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M. Night Skymall
Mar 22, 2012



I told my dad about the internet's brilliant plan for me to purchase a van and convert it into the people hauling offroad vehicle of my dreams, and he immediately offered me more money to never speak of it again and buy a luxury 3-row crossover. I think he's still traumatized from like 20 years ago when I spent forever doing a motor swap on a '91 240sx because it was going to be way cooler than just buying a sports car in the first place (it was not.)

I don't think the minivan thing will work out either, my wife's more anti-minivan than I am, and having one car for people hauling and one car for climbing trips with less people means she has to agree to have the people hauler as her car. I do end up with a much bigger budget if I'm replacing both cars though, as I can roll her trade into it, and my dad's money, and other money I have lying around from selling motorcycles and my wrx finally. Probably going to try to find a crossover my wife/parents'll be happy with, still pretty much leaning towards the 2017-2018 Toyota highlander limited or Honda pilot elite for like 30-35k, then I'll see where I'm at finances wise and I can hand whatever crossover off to my wife and trade her car in for something that's a bit more offroad friendly. I'm typically the one taking my kid to/from school every day, so it still has to be reasonable to put a car seat in, but I could drop any need for a 3rd row or tri-zone climate control or whatever the gently caress luxury stuff.

I think you guys ended up way too fixated on the offroad though. My goal isn't actually to offroad as a hobby, it's to climb as a hobby. In most cases even if your car can't make it up whatever (relatively) steep offroad bullshit to get to the climbing area, you can just park at the bottom and start hiking, since that's usually only the last mile or so, it'd just be nice to have to do that less often. If it's hard to get to a climbing area the climbing probably isn't that great, since it requires active development in most cases which is helped by ease of access. I'm sure there's some cool type-2 fun climbing to be had way the gently caress off the beaten path, but that's not typically what I do.

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DNK
Sep 18, 2004



Your dad offering you money to buy whatever car you want isnít the norm for this thread.

zedprime
Jun 9, 2007

yospos


I'm starting to lose the plot in this multi variable car calculus request. Are you buying a van, lifting it, and painting a wizard on the side or not?

I don't think you've had a disasterful idea yet and you've got a couple different versions of what you need, which is going to be useful in the used market. Hit the pavement and let your butt tell you what's the right one.

DildenAnders
Mar 16, 2016

"I recommend Batman especially, for he tends to transcend the abysmal society in which he's found himself. His morality is rather rigid, also. I rather respect Batman.√ʬĬĚ

(Just buy an old V10 Excursion. I swear nothing will go wrong.)

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010




Thereís a 2012 Corolla at the dealer for 12k with 78 thousand miles.

Carfax comes back clean, and as long as I can take it to my mechanic for a PPi, seems like an okay deal considering this poo poo market. What should I start as an offer?

bird with big dick
Oct 21, 2015




Corollas are fine cars but by the time you install the lift kit, roof cargo box, and rumble seat, you're going to be way over budget.

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

If you're doing sub 8k miles a year a lot of that fuel cost concern is relatively minor. A Suburban 1500 4x4 is gonna get like 17 combined and an Odyssey is going to get 22 or 23. It's like $3-400/year, not nothing but definitely cheaper than tags on a third car.

I must have missed the low annual miles, and Suburbans still fall into the "very low teens" MPG category in my mind.

mariooncrack
Dec 27, 2008


LionArcher posted:

Thereís a 2012 Corolla at the dealer for 12k with 78 thousand miles.

Carfax comes back clean, and as long as I can take it to my mechanic for a PPi, seems like an okay deal considering this poo poo market. What should I start as an offer?

It really depends on the results of the PPI. Get that done first and go from there.

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010




IOwnCalculus posted:

I must have missed the low annual miles, and Suburbans still fall into the "very low teens" MPG category in my mind.

