Register a SA Forums Account here!
JOINING THE SA FORUMS WILL REMOVE THIS BIG AD, THE ANNOYING UNDERLINED ADS, AND STUPID INTERSTITIAL ADS!!!

You can: log in, read the tech support FAQ, or request your lost password. This dumb message (and those ads) will appear on every screen until you register! Get rid of this crap by registering your own SA Forums Account and joining roughly 150,000 Goons, for the one-time price of $9.95! We charge money because it costs us $3,400 per month for bandwidth bills alone, and since we don't believe in shoving popup ads to our registered users, we try to make the money back through forum registrations.
«2246 »
  • Post
  • Reply
Hedgehog Pie
May 19, 2012

Total fuckin' silence.

STONE COLD 64 posted:

okay being fair here tna did way more to kill that than wwe and he still has an aura of danger about him on the main roster

Didn't they even give him the gimmick of "whiny rear end in a top hat" after he started shooting on a drunk, absentee Scott Hall live on PPV? Or was that unconnected? I seem to remember him suddenly using some classic Russoisms as well.

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

VJeff
Jun 2, 2011

#HEKNOWS
#SCOOPS
#IGNOREMYPOSTS


No rules, Just Joe
Just Joe It

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010


Aesop Poprock posted:

Also early ring of honor had cool stuff going on but could still be cringe as hell. What the gently caress was up with the Christopher Street connection and Xavier as champion?

CSC were really popular in NJ and NY indies and ROH were very much a company that gave whoever had some buzz a chance at the time. I agree the gimmick is cringey, though.

As far as Xavier, I think the idea is that Low Ki was so universally accepted as ROH champion and a bad dude in general that I think they figured Xavier winning the belt and continuing to retain it for a while would get him major heat. Didn't really work but man were people happy when Joe murdered his rear end for the belt.

surf rock
Aug 12, 2007



I have a really simple question that's been weirdly hard to answer: with Fox purchasing the TV rights to Smackdown, do we know if they're going to air Smackdown on their main network channel or on one of their cable affiliates like Fox Sports or whatever?

spongeh
Mar 22, 2009

BREADAGRAM OF PROTECTION


I think they specifically said Fox the network, and not FS1.

Pope Corky the IX
Dec 18, 2006

What are you looking at?


surf rock posted:

I have a really simple question that's been weirdly hard to answer: with Fox purchasing the TV rights to Smackdown, do we know if they're going to air Smackdown on their main network channel or on one of their cable affiliates like Fox Sports or whatever?

I canít find the article at the moment, but Fox is putting it on the actual Fox network, and insisting that it get the same treatment as Raw.

surf rock
Aug 12, 2007



spongeh posted:

I think they specifically said Fox the network, and not FS1.

Pope Corky the IX posted:

I canít find the article at the moment, but Fox is putting it on the actual Fox network, and insisting that it get the same treatment as Raw.

gently caress yes! One fewer reason to have a big cable package. Thanks!

Germansimp
May 28, 2013


Aesop Poprock posted:

Also early ring of honor had cool stuff going on but could still be cringe as hell. What the gently caress was up with the Christopher Street connection

That was something that really annoyed me. Before the first segment ever, the commentators talk about how ROH is all about the WRESTLING and HONOR and all the usual anti-entertainment stuff, and then the very first segment of this new fed includes a women being put through a table and 2 gay characters getting the ever-loving crap beaten out of them. Thankfully the last two matches were very good, because a start like that could have permanently soured a lot of people.

Also, on the topic of early ROH being cringe, remember how 8 out of 10 matches on every show were "Match of the Year candidates"? Granted there wasn't as much high-level stuff available as there is these days, but still, there was so drat much average to boring poo poo being called MotYc, it was laughable. Hey, Chad Collyer and Matt Stryker just had a 20-minute scientific wrestling match without any heat segments and a completely dead crowd, what a MOTYC!

Minidust
Nov 4, 2009

Hello chiicagooo!

Oh, wait, is that a GameStop employee in the back? Hey, you, give me a refund. No, I don't care if it was my fault, just - look, am I the one with the microphone or not? REFUND, biyotch!

