suplex DDT, I guess? I'm sorry.
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Apr 28, 2017 18:05
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Destroy My Sweater posted:I want to know if a move/finisher (or some variation of it) exists. This was my imaginary finisher as a child. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7IzIp9Zap5M is the closest I can find.
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Apr 28, 2017 18:08
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Destroy My Sweater posted:I want to know if a move/finisher (or some variation of it) exists. This was my imaginary finisher as a child. She calls it the RamPaige https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k2RV-UkY-fQ
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Apr 28, 2017 18:11
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1QW6iUIt56U
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Apr 28, 2017 18:13
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So Starrcade 83 has a match where the time limit is sixty minutes, and it's a mask vs title match, but only for the first fifteen minutes. Like if it goes longer neither stip applies. Where the Hell did this idea come from? Was it a thing in old school wrestling? Borrowed from some non-worked sport? Or did they really just run low on ideas for Dusty finishes?
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Apr 29, 2017 05:22
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It would be an effective mislead today. The crowd is going to expect the match to go over 15 so they can have their cake and eat it too.
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Apr 29, 2017 05:45
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