Minivans are shockingly bad on gas. Big vehicles are thirsty.

meanolmrcloud
Apr 5, 2004

rock out with your stock out



Is there a thread consensus on midsized suvs in the 18-24k range? We are super not picky about features or newness, but anything from 2016 or so on would be nice. We have 2 sedans which arenít cutting it with our new baby. Iím pretty dang tall and cannot recline the seat in either one of them to drive comfortably without it smushing up against the babyís seat. Having extra room for strollers and baby junk would also be a plus.
If I were to test drive something today, I would pay attention to my headroom first, and noise baffling on the freeway second, as both cars we have now are pretty poo poo for letting noise in.

I like the look of the Kia suvs in that range, and cursory googling says they are good enough for tall folks. There are chevys in that price range, but Iíve never driven a Chevy I liked.

meanolmrcloud fucked around with this message at 16:53 on May 11, 2021

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

Minivans are shockingly bad on gas. Big vehicles are thirsty.

I rented a Chrysler Voyager last week and it did 28mpg over 600 miles with 500lbs of cargo. I thought that was pretty deece

nm
Jan 28, 2008

"I saw Minos the Space Judge holding a golden sceptre and passing sentence upon the Martians. There he presided, and around him the noble Space Prosecutors sought the firm justice of space law."

KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

Minivans are shockingly bad on gas. Big vehicles are thirsty.

Compared to what?
A honda Odyssey gets 19/28, which isn't amazing, but what is the comparable?
You could argue the pilot is (20/27) but no one who's sat in the back of both thinks they're comparable. You don't really get anything comparable until you hit BOF vehicles which struggle to get over 20mph on the highway.

Nitrox
Jul 5, 2002

Slur, your fighting style is extremely problematic!

A plug in hybrid Chrysler Pacifica will drive something like 30 miles on electric alone, which is how they routinely show 50+ mpg on fuelly. The instant torque is also nice

https://www.fuelly.com/car/chrysler/pacifica/2018/chrissbu/612015

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010




nm posted:

Compared to what?
A honda Odyssey gets 19/28, which isn't amazing, but what is the comparable?
You could argue the pilot is (20/27) but no one who's sat in the back of both thinks they're comparable. You don't really get anything comparable until you hit BOF vehicles which struggle to get over 20mph on the highway.

people THINK that they're significantly more efficient than similar CUVs for some reason but they're not, that's all I'm saying

the capability is nice but it's not free

Nitrox posted:

A plug in hybrid Chrysler Pacifica will drive something like 30 miles on electric alone, which is how they routinely show 50+ mpg on fuelly. The instant torque is also nice

https://www.fuelly.com/car/chrysler/pacifica/2018/chrissbu/612015

a unicorn PHEV that nobody buys is obviously a somewhat different case, and I say this as a Pacifica defender

Literally Lewis Hamilton
Feb 22, 2005

#JusticeForBreonnaTaylor
#BlackLivesMatter
#StillIRise
#Blessed




got off on a technicality posted:

I rented a Chrysler Voyager last week and it did 28mpg over 600 miles with 500lbs of cargo. I thought that was pretty deece

Is that computer MPG or actual MPG? Iíve had some very optimistic MPGs from rental car calculations.

got off on a technicality
Feb 7, 2007

oh dear


Literally Lewis Hamilton posted:

Is that computer MPG or actual MPG? I’ve had some very optimistic MPGs from rental car calculations.

fair point; I didn't bother to calculate actual mpg

ethanol
Jul 13, 2007

#essereFerrari


one week left to talk me out of a new tacoma trd off road

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





ethanol posted:

one week left to talk me out of a new tacoma trd off road

Colorado ZR2 with the diesel.

ethanol
Jul 13, 2007

#essereFerrari


IOwnCalculus posted:

Colorado ZR2 with the diesel.

Thatís prob 10k more

bird with big dick
Oct 21, 2015




meanolmrcloud posted:

new baby. Iím 64

lmao good on you buddy

FLIPADELPHIA
Apr 27, 2007




Grimey Drawer

Are Volkswagen Atlases as bad on reliability as the internet is suggesting?