Pope Corky the IX posted:

I canít find the article at the moment, but Fox is putting it on the actual Fox network, and insisting that it get the same treatment as Raw.
I hope it's some nerdy intern's job to page the FOX executives whenever the WWE title match is fourth from the top on a PPV or w/e

STONE COLD 64
Oct 20, 2006

austin 3:16 says shut up. shut hte fuck up. where is my beer. i need hel

Will we see the FOX Football Robot do slams?

Coaaab
Aug 6, 2006

Wish I was there...


Which WWE Superstars will get Monster Jam-themed trucks?

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010


Coaaab posted:

Which WWE Superstars will get Monster Jam-themed trucks?

There's something you need to see...

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YSJuF3l3ruM

Wise Fwom Yo Gwave
Jan 9, 2006

Popping up from out of nowhere...

I wish Samoa Joe would suplex Joe Buck

Zanna
Oct 9, 2012


This may have been answered somewhere in the thread already, but I've not been able to find it: why did Curt Hennig/Mr. Perfect never get a run with the top title in WCW or WWF? It seems like he had all the tools to have a decently successful run as champ.

Cavauro
Jan 9, 2008

andey...


Curt got a huge push for a full year or so when he returned to WWF for the first time. During a time when you'd think he would be a solid guy to put the belt on in the early to mid 90s, he often had to take off a bunch of time to rehab injuries. They may have been scared to push him really hard again at any point after that. I think he finally left WWF because they didn't want to budge on keeping him as a non-wrestler character who went from announcer to manager, or maybe it was just money or a combination of the two. Once he went to WCW there wasn't any room at the top for anyone else besides who was already there. Upon his final WWE run Curt was pretty much booked fine for someone his age who could still go. I am lying big time about all of this

SatoshiMiwa
May 6, 2007



Hennig's peak WWF run came during Hogan's peak and the WWE didn't do heel champions than. Plus Hogan used politics to get out of working a program with Hennig too. And really as good as Curt was the DiBase was just a bit better and was more over and even he didn't get a run with the title.

Than Hennig's back issues forced him to retire and while he came back it probably killed any chance for him to get a world title run

Randaconda
Jul 3, 2014



And back then, everybody didn't get a run with the title. That's just how it was.

AkumaHokoru
Jul 20, 2007



Randaconda posted:

And back then, everybody didn't get a run with the title. That's just how it was.

no. thats how HOGAN was. there would have been other potential champions.

Randaconda
Jul 3, 2014



AkumaHokoru posted:

no. thats how HOGAN was. there would have been other potential champions.

No, that's how the WWF was back then. The title hardly ever changed hands.

Bigass Moth
Mar 6, 2004

I joined the #RXT REVOLUTION.

he knows...


Earthquake should have been champ.

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


AkumaHokoru posted:

no. thats how HOGAN was. there would have been other potential champions.

No there weren't, no one would have made nearly as much as Hogan in the 80s. It made no sense to change the title when they did the Hogan vs Perfect and they had a long run together. After that they were onto the Warrior experiment, then back to Hogan and by the time it made sense to look for a new champion Hennig was in decline. In the 80s it made no sense to put the belt on anyone other than who they did because Hogan was driving their business. The only person who you could argue getting the belt longer was Savage after WM V but it's not realistic to expect them to deny Hogan the title at that point. The business was built around Hogan not because Hogan played politics (and he did) but because he made the company way more money than anyone else did.

After the early 90s Hennig was just no good anymore. His body was wrecked. He shouldn't have even held the US title in WCW, he just couldn't put on much other than an above average match. His character work was OK but he was a shell of what he was. If he wasn't so injured he may have been in consideration after Bret got the title. They had faith in the guy too, when Warrior and Bulldog left they turned to him to main event one of the house show tours.

Davros1
Jul 19, 2007

You've got to admit, you are kind of implausible

AkumaHokoru posted:

no. thats how HOGAN was. there would have been other potential champions.

Bruno, a 7 year reign and 4 year reign
Morales, a 2 year reign
Backlund, a 5 year reign

Hogan, the face champ, holding the title for a long time was just how the WWF always booked themselves. I'm sure Hogan did politic, but he already had Vince on his side.

AkumaHokoru
Jul 20, 2007



MassRafTer posted:

No there weren't, no one would have made nearly as much as Hogan in the 80s. It made no sense to change the title when they did the Hogan vs Perfect and they had a long run together. After that they were onto the Warrior experiment, then back to Hogan and by the time it made sense to look for a new champion Hennig was in decline. In the 80s it made no sense to put the belt on anyone other than who they did because Hogan was driving their business. The only person who you could argue getting the belt longer was Savage after WM V but it's not realistic to expect them to deny Hogan the title at that point. The business was built around Hogan not because Hogan played politics (and he did) but because he made the company way more money than anyone else did.

After the early 90s Hennig was just no good anymore. His body was wrecked. He shouldn't have even held the US title in WCW, he just couldn't put on much other than an above average match. His character work was OK but he was a shell of what he was. If he wasn't so injured he may have been in consideration after Bret got the title. They had faith in the guy too, when Warrior and Bulldog left they turned to him to main event one of the house show tours.

Oh I'm not saying henning in particular. they missed the beat on warrior. they could have had something with Roberts. savage got some shine here and there but had memorable runs as champion (although one of his best was heel champion?) there were a few heels who could have played a big foil for Hogan and done gangbusters if they had let the belt be taken by shenanigans or not I still say we missed some really good stuff because of Hogan's politicking in the 80s

Minidust
Nov 4, 2009

Hello chiicagooo!

Oh, wait, is that a GameStop employee in the back? Hey, you, give me a refund. No, I don't care if it was my fault, just - look, am I the one with the microphone or not? REFUND, biyotch!

Yeah back then the title scene was basically your top guy and the occasional transitional champion (and the transitional champs were very transitional). It's not like now where it's a given you'll see a title change if a feud goes long enough.

ChrisBTY
Mar 29, 2012


AkumaHokoru posted:

Oh I'm not saying henning in particular. they missed the beat on warrior. they could have had something with Roberts. savage got some shine here and there but had memorable runs as champion (although one of his best was heel champion?) there were a few heels who could have played a big foil for Hogan and done gangbusters if they had let the belt be taken by shenanigans or not I still say we missed some really good stuff because of Hogan's politicking in the 80s

The chase was simply not their marketing or creative strategy.
"Watch our superhero beat up the bad guys" was their creative strategy.
Yeah it sucked for career heels, because they ultimately only existed to get the main guy over.
It only eased up because monthly PPVs and weekly Raws meant that programs got burned through much faster so you had to come up with new wrinkles.
And this is still their gameplan. They just don't have a worthy figurehead so they just stapled the belt to Brock and forgot about it.

Jerusalem
May 20, 2004

Anybody remotely interesting is mad in some way or another.


I wish Dibiase had been champion at some point (Andre gifting him the belt was never counted, right?) but there was no denying that Hogan was absolutely THE guy and WWF probably would have been nuts not to continue running with him as champ for as long as they did.

El Gallinero Gros
Mar 17, 2010


AkumaHokoru posted:

Oh I'm not saying henning in particular. they missed the beat on warrior. they could have had something with Roberts. savage got some shine here and there but had memorable runs as champion (although one of his best was heel champion?) there were a few heels who could have played a big foil for Hogan and done gangbusters if they had let the belt be taken by shenanigans or not I still say we missed some really good stuff because of Hogan's politicking in the 80s

Roberts has flat out said that he didn't need a belt and almost preferred not having one because it made his feuds about more than just being the champ. And they did think about making him the #1 heel, but when he DDT'd Hogan at a SNME taping, supposedly there were DDT chants and neither McMhaon or Ebersol liked that.

SatoshiMiwa
May 6, 2007



Jerusalem posted:

I wish Dibiase had been champion at some point (Andre gifting him the belt was never counted, right?) but there was no denying that Hogan was absolutely THE guy and WWF probably would have been nuts not to continue running with him as champ for as long as they did.