If so, are there any mid to large size SUVs that have markedly better reliability?

Thanks thread.

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010




2009 Honda Civic with 113,000 miles for 6.4K. Private owner. Obviously Iím taking it to my mechanic first, but thread tell me if that doesnít seem like a reasonable price. Iím aware of the markets terrible, but as long as the PPI checks out this seems like the kind of vehicle I can buy and then not think about cars much till things calm down and EVís become responsible.

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010




FLIPADELPHIA posted:

Are Volkswagen Atlases as bad on reliability as the internet is suggesting?

If so, are there any mid to large size SUVs that have markedly better reliability?

Thanks thread.

highlander, sequoia, pilot, the GM BOF things are decent

Cpt_Obvious
Jun 18, 2007

I don't Want to be this kind of animal anymore.



Nitrox posted:

A plug in hybrid Chrysler Pacifica will drive something like 30 miles on electric alone, which is how they routinely show 50+ mpg on fuelly. The instant torque is also nice

https://www.fuelly.com/car/chrysler/pacifica/2018/chrissbu/612015

Looking at minivans right now. Is the Pacifica worth considering?

Applebees Appetizer
Jan 23, 2006



LionArcher posted:

2009 Honda Civic with 113,000 miles for 6.4K. Private owner. Obviously Iím taking it to my mechanic first, but thread tell me if that doesnít seem like a reasonable price. Iím aware of the markets terrible, but as long as the PPI checks out this seems like the kind of vehicle I can buy and then not think about cars much till things calm down and EVís become responsible.

That's way more reasonable than the Corolla you posted about that's for sure.

If it checks out and you like it offer 6 even and see if they bite, if not get it anyway because the asking price seems fair for the market now.

[e] if it has a timing belt make sure that was done when it was supposed to be

Frabba
May 30, 2008

Investing in chewy toy futures

My only contribution to Civic chat is I'd be very interested to know if they've replaced the passenger side motor mount already.

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010




Applebees Appetizer posted:

That's way more reasonable than the Corolla you posted about that's for sure.

If it checks out and you like it offer 6 even and see if they bite, if not get it anyway because the asking price seems fair for the market now.

[e] if it has a timing belt make sure that was done when it was supposed to be

Thatís great. Thanks. Test driving in a few hours and going from there.

Nitrox
Jul 5, 2002

Slur, your fighting style is extremely problematic!

Cpt_Obvious posted:

Looking at minivans right now. Is the Pacifica worth considering?
I've been buying minivans for a decade now and went Voyager, Odyssey, Sienna, Grand Caravan, and now Pacifica. If buying used, you pay less for equivalent Chrysler product, but statistically they are more problematic. In my personal anecdotal experience, Honda had the best road dynamics and the most expensive problems. Sienna felt like the most boring appliance and came with the least amount of options, especially at the price point. But after 60k/5 year mark, The Chrysler products give you top tier luxury options for nearly half the price. It's worth it to me, and may be too you as well. Good luck

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010




Okay test drive went fine. Small crack in the windshield (I figure great can lower price down). Young kid, his dad bought it for him, but he wants to get a BMW (I want a fun car to drive). Has a clean title, but hasn't registered it. WTF. So he just slapped plates on the car for us to test drive. Also won't hold it for my mechanic (earliest is next Tuesday, I offered him $50 as a good faith thing till the mechanic checks it out,) because it's first come first serve. Sure sure. Ran the Carfax and it came back with a ton of good records (all served by Honda dealers). A car accident from five years ago that replaced the headlights but Carfax deemed it as minor. Other issue is a biohazard leak of the back (no further description) that is also deemed (minor) by Carfax from three months ago.

My read on the guy is he's young and impatient and his dad bought this for him and he doesn't give a poo poo and wants cash. I was going to call the DMV tomorrow to see if this whole registration thing is bullshit (I have vin number obviously) but I'm guessing thread is going to tell me too many red flags?