In retrospect I think Dibiase should of been the one to win the dirty match with Hogan and they should of kept him as Champion until Mania 4 and built around Savaga/Dibiase. You could do a #1 challengers tournament on TV before hand to get the same result (Dibiase pays someone off to get Hogan/Andre in the first round and they eliminate each other) and Mania 4 wouldn't have been such a dire mess.

But a long run? No, WWF was always a face champion territory until the late 90's. It made no sense to not have the babyface as a long term champion (Though they should of turned Superstar face and ran with him as champion).

Also Warrior wasn't done in by Hogan politics he was just a bad top guy that somehow Vince kept wanting to bring back for reasons

Halloween Jack
Sep 11, 2003

Let your word be "Yes, Yes" or "No, No"; anything more than this comes from the evil one.

I don't think they "missed the beat" on Warrior; if anything, they took a guy with a lot of glaring flaws and marketed him very well. Of course when Hogan is telling the story he's going to say that any shift away from himself was a grave mistake, but it's not like Warrior was held back from sustaining a long run on top. He just wasn't capable.

Spikeguy
Jul 30, 2005

That awkward moment when you get shot by your wife, in front of your wife, who then proceeds to try to kill your wife, while your best friend is off to the side pregnant, with your wife.

How do different territories decide whether to be a face champ territory or a heel champ territory? The quality of their heels and faces?

What's your favorite chase and then title run? Mine has to be a tie between Taz in ECW and Austin starting at Royal Rumble 97 all the way to about 99.

Randaconda
Jul 3, 2014



Spikeguy posted:

How do different territories decide whether to be a face champ territory or a heel champ territory? The quality of their heels and faces?

What's your favorite chase and then title run? Mine has to be a tie between Taz in ECW and Austin starting at Royal Rumble 97 all the way to about 99.

It all depends. Southern territories tended to lean more towards a heel champ with faces chasing him.

jesus WEP
Oct 17, 2004



Fun Shoe

I wonder who was the first heel to have a long run with the WWF Title, like a 6 month reign

Was there one before Yoko?

E: oh duh someone already said Billy Graham

MassRafTer
May 26, 2001

Fundamentals as sound as the WNBA


Spikeguy posted:

How do different territories decide whether to be a face champ territory or a heel champ territory? The quality of their heels and faces?

What's your favorite chase and then title run? Mine has to be a tie between Taz in ECW and Austin starting at Royal Rumble 97 all the way to about 99.

It was all about who was the right guy at the time. NWA affiliates would prefer a heel since it made more sense to have a big heel against their local babyface, but you'd also have Jack Brisco who was the all American babyface. The AWA was dominated by Gagne for two decades, then Bockwinkel, so you went from face to heel. San Francisco seemed to mix it up. Memphis was based around faces although they lost their belts all the time. Detroit was heel heavy with Sheik but they'd mix Bobo Brazil in too.

AkumaHokoru
Jul 20, 2007



El Gallinero Gros posted:

Roberts has flat out said that he didn't need a belt and almost preferred not having one because it made his feuds about more than just being the champ. And they did think about making him the #1 heel, but when he DDT'd Hogan at a SNME taping, supposedly there were DDT chants and neither McMhaon or Ebersol liked that.

Yep I remember this part. they didn't like it they wanted Roberts over as a heel but he ended up going baby a little while after anyway for a bit

Adbot
ADBOT LOVES YOU

AkumaHokoru
Jul 20, 2007



SatoshiMiwa posted:

In retrospect I think Dibiase should of been the one to win the dirty match with Hogan and they should of kept him as Champion until Mania 4 and built around Savaga/Dibiase. You could do a #1 challengers tournament on TV before hand to get the same result (Dibiase pays someone off to get Hogan/Andre in the first round and they eliminate each other) and Mania 4 wouldn't have been such a dire mess.


Honestly? I think this was a MUCH MUCH MUCH better layout than what we got

  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
  • Post
  • Reply
«2246 »