Thanks again thread. Never really had to think about buying cars before. Whole new experience. (I've spent my entire twenties driving a corolla I bought from my grandfather who was the sole owner).

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009



Grimey Drawer

Just walk away.

This is not a unique car. There is not reason to deal with any one of those red flags to buy a used honda.

You need to stop bottom feeding this market or you're gonna get scammed.

LionArcher
Mar 29, 2010




Motronic posted:

Just walk away.

This is not a unique car. There is not reason to deal with any one of those red flags to buy a used honda.

You need to stop bottom feeding this market or you're gonna get scammed.

Fair enough.

Maksimus54
Jan 5, 2011


LionArcher posted:

Other issue is a biohazard leak of the back (no further description) that is also deemed (minor) by Carfax from three months ago.


Dafuq?

I wouldn't trust Carfax to deem what is minor or not, in particular to front end collisions and "bio hazard leaks"

Motronic
Nov 6, 2009



Grimey Drawer

Maksimus54 posted:

"bio hazard leaks"

I have no idea what this is other than a bullet that penetrated though the floor pan of the trunk and the newly dead guy who had been in there was leaking out when the cops found it days later.

I could be wrong.

taqueso
Mar 8, 2004









mariooncrack
Dec 27, 2008


LionArcher posted:

Okay test drive went fine. Small crack in the windshield (I figure great can lower price down). Young kid, his dad bought it for him, but he wants to get a BMW (I want a fun car to drive). Has a clean title, but hasn't registered it. WTF. So he just slapped plates on the car for us to test drive. Also won't hold it for my mechanic (earliest is next Tuesday, I offered him $50 as a good faith thing till the mechanic checks it out,) because it's first come first serve. Sure sure. Ran the Carfax and it came back with a ton of good records (all served by Honda dealers). A car accident from five years ago that replaced the headlights but Carfax deemed it as minor. Other issue is a biohazard leak of the back (no further description) that is also deemed (minor) by Carfax from three months ago.

My read on the guy is he's young and impatient and his dad bought this for him and he doesn't give a poo poo and wants cash. I was going to call the DMV tomorrow to see if this whole registration thing is bullshit (I have vin number obviously) but I'm guessing thread is going to tell me too many red flags?

Thanks again thread. Never really had to think about buying cars before. Whole new experience. (I've spent my entire twenties driving a corolla I bought from my grandfather who was the sole owner).

Cars are big purchases. If there's anything about the car that makes you go WTF, just walk away.

Motronic posted:

Just walk away.

This is not a unique car. There is not reason to deal with any one of those red flags to buy a used honda.

You need to stop bottom feeding this market or you're gonna get scammed.

Building off of this, "buy once, cry once." You might have to pay more initially but you'll also hopefully be avoiding headaches and paying for big repairs down the road.

Pretty rad dad pad
Oct 13, 2003

People who try to pretend they're superior make it so much harder for those of us who really are. Philistines!


LionArcher posted:

Fair enough.

Backing up everything said so far about red flags - IME there's rarely just the one issue, it's either none or a cascading series of them, whether the person's even aware of them or not. I don't know how much time you want to spend car shopping, I always find it takes me ages, but I've always had a good time going more for a particular type of person selling a car rather than a specific car per se (talking about private sales here, never really had anything to do with dealers either buying or selling). Sort of hard to put into words but more or less I'm looking for:

- A somewhat pedantic but well-written description that hits all the key points about the car, sounds like someone sane wrote it and points out things to look for in the photos;
- Decently well thought out photography that gives a good overview of the car but also highlights any issues noted in the description;
- Ability to string a sentence together - initial communication should give you the impression that you're talking to a normal, reasonable, educated person and not someone who's belligerent or a dimwit or otherwise obviously a howling idiot;
- Ability and willingness to actually talk about the car, and to some extent themselves in the context of the car - what's your personal driving style, what's your history with the car, why'd you pick it, would you buy another one (did you buy another one), taken it anywhere interesting lately, that sort of thing. Not everyone wants to do this, that's fine, but ime if you find someone that does it's much more likely that you've found one of the mythical unicorns who actually give a crap about looking after their vehicle.
- Absolutely no rushing. You're not buying one of 100 of this special edition whatever ever made, if there are another half dozen people lined up after me within an hour of you posting the ad it's probably such a great deal because you're hiding something.
- If the photos were taken at a house, see if you can look it up on streetview - not always practical or useful depending on where you live, but I've considered cars because they showed up somewhere year after year in obvious use and in superficially good condition, and not considered cars because they were visibly out of use across several years.

(Basically I'm a fussy nerd and I want to buy a car from a fussy nerd, ideally.)

None of these things are necessarily dealbreakers on their own, and the filtering takes a lot of time and effort, but if you can get something and someone that ticks all of the boxes odds are you're going to have a decent time. I bought a 20 year old but low mileage Suburban a while back, for a few thousand dollars, and basically spent half an hour looking at the thing, half an hour driving it and three hours chatting to the fundamentally nice seller about all kinds of random other crap because I asked a bunch of questions beforehand that were answered coherently and intelligently, a load of not necessarily flattering but essentially invisible info about the thing was volunteered before I drove the hour and change to go see it, and on arriving to see it in person I was presented with an enormous binder containing every receipt for anything ever done to it from new and a 20-year log of everything that had ever gone wrong or even been a bit odd, down to stuff like individual half-inch bits of plastic trim breaking and being replaced, individual instrument panel light bulbs being replaced, records of maintenance done proactively rather than reactively and commentary on why etc. Needless to say, after six weeks of regular driving trying to find anything wrong with it beyond stuff stated beforehand...nothing.

Now - obviously that sort of person is rare, you can't depend on finding one, but the tl;dr is that you can find them, they're out there, and I'd much rather give one of them my money than some dumbass.

Residency Evil
Jul 28, 2003

4/5 godo BRAINS


Motronic posted:

He doesn't have the title. He's setting you up for the "well, I can just give you the title from the last guy so you don't have to wait for them to switch it over to me and then to you". Ask his specifically if he has a clear title in his name. If the answer is no stop right there. The answer will be "no....BUT....."

Listen to the people telling you: this is the red flag playbook of a scummy car transaction you just described.

For my own education, what would the issue be in this case? Presumably the title was signed by the previous owner, he can put his name on it (since the current "owner" presumably hasn't filled out the title with his name on it), and then go register the car/get a new title, right?

KYOON GRIFFEY JR
Apr 12, 2010




he absolutely could do that, the question is why he hasn't done that yet and the answer is at best he's lazy/negligent

IOwnCalculus
Apr 2, 2003





KYOON GRIFFEY JR posted:

he absolutely could do that, the question is why he hasn't done that yet and the answer is at best he's lazy/negligent

And there are many worse answers, including "curbstoning to avoid being caught as a dealership" and "there are issues with the title / original seller that make it non-transferable".

That last one nearly bit me in the rear end once. The guy I bought my old Ranger from had a lien on him for child support and the state blocked the title transfer until it was satisfied. I was lucky in that he was still communicative and got it worked out quick.

If you're shopping the bottom of the price bracket for a given year/model/mileage category, you're going to need to be patient. Also, consider bumping up your mileage limit - if it received the basic maintenance it needs, I'd trust nearly any MY2000 or newer vehicle to last well into the 200k mile range.

ethanol posted:

Thatís prob 10k more

It's so good though (I loving love my diesel Canyon, though it is very much not a ZR2)

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ethanol
Jul 13, 2007

#essereFerrari


Dealer 2 hours away has a in transit tacoma with my chosen options (tech package and led head/fog light) and color (white). I don't want to run my credit for another week (zero'd my revolving accounts a while ago, if that matters, hasn't updated yet). Curious if maybe I should try to get a deposit on that truck to hold it for 7 days? I've always been shy about deposits before

ethanol fucked around with this message at 14:07 on May 12, 2021

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